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Frozen berries

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  • 15-05-2020 8:53pm
    #1
    Registered Users Posts: 1,223 ✭✭✭


    Hi,

    I noticed that the boiling notice for frozen berries in Lidl and Aldi has been removed a long time ago.

    Does this means that we no longer need to boil them? Is anyone still boiling frozen berries from Aldi/Lidl?


Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 1,224 ✭✭✭zerosugarbuzz


    Amouar wrote: »
    Hi,

    I noticed that the boiling notice for frozen berries in Lidl and Aldi has been removed a long time ago.

    Does this means that we no longer need to boil them? Is anyone still boiling frozen berries from Aldi/Lidl?

    I’ve been using their berries the past few months in smoothies. Knew nothing about the boil notice, I’m fine as far as I can tell if that helps.


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,817 ✭✭✭Darc19


    There was a connection with norovirus outbreaks, but this seems to have gone with no outbreaks recently.

    As per fsai, if the retailer knows the source of the produce and knows that controls are in place, no signs are required.

    A company the size of aldi will know that.

    https://www.fsai.ie/faq/frozen_berries.html


  • Registered Users Posts: 521 ✭✭✭Bargain_Hound


    Jaysus. First I’ve heard of this. I’ve been piling frozen berries into my smoothies for years without boiling. Still here too😊


  • Posts: 5,121 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Jaysus. First I’ve heard of this. I’ve been piling frozen berries into my smoothies for years without boiling. Still here too😊
    https://www.fsai.ie/news_centre/boil_imported_frozen_berries_advice_23072018.html
    It was in the media a lot a few years ago.


  • Registered Users Posts: 13,319 ✭✭✭✭dastardly00


    FSAI tweeted last week about the boil notice for imported frozen berries. First time it's been mentioned in a couple of years

    https://twitter.com/FSAIinfo/status/1277985170814050304?s=20


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  • Registered Users Posts: 19,615 ✭✭✭✭Muahahaha


    Think Ill just stop buying them as theres no point boiling them when you want to use them to cool down a smoothie.

    The boil notice has been ongoing for several years now. Im wondering why the EU dont just give the order for manufactures to boil them before blast freezing them? Maybe that doesnt work or something, must be a reason behind it.


  • Registered Users Posts: 623 ✭✭✭Minier81


    I hadn't noticed the sign but I still boil them, well I actually just give them blast in my microwave steam-ie-majig. Then let them cool if going into yoghurt or something cold.


  • Registered Users Posts: 19,615 ✭✭✭✭Muahahaha


    yeah for me its just a bit too much hassle to e planning a smoothie in advance. Plus if theyre not frozen then the smoothie is warm which I dont like. Ik dont want to go down the road of making ice cubes, theyre not good for the blades of the blender anyway.

    I wonder what commerical juice and smoothie shops are doing with their berries. Thinking of the small ones you see in shopping centres and doubting they are boiling berries there, maybe they do it off site in a central kitchen or something


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,297 ✭✭✭phormium


    Kind of defeats the purpose when you have to boil them. I thought that warning was gone at this stage as had seen no sign of it for ages. Safer to buy fresh when on offer and freeze it, I have a huge crop of raspberries this year so that will be handy.


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,553 ✭✭✭murphyebass


    Muahahaha wrote: »
    Think Ill just stop buying them as theres no point boiling them when you want to use them to cool down a smoothie.

    The boil notice has been ongoing for several years now. Im wondering why the EU dont just give the order for manufactures to boil them before blast freezing them? Maybe that doesnt work or something, must be a reason behind it.

    I make smoothies every day.

    Throw a cup of blueberries and strawberries into boiling water for a minute, strain and fire them into you smoothie machine along with banana, honey and milk.

    A few ice cubes at the bottom of a pint glasses cools the whole thing down.

    Fresh fruit is a pain to keep. The sheer convenience of frozen berries even with a dip in boiling water will always trump fresh ones.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 19,615 ✭✭✭✭Muahahaha


    yeah Im just a bit lazy in that if something isnt convenient then I wont do it. Ill still have my frozen smoothies but it just wont be berries- frozen mango or pineapple will do just as well.

    If I was drinking smoothies every day of the week I woudnt mind the prep but for me its usually spontaneous where Im just a little bit hungry and instead of breaking out a snack I make a smoothie as a good way of getting a couple of your five a day
    phormium wrote: »
    Kind of defeats the purpose when you have to boil them. I thought that warning was gone at this stage as had seen no sign of it for ages. Safer to buy fresh when on offer and freeze it, I have a huge crop of raspberries this year so that will be handy.

