Wiring new build

Faiche Ro · 23-06-2020 4:41pm #1

Hi All
looking for some advice regarding wiring of a new build as im really afraid ill mess this up.

One 'professional' recommended putting cat 6 and tv cables to every room in the house.(obviously meant bedrooms and living areas)
Another said no need for that - most things are wireless these days and a run cat 6 to a few wifi booster spots is enough.

So im a bit confused as to the best approach - would appreciate any feedback?

Also if i wanted wall mounted TVs (one in open plan area, one in living room) is there a good way of doing this? i.e wiring HDMI cables fro behind the TV to a point in the corner of the room and putting the sky box there etc.

shanec1928 · 23-06-2020 4:43pm

At least two cat cables to each room. Depending on size of the house some in the roof for access points. All wired back to a central patch panel. Do it right and do it once.

boogerballs · 23-06-2020 4:49pm

if a professional told you to go with wireless over wired cat 6 then that would worry me. With wired you are going to get 1GB+ rates full duplex. Even powerline adapters would be a better setup than wirelsss.

As other replies have said, run 2 connections to each room where you may ever want a networked device. Over the next few years everything will have a network connection and now is the time to put them in as its very little cost when building a new house.

The Nal · 23-06-2020 4:56pm

Put the wifi router in the middle of the house. Most are sitting in the corner of the house under the living room window so the centre of the signal is in the middle of the road.

Wire where possible. Cat cables running to every possible TV/PC/Sky/Home office point. Try not to rely on wifi boosters. They work ok for the most part but can mess with speed and can cause drops so always hardwire where possible.

Would advise a few 5 amp sockets where you intend to put lamps etc. Very handy just to be able to use the wall to turn of low lamps and the like.

With the TV, yeah wire up to where you want to put it but remember if you have a TV on the wall and a Sky box off in a far corner and something else with an infared remote (like an amp or a home cinema system etc), you'll be able to control Sky ok from your TV seat but maybe not the the amp.

Give it as much practical thought as you can. I did to a degree but theres a couple of things I wished Id have thought of now that Im in a couple of years. Some of this stuff you only get one shot at.

Dudda · 23-06-2020 5:25pm

You can't have enough Cat 6 cables. I'd even consider 4 to the main TV and 2 to all other points. You might end up running HDMi over Cat 6 to another room. Put a few into the corner of rooms. These can be used to power POE CCTV in the future. Also have a few outside for external cameras.
For WiFi you need at least one per floor centrally located and I'd still put 2-3 in a bungalow spread out. You can have POE WiFi Access Points. I used 4 Ubiquiti UniFi Access Points in different locations which are amazing but anything cheaper that's similar will work. I've one on the outside of the garage which gives me great WiFi throughout the garden. I would work and have zoom meetings from the garden when we had lovely weather for the first part of the Covid lockdown.
I even put in pipes in the polished concrete floor that go back to the comms cabinet. Tiny thermostats connected to Cat 6 record the temperature of the floor and if the floor in the south facing room is hot the underfloor heating pump comes on. The Boiler doesn't, only the pump which takes almost nothing to power it. Pumping the water around from warm areas to cooler areas spreads out the solar gain from the large south facing windows. It stops this room overheating and keeps cooler rooms warm.
You can almost do anything if you've Cat 6 cables available but you'd never be able to add them later to some places like a concrete floor. Bring lots outside early in the project as doing them later will damage the airtight layer of the house.

Faiche Ro · 23-06-2020 9:23pm

The Nal wrote: »

Put the wifi router in the middle of the house. Most are sitting in the corner of the house under the living room window so the centre of the signal is in the middle of the road.

Wire where possible. Cat cables running to every possible TV/PC/Sky/Home office point. Try not to rely on wifi boosters. They work ok for the most part but can mess with speed and can cause drops so always hardwire where possible.

