Legal to drive with AirPods?

Nharrison02 · 13-05-2019 7:21pm #1

Are AirPods legal to use while driving and is there a way to check that formally? Would I need to check with Gardai?

Eric Cartman · 13-05-2019 7:31pm

Probably not legal, definitely very dangerous and shouldnt be done.

jive · 13-05-2019 7:35pm

It’s legal, they’re just headphones

Nharrison02 · 13-05-2019 7:37pm

Eric Cartman wrote: »

Probably not legal, definitely very dangerous and shouldnt be done.

Having used both hands free kits and AirPods for having phone calls while driving I don’t understand why it’s so much more dangerous. AirPods still allow you to hear all ambient traffic noise. I agree that listening to loud music on them while driving could block out those sounds however that isn’t what I use them for.
I am trying to find out how to get a formal response on it legally rather than an opinion. I tried to get a response from the Gardai but couldn’t get an answer on it.

crazyderk · 13-05-2019 8:05pm

Here the law on using a phone while driving

http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/eli/2006/act/23/section/3/enacted/en/html

"A person shall not while driving a mechanically propelled vehicle in a public place hold a mobile phone."

“ hold ”, in relation to a mobile phone, means holding the phone by hand or supporting or cradling it with another part of the body;

So in other words, don't be touching your phone while driving!

As for Airpods

“ hands-free device ” means a device designed so that when used in conjunction with a mobile phone there is no need for the user to hold the phone by hand;

So it looks like you're good to go, however I'm quoting all this in relation to taking a phone call on Airpods, if you're listening to music and pulled over the Garda may say you were driving with undue care and attention.

SouthDublin6w · 13-05-2019 8:08pm

It’s not dangerous it’s safest way if your gonna be using a ohone. Just hope you don’t get pulled by Seamus from ballygobackwards that was bullied as a child then became a Garda he will be a **** for sure.

Mod
Whiff of an anti-rural bias there!

Credit Checker Moose · 14-05-2019 6:54am

Newsflash, deaf people can drive. There is no requirement to be able to hear ambient traffic sounds.

RayCun · 14-05-2019 9:06am

Hands-free devices are legal, but driver reaction times are just as bad when using a hands-free device as when holding the phone in their hand
https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2016/12/161213093104.htm

If you want to make a phone call, pull over.

Peregrinus · 14-05-2019 9:33am

Credit Checker Moose wrote: »

Newsflash, deaf people can drive. There is no requirement to be able to hear ambient traffic sounds.

Mmm. There's no prohibition on deaf people driving, but non-deaf drivers taking voluntary action to limit their ability to hear ambient traffic sounds would probably expose themselves to an increased risk of a charge of driving without due care and attention, on the argument they cannot attend to sounds that they cannot hear.

Be a difficult one to prove, since (as already pointed out in the thread) the mere fact that you are wearing headphones or earbuds or whatever doesn't, in itself, mean that your ability to hear ambient sound is limited. It all depends on what's playing through them, and at what volume. But it at least raises the issue of what you can hear, and a judge might be tempted to conclude that you were likely using headphones/earbuds in order to acheive a volume/degree of sound exclusion that you couldn't get with a conventional external speaker. So I think probably best to avoid this. If you must make/receive calls while driving, get a hands-free kit for your phone that doesn't involve headphones or earbuds.

Eric Cartman · 14-05-2019 4:02pm

Credit Checker Moose wrote: »

Newsflash, deaf people can drive. There is no requirement to be able to hear ambient traffic sounds.

Coping with lifelong / long term deafness is a bit different to obstructing your hearing temporarily. Also a massove difference between being deaf and having the ambient noise being blocked out by blaring music

Amirani · 14-05-2019 4:42pm

Eric Cartman wrote: »

Coping with lifelong / long term deafness is a bit different to obstructing your hearing temporarily. Also a massove difference between being deaf and having the ambient noise being blocked out by blaring music

How do you know?

