Coronavirus and the effect on Public transport

Charles Babbage · 22-09-2020 1:54pm

Midnight_EG wrote: »

And 1 in 2736 of all people in Ireland have 'died from Covid 19' ....buuuuuuuut only circa 100 people didn't have underlying conditions meaning this 'flu' has killed 1 in over 49,000.

And you're still scared of it

Lots of people have "underlying conditions" and can expect to live for another quarter century, the loss of their lives should not be sneered at as a point scoring exercise on boards.ie. Who are you to regard these people as dispensable?

Midnight_EG · 22-09-2020 2:16pm

Charles Babbage wrote: »

Lots of people have "underlying conditions" and can expect to live for another quarter century, the loss of their lives should not be sneered at as a point scoring exercise on boards.ie. Who are you to regard these people as dispensable?

The point clearly flew over your head

GT89 · 22-09-2020 5:09pm

Charles Babbage wrote: »

Lots of people have "underlying conditions" and can expect to live for another quarter century, the loss of their lives should not be sneered at as a point scoring exercise on boards.ie. Who are you to regard these people as dispensable?

Do you disregard the lives of people who die by suicide as a result of the lockdown as dispensable?

devnull · 22-09-2020 6:26pm

This is the Commuting and Transport forum and the topic has the title of Coronavirus and the effect on public transport.

Can we please get back to discussing that. If you want to discuss COVID-19 topics unrelated to Public Transport, we have an entire forum for that.

- Moderator

dublinman1990 · 22-09-2020 8:35pm

Have PT services in Dublin worked out well with level 3 restrictions when the schools are back to some level of normality?

I was walking to Blackrock today & seen a fair few schoolkids getting either driven home from their parents, walking home themselves or cycling home from school using the temporary cycle lane on Carysfort Avenue. The one issue that I noticed today was that the road staff from DLR council were still out installing the new bus ramps at two bus stops for the 114 route near St Augustine's School & Carysfort Park and repainting the new cycle lanes.

The new bus ramp at the UCD Smurfit bus stop was installed some time last week.

When schools are open as normal pre Covid in a place like Booterstown; it would be very congested for a while with tons of schoolkids from St. Andrews & Blackrock College are trying to make school journeys on PT every day. Getting home on the bus or train would be a nightmare to get them home because large numbers of these students get home on the bus. They would just have to cram up at the bus stop near the Dart Station or take the Dart itself to get them home if they live near it.

I don't have any official figures on the numbers of students who attend St Andrews & Blackrock College. But I would imagine their numbers would be very large.

I would assume that if schoolkids that live in other areas of Dublin who get to school using PT; they would not have useful access to lots of PT services from their homes to within the school's locality if they have limited choices to choose from with either having to use a bus service or with using the cycle lanes.

With transport capacity being capped at 50% in Dublin for the next 3 weeks; if the schoolkids don't have useful access nearby to Dart or Luas services from their home to their school in Dublin; it probably would be much harder for them to attend school classes on time if they have to walk to school when they don't have the choice of using a bus service or a bicycle lane to get there. If kids are using bus services all the time for their school journeys in Dublin. That may significantly increase dwell times at bus stops with lots of schoolkids trying to get home that are at bus stops near the schools. There are issues with that because these kids would share the service with other essential & retail workers at the rush hour in the mornings & also during the afternoons as well during the evening rush.

Are the majority of schoolkids in Dublin able to comply with the current transport restrictions right now because of the reduced capacity that is available to them?

GT89 · 22-09-2020 8:53pm

I have noticed less people now on public transport in Dublin since the extra restrictions were brought in

CIARAN_BOYLE · 23-09-2020 7:15am

The one bus I saw that was full was followed immediately by another so I take it either the first was alte and picking up 2 bus loads of people or a reserve bus was dispatched to follow behind an pick up the slack.

road_high · 24-09-2020 3:06pm

GT89 wrote: »

I have noticed less people now on public transport in Dublin since the extra restrictions were brought in

I'd imagine mainy down to less hospitality staff and far less visitors about too. Plus the increased work from home again.
Private servcies like Dublin Coach etc had only just started back service so it must be soem kick to already anaemic revenues- are the government supporting them?

GT89 · 24-09-2020 3:47pm

road_high wrote: »

I'd imagine mainy down to less hospitality staff and far less visitors about too. Plus the increased work from home again.
Private servcies like Dublin Coach etc had only just started back service so it must be soem kick to already anaemic revenues- are the government supporting them?

