looking for some help

Funkygreendogs · 20-07-2005 7:44pm #1

Hi,

Im looking for anyone who is comfortable working with PHP and graphic design to help me set up a website where people come to learn and discuss various topics and can read interesting articles which will be updated each week/whenever, the topics i have in mind range from computers to psychology. The website itself is non-commercial so i am afraid i cannot offer any form of payment to anyone.

However if you are a likeminded person, who likes a challenge, values information, and is keen on graphic design and comfortable working with php please give us a shout here.
I have already registered the domain name www.myinfolab.com and have gone and designed 1 or 2 things already. What i am looking for is an original layout (think outside the box type stuff) a forum and various php tidbits here and there and then hopefully when all is finished on the website side of things we can go about getting some information, at the moment i would love to get the php side of things sorted as i have not got much experience on this side of things.

All your suggestions / ideas are welcome, thanks,
jason

pencil · 21-07-2005 10:00am

I may be interested but my main concern would be....
- how big is the box, that I will be required to think outside of ?

Can we quantify, a really big box maybe outside my range of abilities.

Funkygreendogs · 21-07-2005 7:02pm

lol pencil thats great. dont worry about the box heh

What i really need help with is i am trying to customize the php forum to fit in with the template and basically add the information such as when it was last updated and stuff to the main page. Also is there php source code for an article submission type thing? for people who can add the new articles.
i have already fiddled a bit with stamping text onto an image(http://www.myinfolab.com/testphp.php)
but i am not sure how to add the actual dates from the php forum: http://www.myinfolab.com/phpbb/ you can see what i mean just by looking at the existing main page, where i have recent topics.
If you have any ideas please email me at funkygreendogs :at: gmail _dot_ com
thanks again,
jason

Figment · 22-07-2005 6:37pm

Can you quantify interesting articles for me please?
Where are you sourcing them?
What will be your publishing schedule?
Have you done this before and know what's involved in keeping a site updated with content?

It sounds like a lot of work on your part and before committing to something like this i would like to be sure that you would be able to keep up your commitments. Then i will know that my commitment would be used and worth it.

For a site like you mention i would suggest you get the content and discussions running for a month or two before really developing the design.

Funkygreendogs · 22-07-2005 11:21pm

Figment, i really need someone like your self to organise all the stuff. As regards articles i was hoping whomever would like to help with this site could submit some articles and myself and i know a few others.

Ok by interesting articles i mean: dream interpretation, computer security, psychology in games, computer interfacing, home electronics...etc what i am talking about basically is the day-to-day workings of my brain, usually i will be in a constant state of discovery/ideas this website will be used by myself and others who are like me to document these home projects/ideas/views on various topics, and also the forum can be used to discuss these topics and maybe find new memberswho can submit new articles.
Also i have a few websites i visit regularly and i hope to ask these sites if i can have premission to reproduce their tutorials ...etc with credit clearly stated ...etc (just an idea at this stage)

As regards a publishing schedule - there will be no strict schedule as such, it will be updated much like a blog every day or so whenever there is something new to report by any of our members.

No i have not done this before but yea i do have a fair idea knowing what its like to update the content, however there should be an update facility so that members can log in and add new articles whenever they wish or are near an internet connection.

I realise it would be smarted to do the content first however i feel it would be alot easier to get the website sorted first and have everything out of the way, that way it will be alot easier to convince people to write articles ...etc. As ive mentioned before i do have lots of ideas myself as regards content (mainly why im setting this site up) and i feel i could write an article once i have an interface to work with.
thanks,
jason

##edit## As for commitment, I have already registered the domain name so it would be stupid of me not to give my all at this, otherwise i would of wasted my money, as long as i have people around me to talk to i will have no problems staying focused on this project so you need not worry about my commitment.

The Corinthian · 23-07-2005 1:28pm

I’d have to agree with Figment here and note that your response was vague to say the least. You appear to be under the misapprehension that if you can put a site together and seed it with a few articles people will come to it.

They don’t.

Even if the idea for your site is viable (and from your description it strikes me as too generic) you still have to continually promote and update it. Otherwise few will come to it and those few will leave shortly thereafter.

Additionally, claiming a site like this is non-commercial is a little inaccurate. Non-commercial Web sites are only really so until they’re actually worth something. For example, there was a popular WAP FAQ that started up in 1999 that, while hosted and maintained by one individual, was essentially populated with articles by numerous voluntary contributors. It wasn’t commercial either, until the person who maintained it sold it in 2001 for around € 25,000 to internet.com, AFAIR.

