Are we actually saving energy?

atilladehun · 31-01-2007 12:14am #1

Just wondering about using less electricity at home. I try to do as much as i can, plugging out when I can, not leaving chargers in all the time and using CFL bulbs. I've always felt this was not that much to do but wondered about the realistic benifts. I know using less fossil fuels is good for the environment but are these actions actually causing the esb to use less fuel?

The fuel is burned to heat the water to create steam to turn turbines which create the power. As far as i am aware. are the esb working a tight scientific ship in this matter? Are they strictly controlling the amount of coal and turf going on the fires? Is it really worth their while? Do they have to produce a certain amout of surplus energy to keep the country running to a certain standard. When we hear of a sudden surge in demad on an evening for whatever reason is a poor soul there lashing more fuel on or were we peoducing those levels just in case?

Do you get my point? I've haven't entirely bought into every little bit helps in ths matter, its just my conscience that makes me walk/recycle/reduce my consumption. I've always felt the change needs to be from the energy producers. How do you feel?

SeanW · 31-01-2007 5:25am

I'm cautious with electricity too, just changed a bunch of lightbulbs for CFLs and plan to replace the others when I can. I try not to have stuff on that I'm not using, save washing etc for non-peak times, but as an individual you don't really accomplish all that much.

Matching supply to demand is not that precise a science, a lot of plants have to be kept on standby to cover things like surges in demand, sudden loss of a plant, a drop-off in wind speed (major problem here) and stuff like that.m What's more, baseline load operation of power stations is such that one person saving a kilowatt doesn't automatically pave the way to put less fuel in the fire.

The benefits of this won't materialise until a lot of people start saving energy which I hope happens sooner rather than later. Of course the core of the problem in my view is the main source of electricity, but that's a matter for another thread.

Until then, I would say keep at it, and enjoy the individual savings on your monthly ESB bill - that's yours to keep

Celticfire · 31-01-2007 1:01pm

Money in your own pocket is what makes these steps worthwhile.

As regards CFL bulbs and unplugging phone chargers I don't think that they are going to make an iota of difference as long as 80,000 new housing units a year are connected to the E.S.B.

mike65 · 31-01-2007 1:58pm

SeanW takes the correct approach - just think about your own pocket, pointless to worry about anything else.

Mike.

Capt'n Midnight · 01-02-2007 2:16am

especially if you drive

You don't need to go back as far the 1940's to a time when everything was repaired or used till it wore out and then it was a case of make do / mend or do without and a lot of stuff could be given away to places that actually wanted it.

Stuff today is far more recyclable than a generation ago, but far less recycleable than two or three generations before that.

Regarding steam for power generation , the efficiency is determined by the temperature - fossil fuel plants can have red-hot steam ( the pipes actually glow ) directly to the turbines, nuclear plants usually have a heat exchange so cooler, less efficient, indirect steam to the turbines
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carnot_cycle

Carnot cycle efficiency is defined as η = 1 - TR / TA

where

η - Carnot cycle thermal efficiency
TR - Heat rejection temperature
TA - Heat addition temperature

electrochemical stuff bypasses the Carnot cycle so rechargable batteries can store IIRC ~60% of the energy fed into them

as for energy storage, you have turlough hill or you can have big whatjoumacallit's like a big rotary transformer / flywheel or just steam pressure in the boiler depending on the timescale you buffer over.

ESB international seem to do well overseas, even though we don't have the manufacturing industry to support it so they must know a bit about it.

2 stroke · 02-02-2007 3:13am

The voltage in the national grid would tend to fluctuate depending on demand. Automatic and manual systems at the ESB end of the line act to stabilise the voltage in the grid between preset levels. If mr A saves 1 kw the rest of us get a fraction of a milivolt extra. However if a city, county ect saves a few Mega watts, well then maybe the ESB might not have to pull the drain plug in turlough hill as often, or maybe they might be able to power down some boilers.

Are we actually saving energy?

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