It seems they are trying to kill Dublin city centre altogether by discouraging public transport

GT89 · 25-09-2020 12:47am

Go-Ahead now trialling hand sanitiser dispensers on some of their fleet. Looks like it will go all over the validator in this location imo
https://twitter.com/GoAheadIreland/status/1309143672496238595?s=19

d51984 · 25-09-2020 10:08am

I can see a load of validators been damaged tbh. At least there trying, but maybe stick them in a different location.

Sultan of Bling · 25-09-2020 4:50pm

GT89 wrote:

Go-Ahead now trialling hand sanitiser dispensers on some of their fleet. Looks like it will go all over the validator in this location imo

Bad idea.

Spillages on the floor will make it slippy and a professional personal injury claimer paradise.

GT89 · 25-09-2020 4:56pm

Sultan of Bling wrote: »

Bad idea.

Spillages on the floor will make it slippy and a professional personal injury claimer paradise.

Exactly what I was thinking it's pointless. If you want to use hand sanitiser you'd carry our own.

punisher5112 · 25-09-2020 5:55pm

Sultan of Bling wrote: »

Bad idea.

Spillages on the floor will make it slippy and a professional personal injury claimer paradise.

Non slip floor, it will be like water what comes out, I actually would be more worried about it been extremely flammable then it causing a slip which it won't.....

Sultan of Bling · 25-09-2020 5:58pm

punisher5112 wrote:

Non slip floor, it will be like water what comes out, I actually would be more worried about it been extremely flammable then it causing a slip which it won't.....

Trust me, as someone who works in the claims industry, the small matter of a non slip floor won't stop them.

punisher5112 · 25-09-2020 6:00pm

Sultan of Bling wrote: »

Trust me, as someone who works in the claims industry, the small matter of a non slip floor won't stop them.

It will be proven it's not possible to slip on it unless oil or such products were dumped on it.

People claim for anything these days, I'd say more will claim it burnt them or it splashed in their eyes....

The dirty fnuckers that need to use it or at least wash won't...

Wouldn't surprise me if people use it to get locked.

GT89 · 27-09-2020 1:01am

Placement seems to be better on the GAI coaches. Tbh honest I can't any good place to put this on city buses where it is not getting in the way of something. On coaches it's not so bad.
https://twitter.com/GoAheadIreland/status/1309535385970790400?s=19

john boye · 06-10-2020 4:47pm

Saw a few DB buses today with "Keep window open" notices on the opening windows. Didn't seem to be having much effect on the ones I saw!

punisher5112 · 06-10-2020 4:52pm

john boye wrote: »

Saw a few DB buses today with "Keep window open" notices on the opening windows. Didn't seem to be having much effect on the ones I saw!

People are stupid unfortunately.

thenightman · 07-10-2020 12:29am

Not seen any 'keep window open' signs on DB and I've been commuting everyday all through initial lockdown to present day. Also, have had to stand on bus home in the evening last two days which is awkward now that middle door is used for alighting so you can't stand there. End up crammed in the bit from the back of drivers cab to before the stairs next to two other people with not a hope of social distancing. Lots of folks with pennys bags and the like making essential journeys now on the bus most days, which rankles myself after doing a 9+ hour day in an essential service!

OldGoat · 07-10-2020 8:31am

john boye wrote: »

Saw a few DB buses today with "Keep window open" notices on the opening windows. Didn't seem to be having much effect on the ones I saw!

I find the "Keep Windows Open" directive a bit strange/counter productive. Does it not defeat the social distancing measures by distributing particulates over a larger area?

punisher5112 · 07-10-2020 8:46am

OldGoat wrote: »

I find the "Keep Windows Open" directive a bit strange/counter productive. Does it not defeat the social distancing measures by distributing particulates over a larger area?

No it gets fresh air in. That's exactly what is needed.....

punisher5112 · 07-10-2020 8:47am

thenightman wrote: »

Not seen any 'keep window open' signs on DB and I've been commuting everyday all through initial lockdown to present day. Also, have had to stand on bus home in the evening last two days which is awkward now that middle door is used for alighting so you can't stand there. End up crammed in the bit from the back of drivers cab to before the stairs next to two other people with not a hope of social distancing. Lots of folks with pennys bags and the like making essential journeys now on the bus most days, which rankles myself after doing a 9+ hour day in an essential service!

