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11-06-2019, 14:13   #61
nozzferrahhtoo
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The left believe in ringfencing minorities from criticism

Long standing practice
I think in my experience people are often interested in ring fencing minorities for protection merely for BEING minorities. But criticism of their ideas as a minority are fair game.

My own motto is "Respect people, never ideas". But often people can not tell the difference. Either by attacking the minority instead of their ideas or.... in the other direction.... mistaking protection of minorities as a ring fence protection of their ideas.

Here in Ireland Muslims are a minority. I would want to ring fence them for protection for THAT reason.

However their ideas.... Islam itself..... is to me one of the more dangerous and damaging and awful religions making it's way into our culture and I think it is fair game for robust attack and criticism.

And I am perfectly capable of affording extra protection to one and extra ire to the other without any internal contradiction. But for some people separating people, and the ideas in the brains of those people, is beyond them. To the point some people conflate criticism of Islam with hate speech or racism. Which could not be more ridiculous.
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11-06-2019, 14:21   #62
DrPhilG
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Originally Posted by nozzferrahhtoo View Post
Here in Ireland Muslims are a minority. I would want to ring fence them for protection for THAT reason.

However their ideas.... Islam itself..... is to me one of the more dangerous and damaging and awful religions making it's way into our culture and I think it is fair game for robust attack and criticism.

And I am perfectly capable of affording extra protection to one and extra ire to the other without any internal contradiction. But for some people separating people, and the ideas in the brains of those people, is beyond them. To the point some people conflate criticism of Islam with hate speech or racism. Which could not be more ridiculous.
Plenty of good replies so far, but this I think is the closest thing to a complete answer to my original question so far, thanks.

Although I do think that for many (including those in the picture in the OP), are acting similar to the other point made - that the more radical side of the left make Islam a form of sacred cow, without actually giving sufficient thought to what it entails at the extreme end.
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11-06-2019, 14:31   #63
Matt Barrett
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I've been scolded out of the Pride month thread for derailing it (apologies) so I'll ask here.

First off, this is a legitimate question, I'm not looking to bash/condemn anyone in the LGBTQ community, and I'm not looking to condemn Muslims or Islam.

I'm just genuinely curious about why there has been an increase, often at LGBTQ marches etc, of support shown by that community, towards the Muslim community.



I'm not saying that supporting one another and speaking out against bigotry and homoohobia together is a bad thing. I'm just surprised that the LGBTQ community support Islam, but condemn Christianity.

I can totally understand them condemning both, as both religions teach that homosexuality is wrong/sinful. I just don't get why one is supported and the other is not.

Again, this is a genuine question that I'm curious about so please don't drag it down to a mud slinging match.
Just going by the banner they seem to be against Islamophobia. You can frown upon Christians being fed to lions and still be a Jew.
But I can see how it plays to the any equality I/we don't like is PC madness gone too far crowd.
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11-06-2019, 14:33   #64
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Originally Posted by Mad_maxx View Post
The left believe in ringfencing minorities from criticism

Long standing practice
They've no time for minority white supremacists though. Hypocritical of them?
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11-06-2019, 14:54   #65
wakka12
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I cant speak for others but Im gay and personally I am not comfortable with such a huge and rapid influx of people with such intolerant beliefs in the country, and the rest of europe. I think the consservative and hardine beliefs of the average muslim makes most conservative catholics look comparatively mild and easy going , most muslims I know are at best apathetic and indifferent towars lgbt community and their 'lifestyle choices', and of course complete intolerance is the most common attitude towards gay people within the islamic community. So I cant say I am as concerned about any injustices done towards the islamic community as many other irish gay people seem to be when that group generally display such utter disdain towards the lgbt community
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11-06-2019, 14:58   #66
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Probably because one community which suffers discrimination and hatred can empathise with other demographics who experience the same.
Yet the islamic community dont share the same feeling of empathy towards the lgbt community?
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11-06-2019, 15:17   #67
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Yet the islamic community dont share the same feeling of empathy towards the lgbt community?
I don't personally think of it as a tit for tat thing.

I'm a queer woman so I can relate to your feelings of unease but look, I've worked with, lived beside Muslims, I interact with them literally every day and I've never had a problem. I'm sure there are those in the community who are less tolerant and less integrated so I'm not interacting with them and I'm sure there are those with whom I am interacting who disapprove but get on with things, but my experience just doesn't match up with the hysteria that's being pushed.

If the values of the West- tolerance, secularism, inclusisivity are superior to those of the Islamic world- intolerance, theocracy, bigotry then we should surely be extending those good qualities to those who have been poisoned by the bad ones. Demonstrate tolerance, let homophobia try to hold up through actual contact with normal gay people.
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11-06-2019, 15:18   #68
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LGBT should stand with their brethren in Chechnya
Chechnya LGBT: Dozens 'detained in new gay purge'

Islam is the predominant religion (95%) in Chechnya, a country that claims to "have no gays".
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11-06-2019, 15:22   #69
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There are a host of bizarre positions taken by many on the modem left.

Often the only deciding factor is the pigmentation of the party.

So the guy above with the God hates fags sign is pointed out as an asshole, same as that preacher from Arizona.

Say that gays must die in an Islamic society and be beaten in others, unaccompanied women must be beaten, Jews must be killed, even if they are kids etc, you'll be recived by the Labour Mayor of London, those with the same views will be feted across countries by the Left, no one will take note because it is now familiar practice.

Mps will attend gender segregated meetings whoring for votes.

The block vote is a big driver in this, in many countries.

Last edited by Danzy; 11-06-2019 at 16:18.
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11-06-2019, 15:27   #70
the dunne
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I'm a queer woman
I've always wondered and hope you may be able to enlighten me. What is the difference between gay and queer?

I've tried to find the answer online but get various different answers.
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11-06-2019, 15:29   #71
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I'm surprised to see the LGBT community supporting Islam. Because a significant portion of the followers of Islam would be happy fcuking them off the top of the tallest building they could find.
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11-06-2019, 15:30   #72
Jimmy McGill
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Check out the Apostate Prophet on YouTube. He's an ex muslim from Turkish/German background (but now living in the States) with first hand experience of their brainwashing. His videos will change how you view islam.
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11-06-2019, 15:31   #73
Matt Barrett
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Originally Posted by biko View Post
LGBT should stand with their brethren in Chechnya
Chechnya LGBT: Dozens 'detained in new gay purge'

Islam is the predominant religion (95%) in Chechnya, a country that claims to "have no gays".
I believe they do. You can disagree with people without being racist towards them. I'm no fan of the Roman Catholic Church but I'd give it's member that same respect I'd give anyone else. Can you imagine boycotting or wanting to remove members of the Catholic faith because you believe in gay rights and the right to choose?

Actually, I just read above and realise it's a hate Islam/Muslim thread, no worries. G'wan lads...
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11-06-2019, 15:31   #74
wakka12
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Originally Posted by the dunne View Post
I've always wondered and hope you may be able to enlighten me. What is the difference between gay and queer?

I've tried to find the answer online but get various different answers.
queer is just an umbrella term for anything you identify as other than straight, maybe they dont fully identify as just gay or bisexual etc
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11-06-2019, 15:32   #75
electro~bitch
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I've always wondered and hope you may be able to enlighten me. What is the difference between gay and queer?

I've tried to find the answer online but get various different answers.
Queer would be anyone falling under the LGBT+ umbrella, gay woman would be specifically lesbian. Gay women are queer (though obviously people prefer specific terms for themselves) but not all queer women are gay. I'm bisexual but queer is a convenient shorthand for these kinds of conversations.
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