Now I don’t begrudge anyone who can do that, but it is important to note that if someone volunteers to help out with such a project that this is the sort of thing that can happen. And if someone is coding or designing for you then ownership of the site can become even more blurred as they can still claim copyright on their work. If you’re cool with this, then fire ahead.

Funkygreendogs wrote:

##edit## As for commitment, I have already registered the domain name so it would be stupid of me not to give my all at this, otherwise i would of wasted my money, as long as i have people around me to talk to i will have no problems staying focused on this project so you need not worry about my commitment.

It can often be much more stupid to throw away good money after bad. Other than the opportunity cost of your own labour, you still have to shell out for hosting. And if the idea is fundamentally unsound to begin with or the resources are not going to be sufficient, then you will be throwing away good money after bad.

I’m sorry if I come across as pessimistic, but it’s probably better if you consider these issues before going further.

Funkygreendogs · 23-07-2005 3:00pm

I’d have to agree with Figment here and note that your response was vague to say the least. You appear to be under the misapprehension that if you can put a site together and seed it with a few articles people will come to it.

What i am hoping will bring people to the site is the quality of the articles, ive seen lots of sites featured on different extremely popular blogs for having content deemed interesting enough to link to and i am hoping in the early stages that this might get the word out. For example: Guy hacks playstation2 controller and steps through every single combination of moves using the parallel port on his computer, guy gets noticed by popular blog, blog links to site, 20,000 visitors to his site in a matter of hours. This is the kind of thing i am hoping will get the website noticed.

Even if the idea for your site is viable (and from your description it strikes me as too generic) you still have to continually promote and update it. Otherwise few will come to it and those few will leave shortly thereafter.

Yes i am fully aware that the more the website is updated the more it shall be visited, therefore the more members we can get that can write articles the more content we will have comming in, which will in turn generate new members ...etc

Additionally, claiming a site like this is non-commercial is a little inaccurate. Non-commercial Web sites are only really so until they’re actually worth something. For example, there was a popular WAP FAQ that started up in 1999 that, while hosted and maintained by one individual, was essentially populated with articles by numerous voluntary contributors. It wasn’t commercial either, until the person who maintained it sold it in 2001 for around € 25,000 to internet.com, AFAIR.

thank you for bringing this to my attention I have not though about this at all yet, and admit I dont know exactly what to do about all this legal mumbo-jumbo, however anyone who aggrees to be apart of this will most definatly own their own percentage and have their own say in things, im just not exactly sure how to put it on paper or how to certify it legally, if you know anything more about this please advise me.

It can often be much more stupid to throw away good money after bad. Other than the opportunity cost of your own labour, you still have to shell out for hosting. And if the idea is fundamentally unsound to begin with or the resources are not going to be sufficient, then you will be throwing away good money after bad.

Yes i have concidered this already and i am willing to take a chance on this as i think it could be an intellectually rewarding project even if it gets nowhere, money well spent in my books.
thanks again for all the feedback on this project and dont worry about being pessimistic, you are completly correct in doing so.
jason

rsynnott · 23-07-2005 4:37pm

The Corinthian wrote:

I’d have to agree with Figment here and note that your response was vague to say the least. You appear to be under the misapprehension that if you can put a site together and seed it with a few articles people will come to it.

They don’t.

My experience has been the opposite, but only with highly specialised articles (I popped up a MySQL C API tutorial thingy about 4 years ago and it's still very popular). However, for the generic site described you're probably right.

The Corinthian wrote:

Even if the idea for your site is viable (and from your description it strikes me as too generic) you still have to continually promote and update it. Otherwise few will come to it and those few will leave shortly thereafter.

Update, yes, promote, no. Any site with decent interesting content will self-promote. Of course, few sites have decent interesting content

The Corinthian wrote:

Additionally, claiming a site like this is non-commercial is a little inaccurate. Non-commercial Web sites are only really so until they’re actually worth something. For example, there was a popular WAP FAQ that started up in 1999 that, while hosted and maintained by one individual, was essentially populated with articles by numerous voluntary contributors. It wasn’t commercial either, until the person who maintained it sold it in 2001 for around € 25,000 to internet.com, AFAIR.

This is definitely correct; if the site becomes popular, you will be forced to use advertising to pay for hosting. At that point it becomes non-commercial. I've got a site that attracts only a 1000 or so visitors a day; without AdSense the hosting costs would be unreasonable for something that's basically a hobby to me.