Its only new so it will be a slow roll out.

I work there and see none yet.

The luas has been fitted with these, most I see are still closed.
If people open a few it will help and doesn't have to be them all.

bk · 09-10-2020 7:09pm

There has been a somewhat interesting report published by the governments "Special Committee On Covid19 Response", report here (pdf):

https://data.oireachtas.ie/ie/oireachtas/committee/dail/33/special_committee_on_covid_19_response/reports/2020/2020-10-09_final-report-of-the-special-committee-on-covid-19-response_en.pdf

A few interesting points:

- "Dublin Bus suggested that dynamic pricing could be introduced to encourage more people to travel outside of peak times." - Sounds like a good idea to me.

- DB/BE/IR/GA/Transdev all saw a 90% drop in passenger numbers in March.

- NTA estimating fare revenue will be down 50 to 60% this year. CIE expecting revenue to fall 60% this year. DB commercial revenue down 87%

- Transport Salaried Staff Association and NBRU suggest schools and business starting times be staggered to take pressure off public transport.

- Commercial Coach operators not expecting coach tourism to fully recover until 2023 - 2024

GT89 · 13-10-2020 11:25pm

They should take off them hideous looking yellow signs on seats on buses and trains telling you where to sit. Makes the bus or train look like a crime scene. They don't have them in London and you can be dam sure they don't have them in Sweden either.

For once I actually wish teenagers would come and rip off every single one of them and throw them on a Halloween bonfire. I think I know that Covid is a thing as it's all over the news night noon and morning.

dublinman1990 · 14-10-2020 9:01pm

Dublin Mini Coaches have placed their 2017 Gemini 3 double decker, used for their Dublin to Newry route, up for sale on Ensignbus.

https://www.ensignbus.com/2017-volvo-b5tl.html

I have heard that one of their Ex Dublin Bus AV buses has been recently sold off as well.

I distinctly remember having a look inside that Gemini 3 bus which was being shown as a brand new bus on display at the Dun Laoghaire Harbour transport rally in 2017. They were there to show their Gravedigger tour bus, which is an ex Dublin Bus AV in the black livery, and one of their mercedes mini buses alongside them all on display for the public to see for that October BH Weekend. The staff on that duty on that day were very professional & lovely people.

There was a large amount of people actually wanting to come in & see the buses to see what they looked like for the 1st time. I have never used their services around Dublin before. Their routes don't run in my area of Dublin. However they have a really impressive looking fleet to see out on the road.

I find it a great shame to know that we may now have to see them succumb to having their vehicles being run on reduced service this year or having to prematurely end their career with this fine company in these strange times. I hope that they will find their way back soon.

They don't deserve to bow out like this when it's battling a severe pandemic like Covid.

Jamie2k9 · 16-10-2020 4:04pm

Didn’t know until today under L4 or 5, public transport will be back to 25% capacity. Strange decision.

GT89 · 16-10-2020 4:31pm

dublinman1990 wrote: »

Dublin Mini Coaches have placed their 2017 Gemini 3 double decker, used for their Dublin to Newry route, up for sale on Ensignbus.

https://www.ensignbus.com/2017-volvo-b5tl.html

I have heard that one of their Ex Dublin Bus AV buses has been recently sold off as well.

I distinctly remember having a look inside that Gemini 3 bus which was being shown as a brand new bus on display at the Dun Laoghaire Harbour transport rally in 2017. They were there to show their Gravedigger tour bus, which is an ex Dublin Bus AV in the black livery, and one of their mercedes mini buses alongside them all on display for the public to see for that October BH Weekend. The staff on that duty on that day were very professional & lovely people.

There was a large amount of people actually wanting to come in & see the buses to see what they looked like for the 1st time. I have never used their services around Dublin before. Their routes don't run in my area of Dublin. However they have a really impressive looking fleet to see out on the road.

I find it a great shame to know that we may now have to see them succumb to having their vehicles being run on reduced service this year or having to prematurely end their career with this fine company in these strange times. I hope that they will find their way back soon.

They don't deserve to bow out like this when it's battling a severe pandemic like Covid.

Is that the crowd that runs the Eastpoint shuttle bus?

bk · 16-10-2020 6:03pm

Jamie2k9 wrote: »

Didn’t know until today under L4 or 5, public transport will be back to 25% capacity. Strange decision.

