TAX BACK ON DENTAL TREATMENT ABROAD

Rossc122 wrote: »

HI

I had dental work done in turkey last year . It qualifies as non routine treat mine and now I’m looking to get the desired 20% back in tax. Can someone please tell me how I go about getting the tax back . I’m aware of med2 forms but I’m unsure if Turkish dentist can fill them out .

Turkey is not in the EU, you are out of luck.

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

Yes you can claim for non routine dental work carried on anywhere in the World provided the dentist is qualified in the country in which you received treatment. Med 2 must be completed by the dentist.

https://www.revenue.ie/en/personal-tax-credits-reliefs-and-exemptions/health-and-age/health-expenses/dental-expenses.aspx

Non-routine dental care outside Ireland
You can claim for non-routine dental treatment performed outside of Ireland. To qualify for relief, the dentist must be a qualified dentistry practitioner under that country's laws. You must have the dentist complete a Form Med 2 for your claim.

Thanks for clarifying the apparent tax position.

Other posters should really get their facts right.

Yyhhuuu wrote: »

Thanks for clarifying the apparent tax position.

Other posters should really get their facts right.

Thanks for that. For the last 20 years as a dentist I have had to fill in my PPS number on the med 2 form and treatment relief was only allowable outside the state with the EU common taxation policy. This may have changed recently without me know but its very resent if thats the case. I am very glad the taxpayer is subsidising money spent abroad outside the EU now, fantastic.

Thank for clarifying, I will make sure to check in with you before giving any more free dental advice here, as I have done for about 15 years.

mountai wrote: »

I am very glad the taxpayer is subsidising money spent abroad outside the EU now, fantastic.

Having trouble understanding this point . I assume OP is a tax payer , so how are other tax payers " Subsidising" a tax claim he is trying to get ? .

Because we are allowing the person pay less tax for spending money that has left the state. Money that stays in the state gets taxed again and can pay for all the things we enjoy. The dentists profit, the staffs wages, the labs profit and wages, the landlords rent, the rates etc.etc all taxed again and again, along with the VAT on everything that money buys.

While its good to relieve dental treatment for the individual receiving the treatment that is money the state is not getting. If the dental work is done outside the state that money is gone for the benefit of everyone else.

EU common taxation policy offset this aspect within the EU.

Mayo_fan wrote: »

An example of the spending staying within the Irish economy would be the Irish dentists super flash car because the Irish dentist earns so (too) much. You know there is a reason a lot of patients go abroad (most to the north), Irish dentists are too expensive, earn multiples of their Northern Ireland equivalent. Same as pharmacies.

Why do dentists earn “so (too) much”?

Firstly, I’m not a dentist so I don’t really care how much they are actually paid.

My assertion as to why dentists earning relatively high wages is as follows (no particular order):

1/ They have attended a difficult, technical degree which takes 5+ years

2/ they are conducting work that requires a high degree of skill and expertise

3/ many have overheads associated with running their own practice (staff, insurance, equipment, advertising, utilities etc.)

4/ there is a reasonable amount of risk and responsibility associated with what they do

5/ the supply of labour (dentists) is low enough such that the demand (customers) are willing to pay them the rates they charge. Granted people travel abroad, but likely not in sufficient numbers to drive prices down (yet?)

The above points are just off the top of my head, buts it’s all of those type of factors combined that make their wages relatively high compared to e.g. a bus driver, who has responsibility and risk but requires far less training and expertise to do their job.

As I mentioned, I’m not a dentist. My wages are however relatively high, but I possess highly technical and employable skills, I have years of experience in high value work environments, I have extensive experience delivering high value projects etc etc. None of that is free, it required me to spend time doing it, college, working crappy hours etc. So, naturally, I want to charge for it, and I charge a lot.

I never hear people who have high wages complain that they are paid too much, I expect it’s because most of them had to put in the work to get to that level.

I appreciate you may have an issue with dentists, but their wages reflect the skills they have and it’s value to their customers. The reason someone stacking shelves in a supermarket gets approximately minimum wage is because it’s a job that requires a low level of skill and there is a large supply of people that can do that job. I’ve done that job, so I’m fairly aware of how easy and how hard it can be.

Regarding the tax relief, I don’t see why someone spending money in Turkey/Antarctica/non-EU should get tax relief in that instance, the money does nothing for the Irish economy. It’s the same as someone buying a holiday home in Florida and claiming tax relief for it here... Subsidies from
Private health insurance I’ve no issue with, but the revenue should tell them to get lost.

Dav010 wrote: »

Don’t knock super flash cars until you have one, they are great.

Only thing better than having a flash car, is have 2 or 3 of them. :cool:

Look dentistry is often a begrudging spend for a lot of people, and one they cannot avoid. This instills irritation with dentists and dentistry as a profession as the focus of their ire. I get that. But luckily the majority of dental issues are preventable,

Dentists are generally extremely busy seeing their existing patients so where anyone has their dental work done impacts only on them, and matters not one bit to a dentist they have never met, or their previous dentist who has not thought about them for even a moment since their last appointment. There is the issue of high speed medical tourism but thats not really the discussion here.

Mayo_fan wrote: »

All your points are very valid.

My point is that dentists and pharmacies in ROI charge too much. You only have to look across the border to understand this(even though the likes of Spain, Hungary etc are a fraction of ROI prices ignore for this argument as they are very different geographies). At least 50% less for complex procedures in Northern Ireland (I got braces there 25 years ago and my son is getting them right now and both cases half price to ROI), while those in the industry will argue rent insurance etc as being different these extra costs don’t account for the price difference. ROI dentists and pharmacies make MUCH MORE profits than their northern equivalents because they charge customers MUCH MORE. it’s that simple.

To further emphasise my point a lot of ROI dentists and pharmacists go to college and train on the UK so their qualifications are the exact same as their neighbours who charge half their prices!

My point is it’s a bit rich a ROI dentist complaining that someone is getting tax relief from their expenses abroad when it’s most likely the case that the patient was forced to go abroad because of the profiteering of the ROI dental industry meant they couldn’t afford to use an ROI dentist.

Dental Clinics are micro businesses which operate on the same economic principles as any other business, charge too much and people won’t avail of your service, charge less than the market rate and you are not reaching earning potential. Should it be any other way?

Show me a Clinic that charges 50% less for complex treatments, I’ll show you someone who didn’t do their research to find better value closer to home. Link to an orthodontic clinic that charges 50% less than the average rate here please.

Incidentally, there is a very good reason why pharmacies charge more here for medication, and it is not just because the Pharmacists want more profit than their northern counterparts, google is your friend.

Mayo_fan wrote: »

I am reading that as let’s charge as much as we can get away with.

This is the fundamental underpinning of ever business ever.

You also mentioned in a previous post about prices in Spain, Hungary and the North.

Average Spanish wages are less than €2000 per month, similar in the North and in Hungary they're around €1000 per month. It's handy earning your money here and spending it in a country with lower living standards, of course everything will be cheaper when the reality is that average Irish salaries are among the largest on the planet.