The €3,000 per month luxury welfare apartments

katiek102010 · 01-12-2019 12:37pm

171170 wrote: »

Do you regard the above situation as the norm across social housing in Ireland?

Also, do you believe that the unusual situation that you have outlined should form the basis of national social housing policy?

Are you familiar with the adage that hard cases make bad law?

It's starting to become a norm. It might be as simple as unable to source child care due to shortages in facilities and 1 parent having to give up full time work.

There are numerous reasons why a 1 income household is becoming the norm. Historically it was the norm and in the 30+ years 1 income households have been priced out and its wrong, very wrong.

A long of "working class" jobs are rotating shift work but schools, childcare are not. In lots of towns and villages it is physically impossible to get wrap around childcare.

Many families go with the parent who earns the most and they other is stuck in a position where they are looking for a job that allows them the flexibility to work termtime during school hours or when the other parent is home. Where are those jobs.
Carers allows people to work a max of 15 hrs a week. Most part time jobs are in excess of that and don't allow the flexibility for hospital appts etc

01-12-2019 12:38pm

Pronto63 wrote: »

What is the actual criteria for your placing on the social housing list.

I guess number of kids comes into it and also and disabilities but how exactly does it work?

Do they give merit to people who work/contribute?

In essence the criteria for being put on the list are that someone has a genuine housing need and are unable to provide housing from their income. There are also criteria like having a link to the local area, so someone from say Artane, would find it hard to get on the Mayo County Council housing list.

So loads of people get on the social housing lists and are then prioritised depending on a range of factors - actual homelessness/overcrowding/number of sprogs/ill health/disability/compassionate grounds, etc. etc.

01-12-2019 12:39pm

katiek102010 wrote: »

It's starting to become a norm. It might be as simple as unable to source child care due to shortages in facilities and 1 parent having to give up full time work.

There are numerous reasons why a 1 income household is becoming the norm. Historically it was the norm and in the 30+ years 1 income households have been priced out and its wrong, very wrong.

A long of "working class" jobs are rotating shift work but schools, childcare are not. In lots of towns and villages it is physically impossible to get wrap around childcare.

Many families go with the parent who earns the most and they other is stuck in a position where they are looking for a job that allows them the flexibility to work termtime during school hours or when the other parent is home. Where are those jobs.
Carers allows people to work a max of 15 hrs a week. Most part time jobs are in excess of that and don't allow the flexibility for hospital appts etc

Three simple questions asked. How about three yes or no answers?

katiek102010 · 01-12-2019 12:40pm

Pronto63 wrote: »

What is the actual criteria for your placing on the social housing list.

I guess number of kids comes into it and also and disabilities but how exactly does it work?

Do they give merit to people who work/contribute?

When I worked in housing it was a points based system on Individual circumstances. The system has not kept up with the times.

It needs a complete overhaul

katiek102010 · 01-12-2019 12:42pm

171170 wrote: »

Three simple questions asked. How about three yes or no answers?

Yes, yes and yes

Idbatterim · 01-12-2019 1:04pm

zeebre12 wrote: »

1.2 million people will get a Christmas bonus next week. I know some people like working carers deserve an extra payment but this is crazy. Great little country.

https://www.gov.uk/christmas-bonus

Yeah ten pounds ! I believe here , that only the long term unemployed get it , not short term unemployed , it’s perverse! The politician wan***s might think they owe this scum something, I don’t ! We keep hearing about the ha k bailout , it’s a one of drop in the ocean compared to this welfare black hole !

Can we find out which councilors voted for this lunacy ?

Idbatterim · 01-12-2019 1:10pm

My point about peter Casey was , he expressed an interest in politics , has some money and would get a lot of media exposure which is priceless. Good luck if joe soap wants to start up a new party without serious money to get their policies out there and exposure etc

Casey also wasn’t a lying rat afraid to speak the truth , that immediately separates him from the rest of the wasters in the dail. Obviously far from perfect , but I’m voting Kermit the frog or Mickey Mouse next election. Or ff to punish fg for their **** , I don’t think they should be let away with it. Of course ff are a disgrace , but in the absence of any party for many of us to vote for , what are we meant to do ?

