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Substantial Refurbishment Criteria

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Comments

  • #52
    jamesthepeach
    Registered Users Posts: 992 ✭✭✭jamesthepeach


    I was in a situation myself where I spent about €8000 doing up an apartment. I let it at 50% below market rate to tenants I knew thinking I'll up to market rate when they leave as they were supposed to be leaving in a year or two.

    Roll on the new rules and I'm trapped with afantasticaly decorated high end apartment let at 50% below the one next door which is falling apart. I can't out up the rent to recover my costs. The guy with one falling apart next door is allowed to increase his rent more than I am and he's already getting 50% more than I am.

    Then I'm told that I didn't to the refurbishment after the rule change so it doesn't count.

    I had only two options then.
    Go airbnb or sell it.
    I was originally going to do airbnb but tested the water with it for sale and got an offer I couldn't believe so took it.

    I have another apartment in the same sort of trap and am trying out airbnb with it for the moment. I've been living in it for a little while and have just started airbnb via an agent. If that doesn't work out I'll sell it too.


  • #53
    Claw Hammer
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,299 ✭✭✭Claw Hammer


    [QUOTE=jamesthepeach;103762114

    Roll on the new rules and I'm trapped with afantasticaly decorated high end apartment let at 50% below the one next door which is falling apart. .[/QUOTE]

    Why don't you take them on?


  • #54
    jamesthepeach
    Registered Users Posts: 992 ✭✭✭jamesthepeach


    Because I spent the money last last year before their new rules. If I had spent it after I would have put up the rent and took them on.
    But as it is I can't put up the rent so I'm out.

    Actually I probably wouldn't have taken them. I did offer the ipoa a substantial sum to take them on and offered to help in the fund raising for it. They never bothered to respond to me though.


  • #55
    4ensic15
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 4,691 ✭✭✭4ensic15


    It is a bit hypocritical suggesting other people do something you wouldn't do yourself. It is easy to see how landlords have been cornered. Each thinking for himself.


  • #56
    mrslancaster
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,876 ✭✭✭mrslancaster


    https://www.rtb.ie/dispute-resolution/dispute-resolution/dispute-resolution-process-faqs

    just reading this section of the rtb website.

    under the question "my landlord wants to increase my rent, can he do this?", the rtb say the LL cannot review within 24 months of commencement of tenancy except in limited circumstances such as a complete refurbishment of the property which affects the market rent of the property.

    so does complete refurbishment qualify as per their own website?


  • #57
    4ensic15
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 4,691 ✭✭✭4ensic15


    mrslancaster wrote: »
    https://www.rtb.ie/dispute-resolution/dispute-resolution/dispute-resolution-process-faqs

    just reading this section of the rtb website.

    under the question "my landlord wants to increase my rent, can he do this?", the rtb say the LL cannot review within 24 months of commencement of tenancy except in limited circumstances such as a complete refurbishment of the property which affects the market rent of the property.

    so does complete refurbishment qualify as per their own website?

    Of course it does. The difficulty is defining "complete refurbishment".


  • #58
    gizmo81
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,695 ✭✭✭gizmo81


    Can I ask about the concept of 'Market Value'?

    Market rent is defined as a rent that a willing Tenant not already in occupation would give and a willing Landlord would take for the dwelling, having regard to other terms of the tenancy and the letting values of dwellings of a similar size, type and character to the dwelling and situated in a comparable area to that in which it is situated.

    As we are in a rental crisis wouldn't it be fair to say there is a line of 'willing tenants' with blank cheques in hand?

    If this comes up at a rent review dispute how do you argue it and is 'market rent' within the 4% RPZ?

    Does RPZ not not nullify Market Rent?


  • #59
    mrslancaster
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,876 ✭✭✭mrslancaster


    ah right, see it now - thanks 4ensic15, ☺


  • #60
    jamesthepeach
    Registered Users Posts: 992 ✭✭✭jamesthepeach


    gizmo81 wrote: »
    Can I ask about the concept of 'Market Value'?

    Market rent is defined as a rent that a willing Tenant not already in occupation would give and a willing Landlord would take for the dwelling, having regard to other terms of the tenancy and the letting values of dwellings of a similar size, type and character to the dwelling and situated in a comparable area to that in which it is situated.

    As we are in a rental crisis wouldn't it be fair to say there is a line of 'willing tenants' with blank cheques in hand?

    If this comes up at a rent review dispute how do you argue it and is 'market rent' within the 4% RPZ?

    Does RPZ not not nullify Market Rent?

