State exams Nov 2020

km79 · 31-10-2020 7:29pm

Redordeadqwwer wrote: »

Is the EA expected to recruit superintendents from existing staff? That's ridiculous no? Can't see many candidates emerging from our place.

And how does one go about "sharing" the role also? Gonna be a long two weeks on my own doing it but could do with the cash. We've only a handful doing it so I'm not sure if we will be required to be there for every might yet.

Yep I read the circular earlier
Exam aide has to sort it all pretty much
The sec appointed superintendent seems to do damn all !

LW2018 · 31-10-2020 10:01pm

Redordeadqwwer wrote: »

Is the EA expected to recruit superintendents from existing staff? That's ridiculous no? Can't see many candidates emerging from our place.

And how does one go about "sharing" the role also? Gonna be a long two weeks on my own doing it but could do with the cash. We've only a handful doing it so I'm not sure if we will be required to be there for every might yet.

Have you received the matrix of students sitting it and the exams they are taking? It came to schools last Thursday. That'll tell you how many nights you have to be in for... and a Sunday trip to collect the week of exam papers too - tight enough turnaround to get supervisors together

Leftwaffe · 31-10-2020 11:30pm

LW2018 wrote: »

Have you received the matrix of students sitting it and the exams they are taking? It came to schools last Thursday. That'll tell you how many nights you have to be in for... and a Sunday trip to collect the week of exam papers too - tight enough turnaround to get supervisors together

No, haven't received anything yet only got the call the other day. Will find out Monday I think. My only concern is the hiring superintendents part, I don't think many if any at all will do that in our place.

LW2018 · 01-11-2020 11:32am

Redordeadqwwer wrote: »

No, haven't received anything yet only got the call the other day. Will find out Monday I think. My only concern is the hiring superintendents part, I don't think many if any at all will do that in our place.

I think the SEC themselves will run into difficulty getting a superintendent on their behalf for each school. I’ll be in the same boat with my gang... between after-school study, grinds, families, personal commitments etc. and the fact that they’ll get about 30 euro after tax for the session will not appeal to them. I’ve no exams into week 4 luckily. We’ll see what comes of this week. Twice I’ve emailed the address in the circular and they’ve yet to come back to me so I don’t think they’ve this completed organised on their end. Still can’t work out the Sunday issue... collecting the exam paper box on a Sunday for the next week of exams ... is it very early in the morning to be in school to open up etc? Can’t be in two places at once! Will you be opening and locking up over the weekend exams and the late night finishes?

Leftwaffe · 02-11-2020 11:40pm

LW2018 wrote: »

I think the SEC themselves will run into difficulty getting a superintendent on their behalf for each school. I’ll be in the same boat with my gang... between after-school study, grinds, families, personal commitments etc. and the fact that they’ll get about 30 euro after tax for the session will not appeal to them. I’ve no exams into week 4 luckily. We’ll see what comes of this week. Twice I’ve emailed the address in the circular and they’ve yet to come back to me so I don’t think they’ve this completed organised on their end. Still can’t work out the Sunday issue... collecting the exam paper box on a Sunday for the next week of exams ... is it very early in the morning to be in school to open up etc? Can’t be in two places at once! Will you be opening and locking up over the weekend exams and the late night finishes?

I called today over a small query and the woman was very helpful to be fair. I’m not sure about the Sunday query but I’m hoping my distribution centre isn’t too far away. A bit of help from management might sort it.

I won’t be opening and closing the building, facilities management will be doing this thankfully.

Am I correct in saying we can get the external superintendent to invigilate exams with only one student in it?

LW2018 · 04-11-2020 10:13pm

Redordeadqwwer wrote: »

I called today over a small query and the woman was very helpful to be fair. I’m not sure about the Sunday query but I’m hoping my distribution centre isn’t too far away. A bit of help from management might sort it.

I won’t be opening and closing the building, facilities management will be doing this thankfully.

Am I correct in saying we can get the external superintendent to invigilate exams with only one student in it?

They got back to me eventually. The days of the collection of scripts means you have to appoint a different EA for those days. That’s what the email back to me said. We, as EA, appoint the superintendents for the exams who will be in the room with the students. Are you appointing an Attendant? I’ve keys for school so I don’t mind the opening element really. I’ve split the role though with another because I just can’t give over that many evenings and the split works perfectly.

