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Roundabout Query

2»

Comments

  • #52
    Seth Brundle
    Moderators, Politics Moderators Posts: 40,287 Mod ✭✭✭✭Seth Brundle


    realdanbreen wrote: »
    That whole '12 O'clock ' rule has a bolox made of the whole thing.
    Much simpler (and safer) to keep in left lane if taking 1st or 2nd exit, otherwise use right lane.
    ...but that doesn't suit so many roundabouts e.g. https://www.google.com/maps/@53.2704102,-6.2427049,204a,35y,270h/data=!3m1!1e3 where anyone coming from Ballinteer Rd to M50 N should be able to use both left and right lanes. If you were to visit this, you would see that they do use both lanes in this scenario.


  • #53
    Dravokivich
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Music Moderators, Politics Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 22,360 CMod ✭✭✭✭Dravokivich


    tom1ie wrote: »
    The overriding rule at roundabouts is
    Left lane: left turn and straight on.
    Right lane: right turn only UNLESS the road straight ahead is a dual lane road. In this case you can use the right lane to go straight on.

    There is NO legal way to be in the left hand lane and exit the roundabout on the right hand side.

    It doesn't matter how many lanes are on the exit. If there's 2 entering and the right isn't marked explicitly to go around, both can exit straight ahead.

    If unmarked you can legally go around the round about entering from the left lane. Its just advised not to.


  • #54
    tom1ie
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,724 ✭✭✭✭tom1ie


    Dravokivich wrote: »
    It doesn't matter how many lanes are on the exit. If there's 2 entering and the right isn't marked explicitly to go around, both can exit straight ahead.

    If unmarked you can legally go around the round about entering from the left lane. Its just advised not to.

    Your telling me that on an unmarked roundabout you can enter on the left and exit on the right?
    How long have you your driving licence, or have you got one?


  • #55
    Alun
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 21,486 ✭✭✭✭Alun


    tom1ie wrote: »
    Your telling me that on an unmarked roundabout you can enter on the left and exit on the right?
    How long have you your driving licence, or have you got one?
    The key word in the statement is "legally". AFAIK there's nothing in any SI that prohibits it, only what's in the ROTR which are guidelines and not legally binding.


  • #56
    Deise Vu
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,970 ✭✭✭Deise Vu


    liamog wrote: »
    Markings on the road override the standard rules.

    For instance you cannot use the right lane to use an exit before 12 O'Clock unless there is a lane marking indicating otherwise. Except in the case where traffic conditions e.g. a queue of cars heading left at the first exit.

    If for some reason the leftmost lane had a right arrow, then you would be allowed to use the left lane to turn right. Though in reality this would be a terrible design and should probably be fixed by the relevant authority.

    You should check out the roundabout at Waterford Train Station at the northern end of Rice Bridge, it has exactly that configuration when you approach from the Sallypark (M9) direction. Helpfully, the road signs tell you to stay in the left lane when turning right if going towards The Quay and use the right lane turning right if going up Bridge Street. Because every driver in the world passing through Waterford knows whether he is going up Bridge Street or down the Quay.

    Waterford is full of roundabouts with variations on the standard left lane for left / straight ahead. Some of the major ones such as the Hospital (handy that!) have left lane / left only and left lane / left or straight ahead depending on which direction you approach the Roundabout. It generally works great but you need to be very aware that the person beside you probably hasn't noticed the signs. The one's completely in the wrong are also always the first on their supercharged car horn.


  • #57
    liamog
    Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Regional East Moderators Posts: 8,059 Mod ✭✭✭✭liamog


    Dravokivich wrote: »
    It doesn't matter how many lanes are on the exit. If there's 2 entering and the right isn't marked explicitly to go around, both can exit straight ahead.


    You are correct re the number of exit lanes not mattering, however if the straight ahead exit is at or before 12 O'Clock and the entry lanes are unmarked. Only the left lane should be used for using that exit, unless traffic conditions, such as their is a large queue of traffic taking an exit prior to straight exit.


  • #58
    Dravokivich
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Music Moderators, Politics Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 22,360 CMod ✭✭✭✭Dravokivich


    tom1ie wrote: »
    Your telling me that on an unmarked roundabout you can enter on the left and exit on the right?
    How long have you your driving licence, or have you got one?

    It doesn't matter how long I've been driving for. I know the difference in context between an action that's legal and an action that's suggested.

    I don't recall reading anything in the Road Traffic Acts, about explicit use of lanes on a round about based upon entry / exit. It's just as with anywhere else on the roads, Road Markings take precedence. If it's unmarked, you are required to try and use it as safely as you can.
    liamog wrote: »
    You are correct re the number of exit lanes not mattering, however if the straight ahead exit is at or before 12 O'Clock and the entry lanes are unmarked. Only the left lane should be used for using that exit, unless traffic conditions, such as their is a large queue of traffic taking an exit prior to straight exit.

    tom1ie is arguing a legal need to not use the left lane, to go further. As opposed to turning off earlier from a right lane. I don't recall seeing anything that states that, other than advice on how to approach round abouts.