Would advise a few 5 amp sockets where you intend to put lamps etc. Very handy just to be able to use the wall to turn of low lamps and the like.

With the TV, yeah wire up to where you want to put it but remember if you have a TV on the wall and a Sky box off in a far corner and something else with an infared remote (like an amp or a home cinema system etc), you'll be able to control Sky ok from your TV seat but maybe not the the amp.

Give it as much practical thought as you can. I did to a degree but theres a couple of things I wished Id have thought of now that Im in a couple of years. Some of this stuff you only get one shot at.

Thanks - out of curiosity what are the things you wished you’d have thought of?

Faiche Ro · 23-06-2020 9:29pm

Thanks for the responses folks much appreciated. Think I’ll take the advice and request a lot more cat 6 cables all wired back to a patch panel in the utility.

Does anyone know if it’s possible to keep your sky box in a separate room (utility with the central path has panel/ comms unit) and have 2 TVs connected to it. Then use the multirroom sky option? Or would in need 2 sky boxes?

wizardman · 23-06-2020 9:49pm

Reading with interest. Why are 2 cat6 recommended, ie what would they be used for?

1 for wired internet?
1 for hdmi over cat6?

I did a kitchen renovation recently and ran 1 cat6 from router to TV and a shotgun cable from dish to TV. Just wondering now am I missing out now with only 1 cat6.

Turbohymac · 23-06-2020 9:54pm

ec_pc · 24-06-2020 7:44am

In my opinion it all comes down to your own requirements. I recently fnished a new build and decided against structured network cabling in favour of a wireless based solution for several reasons.

Firstly there was the cost associated with a full house network - materials, extra sockets for network ports and labour. We have a lot of electrical sockets and it would look messy with even more network sockets alongside tv sockets. Personal opinion on this point I guess.

A big influence was the fact that the company I work for moved to a brand new office last year and went wireless - no structured network cabling by and large. It has worked well, no issues in a busy environment with 200 people, but admitedly it is a significant wirelss infrastructure, but was cheaper than wired.

Some other poster mentioned high speeds associated with cat 6e, but in reality is this even going to be used, espeically if you only have say a 100 or 200 MB internet connection?

Wireless is the future I think. Speeds are sufficient for domestic use. It's neat, portable and replaceable. Practically everything is wireless these days and I certainly don't buy electronics unless they have wireless capability.

I bought powerline extenders for less than 200 euro and have a full wifi mesh through the house and garage about 40 meters from the house using electrical cable to carry the signal. Working very well, great reliability and performance is good.

Just my thoughts, all depends on your needs really.

One extra note - I knew I was going to use wifi extenders from the outset, so a few strategically placed electrical sockets were very useful. Just something else to consider.

Faiche Ro · 24-06-2020 9:34am

ec_pc wrote: »

In my opinion it all comes down to your own requirements. I recently fnished a new build and decided against structured network cabling in favour of a wireless based solution for several reasons.

Firstly there was the cost associated with a full house network - materials, extra sockets for network ports and labour. We have a lot of electrical sockets and it would look messy with even more network sockets alongside tv sockets. Personal opinion on this point I guess.

A big influence was the fact that the company I work for moved to a brand new office last year and went wireless - no structured network cabling by and large. It has worked well, no issues in a busy environment with 200 people, but admitedly it is a significant wirelss infrastructure, but was cheaper than wired.

Some other poster mentioned high speeds associated with cat 6e, but in reality is this even going to be used, espeically if you only have say a 100 or 200 MB internet connection?

Wireless is the future I think. Speeds are sufficient for domestic use. It's neat, portable and replaceable. Practically everything is wireless these days and I certainly don't buy electronics unless they have wireless capability.

I bought powerline extenders for less than 200 euro and have a full wifi mesh through the house and garage about 40 meters from the house using electrical cable to carry the signal. Working very well, great reliability and performance is good.

Just my thoughts, all depends on your needs really.