Leftwaffe · 04-11-2020 10:36pm

LW2018 wrote: »

They got back to me eventually. The days of the collection of scripts means you have to appoint a different EA for those days. That’s what the email back to me said. We, as EA, appoint the superintendents for the exams who will be in the room with the students. Are you appointing an Attendant? I’ve keys for school so I don’t mind the opening element really. I’ve split the role though with another because I just can’t give over that many evenings and the split works perfectly.

I've made a few calls now and they're been fairly responsive to be fair. OK so a different EA for them days. I've only one Sunday so not too bad that way. Yes getting one attendant I think, may aswell. Its only working out as 9 days in total for me, two at weekend. No sign of any further information will it be sent to the school?

LW2018 · 05-11-2020 12:16am

Redordeadqwwer wrote: »

I've made a few calls now and they're been fairly responsive to be fair. OK so a different EA for them days. I've only one Sunday so not too bad that way. Yes getting one attendant I think, may aswell. Its only working out as 9 days in total for me, two at weekend. No sign of any further information will it be sent to the school?

I’ve three Sundays to collect papers... the Sunday before the beginning of the exams... then the Sunday before week 2 and the Sunday before Week 3. I’ve no exams in week 4 but all final papers are collected for week 3 and 4. Going to look into an attendant too because they may as well benefit from it with payment... more info will come to school I’d say this week or early next week to finalise things. I think the depot for me is about 40 mins away. We’ll have to be given a letter to grant us access for the exam papers

Leftwaffe · 05-11-2020 12:27am

LW2018 wrote: »

I’ve three Sundays to collect papers... the Sunday before the beginning of the exams... then the Sunday before week 2 and the Sunday before Week 3. I’ve no exams in week 4 but all final papers are collected for week 3 and 4. Going to look into an attendant too because they may as well benefit from it with payment... more info will come to school I’d say this week or early next week to finalise things. I think the depot for me is about 40 mins away. We’ll have to be given a letter to grant us access for the exam papers

Sorry but what do you mean by "all final papers are collected for week 3 and 4"? I've no exam in week four either so just curious.

LW2018 · 05-11-2020 10:25pm

Redordeadqwwer wrote: »

Sorry but what do you mean by "all final papers are collected for week 3 and 4"? I've no exam in week four either so just curious.

We collect on the 15th for Week one exams, collect again on the 22nd for Week 2 exams and then on the 29th for the exams in Week 3 and Week 4 - we have none in week four either so it'll be less exam papers collected. It is counted as a day of Exam Aide work though (as far as I can work out) and you can claim for travel expenses too

Postgrad10 · 05-11-2020 10:25pm

What’s the reasoning behind the SEC hiring a superintendent and the school having their own centre superintendent ? Is it purely the SEC making sure the school is following correct procedures ?

Leftwaffe · 05-11-2020 10:39pm

Postgrad10 wrote: »

What’s the reasoning behind the SEC hiring a superintendent and the school having their own centre superintendent ? Is it purely the SEC making sure the school is following correct procedures ?

Maybe, not sure really. But the external can invigilate exams with a single student in them which is good. Makes it easier on recruitment.

LW2018 · 06-11-2020 9:11am

Redordeadqwwer wrote: »

Maybe, not sure really. But the external can invigilate exams with a single student in them which is good. Makes it easier on recruitment.

Is that true? I hadn't seen that and have began the recruitment process... must check that out... more over and back!

LW2018 · 06-11-2020 9:26am

The circular says that the external superintendent will only invalidate in the instance where there is only one candidate entered to sit in the school - I think this means one candidate as opposed to 5 candidates and certain days where one of them is only sitting one subject if that makes sense. If you have more than one student coming back to sit the exams, you'll have to recruit superintendents, even if there are days that only one of them are in... That's how I read the line anyway??

"The external superintendent will not invigilate any examination session due to the scale and scope of their responsibilities other than in the very limited circumstances which will apply where there is only one candidate entered to sit in the school".

I'd say it is very likely that there will be a number of exam sessions where only one candidate is sitting that exam session across all schools.

But thoughts are welcome...