The Corinthian wrote:

Now I don’t begrudge anyone who can do that, but it is important to note that if someone volunteers to help out with such a project that this is the sort of thing that can happen. And if someone is coding or designing for you then ownership of the site can become even more blurred as they can still claim copyright on their work. If you’re cool with this, then fire ahead.

It can often be much more stupid to throw away good money after bad. Other than the opportunity cost of your own labour, you still have to shell out for hosting. And if the idea is fundamentally unsound to begin with or the resources are not going to be sufficient, then you will be throwing away good money after bad.

I’m sorry if I come across as pessimistic, but it’s probably better if you consider these issues before going further.

I'd advise anyone signing up for this to at least make it very clear that they retain copyright and are simly giving the OP non-exclusive reproduction rights (which they can revoke at any time), and preferably get something in writing so that they get their due when the site inevitably (unless it folds) goes commercial.

Though really, the whole thing sounds a bit dubious to me. If you want to publish something on the internet, there's no reason to go through this guy; small-scale free hosting abounds.

Funkygreendogs · 23-07-2005 4:45pm

I'd advise anyone signing up for this to at least make it very clear that they retain copyright and are simly giving the OP non-exclusive reproduction rights (which they can revoke at any time), and preferably get something in writing so that they get their due when the site inevitably (unless it folds) goes commercial.

I would have no problem with this. I have been looking into classifying the content under cc licence http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/2.0/

And as for sounding "a bit dubious" please remember at the end of the day this is a bit of fun for people to learn and come together to pool their skills together and create something for others, if this is not what you want then fair enough. However if you feel you could contribute to this project then i would be more than happy to take you on board.
thanks again
jason

rsynnott · 23-07-2005 4:58pm

Funkygreendogs wrote:

I would have no problem with this. I have been looking into classifying the content under cc licence http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/2.0/

No, the people who WROTE the content could do so if they wished.

And as for sounding "a bit dubious" please remember at the end of the day this is a bit of fun for people to learn and come together to pool their skills together and create something for others, if this is not what you want then fair enough. However if you feel you could contribute to this project then i would be more than happy to take you on board.
thanks again
jason

As far as I can see (maybe I'm just a twisted cynic) the only real motivation for this is to make money. No, I certainly won't be contributing

If you are serious about the benefiting humanity bit, then might I suggest scrapping the project and contributing to Wikipedia?

Funkygreendogs · 23-07-2005 5:12pm

As far as I can see (maybe I'm just a twisted cynic) the only real motivation for this is to make money. No, I certainly won't be contributing If you are serious about the benefiting humanity bit, then might I suggest scrapping the project and contributing to Wikipedia?

No im afraid you are incorrect in saying so this has NOTHING to do with money, the motivation behind this is for people to learn and have a bit of fun.

If there is anyone still interested in helping me with this please keep your ideas/suggestions comming, thanks.
jason

rsynnott · 23-07-2005 5:20pm

Funkygreendogs wrote:

No im afraid you are incorrect in saying so this has NOTHING to do with money, the motivation behind this is for people to learn and have a bit of fun.

I see. The magical web-hosting fairy will provide, eh?

Funkygreendogs · 23-07-2005 5:30pm

I see. The magical web-hosting fairy will provide, eh?

As i have mentioned before, i have no problems in providing hosting fees while this thing is in its early stages, however, your suggestion that i might include advertising in the near future to pay for the webhosting as the site grows only is one i am seriously concidering, however any money generated by the website will be put back into hosting fees and upkeep.
Also please note i have no time for sarcasm in this thread this is ment for serious suggestions and ideas, while i respect your suggestions as regards hosting fees and legal problems, sarcasm will help noone, thanks again for your suggestions and keep them comming.
jason

rsynnott · 23-07-2005 9:49pm

Funkygreendogs wrote:

As i have mentioned before, i have no problems in providing hosting fees while this thing is in its early stages, however, your suggestion that i might include advertising in the near future to pay for the webhosting as the site grows only is one i am seriously concidering, however any money generated by the website will be put back into hosting fees and upkeep.

The ads will disappear after the month's hosting fees are generated, correct?

Funkygreendogs wrote:

Also please note i have no time for sarcasm in this thread this is ment for serious suggestions and ideas, while i respect your suggestions as regards hosting fees and legal problems, sarcasm will help noone, thanks again for your suggestions and keep them comming.
jason

There was no sarcasm. This may well be an idea presented completely in good faith; however you really do have to consider the surrounding issues.