Yes, under Level 4

I think the idea is that only essential workers are supposed to be travelling anyway.

GT89 wrote: »

Is that the crowd that runs the Eastpoint shuttle bus?

Yes, looks like it, Dublin Mini Coaches.

GT89 · 16-10-2020 10:49pm

jasper_Quinn wrote: »

It would appear that going into town and shopping in Penney's is essential, bus constantly has people laden down with Penny's bags.

It is essential for the economy

GT89 · 16-10-2020 11:22pm

If masks work why are they limiting the capacity on buses even further under level 5? 99.9% of passengers on buses are wearing them.

Lifelike · 16-10-2020 11:23pm

Jamie2k9 wrote: »

Didn’t know until today under L4 or 5, public transport will be back to 25% capacity. Strange decision.

It’s now being said that public transport is actually safer than we thought at the start of the pandemic, very few clusters worldwide have been traced back to public transport.
https://news.sky.com/story/coronavirus-why-public-transport-could-be-safer-than-we-thought-12091657

As long as the schools are open it makes no sense to reduce transport to 25% capacity as I believe school buses would also be affected by the reduction in capacity.

bk wrote: »

I think the idea is that only essential workers are supposed to be travelling anyway.

As an essential worker who relies on PT to get to/from work, I really disagree with this sentiment. Public transport is the lifeblood of people who don’t drive and I don’t think it’s fair to tell such people to stay put and go absolutely nowhere for such a long period of time with no end in sight. I also don’t think it’s right that the government decides to put anti-car measures in the budget such as a carbon tax increase, while at the same time telling people to stay off public transport. That kind of thinking is not being challenged enough in my view.

OscarMIlde · 17-10-2020 9:01pm

GT89 wrote: »

If masks work why are they limiting the capacity on buses even further under level 5? 99.9% of passengers on buses are wearing them.

Because masks don't work when you wear them under your chin/nose, which is how most Dublin bus passengers are wearing them.

bk · 18-10-2020 1:23pm

Lifelike wrote: »

As an essential worker who relies on PT to get to/from work, I really disagree with this sentiment. Public transport is the lifeblood of people who don’t drive and I don’t think it’s fair to tell such people to stay put and go absolutely nowhere for such a long period of time with no end in sight. I also don’t think it’s right that the government decides to put anti-car measures in the budget such as a carbon tax increase, while at the same time telling people to stay off public transport. That kind of thinking is not being challenged enough in my view.

I don't drive and rely on public transport. Level 5 is basically a version of the lock down in March. Shops like Penneys etc. will be closed. All pubs, restaurants will be closed. No visiting other homes, family, etc. Folks who can work from home, will. Not supposed to go 5km from your home and then only for exercise.

Basically under these restrictions, no one but essential workers are meant to be out and using public transport and there would be little reason for people to do so anyway.

Now the government might not decide to go to Level 5 or they might decide to modify what it means, but the above is the general idea. Even if there wasn't a 25% restriction, numbers would likely fall to below that anyway at Level 5.

punisher5112 · 18-10-2020 1:49pm

Looks like level 4 is coming in....

Gael23 · 18-10-2020 1:50pm

What does this mean for public transport?

punisher5112 · 18-10-2020 1:51pm

Gael23 wrote: »

Etsy does this mean fir public transport?

Reduced capacity.

Unless it's stated otherwise

Gael23 · 18-10-2020 1:56pm

punisher5112 wrote: »

Reduced capacity.

Unless it's stated otherwise

That’s fine as long as the private operators don’t jump ship

bk · 18-10-2020 2:02pm

Gael23 wrote: »

That’s fine as long as the private operators don’t jump ship

Depends what you mean by private operators. GoAhead and Transdev/Luas are private operators who are fully paid for under PSO contracts, so would be fine as long as the government keep paying for those services.

I assume you mean commercial operators (which also includes BE Expressway), well the NTA seem to be giving at least some of them money to operate as PSO operators at the moment, so it depends if that is enough to keep going or not.

Gael23 · 18-10-2020 2:08pm

bk wrote: »

Depends what you mean by private operators. GoAhead and Transdev/Luas are private operators who are fully paid for under PSO contracts, so would be fine as long as the government keep paying for those services.

I assume you mean commercial operators (which also includes BE Expressway), well the NTA seem to be giving at least some of them money to operate as PSO operators at the moment, so it depends if that is enough to keep going or not.

