Baby On Board

Trekker09 · 25-01-2018 8:23am #1

Listening to Newstalk the other morning and they were discussing the Baby On Board initiative by Irish Rail:

http://www.thejournal.ie/baby-on-board-irish-rail-3716072-Nov2017/

It seemed to focus on men not giving up their seats, and that chivalry is dead etc, which I wouldn't completely disagree with, but why was the emphasis on men giving up their seats and not women?

I seldom use public transport, but would always offer a seat to people who I thought needed it more than I did, eg pregnant, people with kids, older people.

Jim Bob Scratcher · 25-01-2018 8:30am

Baby on board my ass, unless she's going to drop it that day I don't see why anyone should offer her a seat. For an older person I would though.

rgodard80a · 25-01-2018 8:35am

I imagine it's partly because the woman may just be fat not pregnant.

Jack Kanoff · 25-01-2018 8:43am

Piss off and book a seat like everyone else, otherwise stand and wave your badge at someone who cares.

RocketRaccoon · 25-01-2018 8:51am

Do women want equality or not? Why should a man,in this day and age,get up to give a (non pregnant, non older) lady his seat?

Black_Knight · 25-01-2018 8:51am

Jack Kanoff wrote: »

Piss off and book a seat like everyone else, otherwise stand and wave your badge at someone who cares.

If you get your head out of your ass you might remember the likes of the dart or the commuter trains which don't have assigned seating.

Every morning those trains are packed and when the doors open you don't simply step on, you look and hope the other commuters packed up to the door can shuffle over.

KungPao · 25-01-2018 8:57am

Can I get a “I’m really tired and need to sit down” badge?

andekwarhola · 25-01-2018 8:57am

Ask for offence and it will be given to you; seek offence and thou will find; knock and the door of offence will be opened to you - Andekwarhola 7:7

circadian · 25-01-2018 9:03am

Car crash of a thread.

I'm all for it, wife just had a baby a few months ago and he was a heffer, well over 10lbs. Essentially she was carrying that weight, then some for all the other bits and bobs in the womb and a really bad centre of gravity. Not to mention the shift in shape of hips.

Yeah pregnant women are usually otherwise healthy, but Christ. Wise up and give up the seat.

Jack Kanoff · 25-01-2018 9:04am

Black_Knight wrote: »

If you get your head out of your ass you might remember the likes of the dart or the commuter trains which don't have assigned seating.

Every morning those trains are packed and when the doors open you don't simply step on, you look and hope the other commuters packed up to the door can shuffle over.

And those of us with a non obvious physical disability have the same issues....get on with it or make other arrangements.

pgj2015 · 25-01-2018 9:06am

no one should be made give up a seat. offer your seat if you like but you shouldn't have to give up the seat. if you choose to get pregnant, thats your choice, it does not mean you automatically have a right to a seat on a train, what will be next skipping the queue in a super market because you are pregnant? Rachel kennedy sounds very self entitled.

The J Stands for Jay · 25-01-2018 9:12am

KungPao wrote: »

Can I get a “I’m really tired and need to sit down” badge?

Only once I get a "My back hurts and standing is causing me pain" badge.

A few years ago, I'd put my back out playing football and got on the luas to go straight to the child clinic in balally. An old woman got on and some middle-aged man decided to start telling me to give her my seat (don't remember if he had a seat or not). With his hectoring and the filthy looks from everyone else, I gave up my seat. I wasn't able to stand up straight as I couldn't straighten my back. No campaign to find me a seat was started, as my obvious injury wasn't deemed to be as needing a seat as a perfectly fit older lady

pgj2015 · 25-01-2018 9:14am

McGaggs wrote: »

Only once I get a "My back hurts and standing is causing me pain" badge.

A few years ago, I'd put my back out playing football and got on the luas to go straight to the child clinic in balally. An old woman got on and some middle-aged man decided to start telling me to give her my seat (don't remember if he had a seat or not). With his hectoring and the filthy looks from everyone else, I gave up my seat. I wasn't able to stand up straight as I couldn't straighten my back. No campaign to find me a seat was started, as my obvious injury wasn't deemed to be as needing a seat as a perfectly fit older lady

bigger ejit you were for giving them the seat.