Leftwaffe · 06-11-2020 7:27pm

LW2018 wrote: »

The circular says that the external superintendent will only invalidate in the instance where there is only one candidate entered to sit in the school - I think this means one candidate as opposed to 5 candidates and certain days where one of them is only sitting one subject if that makes sense. If you have more than one student coming back to sit the exams, you'll have to recruit superintendents, even if there are days that only one of them are in... That's how I read the line anyway??

"The external superintendent will not invigilate any examination session due to the scale and scope of their responsibilities other than in the very limited circumstances which will apply where there is only one candidate entered to sit in the school".

I'd say it is very likely that there will be a number of exam sessions where only one candidate is sitting that exam session across all schools.

But thoughts are welcome...

I have called them twice and clarified this with them. The external superintendent will invigilate the exams where only one student is entered. I told them I had a certain amount of sessions and in a certain number of these there will be only 1 student. They said that the external superintendent will have to invigilate this if I ask them to do so.

However, you make a good point and upon reading it, it does sound like what you’ve suggested. I might go back for more clarity on Monday. Has anyone received more correspondence from the SEC?

Edit: Rhis also the wording on the circular I have: “ The only exception to this arrangement will apply in situations where there is only one candidate entry for the school. In that situation, the SEC-appointed Superintendent will invigilate at the examinations involved”

LW2018 · 06-11-2020 8:07pm

Clarity on this issue will be interesting but I can see how it could be interpreted either way. I’ve all but three sessions filled now and I’m sticking with whom I have as they are willing to do it and have made plans to do so. I wonder will we hear next week from our external SEC Aide and the collection point details

Seannew1 · 06-11-2020 8:27pm

Have SEC external superintendents been appointed yet?

Leftwaffe · 06-11-2020 8:42pm

LW2018 wrote: »

Clarity on this issue will be interesting but I can see how it could be interpreted either way. I’ve all but three sessions filled now and I’m sticking with whom I have as they are willing to do it and have made plans to do so. I wonder will we hear next week from our external SEC Aide and the collection point details

I'll call Monday and find out for sure but I said to to them twice, two different people, and I was assured the external would invigilate exams with only 1 student in them.

But I really don't think they're that organised so my confidence in that is kind of gone now. I've nobody appointed as the external was to do the singular exams and management have said they'll open a recruitment process for other superintendents.

We better receive correspondence early next week, I'm getting a bit anxious now. Hate not knowing the finer details, just want to get everything in line. Got an attendant sorted.

km79 · 06-11-2020 9:14pm

It is absolutely daft that the SEC superintendent can invigilate exams with one student in them but not ones with 2/3/4/5.
Sure it’s still only one centre
Daft . Uneconomical. We will all be paying for this type of silliness from next year Budget on for a long time

Postgrad10 · 06-11-2020 9:39pm

I heard of an SEC external superintendent who has been given one day to superintend. They really had to sell it to him as it’s very little work.

LW2018 · 06-11-2020 10:11pm

Redordeadqwwer wrote: »

I'll call Monday and find out for sure but I said to to them twice, two different people, and I was assured the external would invigilate exams with only 1 student in them.

But I really don't think they're that organised so my confidence in that is kind of gone now. I've nobody appointed as the external was to do the singular exams and management have said they'll open a recruitment process for other superintendents.

We better receive correspondence early next week, I'm getting a bit anxious now. Hate not knowing the finer details, just want to get everything in line. Got an attendant sorted.

Just went searching on the website and found an updated circular which is based on what you’re saying about the SEC superintendent. The one I was reading was from when the matrix was sent out. The new one is far more detailed. Between Year Head work and the LWR work I see the principal every day but these new circulars are possibly buried in his office. Will check again on Monday though. I’ll feel bad after having all the exams sorted with PME students etc. The rate of pay has increased. Schools have to make contact with the SEC superintendent to meet us on Sunday the 15th to securely lock away the exams and for them to check the scripts etc. Covid contact tracing forms need to be filled as well. I’m going to get an attendant too for a nice bit of pocket money for them

Leftwaffe · 06-11-2020 10:43pm

LW2018 wrote: »

Just went searching on the website and found an updated circular which is based on what you’re saying about the SEC superintendent. The one I was reading was from when the matrix was sent out. The new one is far more detailed. Between Year Head work and the LWR work I see the principal every day but these new circulars are possibly buried in his office. Will check again on Monday though. I’ll feel bad after having all the exams sorted with PME students etc. The rate of pay has increased. Schools have to make contact with the SEC superintendent to meet us on Sunday the 15th to securely lock away the exams and for them to check the scripts etc. Covid contact tracing forms need to be filled as well. I’m going to get an attendant too for a nice bit of pocket money for them

What website is this sorry? Could do with seeing that updated circular. When do we find out who our external is? Lot of information missing at the moment.