Boggles · 01-12-2019 1:11pm

Idbatterim wrote: »

My point about peter Casey was , he expressed an interest in politics , has some money and would get a lot of media exposure which is priceless. Good luck if joe soap wants to start up a new party without serious money to get their policies out there and exposure etc

What's his policies?

Idbatterim · 01-12-2019 1:17pm

Boggles wrote: »

What's his policies?

He spoke of the taxpayer being done here , that is the key issue as far as I’m concerned. Go with usc abolition , the public like simple messages !

They have billions to waste every budget , usc can be phased out over several. Of course it will
Involve no yearly welfare hikes , likely cuts. Let them pay a reasonable amount towards their rent, not the virtually free rent they get now. Free rent when you consider many of them are paying it with the free money they get. Produced by Santa and the fairies , not working people obviously

USC is hated , go with it’s abolotion. All the free travel passes , free go visits etc. it’s insane. You’d wonder if there is another collapse , would they shed out the system properly? Highly unlikely with the current rats in power !

ThunbergsAreGo · 01-12-2019 1:18pm

ChikiChiki wrote: »

The great Irish sell off folks. We will look back some day on these times and feel like absolute idiots for not kicking Fine Gael out on its arse.

They deserve to be in the sewers with the rats. Everything is for sale. They have done nothing to put barriers in the way to help their own population.

Kick them out for who?

is_that_so · 01-12-2019 1:24pm

ThunbergsAreGo wrote: »

Kick them out for who?

In a parallel universe the Big Rock Candy Mountain party will do anything you want just by wishing it so.

01-12-2019 1:24pm

Hmmm... abolition of USC(which is the least objectionable tax on income in Ireland) and replacing FG at National level with some other motley crew and the social housing issue will be solved and the Ireland will become a new Nirvana.

Idbatterim · 01-12-2019 1:28pm

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Hmmm... abolition of USC(which is the least objectionable tax on income in Ireland) and replacing FG at National level with some other motley crew and the social housing issue will be solved and the Ireland will become a new Nirvana.

Yeah. Right well you think the only income tax that morally should be cut , the marginal rate. You think a party could run on only cutting that rate. Sure it would only benefit the rich on over e35,000. The field day the meeja and many of the moron electorate would have!

is_that_so · 01-12-2019 1:31pm

Idbatterim wrote: »

Yeah. Right well you think the only income tax that morally should be cut , the marginal rate. You think a party could run on only cutting that rate. Sure it would only benefit the rich on over e35,000. The field day the meeja and many of the moron electorate would have!

€35000 is rich? That's €558 a week or €2417 a month after tax BTW.

Idbatterim · 01-12-2019 1:35pm

is_that_so wrote: »

€35000 is rich? That's €558 a week or €2417 a month after tax BTW.

Sorry that was extreme sarcasm. But yes I’m sure many receiving these luxury apartments would call anyone earning 35,000 or so “ rich” paying an outrageous amount of tax over the 35k pittance to pay for luxury apartments for the work shy. The worlds busiest dominoes and Krispy Kreme stores , where people said they couldn’t pay a few cent for water a day but can pay outrageous amounts for junk food !

thebaz · 01-12-2019 1:43pm

I really want to see a solution to the housing crisis for everyone , but paying this amount of public money to a foreign Cuckoo fund is obscene. the deal should be stopped immediatly.

01-12-2019 1:45pm

I've just submitted a complaint to the Ombudsman. It won't prevent this deal but might prevent others like it.

Idbatterim · 01-12-2019 1:46pm

thebaz wrote: »

I really want to see a solution to the housing crisis for everyone , but paying this amount of money to a foreign Cuckoo fund is obscene. the deal should be stopped immediatly.

They’ll back track with a little public pressure ...

Viscount Aggro · 01-12-2019 2:12pm

Idbatterim wrote: »

They’ll back track with a little public pressure ...

No, there will no backtracking. The deal is done, and will be forgotten about in a few months.

Protesting about it.... Not going to happen. Would be ripped apart by leftist agenda.

01-12-2019 2:33pm

katiek102010 wrote: »

Yes, yes and yes

Thank you.

Those asinine replies have enabled me to make an informed decision to add you to my ignore list.

01-12-2019 2:35pm

is_that_so wrote: »

In a parallel universe the Big Rock Candy Mountain party will do anything you want just by wishing it so.

Steady on - one of his sidekicks has just won a Dáil by-election. The idiots are on the march!