    There is no such thing as market rent in an rpz.


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  • #61
    4ensic15
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 4,691 ✭✭✭4ensic15


    gizmo81 wrote: »
    Does RPZ not not nullify Market Rent?

    A triple negative is too much at this time of night!


  • #62
    gizmo81
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,695 ✭✭✭gizmo81


    That's what I was thinking but the RTB were saying otherwise, that the three properties thing is valid.


    jamesthepeach wrote: »
    There is no such thing as market rent in an rpz.


  • #63
    jamesthepeach
    Registered Users Posts: 992 ✭✭✭jamesthepeach


    gizmo81 wrote: »
    That's what I was thinking but the RTB were saying otherwise, that the three properties thing is valid.

    More rubbish pulled out of their holes.
    How can there be market rent if it is remt controlled at different levels for everybody.

    If the ipoa had any nuts they would ask for funding and destroy these shisters.


  • #64
    The_Conductor
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 32,285 Mod ✭✭✭✭The_Conductor


    I'm not entirely sure why they're running scared.
    The legislation is full of holes, very probably unconstitutional on 4 different grounds (which the Minister himself has acknowledged, but says as the RPZ and other measures are only 'temporary' in nature, he can get around constitutional property protections)- and the body charged with policing this- is hopeless for both tenants and landlords.

    Its a goddamn mess- and the only proposals are to heap additional misery on both tenants and landlords.


  • #65
    GGTrek
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 834 ✭✭✭GGTrek


    gizmo81 wrote: »
    That's what I was thinking but the RTB were saying otherwise, that the three properties thing is valid.


    jamesthepeach wrote: »
    There is no such thing as market rent in an rpz.

    Yes it is still valid in a RPZ. For a RPZ rent review you have first to show the calculation and then show that the rent calculated with the RPZ rules is still lower than 3 equivalent properties and then present proof of the three equivalent properties rent amounts: on average 8 pages of red tape in double copy, every page dated and signed to make sure that the tenant does not try to be smart. It is a massive amount of administration work, there is a separate thread showing that one big letting agent is abandoning the business because of all the cost of red tape. Irish govvie loves red tape, since this is usually the only thig their bureaucrats can produce.


  • #66
    mrslancaster
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,876 ✭✭✭mrslancaster


    http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/politics/nctstyle-test-for-rental-properties-35812809.html

    -- maybe this is the future for all rental properties here but then again maybe this is the norm in other countries...anyone know?


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  • #67
    GGTrek
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 834 ✭✭✭GGTrek


    mrslancaster wrote: »
    http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/politics/nctstyle-test-for-rental-properties-35812809.html

    -- maybe this is the future for all rental properties here but then again maybe this is the norm in other countries...anyone know?
    This is other misery heaped over landlords and tenants. It will block the market completely. The DCC does not have the manpower and the skills (neither legal, nor technical) to inspect every rented property. Imagine the months long queues that would form in order to get the clearance certificate, who pays for the certificate?
    Many DCC health officers inspectors are just office penpushers, they do not even know how the law should be applied (most are not building surveyors!). To give you an example, the RTA 2015 introduced a rent deposit protection scheme administered by the RTB, do you know why it is not yet running? Because the RTB has neither the manpower nor the skills to administer anything!


  • #68
    Bigmac1euro
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,468 ✭✭✭Bigmac1euro


    Would replacing carpet in hall, stairs and landing, New carpets in dining and living room.
    Painting the whole house and refitting a new bath with new tiles on the wall, spending about 6k in total count as a substantial refurbishment ?


  • #69
    The_Conductor
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 32,285 Mod ✭✭✭✭The_Conductor


    Bigmac1euro wrote: »
    Would replacing carpet in hall, stairs and landing, New carpets in dining and living room.
    Painting the whole house and refitting a new bath with new tiles on the wall, spending about 6k in total count as a substantial refurbishment ?

    Not a snowballs chance in hell.
    You need a major refurbishment- possibly changing the structure of character of the property- in order for it to merit consideration under the Act. A new bathroom or kitchen, carpets- or painting- would 100% definitely not qualify.


  • #70
    Bigmac1euro
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,468 ✭✭✭Bigmac1euro


    The_Conductor wrote: »
    Not a snowballs chance in hell.
    You need a major refurbishment- possibly changing the structure of character of the property- in order for it to merit consideration under the Act. A new bathroom or kitchen, carpets- or painting- would 100% definitely not qualify.

    That's music to my ears thanks!


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