    Sadly fresh berries seem to have exploded in price recently. We were just saying over on the Aldi Super 6 thread that blueberries used to be 79c when on offer about a year or 18 months ago , now the offer is 1.29 for the same quantity (125g)


  • Registered Users Posts: 32,373 ✭✭✭✭rubadub


    FSAI tweeted last week about the boil notice for imported frozen berries. First time it's been mentioned in a couple of years

    https://twitter.com/FSAIinfo/status/1277985170814050304?s=20

    That link says.
    Will retailers be displaying notices about the requirement to boil imported frozen berries?
    Retailers selling imported frozen berries need to ensure that the berries they use are sourced from reputable suppliers operating effective food safety management systems and comprehensive traceability systems. As the food chain can be quite complex, it is necessary for food businesses at each stage of the food chain to seek assurances regarding the effectiveness of the food safety management systems in place from their suppliers. If such assurances are not available, the FSAI recommends that the retailer displays a notice advising customers that the frozen berries should be boiled for one minute before consumption.

    So lidl/aldi are not some small shop, the lack of a warning should be a sign that they DO have assurances in place. If so they would be better off having "no boiling required" on them, but it might look bad, or come back to bite them if there is another outbreak. They had warnings in the past so they are fully aware of the issue.

    I was wondering before if these warnings might go on for ages, as fruit could possibly be in deep storage for many years.

    The other option is treating them, chilling with cold water and refreezing immediately yourself. The usual reasons given not to refreeze thawed food is since it changes the texture, the fruit or veg can expand and rupture cells making it all mushy, but if using for smoothies this is not an issue.


  • Registered Users Posts: 19,615 ✭✭✭✭Muahahaha


    I had thought of boiling them in bulk and re-freezing but the FSAI dont mention that as a possibility so I discounted it. Them being mushy wouldnt matter if going to be blitzed in a smoothie anyway but would more be worried about thawing and then re-freezing food.


  • Registered Users Posts: 32,373 ✭✭✭✭rubadub


    this guy does it.
    https://www.huffpost.com/entry/how-does-hepatitis-a-get-into-strawberries_n_57d6cd0ce4b00642712e8911?guccounter=1&guce_referrer=aHR0cHM6Ly93d3cuZ29vZ2xlLmNvbS8&guce_referrer_sig=AQAAAIH2SYHgc4Wz-slDNya5hyNdXsEWd_QPzTa5wdMEMBUOEXX0G9uSv1zWBzuFQtwafZEdQccNxlyKFGQY_khzz5QAntZ0wYcqJ1r4yH99l-o-7orEvk02YInzhr5GUAFB7q_N339P8GE-fdFUgErV5KTBII_jYNrxGm72V55Sh4uz
    Berries of all types are actually a common conduit for viruses, said Benjamin Chapman, a food-safety specialist and an associate professor at North Carolina State University. Over the past decade, there have been several virus outbreaks linked to imported berries, he said...


    And once a berry is contaminated, it’s unlikely that the virus will be washed off, Chapman said. Because berries are more delicate than other fruits, they’re not washed as often, he said. They might be lightly sprayed or misted before being frozen, but that probably won’t remove a virus, he said. And berries have a lot of nooks and crannies on their surfaces, where viruses can hide, he added.

    The next step, freezing the berries, only further preserves the virus, Chapman said. And because frozen berries are sold as “ready to eat,” people are unlikely to heat them before eating, he said. This is especially likely if the berries are being used to make a smoothie, as occurred in the current outbreak, he added.

    Chapman said that he actually microwaves all of his berries before eating them or refreezing them, though he added that his method of heating them to above 200 degrees Fahrenheit (93 degrees C) might be overkill.

    Still, there’s not enough data to suggest that just rinsing the berries would sufficiently remove a virus, he said..


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,553 ✭✭✭murphyebass


    Muahahaha wrote: »
    yeah Im just a bit lazy in that if something isnt convenient then I wont do it. Ill still have my frozen smoothies but it just wont be berries- frozen mango or pineapple will do just as well. (125g)

    I would have assumed that it’s not just frozen berries, ie frozen fruit like mango and pineapple would fall into the same camp.

    I wouldn’t be taking the risk myself for the sake of 60 seconds.


