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Rent a Room Eviction Ban

2»

Comments

  • #52
    Varik
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,553 ✭✭✭✭Varik


    Even a normal illegal/legal eviction of an actual tenant from a tenancy wouldn't be the Guards business.


  • #53
    Yellow_Fern
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,612 ✭✭✭Yellow_Fern


    Varik wrote: »
    Even a normal illegal/legal eviction of an actual tenant from a tenancy wouldn't be the Guards business.

    yes, because its a civil matter for the sheriff. I think the idea here is that its Jake who wont leave your spare bedroom than it could be a criminal matter and that the guards would be involved.


  • #54
    Mic 1972
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,213 ✭✭✭Mic 1972


    Varik wrote: »
    Even a normal illegal/legal eviction of an actual tenant from a tenancy wouldn't be the Guards business.


    They wouldn't intervene for a normal tenancy, but in a rent-a-room scenario they do because a lodger refusing to leave is trespassing


  • #55
    Time
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 993 ✭✭✭Time


    Mic 1972 wrote: »
    They wouldn't intervene for a normal tenancy, but in a rent-a-room scenario they do because a lodger refusing to leave is trespassing

    Trespassing is a tort not a criminal matter. If the trespass is accompanied by behavior that makes the owner afraid for their safety then it’s criminal trespass and the Gardai can get involved.


  • #56
    Mic 1972
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,213 ✭✭✭Mic 1972


    Time wrote: »
    With the greatest respect to the Gardai they are not experts in interpreting legislation. I would be very surprised if a solicitor gave you that same advice because the law simply is not structured in a way that allows people living in the same home as their landlord to gain tenancy rights.


    I'm calling Citizen Information on Monday to get advice too, hopefully they'll have some answers, I'm worried about the note below ...this applies to all Local Authorities and Approved Housing body dwellings



    https://i.imgur.com/tGSFYQv.jpg


  • #57
    JustAThought
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,324 ✭✭✭JustAThought


    Mic 1972 wrote: »
    I'm calling Citizen Information on Monday to get advice too, hopefully they'll have some answers, I'm worried about the note below ...this applies to all Local Authorities and Approved Housing body dwellings



    https://i.imgur.com/tGSFYQv.jpg

    why is your lodger such a problem - whats the background? Prior to this You seem to be afraid of giving them notice in your own house. Tell them ifs over - they need to go. I assume you have given them notice.

    Dies anyone know who voted and who avstained and who was missing? As representatives chosen on a proportinate baisis to represent a not yet formed government this not turning up and not voting is a farce.

    I also think tge 26th was the cut off point for seanad elections. Is this a rush job on the evenof Seanad elections by a small not represented in the democratic election group who are making such waves - where are the men with balls sticking up for Irish families instead of sticking them with unpaying lodgers.


  • #58
    Mic 1972
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,213 ✭✭✭Mic 1972


    JustAThought wrote: »
    why is your lodger such a problem - whats the background? Prior to this You seem to be afraid of giving them notice in your own house. Tell them ifs over - they need to go. I assmhme you have given them notice.

    Dies anyone know who voted and who avstained and who was missing? As representatives chosen on a proportinate baisis to represent a not yet formed government this not turning up and not voting is a farce.


    He was served verbal notice long before the eviction ban with an agreed exit date of 1st april. As soon as the eviction ban was announced he said he wasn't leaving anymore, i sent him a watsapp message to have on record his exit date but it was too late. In the meantime they amended the bill extending the eviction ban to all dwellings and on top of that they announced the lock down. Impossible to kick him out now
    The problem i have with him is that he still goes to work every night, using public transports and possibly not being in a position to apply social distancing in the work place - he is not a nurse - and i honestly don't feel safe in my house anymore and i think i have the right to protect my health, this is not about money


  • #59
    Shefwedfan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,958 ✭✭✭✭Shefwedfan


    People complain about landlord this landlord that

    This is another move by the government to fu*k the whole thing up, It’s always protect the f**king waster. If good tenants are in place then landlord will work with them. It’s the useless f**k that you want rid of you can’t now, so people don’t run the risk.

    Absolute gobsh**ts


  • #60
    garhjw
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,424 ✭✭✭garhjw


    Shefwedfan wrote: »
    People complain about landlord this landlord that

    This is another move by the government to fu*k the whole thing up, It’s always protect the f**king waster. If good tenants are in place then landlord will work with them. It’s the useless f**k that you want rid of you can’t now, so people don’t run the risk.