JjKavanagh, Citylink and the likes

punisher5112 · 18-10-2020 4:34pm

Gael23 wrote: »

JjKavanagh, Citylink and the likes

Depends on their financial status and if they can take the hit for a few weeks it's really anyone thoughts now as it continues to change every few days and weeks......

GT89 · 18-10-2020 6:44pm

If they go back to 17 passengers on Dublin Bus how the hell are they gonna manage with the schools most stops serving schools would have more 17 school children waiting at them.

Tickityboo · 18-10-2020 6:57pm

GT89 wrote: »

If they go back to 17 passengers on Dublin Bus how the hell are they gonna manage with the schools most stops serving schools would have more 17 school children waiting at them.

The parents not going to work can bring them

GT89 · 18-10-2020 7:03pm

Tickityboo wrote: »

The parents not going to work can bring them

So clog up the roads with more cars with the associated crap parking. Great idea.

bk · 18-10-2020 7:13pm

GT89 wrote: »

If they go back to 17 passengers on Dublin Bus how the hell are they gonna manage with the schools most stops serving schools would have more 17 school children waiting at them.

If the numbers keep going up, only a matter of time until the schools close too.

Gael23 wrote:

JjKavanagh, Citylink and the likes

Yes, at least some of them are currently getting support from the government as temporary PSO operations. Though depending on the level of support, that may or may not be enough to keep them going.

BTW Citylink are part of a big international company who seem to be doing ok at the moment, so are likely under less stress then smaller operators, but that is just a guess.

Eduard Khil · 18-10-2020 7:14pm

The attitudes of some bus drivers in my particular case in Finglas towards physically disabled passengers is abhorrent number 40 40D 83 83a 140 and in a much lower case the 17a just plain nastiness going on for months now I've opened several complaints with Dublin bus never hear a thing back.

I'm reliant on these buses to get me to and from my many appointments try asking a fellow passenger can you sit down you'd think you'd insulted them. The buses need an active inspector for mask compliance safe distance and antisocial behaviour specifically on the 40 service its a scary service not helped by drivers turning a blind eye to trouble.

.anon. · 18-10-2020 7:15pm

bk wrote: »

If the numbers keep going up, only a matter of time until the schools close too.

They should really be doing that immediately - closing them for an extra week either side of the midterm break could help to bring numbers down.

ITV2 · 18-10-2020 7:20pm

Eduard Khil wrote: »

The attitudes of some bus drivers in my particular case in Finglas towards physically disabled passengers is abhorrent number 40 40D 83 83a 140 and in a much lower case the 17a just plain nastiness going on for months now I've opened several complaints with Dublin bus never hear a thing back.

I'm reliant on these buses to get me to and from my many appointments try asking a fellow passenger can you sit down you'd think you'd insulted them. The buses need an active inspector for mask compliance safe distance and antisocial behaviour specifically on the 40 service its a scary service not helped by drivers turning a blind eye to trouble.

It's not the job of the bus driver to enforce the mask wearing.. i tried and was insulted/shouted at and the usual name calling, no back up from anyone so I gave up trying.

GT89 · 18-10-2020 7:27pm

Eduard Khil wrote: »

The attitudes of some bus drivers in my particular case in Finglas towards physically disabled passengers is abhorrent number 40 40D 83 83a 140 and in a much lower case the 17a just plain nastiness going on for months now I've opened several complaints with Dublin bus never hear a thing back.

I'm reliant on these buses to get me to and from my many appointments try asking a fellow passenger can you sit down you'd think you'd insulted them. The buses need an active inspector for mask compliance safe distance and antisocial behaviour specifically on the 40 service its a scary service not helped by drivers turning a blind eye to trouble.

From the sound of your post the only person that has an attitude problem is you. How are bus drivers behaviours on the routes you mention abhorrent, please enlighten us?

Have you actually informed the drivers about the trouble the driver is not going to know there is trouble on board and to take appropriate action if no one tells them. They are paid to operate the bus in a safe manner not patrol the bus for breaches of the law or company bylaws.

Eduard Khil · 18-10-2020 7:30pm

Ask for back up, get your union involved I clearly state an inspector should be on board the antisocial bus routes 79a 27 77 and in my case the 40 these buses are safe a lot of the time but they are among the worst for trouble if not the worst.

Coronavirus and the effect on Public transport

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