Dakota Dan · 25-01-2018 9:27am

pgj2015 wrote: »

bigger ejit you were for giving them the seat.

Or even eejit

rainbow kirby · 25-01-2018 9:27am

McGaggs wrote: »

Only once I get a "My back hurts and standing is causing me pain" badge.

There is a new blue "Please offer me a seat" badge in London aimed at those with invisible disabilities. Not as widely recognised as the "Baby on Board" badge is though.

For what it's worth - I've worn a badge in my 2nd and 3rd trimester of both pregnancies (in London). Trains in the morning are so crowded that I do get dizzy and need to sit if I'm standing for too long and late on its just incredibly uncomfortable. I still got asked earlier this week at 37 weeks for my seat by someone who only looked about 4-5 months along maximum...

Huntergonzo · 25-01-2018 9:47am

Just ignore Newstalk, they're probably the biggest anti-men pro-snowflake station on the radio. I usually turn it on in the morning for a few minutes just to hear some PC nonsense and scarcely a day goes by that they don't talk about 'the gender pay gap' or some other 'why men should hate themselves' propaganda.

Just this morning they had a feminist on telling us we should teach our sons not to hit girls/women......well obviously, but how about teaching them not to hit anyboby, why does gender matter?? And nothing about the other way around of course!

Anyway, I would always offer my seat to a lady who was obviously pregnant or an elderly person etc. But I would be less inclined to offer my seat to someone who was advertising a 'baby on board' and if they weren't visibly pregnant I simply wouldn't offer my seat at all.

Lorelli! · 25-01-2018 9:53am

I have no problem giving up my seat for a pregnant woman or anyone that feels they really need it.

I've offered my seat to pregnant women before and some didn't want the seat so they'd probably only carry the badge when they felt they needed it. If some see the badge and don't want to give up their seat, then fair enough, id say there would be plenty of others that would see it and wouldn't mind.

Didn't hear the discussion on Newstalk but it sounds like it trailed off into a different topic.

Chrongen · 25-01-2018 9:58am

I thought a woman's body was "designed" for the rigours of childbearing and childbirth. If they were so fragile then they should be wrapped in cotton wool at the moment of conception and kept that way until the brat has been squeezed out instead of doing sh1t around the house, getting to a train station, travelling to work, working, travelling back, getting shopping on the way, lugging it home, doing more sh1t around the house, etc., etc.
Ever see those African women up the duff and marching miles to a well and carrying a 5 gallon container of water and their heads back to the village. Proper women. Troopers.

Can't stand on the train because for the last month you've been farting for two? Bollocks.

inforfun · 25-01-2018 10:01am

I have given up my set in public transport years ago.
I drive a car.

Gets me everywhere i need to be, not just hopefully close to it.
No arseholes sneezing and coughing without putting their paw in front of their mouth.
No twats doing a full make up in the bus because they cant be arsed to wake up 30 mins earlier.
No people smelling like wet dog when it is raining.

Keep your seat.

Salvation Tambourine · 25-01-2018 10:15am

I remember once being on a DART, sitting with our backs to the standing area. My friend and I noticed this woman (also sitting but in view of the standing area) giving us and several other people a few looks, she didn't seem happy. After about five minutes she stood up and said "Fine! If no one else will offer!" and gave her seat to a pregnant women. She then kept giving us looks. Firstly, we couldn't see and secondly the woman left it five minutes before offering her precious seat. I think she expected men to stand up instead of her and was trying to claim some odd sort of morale high ground.

Anyways, I don't really use public transport that often anymore but I'd like to think if there was someone obviously pregnant or someone elderly I'd give up my seat.

Salvation Tambourine · 25-01-2018 10:17am

McGaggs wrote: »

Only once I get a "My back hurts and standing is causing me pain" badge.