01-12-2019 2:40pm

Idbatterim wrote: »

My point about peter Casey was , he expressed an interest in politics , has some money and would get a lot of media exposure which is priceless. Good luck if joe soap wants to start up a new party without serious money to get their policies out there and exposure etc

Casey also wasn’t a lying rat afraid to speak the truth , that immediately separates him from the rest of the wasters in the dail. Obviously far from perfect , but I’m voting Kermit the frog or Mickey Mouse next election. Or ff to punish fg for their **** , I don’t think they should be let away with it. Of course ff are a disgrace , but in the absence of any party for many of us to vote for , what are we meant to do ?

Well said. I'll be holding my nose and voting, for the first time in my life, for the party of Charles J Haughey and Bertie "dig-out" Ahern

it's going to hurt but Leo's lot deserve a good kicking.

I'd like to have voted for the Soc Dems, but the Kisyombe affair made it very clear that they cannot be trusted.

smurgen · 01-12-2019 3:01pm

KyussB wrote: »

A thread about one of the most blatant single-instance examples of government corruption in a long time - leasing an entire apartment complex for more money than it would cost to buy the thing outright, with no benefit to the country - and people have zero focus on the corruption, and 100% focus on the least well off in society, who haven't benefited from this in any way yet - and who wouldn't benefit from it at all, if people focused on the corruption and had this deal reversed - and the people involved criminally investigated for conflicts of interests and coruption.

People just walk straight into the Divide and Conquer narrative like fucking clueless idiots. To a suspicious extent, tbh...

This is my thing.i don't blame the people that get the houses at all. It was the council and investment fund here that have fleeced the tax payers.important to remember.

NovemberWren · 01-12-2019 3:30pm

Viscount Aggro wrote: »

No, there will no backtracking. The deal is done, and will be forgotten about in a few months.

Protesting about it.... Not going to happen. Would be ripped apart by leftist agenda.

yes, and these tenants will be used as the human collateral to siphon c.E54million? to german and irish Private Investors (many of whom are FF and FG?). and then, when that c.E54million is completely paid to them, they will own completely outright, these places.

today, simon coveney said; "10k social housing provided" this year.

it is way, way, way, beyond time that FF and FG were pulled up on this 'wording'; It should be Insisted that the reality is stated i.e.: 'Private Investors' Profit Housing', should be used, and not the social wording.

Pronto63 · 01-12-2019 3:43pm

171170 wrote: »

In essence the criteria for being put on the list are that someone has a genuine housing need and are unable to provide housing from their income. There are also criteria like having a link to the local area, so someone from say Artane, would find it hard to get on the Mayo County Council housing list.

So loads of people get on the social housing lists and are then prioritised depending on a range of factors - actual homelessness/overcrowding/number of sprogs/ill health/disability/compassionate grounds, etc. etc.

So no points extra for working?

Scandalous!

They should deduct points if you have a parent living in social housing with a spare unused room.

If you can't / won't provide accommodation for your family than live with mam and dad.

Once workers are housed then house the freeloaders.

Idbatterim · 01-12-2019 4:09pm

Looks like protest being planned. Will update you lot of it is going ahead. Even if it can’t stop this farce. They might think about doing it again of it kicks off! Property being given away literally at the height of the recession , much of it in Nama control. It’s incredible!!!

Idbatterim · 01-12-2019 4:09pm

Pronto63 wrote: »

So no points extra for working?

Scandalous!

They should deduct points if you have a parent living in social housing with a spare unused room.

If you can't / won't provide accommodation for your family than live with mam and dad.

Once workers are housed then house the freeloaders.

Yeah it’s just so perverse here !

jockey#1 · 01-12-2019 4:53pm

Auguste Comte wrote: »

There is an election on the way. That's the place to express your feelings. Unaffordable rents, crippling insurance rates, 90 year old stuck on trolly for days, no school places for kids, etc, etc, etc.

ABFG would be my recommendation. None of the above problems are the fault of the unemployed or social welfare recipients, they don't spend our taxes.

Thats the main way Irish citizens can express their feelings towards the current government however only 20-30% of the electorate came out to vote in Friday's by-election, why is that? That is not a good sign for the next general election.

Having spent many years living in Australia where it is compulsory to vote, i really think we need a system like that in this country. The reason we never will is it would take too long to administer by lazy public servants!

