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State exams Nov 2020

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13

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    #62
    Postgrad10
    Registered Users Posts: 2,792 ✭✭✭Postgrad10


    What’s the reasoning behind the SEC hiring a superintendent and the school having their own centre superintendent ? Is it purely the SEC making sure the school is following correct procedures ?


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    #63
    Leftwaffe
    Registered Users Posts: 1,548 ✭✭✭Leftwaffe


    Postgrad10 wrote: »
    What’s the reasoning behind the SEC hiring a superintendent and the school having their own centre superintendent ? Is it purely the SEC making sure the school is following correct procedures ?

    Maybe, not sure really. But the external can invigilate exams with a single student in them which is good. Makes it easier on recruitment.


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    #64
    LW2018
    Registered Users Posts: 114 ✭✭LW2018


    Redordeadqwwer wrote: »
    Maybe, not sure really. But the external can invigilate exams with a single student in them which is good. Makes it easier on recruitment.

    Is that true? I hadn't seen that and have began the recruitment process... must check that out... more over and back!


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    #65
    LW2018
    Registered Users Posts: 114 ✭✭LW2018


    The circular says that the external superintendent will only invalidate in the instance where there is only one candidate entered to sit in the school - I think this means one candidate as opposed to 5 candidates and certain days where one of them is only sitting one subject if that makes sense. If you have more than one student coming back to sit the exams, you'll have to recruit superintendents, even if there are days that only one of them are in... That's how I read the line anyway??

    "The external superintendent will not invigilate any examination session due to the scale and scope of their responsibilities other than in the very limited circumstances which will apply where there is only one candidate entered to sit in the school".

    I'd say it is very likely that there will be a number of exam sessions where only one candidate is sitting that exam session across all schools.

    But thoughts are welcome...


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    #66
    Leftwaffe
    Registered Users Posts: 1,548 ✭✭✭Leftwaffe


    LW2018 wrote: »
    The circular says that the external superintendent will only invalidate in the instance where there is only one candidate entered to sit in the school - I think this means one candidate as opposed to 5 candidates and certain days where one of them is only sitting one subject if that makes sense. If you have more than one student coming back to sit the exams, you'll have to recruit superintendents, even if there are days that only one of them are in... That's how I read the line anyway??

    "The external superintendent will not invigilate any examination session due to the scale and scope of their responsibilities other than in the very limited circumstances which will apply where there is only one candidate entered to sit in the school".

    I'd say it is very likely that there will be a number of exam sessions where only one candidate is sitting that exam session across all schools.

    But thoughts are welcome...

    I have called them twice and clarified this with them. The external superintendent will invigilate the exams where only one student is entered. I told them I had a certain amount of sessions and in a certain number of these there will be only 1 student. They said that the external superintendent will have to invigilate this if I ask them to do so.

    However, you make a good point and upon reading it, it does sound like what you’ve suggested. I might go back for more clarity on Monday. Has anyone received more correspondence from the SEC?

    Edit: Rhis also the wording on the circular I have: “ The only exception to this arrangement will apply in situations where there is only one candidate entry for the school. In that situation, the SEC-appointed Superintendent will invigilate at the examinations involved”


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    #67
    LW2018
    Registered Users Posts: 114 ✭✭LW2018


    Clarity on this issue will be interesting but I can see how it could be interpreted either way. I’ve all but three sessions filled now and I’m sticking with whom I have as they are willing to do it and have made plans to do so. I wonder will we hear next week from our external SEC Aide and the collection point details


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    #68
    Seannew1
    Registered Users Posts: 979 ✭✭✭Seannew1


    Have SEC external superintendents been appointed yet?


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    #69
    Leftwaffe
    Registered Users Posts: 1,548 ✭✭✭Leftwaffe


    LW2018 wrote: »
    Clarity on this issue will be interesting but I can see how it could be interpreted either way. I’ve all but three sessions filled now and I’m sticking with whom I have as they are willing to do it and have made plans to do so. I wonder will we hear next week from our external SEC Aide and the collection point details

    I'll call Monday and find out for sure but I said to to them twice, two different people, and I was assured the external would invigilate exams with only 1 student in them.