  • #59
    liamog
    Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Regional East Moderators Posts: 8,059 Mod ✭✭✭✭liamog


    Dravokivich wrote: »
    tom1ie is arguing a legal need to not use the left lane, to go further. As opposed to turning off earlier from a right lane. I don't recall seeing anything that states that, other than advice on how to approach round abouts.


    Is there a general requirement to obey road markings and signage? The act of using the right lane is not specifically illegal, but ignoring the road markings and failing to keep left may have caused an offence?


  • #60
    TheChizler
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,474 ✭✭✭TheChizler


    liamog wrote: »
    Is there a general requirement to obey road markings and signage? The act of using the right lane is not specifically illegal, but ignoring the road markings and failing to keep left may have caused an offence?
    The only road marking I can think of on a roundabout that can really dictate where you exit is a continuous white line. Otherwise you can just make a lane change (safely) if you need to.

    The only references I can find to arrows in legislation say they dictate the direction you must take at a junction to join the flow of traffic, so going by that a left arrow just means join the roundabout by going left (clockwise) but says nothing about what exit you take since a roundabout is just a series of junctions on a one way road, and a right arrow would technically mean go right when you join the junction, this would be anticlockwise and is directly contradicted by the only law mentioning roundabouts, so does this mean arrows entering roundabouts are meaningless legally and just suggestions? Discuss... :D

    Now if there was a left arrow coming onto a roundabout but the line markings implied you could go left or straight there might be confusion, maybe you might be guilty of dangerous driving depending on how you handled it.


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  • #61
    Spook_ie
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,896 ✭✭✭✭Spook_ie


    liamog wrote: »
    You too emeldc.

    If you ever want to discuss an interesting roundabout again with similar traffic movements
    here's one I'd recommnd https://www.google.com/maps/@53.4267662,-6.3582727,202m/data=!3m1!1e3 though I supect you may want a break :D

    It has spiral markings what's the problem?


  • #62
    Spook_ie
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,896 ✭✭✭✭Spook_ie


    Dravokivich wrote: »
    It doesn't matter how many lanes are on the exit. If there's 2 entering and the right isn't marked explicitly to go around, both can exit straight ahead.

    If unmarked you can legally go around the round about entering from the left lane. Its just advised not to.
    tom1ie wrote: »
    Your telling me that on an unmarked roundabout you can enter on the left and exit on the right?
    How long have you your driving licence, or have you got one?
    Alun wrote: »
    The key word in the statement is "legally". AFAIK there's nothing in any SI that prohibits it, only what's in the ROTR which are guidelines and not legally binding.

    This ^^^^

    The only legal requirement AFAIK in the traffic regulations is that you must turn left when entering a roundabout, note traffic regulations are the SI's that courts, barristers etc. rely on rather than the RoTR which are guidelines.


  • #63
    liamog
    Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Regional East Moderators Posts: 8,059 Mod ✭✭✭✭liamog


    Spook_ie wrote: »
    This ^^^^

    The only legal requirement AFAIK in the traffic regulations is that you must turn left when entering a roundabout, note traffic regulations are the SI's that courts, barristers etc. rely on rather than the RoTR which are guidelines.


    You are also legally required to follow any regulatory road markings.
    So in effect the unmarked roundabout is a free for all?


  • #64
    Spook_ie
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,896 ✭✭✭✭Spook_ie


    liamog wrote: »
    You are also legally required to follow any regulatory road markings.
    So in effect the unmarked roundabout is a free for all?

    If it's unmarked then yes, if it has lane markings then no but the ONLY SI AFAIK referring specifically to roundabouts is that when entering you must turn left.


  • #65
    Spook_ie
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,896 ✭✭✭✭Spook_ie


    http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/eli/1964/si/294/made/en/print
    21 Entering a roundabout

    21. A driver shall enter a roundabout by turning to the left.

    As still referenced by

    http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/eli/2017/si/244

    15

    Failure of a driver to turn to the left when entering a roundabout


  • #66
    loveall
    Registered Users Posts: 130 ✭✭loveall


    Recently i was on a dual carriage way. Two lanes into roundabout and two out for north and south traffic with the east and west roads joining the roundabout being single lane.
    I entered the roundabout in the right lane as traffic in left was indicating left. I gave way to a car coming round in the left lane of the roundabout. I'd expected the driver to take the next exit but he didn't, I had a feeling something wasn't right. He didn't take the exit for the junction i was taking either and so passed directly in front of my bonnet. He'd gone around the whole roundabout in the left lane. I had my eye on him and could see it coming so I was prepared, but the car behind me nearly flew into my rear.
    No such thing as a free for all on any roundabout!


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