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03-04-2020, 10:42   #1
bwbg78
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Rex Krueger - #thejoinersbench Irish timber equivalents

Hi folks,

Getting back into woodworking for the first time since 1995 1st year Mr. Donoghue's class!

I've been inspired to give it a go by Rex Krueger's Woodworking for Humans series on YouTube and I'd like to start with the Joiner's Bench.

(failed to add a link - should be easily searchable on YouTube)

The problem I have is I'm not familiar with Irish equivalents for US plans.

1. Would Douglas Fir be similar to red deal?
2. Would anyone have a list of the common dimensions for planed timber in Irish hardware shops? I've never heard of 4x4" here (except as treated fence posts etc) for example.
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03-04-2020, 10:44   #2
magicbastarder
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if you're planning on making a bench (which i've been 'planning' for at least two years now), check out the paul sellers bench also - i've seen other youtube woodworkers refer to their benches as paul sellers benches.
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03-04-2020, 10:54   #3
bwbg78
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if you're planning on making a bench (which i've been 'planning' for at least two years now), check out the paul sellers bench also - i've seen other youtube woodworkers refer to their benches as paul sellers benches.
I think I'll end up making a hodgepodge of both. Paul Sellers' technique is so effortless it'd sicken ya. He's deadly
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03-04-2020, 11:00   #4
chillyspoon
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I've been inspired to give it a go by Rex Krueger's Woodworking for Humans series on YouTube and I'd like to start with the Joiner's Bench.
I watched that build of Rex's a couple of weeks back, a really interesting bench and simple too.

Steve Ramsay has a couple of bench designs that sit between or even a bit lower than the one Rex does and Paul Seller's bench (in terms of skill required and time) that Magic has referenced. Here's just one of Steve's: https://woodworkingformeremortals.co...-mere-mortals/. His "BMW" (Basic Mobile Workbench) is actually better and really quick to make - easily achievable in one weekend - but it's part of his The Weekend Wood Worker course, so he only releases the plans for that one occasionally when advertising the course. Edit: turns out he still gives away the bench plans and video instructions for free as a teaser for the course (see the bottom of this page): https://theweekendwoodworker.com/story/ or https://theweekendwoodworker.com/bmw/.

In terms of timber dimensions vary between the producers/suppliers. Most still provide based on receiving imperial requests and what you'll get will be the metric equivalent - the mm value can and will vary a lot, regardless of whether you get rough sawn or PAO. It'll always be smaller because that's cheaper for the provider!

Last edited by chillyspoon; 03-04-2020 at 11:09. Reason: Added an additional link.
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03-04-2020, 11:28   #5
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Here's a clear example. A piece of PAO whitedeal that I ordered by specifying 3x3 - and that ain't no 3"!

When you get used to it, your mind automatically adjusts to reality and you think of the 3x3 or whatever as a dimensionless label more than an actual size.
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03-04-2020, 12:19   #6
bwbg78
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Here's a clear example. A piece of PAO whitedeal that I ordered by specifying 3x3 - and that ain't no 3"!

When you get used to it, your mind automatically adjusts to reality and you think of the 3x3 or whatever as a dimensionless label more than an actual size.
I see, so more like "squarish" cross section or "flat board" rather than hard measurements.

Another question is 12"x2" a common measurement in Irish hardware shops? My local one reckoned 9x2 was the widest available.
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03-04-2020, 12:30   #7
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The nominal sizes are a throwback to original practices in cutting lumber. Boards would be rough cut to, say 4x2, but by the time it was dried and planed it would have lost size.

All nominal sizes have corresponding actual dimensions, so that nominal 4x2 will be 3 1/2 X 1 1/2
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03-04-2020, 12:53   #8
magicbastarder
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i mentioned my notion of building one to the chairman of our woodturning chapter, he said there are certain lumber yards he'd recommend to visit which would allow you to pick through the lumber to choose the best; i'll probably revisit this when the restrictions lift.
not sure if i'll be able to share the info, i think he might be calling in a fabout with one or two lumber yards, would be heading along with me to one, possibly.

the reason i mentioned it to him in the first place was in regards to borrowing clamps for the glue-up, as i don't have nearly enough.
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03-04-2020, 15:11   #9
chillyspoon
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The nominal sizes are a throwback to original practices in cutting lumber. Boards would be rough cut to, say 4x2, but by the time it was dried and planed it would have lost size.