Funkygreendogs · 23-07-2005 11:19pm

The ads will disappear after the month's hosting fees are generated, correct?

That is a good idea, i will definatly keep this in mind as i dont want to make it into some kind of corporate entity with all advertisments everywhere.
thanks for the feedback, please keep all your suggestions comming and apologies if i came across as harsh i will concider all your suggestions however i cannot stress enough that this is a non-commercial website for the time being and if necessary we can include advertisements to pay for the webhosting, and maybe add functionality to hide the adverts when the required monthly target has been reached.
jason

smeggle · 24-07-2005 12:42am

ever thought of using blogging software/scripts instead of the over used forum stuff?

Some are quite good like pLOG and can be extensively developed. There is umpteen forums online and a lot have been around for some time. Competition is therefore massive.
That way you can make individual sites with in a site each developed under it's own theme.

I have a sample system I could show you and explain how it works if you pm for details I'll show you how it works. Sample is for a local county free newspaper, so basically I set the main site as the 'Front Page' and created sub-sites for the different article areas, such as Food&Wine, Motoring, Life Styles etc etc.. Although it looks as one site - it's actually seen as about 1-12 individual sites. In the terms of seo optimization I have 12 sites in one, so the engines see 12 individual sites as well as the main core site.

Would suit what your describing and the template your using at your link could easily be installed. (After it's fixed from that horrible html 4.01 to the correct xhtml 1.0 standard of course

).....

rsynnott · 24-07-2005 12:58am

smeggle wrote:

ever thought of using blogging software/scripts instead of the over used forum stuff?

What a wonderful idea. It's a bit like Sputnik 2; "send an animal into space? We could purpose-build a spacecraft, or we could just shove the dog in a tin can on top of a large ICBM."

smeggle · 24-07-2005 1:04am

rsynnott wrote:

What a wonderful idea. It's a bit like Sputnik 2; "send an animal into space? We could purpose-build a spacecraft, or we could just shove the dog in a tin can on top of a large ICBM."

Huh? WTF u on about? or on for that matter?

rsynnott · 24-07-2005 1:13am

smeggle wrote:

Huh? WTF u on about? or on for that matter?

CMSs are designed for making content websites. Blogs are not. Likewise, Sputnik II (the one with Laika) was a little jury-rigged; it was a box containing a dog on top of a converted military rocket. (It didn't work; the dog died quickly; for evidence that people were weird during the cold war, you need look no further than the fact that that was classified till the 90s). Later on, proper spacecraft were designed with carrying living things in mind.

Okay, so it wasn't a good comparison

smeggle · 24-07-2005 1:32am

rsynnott wrote:

CMSs are designed for making content websites. Blogs are not. Likewise, Sputnik II (the one with Laika) was a little jury-rigged; it was a box containing a dog on top of a converted military rocket. (It didn't work; the dog died quickly; for evidence that people were weird during the cold war, you need look no further than the fact that that was classified till the 90s). Later on, proper spacecraft were designed with carrying living things in mind.

Okay, so it wasn't a good comparison

A very poor comparison really. If you understand the software/script you are using and utilise them to there fullest potential then what I've described is easily achieved. CMS's are good in some respects but can also be a royal pain in the ass to a newcomer.
With my system that I use I can create 1 main article/summary site and then set multiple sub-sites from there. I can even go into the sub-sites and set further sub-sections/sites within each. With an ability to add imagery and audio or video modules with in each section.
There is no cms as such but it would be more than adequate for what the original poster requires.

On top of that, he/she doesn't join the myraid of forum based sites that no matter how good a content they have are just that - yet another forum. Working your script/software in a unique and novel way will attract more attention than just using the same principals folk have been using for like 5-6 years now.

If you want to see a sample pm me for details and you'll see what I mean.

It's like grabbing yon old doggy there and putting him in a new space craft instead

rsynnott · 24-07-2005 1:43am

Eh, still sounds like re-inventing the square wheel to me...

Funkygreendogs · 24-07-2005 8:53pm

smeggle, this might be a good idea, a blog would definatly suite the article submission type of format im thinking about, and yes this would also stand out from the countless other forums that are out there, however it would need to be modded beyond all recognition, would it be possible to do this?

The ability to add imagery and audio or video would definatly help give the content that quality i am looking for. I would definatly like to see some samples, thanks.
jason

looking for some help

Comments