pneumonia in 8-12 month old weanlings

cacs · 13-12-2019 11:43pm #1

I got a bout of pneumonia in the shed this week. 13 out of 15 got it two are quite sick hopefully they will pull through. I have an open four bay shed and I think they got a chill last weekend with the wind. They have been well dosed but not vaccinated. Honestly they have had bits of coughs every day since housing the first of October. I think their immune system has been keeping an infection at bay and with the cold wind last week the infection may have tipped the balance. I did not vaccinate them because last year I did vaccinate with the rspv vaccine and the still got sick. I treated them all last year with they orange colour powder antibiotic and it cleared them up. This is happening every year this year was the worst. Looking back I probably should treated them a month ago with anti botic powder but honestly I don’t want to be doing that. I want to reduce my antibiotic usage. So my big question what should I do next year to try and avoid the same thing happening. I know vaccinate. I was thinking of mixing sea weed into boost immunity. What else. I want to farm responsibly and better what would you suggest

farisfat · 13-12-2019 11:53pm

Ibr.

patsy_mccabe · 13-12-2019 11:55pm

Have a look at your worming. I had a similar problem this year with my young weanlings. They are about 3 to 5 months and still with the cows. They were all coughing with snotty noses on and off, since I put them in the shed in October. They were all done in late Augest before that. I did them with Dectomax pouron a week ago and they have improved big time since. There seems to be a growing resistance to Ivermectins. I know Dectomax (Doromectin) is the same family as Ivermectin but I've heard only good things from those that used it.

IBR is at the back of my mind too, but every year it always seems to be the same - coughing, snotty noses but never getting to pneumonia.

I feed them plenty meal too at the start of the winter. It keeps them warm - cheaper than vet visits.

tanko · 14-12-2019 12:10am

I think that vaccinating weanlings against pneumonia a month or two before weaning is money well spent, have been using Rispoval 3 here for years, think it well worth it.
Having them well treated for worms and eating nuts well before weaning is important also.

cacs · 14-12-2019 12:15am

patsy_mccabe wrote: »

Have a look at your worming. I had a similar problem this year with my young weanlings. They are about 3 to 5 months and still with the cows. They were all coughing with snotty noses on and off, since I put them in the shed in October. They were all done in late Augest before that. I did them with Dectomax pouron a week ago and they have improved big time since. There seems to be a growing resistance to Ivermectins. I know Dectomax (Doromectin) is the same family as Ivermectin but I've heard only good things from those that used it.

IBR is at the back of my mind too, but every year it always seems to be the same - coughing, snotty noses but never getting to pneumonia.

I feed them plenty meal too at the start of the winter. It keeps them warm - cheaper than vet visits.

Thanks patsy I was talking to a vet last week. He said some research is coming out that there is not as good of kill rate with generic ivermectins. They contain the same active ingredient but carrier chemical is different and this is having an effect on kill and immunity to ivermectin. I had these well doses with generic. I had just waiting for a clippers I had ordered and Ivormec pour which all came in this week. You are right my vet was on to me about ibr vaccine a couple months back and again I did it do it. Maybe there is some good things here to think about

Jjameson · 14-12-2019 12:42am

Have a dose on myself and it’s an eye opener. That cold dry air and wind is like shards of glass in the chest.

farisfat · 14-12-2019 12:43am

Are they home breed or bought.

RD10 · 14-12-2019 1:13am

Might sound a stupid question but what are first signs of pneumonia? Dont think i've ever had it here.
Weaned some about 2 weeks ago and one seems bit off form since this morning, was fine until today. not bad now but like she has a small bit of a chill or something. bit down in herself but as i say not bad. no coughing & have seen her eating (maybe not as much as she had been but not off food entirely)
Had been doing well since being weaned and she didnt seem overly stressed by the process.
Might be nothing to do with it at all.

keysersoze1 · 14-12-2019 1:24am

Take her temperature that reading will tell you what antibiotics you need to give if any

Base price · 14-12-2019 1:59am

RD10 wrote: »

Might sound a stupid question but what are first signs of pneumonia? Dont think i've ever had it here.
Weaned some about 2 weeks ago and one seems bit off form since this morning, was fine until today. not bad now but like she has a small bit of a chill or something. bit down in herself but as i say not bad. no coughing & have seen her eating (maybe not as much as she had been but not off food entirely)
Had been doing well since being weaned and she didnt seem overly stressed by the process.
Might be nothing to do with it at all.