A few years ago, I'd put my back out playing football and got on the luas to go straight to the child clinic in balally. An old woman got on and some middle-aged man decided to start telling me to give her my seat (don't remember if he had a seat or not). With his hectoring and the filthy looks from everyone else, I gave up my seat. I wasn't able to stand up straight as I couldn't straighten my back. No campaign to find me a seat was started, as my obvious injury wasn't deemed to be as needing a seat as a perfectly fit older lady

I've done my knee in a few times and know how you feel here. No one can see the recent scar from a knee operation so it's assumed you're perfectly healthy. But there's no point in blaming someone for something they couldn't be aware of.

_Dara_ · 25-01-2018 10:18am

Jim Bob Scratcher wrote: »

Baby on board my ass, unless she's going to drop it that day I don't see why anyone should offer her a seat. For an older person I would though.

The older person might need it less than the six or seven months pregnant woman. My folks are coasting towards 70. My mother would need a seat due to a slightly arthritic knee. But my father is full of beans and is a regular hill-walker. He could stand for ages, no problem.

silverharp · 25-01-2018 10:19am

Trekker09 wrote: »

Listening to Newstalk the other morning and they were discussing the Baby On Board initiative by Irish Rail:

http://www.thejournal.ie/baby-on-board-irish-rail-3716072-Nov2017/

It seemed to focus on men not giving up their seats, and that chivalry is dead etc, which I wouldn't completely disagree with, but why was the emphasis on men giving up their seats and not women?

I seldom use public transport, but would always offer a seat to people who I thought needed it more than I did, eg pregnant, people with kids, older people.

that's a bit sexist , surely the sisterhood should step up too

xalot · 25-01-2018 10:29am

When I was heavily pregnant the only times I was ever offered a seat on public transport was from women, who were absolutely insistent that I sit down.
Men, maybe for fear of offending, were much slower off the mark. I think wearing the badge says 'I'm not fat I'm pregnant' and if you've any consideration for other peoples welfare than you should offer your seat.

I offer myself all the time to anyone who looks like they need it more than me. I dont understand the outrage.

_Dara_ · 25-01-2018 10:32am

Able-bodied men AND women should give up their seats for those more needy. There's no need to differentiate by gender here. And an able-bodied man shouldn't need to give his seat up for an able-bodied woman.

But let me say this: those of you here who are bellyaching at the thought of giving up a seat for anyone heavily pregnant or elderly or with a hidden disability - yiz don't know you're alive. Marvel at your healthy body and what it allows you to do, including standing for a while with no ill effects. Don't you know how lucky you are?

_Dara_ · 25-01-2018 10:36am

Huntergonzo wrote: »

Anyway, I would always offer my seat to a lady who was obviously pregnant or an elderly person etc. But I would be less inclined to offer my seat to someone who was advertising a 'baby on board'

Why would you offer a seat to an obviously pregnant woman but be less likely to if she was wearing that badge? The purpose of it is to eliminate doubt that the woman is actually pregnant. And a small bump doesn't mean that the woman is early on in the pregnancy. Some women only have a little bump even at six or seven months. My very slim cousin was six months gone before she told her parents she was pregnant at 19. They hadn't a clue.

Canis Lupus · 25-01-2018 10:41am

Strong, independent, fierce and equal. Unless I need a seat.

Dakota Dan · 25-01-2018 10:42am

inforfun wrote: »

I have given up my set in public transport years ago.
I drive a car.

Gets me everywhere i need to be, not just hopefully close to it.
No arseholes sneezing and coughing without putting their paw in front of their mouth.
No twats doing a full make up in the bus because they cant be arsed to wake up 30 mins earlier.
No people smelling like wet dog when it is raining.

Keep your seat.

Pity you gave up using public transport because you must have been a perfect passenger.

Jordan 199 · 25-01-2018 10:44am

The Be Sharps.

doolox · 25-01-2018 10:49am

If you have to buy something and then give it up to someone else if they happen to be there on the bus or train.

I used public transport for a few weeks and had to stand for the first few stops but always managed to get a seat during the journey.

There is not a chance in hell I'd give it up for anyone who is capable of walking to the station or bus stop and let every other seat occupier sit in their seats.