One extra note - I knew I was going to use wifi extenders from the outset, so a few strategically placed electrical sockets were very useful. Just something else to consider.

Thanks - when you say wifi extenders are they the same as what i have been referring to as 'boosters'? I have 4 of these throughout the house to give good wifi signal (including on the balcony) but didn't specify electrical socket beside the booster point - i had assumed the devices would be POE?

Len_007 · 24-06-2020 9:39am

I got my living room wired for 7.1 Surround sound, so there's 7 speaker ports (8th is for the sub) scattered around the room feeding from a panel in the wall to the utility room where I'll have my AV receiver. So if home cinema is you thing maybe think along those lines

ec_pc · 24-06-2020 10:18am

Faiche Ro wrote: »

Thanks - when you say wifi extenders are they the same as what i have been referring to as 'boosters'? I have 4 of these throughout the house to give good wifi signal (including on the balcony) but didn't specify electrical socket beside the booster point - i had assumed the devices would be POE?

Not sure what booster you have, but when it comes to wifi extenders, there are essentially 2 types - those which boost the signal purely using wifi and then there are models which will also send the signal over the electrical wiring. For example, google TP Link Deco P9 to see what I mean.

Tabby McTat · 24-06-2020 11:20am

Len_007 wrote: »

I got my living room wired for 7.1 Surround sound, so there's 7 speaker ports (8th is for the sub) scattered around the room feeding from a panel in the wall to the utility room where I'll have my AV receiver. So if home cinema is you thing maybe think along those lines

+1 on this. Surround sound system can look pretty messy if you have the cables running across the room. I had my room wired for a few years before getting decent speakers but it makes a great difference now on movies and Netflix shows that are output in 5.1.

shanec1928 · 24-06-2020 11:43am

wizardman wrote: »

Reading with interest. Why are 2 cat6 recommended, ie what would they be used for?

1 for wired internet?
1 for hdmi over cat6?

I did a kitchen renovation recently and ran 1 cat6 from router to TV and a shotgun cable from dish to TV. Just wondering now am I missing out now with only 1 cat6.

a bit of that give you options. you might have the tv hard wired and need an ap in that room. theirs your two cables used straight away saves having to use a load of small switches too.

make sure the person fitting leaves enough slack cable. especially at the patch panel. you may end up adding to it over time and end up needing a bigger cabinet or moving it slightly having the slack in the cable makes this so much easier.

awec · 24-06-2020 12:00pm

Faiche Ro wrote: »

Thanks for the responses folks much appreciated. Think I’ll take the advice and request a lot more cat 6 cables all wired back to a patch panel in the utility.

Does anyone know if it’s possible to keep your sky box in a separate room (utility with the central path has panel/ comms unit) and have 2 TVs connected to it. Then use the multirroom sky option? Or would in need 2 sky boxes?

You could do this but both TVs would get the same output, i.e. you'd only be able to watch the same thing. Changing Sky Channel will change on both TVs.

If you want to watch different things you'll need multiroom, which is a separate minibox for each additional TV. For Sky, the miniboxes connect via wifi to the main box, so no wires required.

You might be able to have your main box in your utility, and connect 1 tv directly to this, and get multiroom for the 2nd tv. But you would need to get the bluetooth remote for the main box (~35 quid from Sky if you don't already have it), and then hope that it'd be within range for a reliable connection from wherever your tv connected to the main box is.

Sky multiroom is like 20 quid a month, you get 1 mini box free, then any additional miniboxes you've to pay like 100 quid for I think.

The Nal · 24-06-2020 5:12pm

Faiche Ro wrote: »

Thanks - out of curiosity what are the things you wished you’d have thought of?

5 amp socket for the bedside lamp.

As others have said, speaker wire to a few points for the home cinema surround sound.

Tabby McTat · 24-06-2020 5:31pm

The Nal wrote: »

5 amp socket for the bedside lamp.

As others have said, speaker wire to a few points for the home cinema surround sound.