I would always look out for them walking to the trough for a feed and watch if one is hanging back. The same goes if they are indoor - watch out for any hanging back/not interested when they hear the meal bag/diet feeder.
Watch them when they are eating meal especially if the odd one gives a cough after 30s or a minute. Observer that animal and see if it goes back eating or does it stall with it's head over the trough. Look to see if it's pulling/heaving/flanking from it's guts.

Cavanjack · 14-12-2019 8:12am

RD10 wrote: »

Might sound a stupid question but what are first signs of pneumonia? Dont think i've ever had it here.
Weaned some about 2 weeks ago and one seems bit off form since this morning, was fine until today. not bad now but like she has a small bit of a chill or something. bit down in herself but as i say not bad. no coughing & have seen her eating (maybe not as much as she had been but not off food entirely)
Had been doing well since being weaned and she didnt seem overly stressed by the process.
Might be nothing to do with it at all.

High temp, dull/quiet and not eating. They could also be breathing heavy and coughing but not always.

Say my name · 14-12-2019 10:43am

Give them the seaweed it won't do a bit of harm.
On the worms they're finding out that sward variety means worm burden is not as much of an issue. Some say it's tannins in these plants others say it's the variety of microbes in the gut that worms don't like. But anyway you'll see stock self medicate with different plants if given the choice. Maybe these plants can be conserved as a winter forage? Or a dose of ivy..ha.
But in Korean natural farming they advocate that to kill a microbe/fungi/bacteria pest you don't kill it per se but get as wide as variety of microbes and apply that to the crop. Crowd out that pest problem so it can't compete.

At the biofarm conference this year Christine Jones advocated that you needed 70 different types of plant food for yourself for your own health. My guess is apart from the diverse nutrients and vitamins it's the diversity in microbes that are the benefit and maybe unknownced to yourself its a parasite reducer.

In Jadam teaching they advocate getting old deciduous forest soil and sea salt and warm water to make batches of beneficial microbes and add that to livestock water and bedding. Whether it affects parasites I don't know but they claim they an improvement in livestock health.

Water John · 14-12-2019 11:33am

OP you write about the open shed and possible chill. A draught is the worst thing for an animal. Look at investing in preventing that. Sheeting plus Galebreakers, esp up to 8 feet from the ground.

cacs · 14-12-2019 4:03pm

farisfat wrote: »

Are they home breed or bought.

All home bred

grassroot1 · 15-12-2019 7:56pm

What is your weaning process

jfh · 15-12-2019 8:19pm

Water John wrote: »

OP you write about the open shed and possible chill. A draught is the worst thing for an animal. Look at investing in preventing that. Sheeting plus Galebreakers, esp up to 8 feet from the ground.

+1on this, I had vaccinated mine and a combination of a draught and a leaky drinker brought on pneumonia.

mahoney_j · 15-12-2019 8:33pm

cacs wrote: »

I got a bout of pneumonia in the shed this week. 13 out of 15 got it two are quite sick hopefully they will pull through. I have an open four bay shed and I think they got a chill last weekend with the wind. They have been well dosed but not vaccinated. Honestly they have had bits of coughs every day since housing the first of October. I think their immune system has been keeping an infection at bay and with the cold wind last week the infection may have tipped the balance. I did not vaccinate them because last year I did vaccinate with the rspv vaccine and the still got sick. I treated them all last year with they orange colour powder antibiotic and it cleared them up. This is happening every year this year was the worst. Looking back I probably should treated them a month ago with anti botic powder but honestly I don’t want to be doing that. I want to reduce my antibiotic usage. So my big question what should I do next year to try and avoid the same thing happening. I know vaccinate. I was thinking of mixing sea weed into boost immunity. What else. I want to farm responsibly and better what would you suggest

Do all calves here with bovipast ,great job

Cavanjack · 15-12-2019 9:03pm

jfh wrote: »

+1on this, I had vaccinated mine and a combination of a draught and a leaky drinker brought on pneumonia.

How does a leaky drinker cause pneumonia? Heard of it before alright. I suppose if it got a straw bed wet maybe?

greysides · 15-12-2019 10:07pm

Cavanjack wrote: »

How does a leaky drinker cause pneumonia? Heard of it before alright. I suppose if it got a straw bed wet maybe?