Viscount Aggro · 01-12-2019 4:57pm

Post up any details of planned protest.
I will join it in a heartbeat.

01-12-2019 6:01pm

Look on the bright side - all these new social residents may cause nearby property prices to crumble and make them affordable to workers. Maybe this is a long-term solution to the crisis :P

Idbatterim · 01-12-2019 7:41pm

Block the sandyford road for the protest. Then rte and the other spineless pathetic media here won’t be able to ignore it. All over the printer etc. what’s their opinion on this scandal of epically bigger proportion?! Jesus I thought decades after knowing I live in a banana republic that nothing could shock me any more , but I’m still reeling from this !!! I’m surprised Walford in ballsbridge wasn’t bought for Margaret cash , 58,000,000 paid for it by Sean Dunne. Sure it looks like that’s where we are headed. Put the scum out amongst the decision makers and they’ll change their tune !

BDI · 01-12-2019 8:22pm

Idbatterim wrote: »

Block the sandyford road for the protest. Then rte and the other spineless pathetic media here won’t be able to ignore it. All over the printer etc. what’s their opinion on this scandal of epically bigger proportion?! Jesus I thought decades after knowing I live in a banana republic that nothing could shock me any more , but I’m still reeling from this !!! I’m surprised Walford in ballsbridge wasn’t bought for Margaret cash , 58,000,000 paid for it by Sean Dunne. Sure it looks like that’s where we are headed. Put the scum out amongst the decision makers and they’ll change their tune !

In fairness rte staff will be against poverty types living near their investment properties. Their children that they don’t speak about will probably get these houses too.

Rubberchikken · 01-12-2019 8:46pm

having read the irish times article it lovely to think that the council are so considerate of these poor landlords.

Auguste Comte · 01-12-2019 9:06pm

ThunbergsAreGo wrote: »

Kick them out for who?

Im not sure who are the solution, but Fine Gael are definitely the problem.

Viscount Aggro · 01-12-2019 9:20pm

How was planning permission given?
The road is already jammed with cars Q'ing for the town centre.
The new apartment scheme will have a few cars using it, regardless of social background of residents.

Protest? What will you be protesting about?

Boggles · 01-12-2019 9:26pm

Idbatterim wrote: »

He spoke of the taxpayer being done here , that is the key issue as far as I’m concerned. Go with usc abolition , the public like simple messages !

Did he have a policy document that showed the costings and the cause and effects?

Of course he didn't he was an absolute cretin shouting populous nonsense to give himself exposure.

He couldn't give 2 flying fúcks about anyone but himself.

If we start electing self serving sweaty incoherent mouth breathing simpletons like that dumb fúck we are screwed.

X111111111111 · 01-12-2019 9:28pm

The fume over this is outstanding. Protest lol. Our country is run by absolute gangsters who will get voted in again at a canter the next election. FG or FF it makes no difference the gravy train will role on.

I remember a couple of years back a lad organised a protest against the insurance cartel price fixing and 11 people turned up, 11 from a country of some 5 million. The Irish don't do organised protest but are world champions at cap doffing to our supposed betters at the risk of being seen as a trouble maker or ringing Joe.

Fighting Irish my hole.

Idbatterim · 01-12-2019 9:30pm

Boggles wrote: »

Did he have a policy document that showed the costings and the cause and effects?

Of course he didn't he was an absolute cretin shouting populous nonsense to give himself exposure.

He couldn't give 2 flying fúcks about anyone but himself.

If we start electing self serving sweaty incoherent mouth breathing simpletons like that dumb fúck we are screwed.

You’ve just described ffg. They are going to be junior party to ff after the next election. Some achievement despite a booming economy. It took ff to wreck the economy to lose power. Fg will lose the biggest party status with a booming economy. The irony !!!

Boggles · 01-12-2019 9:32pm

Idbatterim wrote: »

You’ve just described ffg. They are going to be junior party to fg after the next election. Some achievement despite a booming economy. It took ff to wreck the economy to lose power. Fg will lose the biggest party status with a booming economy. The irony !!!

Yes, so why you are advocating for that absolute populous self serving scum bag to set up a party is baffling.

We need to get rid of their ilk, not encourage more of them.