I will not be the giver up gob****e for the other people.

Life is hard enough as it is.

Let the public transport providers supply more seats.

clairewithani · 25-01-2018 10:49am

I have had quite a few pregnancies and while I was in great health for them I did feel tired in last trimester and had backache. It was often uncomfortable to stand. Thankfully I am in my 50s and while I was pregnant people wouldn't hesitate to offer me a seat. I think it's a nice gesture. I would hope my children would be nice enough to offer a seat to people who might need it. Doesn't cost anything and might make life a tiny bit easier for someone.

El Weirdo · 25-01-2018 10:57am

Fucking hell, I see this thread has brought all the cunts out.

Feisar · 25-01-2018 11:03am

They are going about it the wrong way, those that would give up their seat should have a badge so someone that needs one can ask them for their seat.

25-01-2018 11:04am

rainbow kirby wrote: »

There is a new blue "Please offer me a seat" badge in London aimed at those with invisible disabilities. Not as widely recognised as the "Baby on Board" badge is though.

For what it's worth - I've worn a badge in my 2nd and 3rd trimester of both pregnancies (in London). Trains in the morning are so crowded that I do get dizzy and need to sit if I'm standing for too long and late on its just incredibly uncomfortable. I still got asked earlier this week at 37 weeks for my seat by someone who only looked about 4-5 months along maximum...

Did you give up the seat or explain

razorblunt · 25-01-2018 11:11am

My commute is 30 mins each way on a tram. Normally I'm reading a book and might not raise my head for the entire journey but I do always try to give up my seat if busy. It's a tough one though, I've played the fat vs pregnant game before and lost so the badges like they have in London would be useful. It's also a gamble with older people, what perceived age is the cut off? A few times its been laughed off as "oh I'm not that old son, I'll stand".

In fairness though the ticket inspectors are very good at moving people out of the seats reserved for wheelchairs, elderly, pregnant, injured people.

Huntergonzo · 25-01-2018 11:12am

_Dara_ wrote: »

Why would you offer a seat to an obviously pregnant woman but be less likely to if she was wearing that badge? The purpose of it is to eliminate doubt that the woman is actually pregnant. And a small bump doesn't mean that the woman is early on in the pregnancy. Some women only have a little bump even at six or seven months. My very slim cousin was six months gone before she told her parents she was pregnant at 19. They hadn't a clue.

Just to be clear I would offer my seat to an obviously pregnant woman whether she was wearing a silly badge or not.

But these sort of things would inevitably be abused by fat lazy gits who just want a seat so I would be weary of 'baby on board' advertisments.

Rule of thumb - if you see she's visibly pregnant offer a seat (I know I know it isn't always visible, but by and large you can tell), if she looks at you and points to her badge but doesn't look in any great distress, then kick back and enjoy your seat.

Ps, my back is fcuked anyway and I find it pretty uncomfortable to be standing up for extended periods of time, so where's my badge and why don't they talk about me ad nauseam on national radio?

rainbow kirby · 25-01-2018 11:16am

bluewolf wrote: »

Did you give up the seat or explain

I explained and did not give up the seat. The (very much not pregnant!) woman sitting across from me ended up moving.

_Dara_ · 25-01-2018 11:24am

Huntergonzo wrote: »

Just to be clear I would offer my seat to an obviously pregnant woman whether she was wearing a silly badge or not.

But these sort of things would inevitably be abused by fat lazy gits who just want a seat so I would be weary of 'baby on board' advertisments.

Rule of thumb - if you see she's visibly pregnant offer a seat (I know I know it isn't always visible, but by and large you can tell), if she looks at you and points to her badge but doesn't look in any great distress, then kick back and enjoy your seat.

Ps, my back is fcuked anyway and I find it pretty uncomfortable to be standing up for extended periods of time, so where's my badge and why don't they talk about me ad nauseam on national radio?

Like all badges of their kind, they’re not going to give them out willy nilly. It’s highly unlikely that someone who isn’t pregnant will have one.