Lots of 5 amps in living areas and bedroom. Run a cable out to the garden shed. Also sockets on the kitchen island if you have one. I've learnt you can't have enough sockets in the kitchen.
Sockets by the front door are handy for vacuuming the car!

Faiche Ro · 25-06-2020 5:53am

barrac wrote: »

+1 on this. Surround sound system can look pretty messy if you have the cables running across the room. I had my room wired for a few years before getting decent speakers but it makes a great difference now on movies and Netflix shows that are output in 5.1.

I have a pretty standard square tv room. Do I just as the electrician to run speaker wires to the 4 corners and back to a point behind the TV? Is there a specific cable that I need to specify?

ec_pc · 25-06-2020 5:58am

Other useful things we did : Alarm panel at back door and in bedroom (handy if alarm goes off during night), light switch beside bed, weatherproof outdoor sockets, sockets in attic, low level secondary light for bathrooms at night, power feeds to patio for future use, power and data line to gate for future use, power to shed.

We also put in CCTV, but worth considering installing the cables now for future use.

We had a great electrician who walked through the house room by room, recommended sockets in places I would not have considered. Take into account the possible layout of each room and where sockets are needed.

Tabby McTat · 25-06-2020 8:51am

Faiche Ro wrote: »

I have a pretty standard square tv room. Do I just as the electrician to run speaker wires to the 4 corners and back to a point behind the TV? Is there a specific cable that I need to specify?

Simple as that really. Depending on the layout of the room, with furniture etc, you mightn't have the surround speakers in each corner. It's standard speaker cable you are using, but make sure that it's of good quality. You'll still need to run a cable for the subwoofer but at this stage you can't tell where the best place to put that will be. It depends on furniture placement and the accoustics of the room. I have mine in a corner behind me if that's any use.

Lumen · 25-06-2020 8:57am

WiFi networking, and particularly mesh networking, has come on so much in the last few years I'm not sure I'd bother with wired unless there was something in the building fabric (e.g. foil backed insulation) blocking signals, or I was living in an squeezy housing estate (but then how many one-offs are there in housing estates now?).

My house has telephone cabling all over it from the 1980s for things like bedside telephones. Cables for telephones! There's an unused satellite dish on the roof and coax running to all the living rooms, none of which is used any more. I bet the original owners though the place was futureproof too.

tedimc · 25-06-2020 9:10am

Lumen wrote: »

WiFi networking, and particularly mesh networking, has come on so much in the last few years I'm not sure I'd bother with wired unless there was something in the building fabric (e.g. foil backed insulation) blocking signals, or I was living in an squeezy housing estate (but then how many one-offs are there in housing estates now?).

My house has telephone cabling all over it from the 1980s for things like bedside telephones. Cables for telephones! There's an unused satellite dish on the roof and coax running to all the living rooms, none of which is used any more. I bet the original owners though the place was futureproof too.

I agree with this. I wired network points, multi room sound and surround sound in my house. Alexa has pretty much made the multi room audio redundant, I had a seriously limited option list for wired surround sound systems when I went to look (most were wireless) and my ubiquity WiFi system has made the network points totally redundant.

If doing again, the only thing I would do is CCTV PoE and maybe cables for a temp/humidity monitoring.

I also put motion sensors in each room for a smart home system.

Lumen · 25-06-2020 9:24am

tedimc wrote: »

I agree with this. I wired network points, multi room sound and surround sound in my house. Alexa has pretty much made the multi room audio redundant,

Oh, I'd forgotten about the audio cabling. I have some of that too!

I suspect we're on the verge of speakers become obselescent too. I have a lovely pair of floorstanding speakers I can stream to, but they rarely get used, and I've started wearing earbuds around the house. In a couple of decades we'll probably be using cochlear implants.