  • Registered Users Posts: 32,373 ✭✭✭✭rubadub


    I would have assumed that it’s not just frozen berries, ie frozen fruit like mango and pineapple would fall into the same camp.

    the frozen stuff would be the innards for those
    One of the reasons for this is that berries are very delicate, and so unlike other, hardier fruits and vegetables, berries need to be harvested by hand, Chapman told Live Science. [Top 7 Germs in Food that Make You Sick]

    Tomatoes, for example, are machine-harvested, so no hands touch them, he said. But berries are too fragile for machines, so each berry is handpicked, he said.

    Because hepatitis A is spread through the “fecal-to-oral route,” if workers picking berries were infected with hepatitis A and had not properly washed their hands, they could transfer the virus from their hands to the berry, Chapman said. In parts of the world where hepatitis A is more common, this is definitely a risk, he added.


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,297 ✭✭✭phormium


    Muahahaha wrote: »
    I had thought of boiling them in bulk and re-freezing but the FSAI dont mention that as a possibility so I discounted it. Them being mushy wouldnt matter if going to be blitzed in a smoothie anyway but would more be worried about thawing and then re-freezing food.

    Refreezing in that scenario is fine, you are cooking them so can refreeze no problem.


  • Registered Users Posts: 623 ✭✭✭Minier81


    Just saw this reminder today:

    "We want to remind consumers of the advice from the Food Safety Authority of Ireland (FSAI) to wash fresh berries and boil frozen berries for one minute prior to consumption. Don’t forget to do this for berries that are added into smoothies...."
    https://www.hpsc.ie/news/title-20094-en.html


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,223 ✭✭✭Amouar


    Minier81 wrote: »
    Just saw this reminder today:

    "We want to remind consumers of the advice from the Food Safety Authority of Ireland (FSAI) to wash fresh berries and boil frozen berries for one minute prior to consumption. Don’t forget to do this for berries that are added into smoothies...."
    https://www.hpsc.ie/news/title-20094-en.html

    Looks like this is never ending. How about just banning the import of frozen berries from countries with previous cases of Hep contamination?


  • Registered Users Posts: 865 ✭✭✭tringle


    I never knew this amd use frozen berries at least 5 times a week


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  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 2,980 ✭✭✭s1ippy


    It should really be more highly publicised, it should be on the packet of berries.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,157 ✭✭✭lucalux


    s1ippy wrote: »
    It should really be more highly publicised, it should be on the packet of berries.

    I agree, but with suppliers changing regularly and all that it probably isn't going to happen soon and not at all if they're not made to.

    I think there should be a highly visible notice on the freezer door, or an FSAI info sticker on the packets at the very least.

    Loads of people don't know and even when I had known about previous warnings - just before they came out with another updated warning I ended up with Norovirus myself from raspberries, as I thought the risk had passed :o


  • Registered Users Posts: 227 ✭✭tangy


    lucalux wrote: »
    <snip>
    I ended up with Norovirus myself from raspberries, as I thought the risk had passed :o

    But how would you know? Were they analysed and found contaminated?


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,157 ✭✭✭lucalux


    tangy wrote: »
    But how would you know? Were they analysed and found contaminated?

    I hadn't eaten anything else that day and the doctor ran tests so maybe she was wrong


  • Registered Users Posts: 227 ✭✭tangy


    A quick search says the incubation period is 12 - 48 hours. Just a random page; might be wrong.

    UK NHS says it's not just eating food:
    You can catch norovirus from:

    close contact with someone with norovirus
    touching surfaces or objects that have the virus on them, then touching your mouth
    eating food that's been prepared or handled by someone with norovirus

    Did your doctor get the raspberries tested? Otherwise, how would you know?


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,275 ✭✭✭km991148


    phormium wrote: »
    Refreezing in that scenario is fine, you are cooking them so can refreeze no problem.

    Just don't put them back in the same bag I guess?


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,157 ✭✭✭lucalux


    tangy wrote: »
    A quick search says the incubation period is 12 - 48 hours. Just a random page; might be wrong.

    UK NHS says it's not just eating food:


    Did your doctor get the raspberries tested? Otherwise, how would you know?

    I took the doctor's opinion as being more informed than my own. I don't usually projectile vomit as a rule.
    I notified the EHO in my area. Hadn't had any contact with other people at all.
    I'm happy to believe that it was the frozen berries, that have a known link to Norovirus.

    If you want to doubt it, that's fine too. It could be complete hogwash, and I could be 100% wrong.


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,297 ✭✭✭phormium


    They will be mush so bag wouldn't be much good and unsealable, I freeze cooked fruit in containers.


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