    Absolute gobsh**ts

    This was an amendment by SF and/or PBP losers. It was not in the initial bill. Clear attempt by these types of people to politicise the the health emergency.


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  • #61
    Mic 1972
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,213 ✭✭✭Mic 1972


    Thinking about old people renting out rooms and not being able to get rid of lodgers in the middle of the pandemic when they are at risk. If i had another place to go I would leave the house behind but this is my sole residence


  • #62
    garhjw
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,424 ✭✭✭garhjw


    Mic 1972 wrote: »
    He was served verbal notice long before the eviction ban with an agreed exit date of 1st april. As soon as the eviction ban was announced he said he wasn't leaving anymore, i sent him a watsapp message to have on record his exit date but it was too late. In the meantime they amended the bill extending the eviction ban to all dwellings and on top of that they announced the lock down. Impossible to kick him out now
    The problem i have with him is that he still goes to work every night, using public transports and possibly not being in a position to apply social distancing in the work place - he is not a nurse - and i honestly don't feel safe in my house anymore and i think i have the right to protect my health, this is not about money

    According to some the property and rental market has crashed and rents are plummeting. Your tenant should have no problem finding a short term let. I would kick him out. You don’t want him in your property where you live so he has to leave. Whatever the reason you want him gone for you will fell more comfortable in your home if he is gone. Remember that...


  • #63
    timhenn
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 514 ✭✭✭timhenn


    Are landlords showing their greed? Even in times like this? Money is important but people need to put their profit seeking aside for a short while until this is sorted.


  • #64
    DubCount
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,092 ✭✭✭DubCount


    timhenn wrote: »
    Are landlords showing their greed? Even in times like this? Money is important but people need to put their profit seeking aside for a short while until this is sorted.

    I have no doubt you are working for free at the moment, and not displaying greed by taking a wage from your employer.


  • #65
    Mic 1972
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,213 ✭✭✭Mic 1972


    garhjw wrote: »
    According to some the property and rental market has crashed and rents are plummeting. Your tenant should have no problem finding a short term let. I would kick him out. You don’t want him in your property where you live so he has to leave. Whatever the reason you want him gone for you will fell more comfortable in your home if he is gone. Remember that...


    There are plenty of rooms available but with the new bill i lost my right to evict him, simple as that


  • #66
    timhenn
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 514 ✭✭✭timhenn


    DubCount wrote: »
    I have no doubt you are working for free at the moment, and not displaying greed by taking a wage from your employer.

    Social welfare while it's closed down. No one said to work for free. Just don't be kicking people out on the streets at times like this. The amount of airbnbs that have gone up on daft is crazy. And I mean they are using daft as airbnb. Short term rents for individual rooms.


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  • #67
    Mic 1972
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,213 ✭✭✭Mic 1972


    timhenn wrote: »
    Social welfare while it's closed down. No one said to work for free. Just don't be kicking people out on the streets at times like this. The amount of airbnbs that have gone up on daft is crazy. And I mean they are using daft as airbnb. Short term rents for individual rooms.


    Accomodations are available, this is not about kicking people out in the streets. They can find other rooms in shared houses, prices are the same.
    Unfortunately the new bill allows some lodgers to take advantage and have an excuse to stay around someone's house
    it's shocking how a bill like this could pass considering how risky it is for some people to live in a share environment at the moment. A lot of house owners are left with no rights overnight


  • #68
    Shefwedfan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,958 ✭✭✭✭Shefwedfan


    timhenn wrote: »
    Are landlords showing their greed? Even in times like this? Money is important but people need to put their profit seeking aside for a short while until this is sorted.

    Would you cop on? How is someone renting a room in their own house showing greed?

    Just check thread on here where the people refused to clean etc so putting the person at risk

    Is that what you call greed?

    I have yet to see any stories of landlords throwing anyone out, loads of people mentioned to me
    Landlord reducing etc so they can keep good tenants

    As I said already, this is only protecting the waster tenant and giving them more rights, scree the landlord,


  • #69
    timhenn
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 514 ✭✭✭timhenn


    Mic 1972 wrote: »
    Accomodations are available, this is not about kicking people out in the streets. They can find other rooms in shared houses, prices are the same.
    Unfortunately the new bill allows some lodgers to take advantage and have an excuse to stay around someone's house
    it's shocking how a bill like this could pass considering how risky it is for some people to live in a share environment at the moment. A lot of house owners are left with no rights overnight

    Have you looked up daft? A lot of places have come available put short term only! Also, there are still many shared room places available, not cheap either! You should be directing your anger at these types of greedy landlords.