I have a hidden disability and I still can’t fathom the pettiness around this.

c68zapdsm5i1ru · 25-01-2018 11:31am

I can't believe some of the selfish attitudes on this thread.

Well actually, I can, because I've seen it with my own eyes on public transport.

I think the badges are a great idea. I asked my teenage nephew recently if he'd give up his seat for an older or pregnant person. He said he would for an older person, but he'd be afraid he might insult a fat woman who wasn't really pregnant.
I think that's a dilemma for a lot of people so the badges would cut out any awkwardness.

I also think, if someone offers you a seat, just take it and don't embarrass them by standing there arguing or laughing that 'I'm not that old'. It just puts people off standing up when they witness that kind of behaviour.

beans · 25-01-2018 11:32am

We should be encouraging an increase in birth-rate, and if making commuter-spaces more friendly for expectant mothers is the way to do this, so be it.

The 'Baby on Board' badges in London work well, and I'd be happy to see the system introduced everywhere as a standard.

Of course, offering your seat to a pregnant woman shouldn't be compulsory, but it is good manners.

Vita nova · 25-01-2018 11:42am

Not out of chivalry but for purely medical reasons, I'd always give up a seat to a pregnant woman. Pregnant women are prone to become dizzy while standing for long periods and could possibly faint. Had a pregnant family member that had a dizzy spell on a train and would have fainted had she not got a seat in time.
I think the badge is a great idea because sometimes it can be hard to tell if someone is pregnant.

One eyed Jack · 25-01-2018 11:45am

_Dara_ wrote: »

I have a hidden disability and I still can’t fathom the petiness around this.

That's exactly the word I was searching for. The way some people in this thread are reacting like they were expected to give up a kidney or something!

Seat on public transport, it really doesn't have to be the big deal it's being made out to be. If a person needs a seat, they really shouldn't need a badge, it's just so passive. They should have no fear of asking for a seat, and if a person doesn't want to give them a seat, just ask the next person!

If I see someone I feel is more in need of a seat than I am, I'll get up and ask them would they like a seat. If they say no thanks, I won't do Mrs. Doyle on it. I've faced criticism on here before from women who were offended by the idea that I would always offer a woman who was standing my seat, but I think to take offence at that is just as petty. No woman I've ever encountered offline has ever made an issue of it, and I'd dread to think adults would generally be so petty and passive that they either imagine they're being expected to give up a kidney, would prefer to wear a silly badge instead of just ask for a seat, or would be offended by the idea of being offered a seat.

25-01-2018 11:57am

beans wrote: »

The 'Baby on Board' badges in London work well, and I'd be happy to see the system introduced everywhere as a standard.

Of course, offering your seat to a pregnant woman shouldn't be compulsory, but it is good manners.

it amazes me that people are even arguing against this, are people really that ignorant?

and while you're mentioning London, could we please introduce the "Stand on the right" rule for escalators?

Saruhashi · 25-01-2018 11:57am

Would this problem not be easily solved by encouraging pregnant women or people with disabilities to ask for a seat?

I think if you get on a Dart carriage there are 40 seats? If you manage to shuffle onto the train to a position where you can be seen by seated customers then I guess maybe 8 seated people would be able to see you? They can't all offer their seat at once and it's very likely that they are all sitting there hoping that someone else will offer so that they don't lose their seat.

So why not ask?

If people are willing to offer a seat then that's brilliant but there are a number of reasons why someone might not offer a seat and it's unfair to have a passive aggressive approach to those people. Just ask for a seat if nobody offers.

Huntergonzo · 25-01-2018 11:59am

_Dara_ wrote: »

Like all badges of their kind, they’re not going to give them out willy nilly. It’s highly unlikely that someone who isn’t pregnant will have one.

I have a hidden disability and I still can’t fathom the pettiness around this.

You're very wrong there, they will hand them out willy nilly.

Nothing pettier than a badge saying 'baby on board', can I get a badge which says 'couldn't give a fcuk'!

c68zapdsm5i1ru · 25-01-2018 12:06pm

Saruhashi wrote: »

Would this problem not be easily solved by encouraging pregnant women or people with disabilities to ask for a seat?