    But I really don't think they're that organised so my confidence in that is kind of gone now. I've nobody appointed as the external was to do the singular exams and management have said they'll open a recruitment process for other superintendents.

    We better receive correspondence early next week, I'm getting a bit anxious now. Hate not knowing the finer details, just want to get everything in line. Got an attendant sorted.


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    #70
    km79
    Registered Users Posts: 48,137 ✭✭✭✭km79


    It is absolutely daft that the SEC superintendent can invigilate exams with one student in them but not ones with 2/3/4/5.
    Sure it’s still only one centre
    Daft . Uneconomical. We will all be paying for this type of silliness from next year Budget on for a long time


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    #71
    Postgrad10
    Registered Users Posts: 2,792 ✭✭✭Postgrad10


    I heard of an SEC external superintendent who has been given one day to superintend. They really had to sell it to him as it’s very little work.


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    #72
    LW2018
    Registered Users Posts: 114 ✭✭LW2018


    Redordeadqwwer wrote: »
    I'll call Monday and find out for sure but I said to to them twice, two different people, and I was assured the external would invigilate exams with only 1 student in them.

    But I really don't think they're that organised so my confidence in that is kind of gone now. I've nobody appointed as the external was to do the singular exams and management have said they'll open a recruitment process for other superintendents.

    We better receive correspondence early next week, I'm getting a bit anxious now. Hate not knowing the finer details, just want to get everything in line. Got an attendant sorted.

    Just went searching on the website and found an updated circular which is based on what you’re saying about the SEC superintendent. The one I was reading was from when the matrix was sent out. The new one is far more detailed. Between Year Head work and the LWR work I see the principal every day but these new circulars are possibly buried in his office. Will check again on Monday though. I’ll feel bad after having all the exams sorted with PME students etc. The rate of pay has increased. Schools have to make contact with the SEC superintendent to meet us on Sunday the 15th to securely lock away the exams and for them to check the scripts etc. Covid contact tracing forms need to be filled as well. I’m going to get an attendant too for a nice bit of pocket money for them


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    #73
    Leftwaffe
    Registered Users Posts: 1,548 ✭✭✭Leftwaffe


    LW2018 wrote: »
    Just went searching on the website and found an updated circular which is based on what you’re saying about the SEC superintendent. The one I was reading was from when the matrix was sent out. The new one is far more detailed. Between Year Head work and the LWR work I see the principal every day but these new circulars are possibly buried in his office. Will check again on Monday though. I’ll feel bad after having all the exams sorted with PME students etc. The rate of pay has increased. Schools have to make contact with the SEC superintendent to meet us on Sunday the 15th to securely lock away the exams and for them to check the scripts etc. Covid contact tracing forms need to be filled as well. I’m going to get an attendant too for a nice bit of pocket money for them

    What website is this sorry? Could do with seeing that updated circular. When do we find out who our external is? Lot of information missing at the moment.

    Any help appreciated.

    Edit: SEC website I’m assuming I’m half asleep.


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    #74
    Postgrad10
    Registered Users Posts: 2,792 ✭✭✭Postgrad10


    I’m assuming like previous years, the SEC Superintendent will make contact with the school authorities once they receive their appointment letter.


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    #75
    LW2018
    Registered Users Posts: 114 ✭✭LW2018


    Redordeadqwwer wrote: »
    What website is this sorry? Could do with seeing that updated circular. When do we find out who our external is? Lot of information missing at the moment.

    Any help appreciated.

    Edit: SEC website I’m assuming I’m half asleep.

    https://www.examinations.ie/schools/

    If you use the drop down list under Exam Superintendents you’ll see all the relevant forms including rates of pay and claim forms. The circular 21/20 is there which appears to be the most up-TP-date one.

    I’m sure it will be up to the External to make contact but all of this has to happen during the next school week!


