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12V LED lights in hot press/storage room shelves

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  • 22-02-2021 11:10pm
    #1
    meztli
    Registered Users Posts: 11 ✭


    Hi,
    is it allowed to install 12V LED lights on the wooden shelves of a hot press/storage room?

    In my apartment there's already a light on the ceiling of the hot press room with a light switch that controls it (I've checked and it's connected to the lighting RCBO).

    My idea was:
    * bypass the light switch adding a blank plate instead of it
    * replace the light fitting on the ceiling with a 12V LED one
    * put a 12V LED transform on the ceiling above where the light fitting was
    * use trunking to get the 12V cable to run on one side of the door
    * install 12 LED strips on the wooden shelves connecting them to the cable that runs on the side of the door
    * install a magnetic door sensor to switch the LED on when the door is opened

    image.png
    https://ibb.co/BV7RKMD
    I drew this on top of a random hot press room to explain my idea better. Hope it makes sense.

    Any help on the matter would be much appreciated.

    Thanks


Comments

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    #2
    Chomper.
    Closed Accounts Posts: 67 ✭✭Chomper.


    I wouldn't bother you've equipment there ,.you'll need the light someday


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    #3
    meztli
    Registered Users Posts: 11 ✭meztli


    Chomper. wrote: »
    I wouldn't bother you've equipment there ,.you'll need the light someday

    Hi Chomper, thanks for your reply. Sorry but I don't understand.
    The photo I used is not my hot press it's just a random one I found online.
    I know I need the light, I just want more of it, especially on the shelves.


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    #4
    Chomper.
    Closed Accounts Posts: 67 ✭✭Chomper.


    meztli wrote: »
    Hi Chomper, thanks for your reply. Sorry but I don't understand.
    The photo I used is not my hot press it's just a random one I found online.
    I know I need the light, I just want more of it, especially on the shelves.

    The wiring rules are strict on electrical equipment in hot press

    The lighting is probably not equipment in the strictest sense of the word unless you had the transformer plugged in

    Still I wouldn't be in favour of this myself


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    #5
    Chomper.
    Closed Accounts Posts: 67 ✭✭Chomper.


    I would improve the ceiling lighting to a high output led type

    Forget the shelf lighting imo


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    #6
    2011
    Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators, Regional East Moderators Posts: 12,536 Mod ✭✭✭✭2011


    Chomper. wrote: »
    I would improve the ceiling lighting to a high output led type

    Forget the shelf lighting imo

    Agreed.
    I suggest that you install a PIR on the ceiling. This would be so much easier.


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    #7
    meercat
    Registered Users Posts: 4,729 ✭✭✭meercat


    2011 wrote: »
    Agreed.
    I suggest that you install a PIR on the ceiling. This would be so much easier.

    This would be against regulations
    555.6.1


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    #8
    Chomper.
    Closed Accounts Posts: 67 ✭✭Chomper.


    meercat wrote: »
    This would be against regulations
    555.6.1

    Ah here..

    "Electrical Equipment"

    A pir or microwave integrated into a fitting is ok

    Doubt a inspector would pull you up on a ceiling pir either


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    #9
    meercat
    Registered Users Posts: 4,729 ✭✭✭meercat


    Chomper. wrote: »
    Ah here..

    "Electrical Equipment"

    A pir or microwave integrated into a fitting is ok

    Doubt a inspector would pull you up on a ceiling pir either

    I don’t make the rules but neither a light or pir are permitted in a hot press although the op says room so that may be allowed


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    #10
    Chomper.
    Closed Accounts Posts: 67 ✭✭Chomper.


    meercat wrote: »
    I don’t make the rules but neither a light or pir are permitted in a hot press although the op says room so that may be allowed

    I was about to correct you but I see strictly speaking a luminaire is 'apparatus' which then falls under the definition of electrical equipment


    Seems ridiculous although there was the issue of incandescents and clothes piled up causing a fire hazard


    Surely the rules can/will be amended in some way to allow for an enclosed led fitting


    A hot press requires illumination to work on equipment


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    #11
    2011
    Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators, Regional East Moderators Posts: 12,536 Mod ✭✭✭✭2011


    meercat wrote: »
    I don’t make the rules but neither a light or pir are permitted in a hot press although the op says room so that may be allowed

    If you install a downlighter then technically the light is not in the hot press (its in the ceiling void above the hot press). Same for the PIR.


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    #12
    Chomper.
    Closed Accounts Posts: 67 ✭✭Chomper.


    It's actually a hazard having no light in a hot press

    I'm behind a desk nowadays but are they are actually enforcing this rule?


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    #13
    meztli
    Registered Users Posts: 11 ✭meztli


    Ok, I understand that the LED under the shelves idea is not a possibility.

    The light on the ceiling was there already, I've also asked other tenants of the apartment block I live in and it's the same in their apartment.

    Considering the amount of regulation around hot press room, I think I'm not going to mess with it and leave everything as it is.

    Thanks everyone for the help.

    PS: Out of curiosity is it possible to get the regulation text somewhere?


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    #14
    Chomper.
    Closed Accounts Posts: 67 ✭✭Chomper.


    2011 wrote: »
    If you install a downlighter then technically the light is not in the hot press (its in the ceiling void above the hot press). Same for the PIR.

    It would need to be above in a void not flush

    Are new builds not fitted with luminaire in hot press, fist.i heard of this although technically it appears correct


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    #15
    meercat
    Registered Users Posts: 4,729 ✭✭✭meercat


    2011 wrote: »
    If you install a downlighter then technically the light is not in the hot press (its in the ceiling void above the hot press). Same for the PIR.