Pawwed Rig · 01-12-2019 9:48pm

Boggles wrote: »

We need to get rid of their ilk, not encourage more of them.

I had so much optimism when a Stephen Donnelly lead Social Democrats appeared on the scene. They have been so disappointing

01-12-2019 10:00pm

Pawwed Rig wrote: »

I had so much optimism when a Stephen Donnelly lead Social Democrats appeared on the scene. They have been so disappointing

But Donnelly was never the sole leader, just one third (or should that be "turd") of the three-headed monster!

And as soon as he realised the pair of harridans that he had ended up with, he bailed out!

tabby aspreme · 01-12-2019 10:03pm

Have any of the DLR Councillors spoken about this, you would think some of the Labour, PBP, or Green Councillors would see this, as excessive spending of public money, with no long term return, that it is

01-12-2019 10:05pm

we should all protest by taking a day off work

Idbatterim · 01-12-2019 10:12pm

Protest organized for Saturday seventh. See attached. It’s a ****ing scandal. Brian leeson has organized it. The only single person in my area who seems to give a toss about this housing crisis. What has years and years of voting for the early risers party got me ?! It’s gotten us this farce. This insult ! Oh Jesus I can’t wait for the electioneering to start , the fg vermin will be getting a serious earful !

Thelonious Monk · 01-12-2019 10:22pm

That's Eirigí ffs. The turnout will be hilarious. People just don't care enough about these things, you're wasting your time.

Ha Long Bay · 01-12-2019 10:28pm

Idbatterim wrote: »

Protest organized for Saturday seventh. See attached. It’s a ****ing scandal. Brian leeson has organized it. The only single person in my area who seems to give a toss about this housing crisis. What has years and years of voting for the early risers party got me ?! It’s gotten us this farce. This insult ! Oh Jesus I can’t wait for the electioneering to start , the fg vermin will be getting a serious earful !

Had to look up the guy you mentioned. He is a member of Éirígí and on his website "from 2016 to the present he has been extremely active on the issue of housing, helping to establish both Dundrum Housing Action and the Dundrum Housing Cooperative. This work has also involved him working with a large number of individuals and families that are directly affected by the housing crisis"

https://www.brianleeson.com/about-brian

He is now out complaining public housing is being provided?

X111111111111 · 01-12-2019 10:29pm

Idbatterim wrote: »

Protest organized for Saturday seventh. See attached. It’s a ****ing scandal. Brian leeson has organized it. The only single person in my area who seems to give a toss about this housing crisis. What has years and years of voting for the early risers party got me ?! It’s gotten us this farce. This insult ! Oh Jesus I can’t wait for the electioneering to start , the fg vermin will be getting a serious earful !

You'll get a few crusties that turn up at these things and that's it. Real change comes at the ballot box and people are too thick and stupid to vote for change in this country.

strandroad · 01-12-2019 10:32pm

john4321 wrote: »

Had to look up the guy you mentioned. He is a member of Éirígí and on his website "from 2016 to the present he has been extremely active on the issue of housing, helping to establish both Dundrum Housing Action and the Dundrum Housing Cooperative. This work has also involved him working with a large number of individuals and families that are directly affected by the housing crisis"

https://www.brianleeson.com/about-brian

He is now out complaining public housing is being provided?

I am not into this crowd at all but I see nothing illogical in favouring good value public housing over bad value public housing and therefore protesting against the latter?

Thelonious Monk · 01-12-2019 10:33pm

john4321 wrote: »

Had to look up the guy you mentioned. He is a member of Éirígí and on his website "from 2016 to the present he has been extremely active on the issue of housing, helping to establish both Dundrum Housing Action and the Dundrum Housing Cooperative. This work has also involved him working with a large number of individuals and families that are directly affected by the housing crisis"

https://www.brianleeson.com/about-brian

He is now out complaining public housing is being provided?

well it's being provided at 52 million, they could have built a whole town for that price if they didn't spend it on prime real estate

Ha Long Bay · 01-12-2019 10:36pm

strandroad wrote: »

I am not into this crowd at all but I see nothing illogical in favouring good value public housing over bad value public housing and therefore protesting against the latter?

I was just pointing out who the poster was pointing too as the solution is actually the cause of the problem. Putting pressure on the government to provide housing with no thoughts on cost.

The €3,000 per month luxury welfare apartments

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