Class MayDresser · 25-06-2020 9:39am

One thing I have which I find handy is a DP switch for the socket behind the TV, means I can knock everything off when I need to without pulling out the TV.
WiFi enabled sockets would take care of this now but they can be expensive yet imo.
If you have a fireplace now is the time to leave a switched lighting supply in case you'll want to integrate lights into the mantelpiece or hearth later.
Light under the stairs, outside security gate communications, satellite dish and saorview cabling, telephone line ducting a few more considerations.

Tabby McTat · 25-06-2020 10:25am

tedimc wrote: »

I agree with this. I wired network points, multi room sound and surround sound in my house. Alexa has pretty much made the multi room audio redundant, I had a seriously limited option list for wired surround sound systems when I went to look (most were wireless) and my ubiquity WiFi system has made the network points totally redundant.

If doing again, the only thing I would do is CCTV PoE and maybe cables for a temp/humidity monitoring.

I also put motion sensors in each room for a smart home system.

Agree with WiFi for multi room audio. Alexa, Sonos or Yamaha Musiccast are all good options here. For surround sound I would definitely be going with wired speakers.

teednab-el · 06-07-2020 6:08am

Wired data points will always beat wireless for reliability no matter what. Cat 6 will be around in next 10 to 15 years so i be putting in those cables where i could.

theteal · 06-07-2020 6:30am

wizardman wrote: »

Reading with interest. Why are 2 cat6 recommended, ie what would they be used for?

1 for wired internet?
1 for hdmi over cat6?

I did a kitchen renovation recently and ran 1 cat6 from router to TV and a shotgun cable from dish to TV. Just wondering now am I missing out now with only 1 cat6.

1 network port is most likely fine for a kitchen TV but a main living room TV would like need a few more. In my own case theres the TV, virgin box, xbox and a media pc all patched. . .I'm eyeing up an a/v amp that'll likely need one also.

teednab-el · 06-07-2020 7:48am

theteal wrote: »

1 network port is most likely fine for a kitchen TV but a main living room TV would like need a few more. In my own case theres the TV, virgin box, xbox and a media pc all patched. . .I'm eyeing up an a/v amp that'll likely need one also.

Could you not get a switch for all of that? Personally i think more than 2 x cat 6 at tv point is overkill. 2 should be plenty.

dubrov · 06-07-2020 8:03am

Wireless is very good now so should be sufficient.
I would consider wiring from where your router is to another point on the far side of the house so you can add a wireless access point.

Another thing to consider is neat cabling around the TV. You can put the coaxial/socket/LAN points behind where the TV will hang but also be aware you are likely to need a console/AV receiver/Satellite box below it that will also need cables. If you want to hide these you'll really need two points (behind the TV and one below).

06-07-2020 8:07am

Run 2x CAT6 to each room but install them in conduit so as to future proof the house.

Calahonda52 · 07-07-2020 11:20am

Wired all the way for me and conventional landline, there is enough EMF and then when 5G comes along...

Josh. · 08-07-2020 7:28pm

I'm a spark myself not that it matters , the best convenience in my own place is to be able to walk round without turning on/off light switches when it's dark, whatever way you choose to do that, lot safer with kids and anyone inebriated, you might want a few flush pirs fitted in corridors, toilets

Other things already said , good speaker cable in the right locations

Cables where you may need them later garden , attic , and decent supply to shed

Exterior lighting around the house

Provision for smart controls, neutrals at light switches if needed

Decent mechanical extraction in bathrooms and kitchen

Provision for EV charging

Effects · 08-07-2020 9:32pm

dubrov wrote: »

Wireless is very good now so should be sufficient.

Nah.

dubrov · 08-07-2020 10:42pm

Effects wrote: »

Nah.

Wireless has moved on hugely. Speeds of 80Mb/s are no problem now.
Range is still an issue for many but there are some pretty decent mesh solutions available.