Credit Checker Moose · 14-05-2019 4:50pm

Indeed.

I am 50% deaf and I can hear hardly nothing when driving. However John Law says it is ok for me to drive.

Peregrinus · 15-05-2019 2:08am

Credit Checker Moose wrote: »

Indeed.

I am 50% deaf and I can hear hardly nothing when driving. However John Law says it is ok for me to drive.

Yes. But - as you will know better than I - someone who lives with deafness is conscious of the limitations this imposes, and has likely developed coping mechanisms. I don't think this is really the same as having your ability to hear ambient sound temporarily blocked.

Carawaystick · 17-05-2019 9:53pm

Peregrinus wrote: »

Mmm. There's no prohibition on deaf people driving, but non-deaf drivers taking voluntary action to limit their ability to hear ambient traffic sounds would probably expose themselves to an increased risk of a charge of driving without due care and attention, on the argument they cannot attend to sounds that they cannot hear.

Having windows closed in a car would be a voluntary action to limit the drivers ability to hear ambient sounds also, yet I've never heard this brought up...

GM228 · 17-05-2019 9:57pm

Motorists in the UK can be convicted for having too much rubbish in their car or even holding a banana whilst stationary so AirPods seem fair game to me

GM228 · 17-05-2019 10:33pm

Peregrinus wrote: »

Mmm. There's no prohibition on deaf people driving, but non-deaf drivers taking voluntary action to limit their ability to hear ambient traffic sounds would probably expose themselves to an increased risk of a charge of driving without due care and attention, on the argument they cannot attend to sounds that they cannot hear.

Be a difficult one to prove, since (as already pointed out in the thread) the mere fact that you are wearing headphones or earbuds or whatever doesn't, in itself, mean that your ability to hear ambient sound is limited. It all depends on what's playing through them, and at what volume. But it at least raises the issue of what you can hear, and a judge might be tempted to conclude that you were likely using headphones/earbuds in order to acheive a volume/degree of sound exclusion that you couldn't get with a conventional external speaker. So I think probably best to avoid this. If you must make/receive calls while driving, get a hands-free kit for your phone that doesn't involve headphones or earbuds.

Peregrinus wrote: »

Yes. But - as you will know better than I - someone who lives with deafness is conscious of the limitations this imposes, and has likely developed coping mechanisms. I don't think this is really the same as having your ability to hear ambient sound temporarily blocked.

Hum, I disagree.

The test for a charge of driving without due care and attention is basically an appreciable falling below the standard of care and attention expected of a reasonably competent driver, creating a risk of harm to others that the reasonably competent driver would recognise and avoid - it seems to be often forgotten that an element of harm is required to others for the offence.

You would need to show the reasonably competent driver is expected to listen for ambient noise to start with, nothing in legislation or case law would prove this and the fact that a person can drive whilst deaf would defeat any such claim, you then also need to show a risk of harm to others aswell, what risk of harm is created?

It is often stated to be a catch all offence and usually is if you prove both parts of the test.

bobbyss · 19-05-2019 2:44pm

crazyderk wrote:

Here the law on using a phone while driving

What does 'driving' mean though?
Can the driver use a mobile in a car park with ignition off?
Or at the traffic lights with ignition off?

JimsAlterEgo · 20-05-2019 8:03am

bobbyss wrote: »

What does 'driving' mean though?
Can the driver use a mobile in a car park with ignition off?
Or at the traffic lights with ignition off?

a driver at traffice lights is driving, they are not in a car park

bobbyss · 20-05-2019 4:51pm

JimsAlterEgo wrote:

a driver at traffice lights is driving, they are not in a car park

I see. Even with the ignition turned off?

Credit Checker Moose · 20-05-2019 4:53pm

Yes. That is the last refuge of a desperate man.

Stopped in the course of traffic is still driving. Plenty of case law on that.

Legal to drive with AirPods?

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