  • #70
    timhenn
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 514 ✭✭✭timhenn


    Shefwedfan wrote: »
    Would you cop on? How is someone renting a room in their own house showing greed?

    Just check thread on here where the people refused to clean etc so putting the person at risk

    Is that what you call greed?

    I have yet to see any stories of landlords throwing anyone out, loads of people mentioned to me
    Landlord reducing etc so they can keep good tenants

    As I said already, this is only protecting the waster tenant and giving them more rights, scree the landlord,

    Have a look at daft and then come back to me. Cheers.


  • #71
    Time
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 993 ✭✭✭Time


    Mic 1972 wrote: »
    He was served verbal notice long before the eviction ban with an agreed exit date of 1st april. As soon as the eviction ban was announced he said he wasn't leaving anymore, i sent him a watsapp message to have on record his exit date but it was too late. In the meantime they amended the bill extending the eviction ban to all dwellings and on top of that they announced the lock down. Impossible to kick him out now
    The problem i have with him is that he still goes to work every night, using public transports and possibly not being in a position to apply social distancing in the work place - he is not a nurse - and i honestly don't feel safe in my house anymore and i think i have the right to protect my health, this is not about money

    Don’t bother speaking to citizens advice. Spend a small bit on a consultation with your solicitor, they’ll confirm what you’ve been told here re: this not applying to private residences where the owner also lives. Then on April 1st you can simply change the locks.


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  • #72
    Shefwedfan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,958 ✭✭✭✭Shefwedfan


    timhenn wrote: »
    Have a look at daft and then come back to me. Cheers.

    I don’t have to....


  • #73
    Mic 1972
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,213 ✭✭✭Mic 1972


    timhenn wrote: »
    Have you looked up daft? A lot of places have come available put short term only! Also, there are still many shared room places available, not cheap either! You should be directing your anger at these types of greedy landlords.


    I'm on Daft right now, there are pages and pages of rooms available in shared accommodation for +1 year, let alone that most lodgers are ok with 4-6 months
    There is not an accommodation issue at the moment, in fact it's the opposite, things haven't looked this good for renters in a long time


  • #74
    timhenn
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 514 ✭✭✭timhenn


    Shefwedfan wrote: »
    I don’t have to....

    So you know of the greed of certain landlords. Why are you denying it then?


  • #75
    garhjw
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,424 ✭✭✭garhjw


    timhenn wrote: »
    So you know of the greed of certain landlords. Why are you denying it then?

    Why did you come on this thread spouting your anti landlord bitterness? OP is in a tough situation and all you can do is whine.


  • #76
    timhenn
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 514 ✭✭✭timhenn


    Mic 1972 wrote: »
    I'm on Daft right now, there are pages and pages of rooms available in shared accommodation for +1 year, let alone that most lodgers are ok with 4-6 months
    There is not an accommodation issue at the moment, in fact it's the opposite, things haven't looked this good for renters in a long time

    For how much? What price are you talking?


  • #77
    Caranica
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,144 ✭✭✭✭Caranica


    Mic 1972 wrote: »
    I'm on Daft right now, there are pages and pages of rooms available in shared accommodation for +1 year, let alone that most lodgers are ok with 4-6 months
    There is not an accommodation issue at the moment, in fact it's the opposite, things haven't looked this good for renters in a long time

    You're the one who extended the notice for this lodger. You've effectively shot yourself in the foot on this one. I understand your fears but you could have avoided all of this stress.


  • #78
    timhenn
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 514 ✭✭✭timhenn


    garhjw wrote: »
    Why did you come on this thread spouting your anti landlord bitterness? OP is in a tough situation and all you can do is whine.

    Sympathy to the op. It's important that anti tenant sentiment doesn't set in, however. It's a difficult enough time as it is.


  • #79
    Mic 1972
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,213 ✭✭✭Mic 1972


    timhenn wrote: »
    For how much? What price are you talking?


    I'm charging him 600 including bills for a double
    I'm seeing anything from 450 to 850 at the moment. Single to double, worst case he can take a single room if really this is an emergency


  • #80
    timhenn
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 514 ✭✭✭timhenn


    Mic 1972 wrote: »
    I'm charging him 600 including bills for a double
    I'm seeing anything from 450 to 850 at the moment. Single to double, worst case he can take a single room if really this is an emergency

    600 isn't cheap. A single room for how much? In what area? Far from his work?


