Nissan Leaf battery upgrade

extremetaz wrote: »

Why is the NCT and the log book bring brought in to this? Neither have any thing to do with such a modification
The log book doesn't list anything about the battery and I see no need for that to change.
The NCT can check that the thing isn't about to fall out, but they're not qualified to do any more than that.

Anyone who knows what goes into building a reliable lithium pack, and how that pack interacts with the car to begin with, already knows that there's not much room for error and the safety interlocks are substantial. There needs to be standards and certification for aftermarkets packs, definitely - absolutely no question about that. Once that certification is achieved though, the insurance company will have to view it like any other servicable part, and you don't see them voiding claims because you switch your brake pads from EBC to Juratek, or your tires from Bridgestone to Firestone...

Once the part is certified as being fit for use they've no case, or justification, for concern. It's that simple. So the only question is what that certification process looks like. The standards governing EV packs, that I'm aware of, are IEC 12405, 19453 and 60254. Which components of each need to be observed I'd have to read through to find out (and I'm not going to because I don't need to - and lets face it, nobody would unless they do!), but that's the place to start where all of that is concerned.

*edit: A very quick google also brought up this (which I've also not read yet, but at least its free to view unlike most IEC standards).

I mention the NCT as the vehicle should have a valid NCT. I mention the logbook because I am pretty sure my logbook has the battery capacity written on it, but I might be mistaken. A higher capacity battery will add value to the car and if this is on the logbook, you then have grounds to argue that value when the insurer tries to low-ball you in the event of a claim for a stolen, or written off car.

Insurance companies are still a cartel getting away with so much, it makes my blood boil. What they should do and what they actually do are not aligned. I renewed my insurance the other day. My renewal quote was pretty good and I went with it, but I also shopped around before paying the premium. Insurers are still asking the sex of proposer and named persons, even though they supposedly can't change the price based on gender. They still view Japanese imports as some sort of bomb, unless of course the car was sold new through a dealership here. They still ask about non motor related convictions and they will use ANY excuse to get out of paying a claim.

I agree that once the replacement is certified, there should be nothing else required. In practice, the insurer will simply refuse to quote anything outside the norm and you may well be priced out of the market. I have experienced this BS a number of times and it can be difficult to get around. Some examples below.

*I had trouble insuring a Mazda Bongo I was using as a commercial vehicle. Most insurers didn't have it listed and wouldn't go further than that. "Sorry, it's not on our system". I had to complete an offline application and the price was prohibitively expensive.

*I found it very difficult to insure a Mitsubishi FTO when I purchased one. Nobody would quote a jap import. My full clean Irish DL with over 10 years NCB made no difference. I was about to sell the car on when I got lucky and insured it online, but I was stuck with the same insurer for years at their mercy.

*I was unable to insure a road legal quad. I rang every insurer and broker listed and I was told that I needed to have x amount of my own farm land to be able to get a quote, even though it was a road quad which had been legally driven on European roads before coming to Ireland.

pszemo wrote: »

Hi everyone
My upgrade is for everyone with Nissan Leaf from 2011 to 2016 who wants to give a second life to his car.
I'm offering replacement your old battery modules with brand new LG Chem cells.

OP, maybe register/advertise here:

https://insideevs.com/news/443871/world-map-for-battery-replacing-companies/

hasse wrote: »

Seeing the Nissan eNV200 is basically a NV200 with Leaf battery and Drivetrain, would it be possible to get this battery replacement for a eNV200?
Trying to find an electric 7 seater without spendingTesla Model X kind of money, and a eNV200 seems to be only potential option.

According to the internet, the env200 has active battery cooling, so should not suffer anything like the same battery degradation as the leaf, so should not be required.
Although I haven't checked, the battery warranty might be different on the env200(as it is actively cooled), so if there was a problem, it might be covered under warranty.

I see an Irish guy went to muxan for battery upgrade

https://www.irishevowners.ie/rangetherapy-autumn-2020-is-a-new-spring-for-irish-leafs/

zg3409 wrote: »

I see an Irish guy went to muxan for battery upgrade

https://www.irishevowners.ie/rangetherapy-autumn-2020-is-a-new-spring-for-irish-leafs/

These are going to be quite popular with Gen 1 and Gen 2 Leaf owners over the next few years I'd imagine.

zg3409 wrote: »

I see an Irish guy went to muxan for battery upgrade

https://www.irishevowners.ie/rangetherapy-autumn-2020-is-a-new-spring-for-irish-leafs/

It's a bit more than that, they will now be carrying out these upgrades themselves in Ireland.
Well, I think they will be.
Very interesting.

Deleted User wrote: »

The way forward is batteries that don't need to be replaced, we're probably at that stage already with 60+ Kwh of battery, might have useful range for the life of the car.

When you pay for cheap leaf and new battery it's not so cheap any more.

Any Leaf, even the ones with the most severe battery degradation, have enough useful range for the life of the car. Obviously not with somebody who does a 200km commute. But with someone using it for very short trips, second family car, old age pensioner, etc.

Agree with your previous point though, why bother? Others have given good reasons, but I agree with you, there is no economic argument for doing it at current commercial prices. You will lose a bomb of money if you get it done in most cases. Spend €6k on an upgrade and your car will be worth max €3k more. So you lose €3k instantly when this job is done

Now this market is very new in Ireland and if you get your car done with the aim of getting trained up in the Netherlands (where EV / all things to do with electric mobility are years ahead of us) and doing other cars commercially over here, there is a gap in the market here, somebody could be setting themselves up for a good business here

JPA wrote: »

Isn't it obvious? You might have a leaf with 90 km range which you just can't live with. Get the upgrade and you're sorted for 5 more years at least. Cheaper than buying a new car by far

In cash outflow maybe, but you lose significant money instantly on the conversion. So in total cost of ownership it almost certainly is cheaper to buy another EV with more range

Many people in Ireland do not understand that concept though as they can not see beyond actually handing over money as the only way or form of the cost of something

Not at all a dig at you BTW, just a general observation.

I think the 'engine' and body of an EV should last a long time. I see some old ICE cars on the road, old Corollas of 20/25. Why not either extend or replace the failing battery?

Water John wrote: »

I think the 'engine' and body of an EV should last a long time. I see some old ICE cars on the road, old Corollas of 20/25. Why not either extend or replace the failing battery?

Exactly. If body work is in great shape I'd upgrade the battery.

Every owner makes their choice in the matter of cost/return.

People go into car dealers every day and buy new cars and it makes no financial sense.

Water John wrote: »

Every owner makes their choice in the matter of cost/return.

People go into car dealers every day and buy new cars and it makes no financial sense.

Good point, still it would be nice to have a better value upgrade that made saving old leafs worthwhile from a financial perspective. Without a cost effective option a lot of Leafs will be scrapped, not very green, shows the value of a "lifetime battery".

With Teslas move to the structural cell battery (4680) the secondhand automotive battery/module market looks like it will not be long lived. It seems the preferred recycling route is to grind the cells up and extract the chemicals.

unkel wrote: »

Sometimes they do. My last car that I bought brand new cost me less per month than the banger I had before that, which cost just €600 to buy (and on which I spent less than €100 in maintenance)

But how much did you buy it for brand new?

physioman wrote: »

But how much did you buy it for brand new?

€25k. Sold 3 years later for €20k. 3 years tax €360, 3 years servicing and maintenance €0, 3 years fuel €100, 2 tyres with fitting €180. That's it apart from insurance. Also saved about €500 on tolls because it's an EV

A banger that someone gave me for free would have cost more..