Any help appreciated.

Edit: SEC website I’m assuming I’m half asleep.

Postgrad10 · 06-11-2020 11:40pm

I’m assuming like previous years, the SEC Superintendent will make contact with the school authorities once they receive their appointment letter.

LW2018 · 07-11-2020 2:59pm

Redordeadqwwer wrote: »

What website is this sorry? Could do with seeing that updated circular. When do we find out who our external is? Lot of information missing at the moment.

Any help appreciated.

Edit: SEC website I’m assuming I’m half asleep.

https://www.examinations.ie/schools/

If you use the drop down list under Exam Superintendents you’ll see all the relevant forms including rates of pay and claim forms. The circular 21/20 is there which appears to be the most up-TP-date one.

I’m sure it will be up to the External to make contact but all of this has to happen during the next school week!

Postgrad10 · 08-11-2020 12:51pm

Externals were only being informed at the end of last week and that pattern of response is the same at the normal SEC exams.

Leftwaffe · 09-11-2020 10:49am

I’m going to call again today but a circular on the SEC website addressed to the principal states the following in relation to external superintendents invigilating exams:

“For the November Examinations, Superintendents will be appointed by schools to invigilate examinations, similar to arrangements for special centres in previous years. Schools may appoint one superintendent per examination centre.

Schools will deploy superintendents to both main and special centres.

The only exception to this arrangement will apply in situations where there is only one centre. In this situation, the SEC appointed superintendent will invigilate at the examinations involved.”

Does this mean they can invigilate all exams if the school has only 1 centre? Talk about mixed messaging.

Leftwaffe · 09-11-2020 3:19pm

Alright so some clarification.

Called the SEC and they said the External Superintendent can invigilate ALL exams.

In the exams where there is more than 1 student, it is at the discretion of the school whether they wish to wish to hire another superintendent.

This is obviously discounting the need for special centres.

km79 · 09-11-2020 7:20pm

Redordeadqwwer wrote: »

Alright so some clarification.

Called the SEC and they said the External Superintendent can invigilate ALL exams.

In the exams where there is more than 1 student, it is at the discretion of the school whether they wish to wish to hire another superintendent.

This is obviously discounting the need for special centres.

That makes more sense
Get the feeling they are just making it up as they go along .......

Bananaleaf · 09-11-2020 7:21pm

Read all 6 pages. Well, I scanned them if I'm honest! Don't see any mention of payment. Are superintendents paid the same day rate as we would have been in June?

Leftwaffe · 09-11-2020 7:47pm

Bananaleaf wrote: »

Read all 6 pages. Well, I scanned them if I'm honest! Don't see any mention of payment. Are superintendents paid the same day rate as we would have been in June?

If you check the link to the SEC page above there should be a PDF on there containing info about superintendent payment. Fairly sure I read the rates today.

Leftwaffe · 09-11-2020 7:50pm

km79 wrote: »

That makes more sense
Get the feeling they are just making it up as they go along .......

Makes no sense but he was adamant on the phone and said they’ve had an abundance of calls about it. Makes my life easier so suits me.

Bananaleaf · 09-11-2020 8:37pm

Redordeadqwwer wrote: »

If you check the link to the SEC page above there should be a PDF on there containing info about superintendent payment. Fairly sure I read the rates today.

Well, they didn't make that easy to find!!

Evening rate of €118.04 and weekend rate of €236.08 per day if anyone is interested - save you looking

LW2018 · 09-11-2020 8:41pm

Redordeadqwwer wrote: »

Makes no sense but he was adamant on the phone and said they’ve had an abundance of calls about it. Makes my life easier so suits me.

I've never been more frustrated with the SEC than I have with this and I've been doing the EA role for years. From changing the criteria after the pre-planning stage has begun by many. I explained this to some person in the Superintendenting section today and he told me to remove any supervisor I had appointed for an exam where only one candidate is sitting that exam. I went back to the this person to say three exams are no longer needed.