  • #81
    Mic 1972
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,213 ✭✭✭Mic 1972


    Time wrote: »
    Don’t bother speaking to citizens advice. Spend a small bit on a consultation with your solicitor, they’ll confirm what you’ve been told here re: this not applying to private residences where the owner also lives. Then on April 1st you can simply change the locks.


    I'll take your advise, you seem to know what you are talking about
    I'm getting conflicting advise from friends about this, i hope there are no legal consequences for changing the lock in case he isn't moving


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  • #82
    Mic 1972
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,213 ✭✭✭Mic 1972


    timhenn wrote: »
    600 isn't cheap. A single room for how much? In what area? Far from his work?


    600 for a double is pretty standard in D15, I cover all bills and cleaning
    It sounds like you are the one who hasn't' been on Daft


  • #83
    Mic 1972
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,213 ✭✭✭Mic 1972


    Caranica wrote: »
    You're the one who extended the notice for this lodger. You've effectively shot yourself in the foot on this one. I understand your fears but you could have avoided all of this stress.


    Fair enough, he said he was having trouble finding another room, i said ok to stay longer on the ground that he would definitely move on 1st April. He said that worst case he was going to move back in with his family for a few weeks, they live in the same estate, i know them personally. It didn't sound like a big deal

    But i don't think they are going to have him, that's why he is playing this game now


  • #84
    timhenn
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 514 ✭✭✭timhenn


    Mic 1972 wrote: »
    600 for a double is pretty standard in D15, I cover all bills and cleaning
    It sounds like you are the one who hasn't' been on Daft

    I didn't say 600 was off standard, I said it wasn't cheap and you've proved my point. You said "things haven't looked this good for renters in a long time", prices are still ridiculous. 600 for a room in D15 is crazy. Landlords have been gouging tenants and nothing has changed.


  • #85
    Graham
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 17,642 Mod ✭✭✭✭Graham


    Mod Note

    Timhenn, if you want to have a general moan about rents, landlords or tenants please take it somewhere else rather than dragging this thread further off topic.


  • #86
    garhjw
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,424 ✭✭✭garhjw


    <SNIP>


  • #87
    Shefwedfan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,958 ✭✭✭✭Shefwedfan


    timhenn wrote: »
    I didn't say 600 was off standard, I said it wasn't cheap and you've proved my point. You said "things haven't looked this good for renters in a long time", prices are still ridiculous. 600 for a room in D15 is crazy. Landlords have been gouging tenants and nothing has changed.

    600 euro with bills is hardly crazy

    That will include, electricity, bins, heating, property tax, tv licences and probably the tv itself....

    Put all of this together and the bills dont long add up. Going back to early 2000's and it was circa 350-400 at least for a double room without bills in the D15 area. I know because I rented plenty of properties around that time in D15. Plus price of all of the above have increased substantially in that time frame.

    Maybe if you want to comment, at least know what you are talking about


  • #88
    Shefwedfan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,958 ✭✭✭✭Shefwedfan


    This is just another kick in the teeth for the diminishing landlord/landlady community. At the same time you have people moaning about property been sold to vulture funds and big companies for renting. Well this is the reason why.

    Tenant should be fighting against this, not the landlord. It is just going to drive the cost up higher and reduce the options more


  • #89
    roper1664
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 228 ✭✭roper1664


    Another way of looking at how ridiculous and unworkable this thing would be, if it did apply to licensees, is that they have no rights to the home owner's possessions e.g., oven, fridge, sink, toilet, bed, wardrobe, etc., the home owner simply allows the licensee to use them. The homeowner lets the licensee use these at their discretion. No one can stop the homeowner from entering the room they are allowing the tenant to use (and of course it is not permitted for this door to be locked) at any time. Of course out of basic decency this would usually never be an issue but basic decency goes out the window as soon as the lodger crosses the line.

    Also, what if the homeowner feels uncomfortable or threatened?

    Anyway, the important point is that what the OP described is not an eviction or a tenancy. This is very important to be clear on. It's telling a paying "guest" to get out of the house.
    Notwithstanding any of the provisions in this section, all proposed evictions in all tenancies in the State

    Clear, reasonable notice has been given and I'd have their possessions outside the front door and the locks changed the next time they leave the house after the notified date to leave (in fact I'd walk them out the door at the time I'd fairly stated if I was getting trouble from someone, but I'm understanding this wouldn't be something that everyone is physically or otherwise capable of).