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    #76
    Postgrad10
    Registered Users Posts: 2,792 ✭✭✭Postgrad10


    Externals were only being informed at the end of last week and that pattern of response is the same at the normal SEC exams.


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    #77
    Leftwaffe
    Registered Users Posts: 1,548 ✭✭✭Leftwaffe


    I’m going to call again today but a circular on the SEC website addressed to the principal states the following in relation to external superintendents invigilating exams:

    “For the November Examinations, Superintendents will be appointed by schools to invigilate examinations, similar to arrangements for special centres in previous years. Schools may appoint one superintendent per examination centre.

    Schools will deploy superintendents to both main and special centres.

    The only exception to this arrangement will apply in situations where there is only one centre. In this situation, the SEC appointed superintendent will invigilate at the examinations involved.”

    Does this mean they can invigilate all exams if the school has only 1 centre? Talk about mixed messaging.


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    #78
    Leftwaffe
    Registered Users Posts: 1,548 ✭✭✭Leftwaffe


    Alright so some clarification.

    Called the SEC and they said the External Superintendent can invigilate ALL exams.

    In the exams where there is more than 1 student, it is at the discretion of the school whether they wish to wish to hire another superintendent.

    This is obviously discounting the need for special centres.


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    #79
    km79
    Registered Users Posts: 48,137 ✭✭✭✭km79


    Redordeadqwwer wrote: »
    Alright so some clarification.

    Called the SEC and they said the External Superintendent can invigilate ALL exams.

    In the exams where there is more than 1 student, it is at the discretion of the school whether they wish to wish to hire another superintendent.

    This is obviously discounting the need for special centres.

    That makes more sense
    Get the feeling they are just making it up as they go along .......


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    #80
    Bananaleaf
    Registered Users Posts: 2,921 ✭✭✭Bananaleaf


    Read all 6 pages. Well, I scanned them if I'm honest! Don't see any mention of payment. Are superintendents paid the same day rate as we would have been in June?


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    #81
    Leftwaffe
    Registered Users Posts: 1,548 ✭✭✭Leftwaffe


    Bananaleaf wrote: »
    Read all 6 pages. Well, I scanned them if I'm honest! Don't see any mention of payment. Are superintendents paid the same day rate as we would have been in June?

    If you check the link to the SEC page above there should be a PDF on there containing info about superintendent payment. Fairly sure I read the rates today.


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    #82
    Leftwaffe
    Registered Users Posts: 1,548 ✭✭✭Leftwaffe


    km79 wrote: »
    That makes more sense
    Get the feeling they are just making it up as they go along .......

    Makes no sense but he was adamant on the phone and said they’ve had an abundance of calls about it. Makes my life easier so suits me.


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    #83
    Bananaleaf
    Registered Users Posts: 2,921 ✭✭✭Bananaleaf


    Redordeadqwwer wrote: »
    If you check the link to the SEC page above there should be a PDF on there containing info about superintendent payment. Fairly sure I read the rates today.

    Well, they didn't make that easy to find!!

    Evening rate of €118.04 and weekend rate of €236.08 per day if anyone is interested - save you looking :)


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    #84
    LW2018
    Registered Users Posts: 114 ✭✭LW2018


    Redordeadqwwer wrote: »


    Makes no sense but he was adamant on the phone and said they’ve had an abundance of calls about it. Makes my life easier so suits me.

    I've never been more frustrated with the SEC than I have with this and I've been doing the EA role for years. From changing the criteria after the pre-planning stage has begun by many. I explained this to some person in the Superintendenting section today and he told me to remove any supervisor I had appointed for an exam where only one candidate is sitting that exam. I went back to the this person to say three exams are no longer needed.

    Got an envelope from the Principal with all the details and the centre roll etc. today and the line in the circular (21/20) states:

    NB: In situations where there is only one centre, the SEC appointed superintendent will invigilate at the examinations involved.


    I only have one centre for the full run of these exams as there are no special centres so I have emailed (4th time over and back since this morning) seeking clarity on whether I now need to remove ALL the people that have altered their schedules, rearranged grinds etc. to help facilitate THEIR exams. I explained my frustration at the lack of organisation and clarity and the difficult position that I was put in today cancelling the work for one supervisor and reassuring the others that they were still needed and yet I may have to go back and tell them that, no, they actually are not required, looking for inept than ever.