I think if you get on a Dart carriage there are 40 seats? If you manage to shuffle onto the train to a position where you can be seen by seated customers then I guess maybe 8 seated people would be able to see you? They can't all offer their seat at once and it's very likely that they are all sitting there hoping that someone else will offer so that they don't lose their seat.

So why not ask?

If people are willing to offer a seat then that's brilliant but there are a number of reasons why someone might not offer a seat and it's unfair to have a passive aggressive approach to those people. Just ask for a seat if nobody offers.

Well judging by some of the posts on this thread, there's a high chance that someone asking a specific passenger if they might have their seat as they're pregnant/suffering from a disability will receive a rude, unpleasant response. Badges are a safer option as there are usually a few decent people on the bus or luas who will actually be okay with offering their seat to someone in need.

One eyed Jack · 25-01-2018 12:21pm

Skylar Massive Serf wrote: »

Well judging by some of the posts on this thread, there's a high chance that someone asking a specific passenger if they might have their seat as they're pregnant/suffering from a disability will receive a rude, unpleasant response. Badges are a safer option as there are usually a few decent people on the bus or luas who will actually be okay with offering their seat to someone in need.

I know what you mean, but I wouldn't encourage anyone to judge people generally by the attitudes some people display online. People managed fine without badges for generations, both in being able to ask for a seat, and offering a seat. There aren't that many socially autistic people in society now that we need badges or we are incapable of seeing when someone is more in need of a seat than we are. It's just generally a matter of being able to be assertive for oneself or just good manners on the other hand, no need for people to be losing the run of themselves for either being expected to ask for a seat, or being expected to give up their seat.

Dakota Dan · 25-01-2018 12:34pm

El Weirdo wrote: »

Fucking hell, I see this thread has brought all the cunts out.

Welcome to the thread c**t

Mystery Egg · 25-01-2018 12:38pm

I'm pregnant and I've got a badge. My husband got it for me because I've got extreme pain in my right hip due to multiple historic surgeries that the pregnancy has aggravated.

You'll all be delighted to learn that I've not once been offered a seat. At one stage en route to work I actually had to get off the luas to sit briefly to relieve the hip pressure and then get back on to another luas. I thought I was going to collapse. I'm sure if I did I'd be left to crawl home on my hands and knees as I deserve for the crime of having a child.

Pregnant women can't take medication for pain so it's not as manageable as usual.

Prior to getting pregnant myself I've always, always offered my seat to anyone that I thought might need it - elderly, pregnant or disabled. Thanks to the ridiculous attitudes visible in this thread that kind of practice is on the wane.

You'll all be old and sick one day.

thierry14 · 25-01-2018 12:42pm

When men were men

Such a load of pussies in this thread

Modern men

Whinging

Give up the seat

c68zapdsm5i1ru · 25-01-2018 12:44pm

Mystery Egg wrote: »

I'm pregnant and I've got a badge. My husband got it for me because I've got extreme pain in my right hip due to multiple historic surgeries that the pregnancy has aggravated.

You'll all be delighted to learn that I've not once been offered a seat. At one stage en route to work I actually had to get off the luas to sit briefly to relieve the hip pressure and then get back on to another luas. I thought I was going to collapse. I'm sure if I did I'd be left to crawl home on my hands and knees as I deserve for the crime of having a child.

Pregnant women can't take medication for pain so it's not as manageable as usual.

Prior to getting pregnant myself I've always, always offered my seat to anyone that I thought might need it - elderly, pregnant or disabled. Thanks to the ridiculous attitudes visible in this thread that kind of practice is on the wane.

You'll all be old and sick one day.

It really is sickening the way some posters are almost boasting about the fact that 'would they hell as like' give up their seat to some bloody pregnant woman. I don't know if they're just very young and very immature, or if they're the parents who are raising some of the kids and teens I see on buses who not only don't offer up their seat, but will happily grab a seat as soon as it becomes available even if there's a person in greater need standing right beside them.

Baby On Board

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