Got an envelope from the Principal with all the details and the centre roll etc. today and the line in the circular (21/20) states:

NB: In situations where there is only one centre, the SEC appointed superintendent will invigilate at the examinations involved.

I only have one centre for the full run of these exams as there are no special centres so I have emailed (4th time over and back since this morning) seeking clarity on whether I now need to remove ALL the people that have altered their schedules, rearranged grinds etc. to help facilitate THEIR exams. I explained my frustration at the lack of organisation and clarity and the difficult position that I was put in today cancelling the work for one supervisor and reassuring the others that they were still needed and yet I may have to go back and tell them that, no, they actually are not required, looking for inept than ever.

Glad to hear that they said it is at the school's discretion, because I will be allowing them continue in that role if that is the case. They should have waited and thought all of this through before issuing guidelines and instructions to keep changing them. The Principal said he would ring and let them know that we have no EA and have nobody to fill the role if I wanted to park it - he understood the frustration.

Leftwaffe · 09-11-2020 10:07pm

LW2018 wrote: »

I've never been more frustrated with the SEC than I have with this and I've been doing the EA role for years. From changing the criteria after the pre-planning stage has begun by many. I explained this to some person in the Superintendenting section today and he told me to remove any supervisor I had appointed for an exam where only one candidate is sitting that exam. I went back to the this person to say three exams are no longer needed.

Got an envelope from the Principal with all the details and the centre roll etc. today and the line in the circular (21/20) states:

NB: In situations where there is only one centre, the SEC appointed superintendent will invigilate at the examinations involved.

I only have one centre for the full run of these exams as there are no special centres so I have emailed (4th time over and back since this morning) seeking clarity on whether I now need to remove ALL the people that have altered their schedules, rearranged grinds etc. to help facilitate THEIR exams. I explained my frustration at the lack of organisation and clarity and the difficult position that I was put in today cancelling the work for one supervisor and reassuring the others that they were still needed and yet I may have to go back and tell them that, no, they actually are not required, looking for inept than ever.

Glad to hear that they said it is at the school's discretion, because I will be allowing them continue in that role if that is the case. They should have waited and thought all of this through before issuing guidelines and instructions to keep changing them. The Principal said he would ring and let them know that we have no EA and have nobody to fill the role if I wanted to park it - he understood the frustration.

Jesus sounds a disaster to be honest. Not fair really is it. I'm lucky I hadn't appointed anyone so it worked out OK in that sense but can see your point. Different circulars have had different things written on them, bit of a joke.

If you're looking to get in contact with quickly Id recommend calling them. I have two numbers for them and also a direct line number to the superintendents section which were very helpful too. DM if you need them.

LW2018 · 09-11-2020 10:37pm

Redordeadqwwer wrote: »

Jesus sounds a disaster to be honest. Not fair really is it. I'm lucky I hadn't appointed anyone so it worked out OK in that sense but can see your point. Different circulars have had different things written on them, bit of a joke.

If you're looking to get in contact with quickly Id recommend calling them. I have two numbers for them and also a direct line number to the superintendents section which were very helpful too. DM if you need them.

Will send you a DM thanks

Leftwaffe · 11-11-2020 2:16pm

Has anyone heard where their distribution centre is yet? Haven't received any more correspondence

LW2018 · 11-11-2020 6:33pm

Heard from the SEC appointed Superintendent today but no word yet on the collection depot nor the time so I couldn't arrange a time with the Aide to meet. We might find out.... Sunday morning?!!!

djemba djemba · 20-11-2020 5:52pm

How soon after the exams do the papers go up online.

RealJohn · 20-11-2020 6:24pm

djemba djemba wrote: »

How soon after the exams do the papers go up online.

I was wondering that myself. Usually they’re up straight away these days, but 2020 isn’t even an option on the list yet. Has the procedure changed?

ccazza · 20-11-2020 6:26pm

djemba djemba wrote: »

How soon after the exams do the papers go up online.

They are being put up next Monday for the exams that have been sat the week before. They are only being published if someone actually sat the exam. They will do this each week for the duration of the exams.

RealJohn · 20-11-2020 9:18pm

Surely all of the exams will have at least one student sitting them, other than maybe some of the ordinary/foundation level papers, or really niche ones like the non-curricular languages?
Maybe a few of the junior cert/cycle subjects won't have anyone alright.