    Glad to hear that they said it is at the school's discretion, because I will be allowing them continue in that role if that is the case. They should have waited and thought all of this through before issuing guidelines and instructions to keep changing them. The Principal said he would ring and let them know that we have no EA and have nobody to fill the role if I wanted to park it - he understood the frustration.


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    #85
    Leftwaffe
    Registered Users Posts: 1,548 ✭✭✭Leftwaffe


    LW2018 wrote: »
    I've never been more frustrated with the SEC than I have with this and I've been doing the EA role for years. From changing the criteria after the pre-planning stage has begun by many. I explained this to some person in the Superintendenting section today and he told me to remove any supervisor I had appointed for an exam where only one candidate is sitting that exam. I went back to the this person to say three exams are no longer needed.

    Got an envelope from the Principal with all the details and the centre roll etc. today and the line in the circular (21/20) states:

    NB: In situations where there is only one centre, the SEC appointed superintendent will invigilate at the examinations involved.


    I only have one centre for the full run of these exams as there are no special centres so I have emailed (4th time over and back since this morning) seeking clarity on whether I now need to remove ALL the people that have altered their schedules, rearranged grinds etc. to help facilitate THEIR exams. I explained my frustration at the lack of organisation and clarity and the difficult position that I was put in today cancelling the work for one supervisor and reassuring the others that they were still needed and yet I may have to go back and tell them that, no, they actually are not required, looking for inept than ever.

    Glad to hear that they said it is at the school's discretion, because I will be allowing them continue in that role if that is the case. They should have waited and thought all of this through before issuing guidelines and instructions to keep changing them. The Principal said he would ring and let them know that we have no EA and have nobody to fill the role if I wanted to park it - he understood the frustration.

    Jesus sounds a disaster to be honest. Not fair really is it. I'm lucky I hadn't appointed anyone so it worked out OK in that sense but can see your point. Different circulars have had different things written on them, bit of a joke.

    If you're looking to get in contact with quickly Id recommend calling them. I have two numbers for them and also a direct line number to the superintendents section which were very helpful too. DM if you need them.


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    #86
    LW2018
    Registered Users Posts: 114 ✭✭LW2018


    Redordeadqwwer wrote: »
    Jesus sounds a disaster to be honest. Not fair really is it. I'm lucky I hadn't appointed anyone so it worked out OK in that sense but can see your point. Different circulars have had different things written on them, bit of a joke.

    If you're looking to get in contact with quickly Id recommend calling them. I have two numbers for them and also a direct line number to the superintendents section which were very helpful too. DM if you need them.

    Will send you a DM thanks


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    #87
    Leftwaffe
    Registered Users Posts: 1,548 ✭✭✭Leftwaffe


    Has anyone heard where their distribution centre is yet? Haven't received any more correspondence


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    #88
    LW2018
    Registered Users Posts: 114 ✭✭LW2018


    Heard from the SEC appointed Superintendent today but no word yet on the collection depot nor the time so I couldn't arrange a time with the Aide to meet. We might find out.... Sunday morning?!!!


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    #89
    djemba djemba
    Registered Users Posts: 2,579 ✭✭✭djemba djemba


    How soon after the exams do the papers go up online.


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    #90
    RealJohn
    Registered Users Posts: 2,099 ✭✭✭RealJohn


    djemba djemba wrote: »
    How soon after the exams do the papers go up online.
    I was wondering that myself. Usually they’re up straight away these days, but 2020 isn’t even an option on the list yet. Has the procedure changed?


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    #91
    ccazza
    Registered Users Posts: 272 ✭✭ccazza


    djemba djemba wrote: »
    How soon after the exams do the papers go up online.

    They are being put up next Monday for the exams that have been sat the week before. They are only being published if someone actually sat the exam. They will do this each week for the duration of the exams.


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