In 20 years, I'd say wired will be dead as a dodo

shanec1928 · 09-07-2020 10:31am

dubrov wrote: »

Wireless has moved on hugely. Speeds of 80Mb/s are no problem now.
Range is still an issue for many but there are some pretty decent mesh solutions available.

In 20 years, I'd say wired will be dead as a dodo

sure....:pac::pac:

theteal · 09-07-2020 10:49am

teednab-el wrote: »

Could you not get a switch for all of that? Personally i think more than 2 x cat 6 at tv point is overkill. 2 should be plenty.

Nope, adding and extra component, taking up a power port, adding clutter. I'll do the job right and have a minimum of 4 ports in that part of the room when I finally get the finger out.

dubrov wrote: »

Wireless has moved on hugely. Speeds of 80Mb/s are no problem now.
Range is still an issue for many but there are some pretty decent mesh solutions available.

In 20 years, I'd say wired will be dead as a dodo

So many things can cause interference with a wireless signal that there is no way I'd recommend it be relied upon. As a new example (to me at least), I'm following a few chats over on AVForums based around some expensive new fangled wireless soundbar speaker setups. There are more than a few of those guys having issues with both their WLAN and the signal getting to their shiny new wireless speakers since their new purchases arrived.

There are also security implications with wireless, my infosec manger would love nothing more than to get rid of our corp wireless stating that Amazon don't allow it in their organisation (surprising if true but knowing him it most likely is) .

dubrov · 09-07-2020 11:52am

Interference could be an issue alright if you are planning to use a lot of devices.

In the security point, yes it is less secure than wired but once you have a wireless access point to the network at all, wiring after that point doesn't really make a difference. So either give up the wireless internet access on the laptop or accept the risk

Pretty much all devices use encrypted communication these days.

Josh. · 09-07-2020 12:57pm

I dunno

Not an expert on this but wired is also simpler to setup as well as stable

I'd still be using a mix of wired and wireless

Josh. · 09-07-2020 1:00pm

The mechanical extraction in the kitchen and bathrooms can be important

Roof vents and proper fans, the Micky Mouse 4"fans are useless

Plan the siting and wiring of the TVs so you're not messing about after

Effects · 09-07-2020 6:33pm

dubrov wrote: »

Wireless has moved on hugely. Speeds of 80Mb/s are no problem now.

For whatever reason, wireless doesn't travel that well, corner to corner in my house.
So I was able to add another wireless router downstairs, on one of the cat 6 cables I ran to a closet. Covers downstairs nicely.

I also stream from a NAS in my comms cab in the home office to the TV in the sitting room over Cat 6. I'd rather not have that over Wifi.

teednab-el · 10-07-2020 1:52am

dubrov wrote: »

In 20 years, I'd say wired will be dead as a dodo

Highly unlikely

rampantbunny · 13-07-2020 9:03am

barrac wrote: »

Lots of 5 amps in living areas and bedroom. Run a cable out to the garden shed. Also sockets on the kitchen island if you have one. I've learnt you can't have enough sockets in the kitchen.
Sockets by the front door are handy for vacuuming the car!

A few external sockets can be useful also. I've one at back of garage, one at side of house (for cleaning car) and another elsewhere. Easier than running extension cables out windows etc. I use them most weekends.

You can also run power to sockets hidden in a press/drawer unit to hide devices as they charge. I didn't do this myself because I was concerned about chargers exploding and the like, but many have done it without issue.

Accent lighting plays a big part in interior design so spend some time thinking about this. Display presses, kitchen kicker-boards, wine-rack, pictures - all these can be enhanced with subtle lighting. You don't need to install anything except wiring for the moment.

dubrov · 19-07-2020 9:24am

One other thing to consider if you want good wireless throughout the house.
Many of the good wireless access points are designed to go on the ceiling (see Ubiquiti).
So you would need to run an ethernet cable to a ceiling point (preferably in the hallway).
You can run them off wall ethernet connections but they won't perform as well or look as neat.

Wiring new build

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