    The issue is stacking clothes that may reach the fitting and ignite from the heat of the bulb. I know you will say led won’t heat

    That’s why no switches are permitted now either


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    #16
    meercat
    Registered Users Posts: 4,729 ✭✭✭meercat


    meztli wrote: »

    PS: Out of curiosity is it possible to get the regulation text somewhere?

    555.6.1
    Electrical equipment in a domestic airing cupboard and similar enclosures shall be confined to the following

    An immersion heater and its associated wiring but excluding switches

    Auxiliary equipment associated with water heating systems


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    #17
    2011
    Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators, Regional East Moderators Posts: 12,536 Mod ✭✭✭✭2011


    meercat wrote: »
    The issue is stacking clothes that may reach the fitting and ignite from the heat of the bulb. I know you will say led won’t heat

    That’s why no switches are permitted now either

    Agreed. This is why an enclosed LED light installed in the space above the hot press poses no risk and complies with the spirit and letter of the rules.


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    #18
    Chomper.
    Closed Accounts Posts: 67 ✭✭Chomper.


    2011 wrote: »
    Agreed. This is why an enclosed LED light installed in the space above the hot press poses no risk and complies with the spirit and letter of the rules.

    If it's flush they'll rule it's in the hot press


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    #19
    meztli
    Registered Users Posts: 11 ✭meztli


    meercat wrote: »
    555.6.1
    Electrical equipment in a domestic airing cupboard and similar enclosures shall be confined to the following

    An immersion heater and its associated wiring but excluding switches

    Auxiliary equipment associated with water heating systems

    Thanks a lot for sharing the relevant part of the regulation.
    I was more interested in the whole thing, I've found https://shop.standards.ie/en-ie/standards/ET101-2008-A1-A2-A3-2018-1132705_SAIG_ETCI_ETCI_2735005/ which should be free for the PDF version but the website doesn't work at checkout. I know this has been replaced by a newer version but my apartment black should have been build in the early 2000 so I wanted to understand the regulations that made sense for it.
    meercat wrote: »
    The issue is stacking clothes that may reach the fitting and ignite from the heat of the bulb. I know you will say led won’t heat

    That’s why no switches are permitted now either

    Forgive my naive question, but is stacking clothes really the issue that prevents everyone from having lights in hot press rooms?
    Wouldn't a light fitting that prevents clothes from getting in direct contact with the hot bulb solve the issue?


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    #20
    Mrcaramelchoc
    Registered Users Posts: 1,795 ✭✭✭Mrcaramelchoc


    I bought these for my hotpress.

    https://m.banggood.com/BlitzWolf-BW-LT8-Motion-Sensor-LED-Cabinet-Light-Removable-Lithium-Battery-3000K-Color-Temperature-Night-Ligh-p-1321589.html?akmClientCountry=IE&rmmds=orderdetail

    No wiring and they work perfectly. Just a suggestion.


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    #21
    meztli
    Registered Users Posts: 11 ✭meztli


    Mrcaramelchoc wrote: »
    I bought these for my hotpress.

    https://m.banggood.com/BlitzWolf-BW-LT8-Motion-Sensor-LED-Cabinet-Light-Removable-Lithium-Battery-3000K-Color-Temperature-Night-Ligh-p-1321589.html?akmClientCountry=IE&rmmds=orderdetail

    No wiring and they work perfectly. Just a suggestion.

    Thanks a lot for sharing that, I've got something similar at the moment, I wanted to get rid of having to charge them and also have something to do over the weekend in this madness where I spend all the time at home 😅

    After realising how complex the matter is, I'll stick with charing those things.


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    #22
    meercat
    Registered Users Posts: 4,729 ✭✭✭meercat


    meztli wrote: »



    Forgive my naive question, but is stacking clothes really the issue that prevents everyone from having lights in hot press rooms?

    It’s not just lights. It’s switches as well. There have been incidences when clothes stacked on immersion switches have caused fires

    Whilst the regulations may have permitted lights in a hot press at the time of construction they are not permitted now so any rec undertaking work in a hot press now must abide by current regulations


    If you can walk into the hot press it’s considered a room and these regulations don’t apply


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    #23
    meztli
    Registered Users Posts: 11 ✭meztli


    meercat wrote: »
    It’s not just lights. It’s switches as well. There have been incidences when clothes stacked on immersion switches have caused fires

    Whilst the regulations may have permitted lights in a hot press at the time of construction they are not permitted now so any rec undertaking work in a hot press now must abide by current regulations


    If you can walk into the hot press it’s considered a room and these regulations don’t apply

    Ah! that explains it then, I can walk in there.

    Thanks a lot for the explanations meercat.


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    #24
    2011
    Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators, Regional East Moderators Posts: 12,536 Mod ✭✭✭✭2011


    Chomper. wrote: »
    If it's flush they'll rule it's in the hot press

    No, it’s recessed to the point that not a single part of the light crosses into the hot press.


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    #25
    Chomper.
    Closed Accounts Posts: 67 ✭✭Chomper.


    2011 wrote: »
    No, it’s recessed to the point that not a single part of the light crosses into the hot press.

    Can you provide a link for the luminaire ?


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    #26
    2011
    Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators, Regional East Moderators Posts: 12,536 Mod ✭✭✭✭2011


    Chomper. wrote: »
    Can you provide a link for the luminaire ?

    Sure


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    #27
    Chomper.
    Closed Accounts Posts: 67 ✭✭Chomper.


    2011 wrote: »
    Sure
    I'm still not seeing how it's outside the hot press

    This rule on luminaires is news to me until I checked the definition today

    Luminaire = electrical apparatus = electrical equipment

    It seems a little dated now re; hazard from incandescent lamps

    Is there any change in ET10101 I'm curious ?


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