Wet bed syphons heat and energy from body. Extra humidity in air increases survival length of viruses in the air and virus travels in water droplets deep into the lungs on inhaled air.

jfh · 15-12-2019 10:27pm

greysides wrote: »

Wet bed syphons heat and energy from body. Extra humidity in air increases survival length of viruses in the air and virus travels in water droplets deep into the lungs on inhaled air.

He said it better than I could ðŸ˜

cacs · 16-12-2019 6:35pm

These cattle from 330 kg to 500kg. My thinking is they had an underline infection. There immune system was holding it at bay until they got a chill. Then it ran through them. I was talking to some at the weekend he had his fully vaccinated and he lost two over the weekend. Who knows

greysides · 17-12-2019 1:08am

Define 'fully vaccinated'..?
There are three viruses to consider and one bacterium. RSV, PI3, IBR and Pasteurella, respectively. Full cover would be vaccinations against the three viruses, at least. That usually requires a combination of vaccines.

cacs · 17-12-2019 11:42pm

greysides wrote: »

Define 'fully vaccinated'..?
There are three viruses to consider and one bacterium. RSV, PI3, IBR and Pasteurella, respectively. Full cover would be vaccinations against the three viruses, at least. That usually requires a combination of vaccines.

Hello Greyside he vaccinated with bovilius rsv vaccine. I had 13 out 15 8-12 month old weanlings down with it. One just rallied today I thought she was a goner. Did not eat panting foaming at the mouth since last Thursday. In fairness local vet played a blinder for me.

greysides · 18-12-2019 8:54am

cacs wrote: »

Hello Greyside he vaccinated with bovilius rsv vaccine. I had 13 out 15 8-12 month old weanlings down with it. One just rallied today I thought she was a goner. Did not eat panting foaming at the mouth since last Thursday. In fairness local vet played a blinder for me.

I presume you mean Bovipast RSP. The Bovilis range is shown below.

In this case the IBR component has not been covered. It usually hits older animals than calves but that isn't absolute. Most farmers don't aim to cover the entire range. Once the immediate 'fire' is out, you could get your vet to take some blood samples to see if IBR antibodies are present. If they are you need to add Bovilis IBR Marker (live) to your schedule for next year, maybe in mid autumn.

Two shot vaccines take a while to become effective so some planning ahead is needed. Intranasal vaccines will work quicker and shortly after the single required shot. They don't work for as long and need follow up to extend that period if it it is deemed necessary.

DukeCaboom · 18-12-2019 9:18am

We got ibr here over the weekend, completely self inflicted of course. Got it very bad in 2010, vaccinated for years and got complacent and stopped. Luckily it was only beef in the yard so killed 2 Friday.
Speaking to a few dairy friends and have put down a sh1t week with pneumonia in sucks.

greysides · 18-12-2019 6:57pm

DukeCaboom wrote: »

Luckily it was only beef in the yard so killed 2 Friday.

Bear in mind that animals with fevers won't kill out right, could result in total carcase condemnation.

DukeCaboom · 18-12-2019 7:15pm

greysides wrote: »

Bear in mind that animals with fevers won't kill out right, could result in total carcase condemnation.

I'll take my chances, still better than getting a blue page for them.

patsy_mccabe · 18-12-2019 8:05pm

DukeCaboom wrote: »

We got ibr here over the weekend, completely self inflicted of course. Got it very bad in 2010, vaccinated for years and got complacent and stopped. Luckily it was only beef in the yard so killed 2 Friday.
Speaking to a few dairy friends and have put down a sh1t week with pneumonia in sucks.

Would you mind describing the symptoms exactly? Does it go further than coughing and snotty noses?

DukeCaboom · 18-12-2019 8:49pm

patsy_mccabe wrote: »

Would you mind describing the symptoms exactly? Does it go further than coughing and snotty noses?

Off their grub
Empty bellys
Panting/drawing
A lot of spit from their mouth
Listless.....

After that the bad stuff happens

patsy_mccabe · 18-12-2019 9:03pm

DukeCaboom wrote: »

Off their grub
Empty bellys
Panting/drawing
A lot of spit from their mouth
Listless.....

After that the bad stuff happens

What is the bad stuff exactly?

DukeCaboom · 18-12-2019 9:05pm

patsy_mccabe wrote: »

What is the bad stuff exactly?

They go up to biggy & Tupac! ðŸ˜‚

pneumonia in 8-12 month old weanlings

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