    OP, change the locks if they're not gone and seek legal advice if that makes you feel better about it. You're hardly going to keep living like this and have someone bully you in your own home, telling you what's what.

    And please let us know how you get on. All of the best.


  • #90
    Mic 1972
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,213 ✭✭✭Mic 1972


    Quick update for those who's been following the saga
    He packed up everything, bags are sitting in the hall, all set up and ready to move out tomorrow!
    Seems like he's moving back in with family after all

    And thanks everybody for the advise!


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  • #91
    garhjw
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,424 ✭✭✭garhjw


    Mic 1972 wrote: »
    Quick update for those who's been following the saga
    He packed up everything, bags are sitting in the hall, all set up and ready to move out tomorrow!
    Seems like he's moving back in with family after all

    And thanks everybody for the advise!

    Glad it worked out for you. It must be a big relief.


  • #92
    roper1664
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 228 ✭✭roper1664


    Mic 1972 wrote: »
    Quick update for those who's been following the saga
    He packed up everything, bags are sitting in the hall, all set up and ready to move out tomorrow!
    Seems like he's moving back in with family after all

    And thanks everybody for the advise!

    Good news. You gave him good fair notice and he still made things awkward for a while. After all that, he's agreed to leave after an extension to the moving-out date.
    Seems like the lodging is ending on good terms.


  • #93
    Claw Hammer
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,295 ✭✭✭Claw Hammer


    Government admits there is no ban on removing rent a room licencees.
    https://www.irishexaminer.com/breakingnews/ireland/landlords-urged-not-to-evict-rent-a-room-tenants-during-covid-19-emergency-991457.html


  • #94
    TheBoyConor
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,292 ✭✭✭TheBoyConor


    Sure it would be preposterous to ban the eviction ejection of a lodger from the homeowners house. To have a ban on such ejections would mean that a homeowner could be effectively a held to ransom within their own home by some prick of a lodger who has gotten to big for their own boots.

    there would then be no check on rogue lodgers, they would know that they are basically untouchable and could stop paying rent, damage the property, bully or abuse the homeowner or their family, safe in the knowledge that they are not allowed to be ejected.

    I personally would not stand for it in that scenario. If a lodger got smart with my in that vein I would give them one warning to cop op. After that I would catch them up be the neck and forcibly propel them head first through the door and I would deal with whatever the consequences might be.

    Knowing the courts in this country, it'll be the probation act, a donation to the poor box, a recognisance of the difficult situation I found myself in and possibly my name in the court pages of the local rag.


  • #95
    Claw Hammer
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,295 ✭✭✭Claw Hammer


    TheBoyConor wrote: »
    I would deal with whatever the consequences might be.

    Knowing the courts in this country, it'll be the probation act, a donation to the poor box, a recognisance of the difficult situation I found myself in and possibly my name in the court pages of the local rag.

    What if the consequences were a mandatory injunction, directing you to allow the lodger continue to reside in the property?


  • #96
    TheBoyConor
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,292 ✭✭✭TheBoyConor


    I would have big doubts that a court would order that I must allow someone who is a threatening abuser live in my home knowing full well that they will most likely not pay.

    However, if that did happen, I would appeal it and I would challenge it on the basis that the order is unconstitutional as it runs afoul of the inviolability of the citizens dwelling.

    Furthermore, I would state that I need the space in the house for immediate family and I would have them move in for a while. The order would then conflict with Article 41 and the family ought to be prioritised.


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  • #97
    Claw Hammer
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,295 ✭✭✭Claw Hammer


    TheBoyConor wrote: »
    I would have big doubts that a court would order that I must allow someone who is a threatening abuser live in my home knowing full well that they will most likely not pay.

    However, if that did happen, I would appeal it and I would challenge it on the basis that the order is unconstitutional as it runs afoul of the inviolability of the citizens dwelling.

    Furthermore, I would state that I need the space in the house for immediate family and I would have them move in for a while. The order would then conflict with Article 41 and the family ought to be prioritised.

    You may be told to allow them stay pending appeal.


  • #98
    Time
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 993 ✭✭✭Time


    Claw Hammer wrote: »
    You may be told to allow them stay pending appeal.

    One of the principles of equity is that you seek equitable relief with "clean hands" a lodger refusing to pay wouldn't really meet this criteria and probably wouldn't be entitled to an injunction as a result.


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