All nominal sizes have corresponding actual dimensions, so that nominal 4x2 will be 3 1/2 X 1 1/2
There's an additional factor here in western Europe because the transition from imperial to metric was sufficiently recent to have us still talking in terms of imperial dimensions while much of the modern machinery producing commercial quantities of S4S timber is processing dimensions in mm, which is all very interesting but of little relevance for your bench needs - lol

Last edited by chillyspoon; 03-04-2020 at 15:16. Reason: Comedy.
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03-04-2020, 16:45   #10
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I suppose it all goes to say that if you stay at it for any length of time, you'll very quickly get used to intuiting what you actually need dimensionally from the nominal sizes.

Throw up pictures of the bench when you're done (and a couple of the process while you're at it)

As it goes, I've built a couple of different work benches, some out of just 4x2's and 18" ply, and all have been more than serviceable

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03-04-2020, 17:35   #11
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What part of the country are you located in bwbg78? - there are folks all over the place here, so someone's bound to be able to help you find suitable suppliers reasonably local to you when things settle down like Magic's mentioned of course.
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03-04-2020, 18:58   #12
bwbg78
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What part of the country are you located in bwbg78? - there are folks all over the place here, so someone's bound to be able to help you find suitable suppliers reasonably local to you when things settle down like Magic's mentioned of course.
Thanks very much. I'm based in Tuam, I believe there's someone milling timber in Corofin but I can seem to track them down online.
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04-04-2020, 00:51   #13
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Buying rough timber will always be the most economical - but you really need a planer/thicknesser to process it. Getting 4x4 timber may well involve buying fence posts unless you are willing to glue up 2 inch stuff.This will be pretty wet as it is often stored outside.
Almost all the rough timber you buy will be a 'spruce' of some kind.If you can find Red Deal ( Scots Pine ) its a nicer wood all round or you might find ' Yellow Pine'
from the US which is almost free of knots.
I don't think you will find any softwood boards wider than 10 " so unless you want to make a family heirloom use whatever wood you can find that looks nice.
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04-04-2020, 09:00   #14
bwbg78
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Buying rough timber will always be the most economical - but you really need a planer/thicknesser to process it. Getting 4x4 timber may well involve buying fence posts unless you are willing to glue up 2 inch stuff.This will be pretty wet as it is often stored outside.
Almost all the rough timber you buy will be a 'spruce' of some kind.If you can find Red Deal ( Scots Pine ) its a nicer wood all round or you might find ' Yellow Pine'
from the US which is almost free of knots.
I don't think you will find any softwood boards wider than 10 " so unless you want to make a family heirloom use whatever wood you can find that looks nice.
Thanks a million for the details. This should make my next trip to the counter in the builders' providers a lot less cringe!
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04-04-2020, 11:40   #15
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Thanks very much. I'm based in Tuam, I believe there's someone milling timber in Corofin but I can seem to track them down online.
There are a few avenues for investigation you could pursue to find out but you'll probably need to wait until restrictions are eventually relaxed.

- get in touch with your nearest wood turning chapter; guaranteed someone will know the local mills; there are often private mills as well as public ones.
- get in touch with your nearest men's shed group, if there are some wood workers among the members you'll find someone that knows the local mills there too.
- call the local builders supplies places and simply ask if they know who does rough sawn wood nearby.

... but; going all the way back to your initial post, unless you're really dead set on building Rex's design from rough sawn wood, I'd recommend just buying some PAO dimensioned red deal and 18mm WBP ply (or MR MDF) from a well stocked builder supplies place to build your first bench with. It'll be enough of a project to get started with without needing to dimension and plane the timber first, and you can then use that bench to plane rough sawn wood for years to come!

By the way, if you tell the builders supplies place that you're buying construction timber for making furniture (even crappy white deal) they're usually happy to either let you pick your own or they'll pick out some straighter stuff for you. I do that the whole time, and I usually - not always - ends up with better stuff than if I say nothing.
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