LW2018 · 21-11-2020 2:19pm

RealJohn wrote: »

Surely all of the exams will have at least one student sitting them, other than maybe some of the ordinary/foundation level papers, or really niche ones like the non-curricular languages?
Maybe a few of the junior cert/cycle subjects won't have anyone alright.

I'm hoping for some Junior Cycle papers to see what was to be that year but again, may be more unlikely

RealJohn · 21-11-2020 2:28pm

I figure the ones I’m interested in are reasonably likely to be sat by at least one candidate, but I suppose I can’t be sure of that.

gaiscioch · 21-11-2020 2:46pm

Anybody take a photo, or come across a photo, of yesterday’s History HL paper? Nobody sitting it in our school so the exam person didn’t get a copy of it sent to the school. Also, strange how there doesn’t seem to be any newspaper reviewing this week’s LC exam papers, even if there are only 1000 or so people sitting them. It would be of interest to teachers and current students.

Here’s the publication schedule for putting the exams on Examinations.ie, although it doesn’t say what time on Monday:

https://examinations.ie/misc-doc/BI-EX-64355925.pdf

rainbowtrout · 21-11-2020 3:07pm

gaiscioch wrote: »

Anybody take a photo, or come across a photo, of yesterday’s History HL paper? Nobody sitting it in our school so the exam person didn’t get a copy of it sent to the school. Also, strange how there doesn’t seem to be any newspaper reviewing this week’s LC exam papers, even if there are only 1000 or so people sitting them. It would be of interest to teachers and current students.

Here’s the publication schedule for putting the exams on Examinations.ie, although it doesn’t say what time on Monday:

https://examinations.ie/misc-doc/BI-EX-64355925.pdf

I'd imagine normally newspaper reviews are done by contacting their usual list of contacts for each subject area. With so few doing each exam and the exams taking place in the evening it's likely that most teachers haven't actually seen the exams to comment on them. There's a LC thread running on reddit at the moment and some leaving certs posted photographs of exams they had taken so far.

gaiscioch · 21-11-2020 3:24pm

rainbowtrout wrote: »

There's a LC thread running on reddit at the moment and some leaving certs posted photographs of exams they had taken so far.

Can’t find that; the layout of that website is beyond me so I must be looking in the wrong place:

https://www.reddit.com/r/TheLeavingCert/search?q=Leaving%20cert%202020%20history&restrict_sr=1

LW2018 · 21-11-2020 4:09pm

gaiscioch wrote: »

Anybody take a photo, or come across a photo, of yesterday’s History HL paper? Nobody sitting it in our school so the exam person didn’t get a copy of it sent to the school. Also, strange how there doesn’t seem to be any newspaper reviewing this week’s LC exam papers, even if there are only 1000 or so people sitting them. It would be of interest to teachers and current students.

Here’s the publication schedule for putting the exams on Examinations.ie, although it doesn’t say what time on Monday:

https://examinations.ie/misc-doc/BI-EX-64355925.pdf

I'm also looking for the HL History paper!! Looks like I will have to wait until next Monday unfortunately. I want to see the DBQ that appeared!

rainbowtrout · 21-11-2020 4:26pm

gaiscioch wrote: »

Can’t find that; the layout of that website is beyond me so I must be looking in the wrong place:

https://www.reddit.com/r/TheLeavingCert/search?q=Leaving%20cert%202020%20history&restrict_sr=1

This is the biology paper

https://www.reddit.com/r/TheLeavingCert/comments/jvx8ks/i_think_people_might_need_a_scan_of_the_biology/

LW2018 · 21-11-2020 4:46pm

rainbowtrout wrote: »

This is the biology paper

https://www.reddit.com/r/TheLeavingCert/comments/jvx8ks/i_think_people_might_need_a_scan_of_the_biology/

Thanks for this link. I will keep an eye on this website to see if there are anymore uploaded. I've been keeping the spare papers in school for the other departments. I wonder what the uptake on Junior Cycle is

km79 · 21-11-2020 5:13pm

rainbowtrout wrote: »

This is the biology paper

https://www.reddit.com/r/TheLeavingCert/comments/jvx8ks/i_think_people_might_need_a_scan_of_the_biology/

Those long questions are delightful
My students would have probably scored to the higher end of their potential

State exams Nov 2020

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