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General Rugby Discussion

12357…200

Comments

  • #202
    irishbucsfan
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 37,978 ✭✭✭✭irishbucsfan


    Deleted User wrote: »
    I've not said anything like that. Nor inferred it. Feel free to to fail to comprehend me, then misrepresent me as a way to refute a point, I won't be taking part though.

    It's in black and white above what I've said.

    OK, fair enough. I think it's pretty clear that you're being disingenuous here and awec had it right. But if you're having a dig at their marketing then I don't see why you wouldn't just say that either. If you're not going to stand over your comments then that's fine.


  • #203
    OldRio
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,142 ✭✭✭OldRio


    Ah now lads. You should know by now. Any dismissive chat about English Rugby will only result in one outcome.


  • #204
    irishbucsfan
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 37,978 ✭✭✭✭irishbucsfan


    OldRio wrote: »
    Ah now lads. You should know by now. Any dismissive chat about English Rugby will only result in one outcome.

    Not if there is any merit to it.

    Calling Jim Mallinder a fool for his comments in 2011 or Austin Healy a fool for his article in December last year, or Nigel Wray a fool for pretty much any comment he has ever made is fine, because it's completely justified and can be backed up with real evidence.


  • #205
    OldRio
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,142 ✭✭✭OldRio


    Like I said


  • #206
    molloyjh
    Registered Users Posts: 24,767 ✭✭✭✭molloyjh


    irishbucsfan wrote: »
    Not if there is any merit to it.

    Calling Jim Mallinder a fool for his comments in 2011 or Austin Healy a fool for his article in December last year, or Nigel Wray a fool for pretty much any comment he has ever made is fine, because it's completely justified and can be backed up with real evidence.

    You know as well as the rest of us that this has come from the comments over the last few years about how the Irish teams can rest internationals where-as the English teams cannot. Which basically says that the AP is so tough and competitive that players cannot be rested. That sort of thing had, very definitively, been said numerous times throughout the Euro row and beyond. We're just poking a bit of fun at that idea. That's it. It's a bit of fun. Banter. Relax. You don't have to jump to the APs defence at every whisper of potential negativity.


  • #207
    irishbucsfan
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 37,978 ✭✭✭✭irishbucsfan


    molloyjh wrote: »
    You know as well as the rest of us that this has come from the comments over the last few years about how the Irish teams can rest internationals where-as the English teams cannot. Which basically says that the AP is so tough and competitive that players cannot be rested. That sort of thing had, very definitively, been said numerous times throughout the Euro row and beyond. We're just poking a bit of fun at that idea. That's it. It's a bit of fun. Banter. Relax. You don't have to jump to the APs defence at every whisper of potential negativity.

    Yes, that's exactly what I'm saying it's about. Emmet is the one denying that the comments had anything to do with that!


  • #208
    molloyjh
    Registered Users Posts: 24,767 ✭✭✭✭molloyjh


    irishbucsfan wrote: »
    Yes, that's exactly what I'm saying it's about. Emmet is the one denying that the comments had anything to do with that!

    Well I can't speak for emmett, but seeing as it was my post that kicked all this off I can say it about my own. And it was just meant in good fun.


  • #209
    Lillianna Long Publisher
    Posts: 0 ✭✭✭✭ Lillianna Long Publisher


    irishbucsfan wrote: »
    Yes, that's exactly what I'm saying it's about. Emmet is the one denying that the comments had anything to do with that!
    Deleted User wrote:
    Not true. It's a common myth that's trotted out in the media a lot, and was beaten like a drum in a recent debate by some of PRL's mouthpieces.

    have I?

    Miscomprehension round 1
    Misrepresentation round 1
    followed by
    Miscomprehension round 2
    Misrepresentation round 2

    I sense a pattern


  • #210
    RuggieBear
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,958 ✭✭✭✭RuggieBear


    lets keep this in the other thread please.


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  • #211
    Lillianna Long Publisher
    Posts: 0 ✭✭✭✭ Lillianna Long Publisher


    RuggieBear wrote: »
    lets keep this in the other thread please.

    No easy threads in the Rugby forum. :pac:


  • #212
    irishbucsfan
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 37,978 ✭✭✭✭irishbucsfan


    Deleted User wrote: »

    have I?

    Miscomprehension round 1
    Misrepresentation round 1
    followed by
    Miscomprehension round 2
    Misrepresentation round 2

    I sense a pattern

    Yes, here

    It's fine if that's what you meant. As long as you accept that not a single quote you've posted among all of those is an example of anyone using the line in the context people are saying they were!


  • #213
    Lillianna Long Publisher
    Posts: 0 ✭✭✭✭ Lillianna Long Publisher


    irishbucsfan wrote: »
    Yes, here

    It's fine if that's what you meant. As long as you accept that not a single quote you've posted among all of those is an example of anyone using the line in the context people are saying they were!

    The question you asked me was if those comments had anything to do with that quote.
    Which they didn't. So I said they didn't.

    The quotes were in reply to awec saying that nobody had ever said it, which is patently untrue.
    I've learned to be ridiculously pedantic when dealing with people who aim to misrepresent you. Are you really struggling to understand this post? http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=92306728&postcount=184


  • #214
    RuggieBear
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,958 ✭✭✭✭RuggieBear


    No more. Take it to PM


  • #215
    Winters
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,761 ✭✭✭✭Winters


    Pop quiz, which ex Ireland and Lions player is due to make his league debut for Malahide this weekend in Leinster League Division 1B?


  • #216
    Yeah_Right
    Registered Users Posts: 6,034 ✭✭✭Yeah_Right


    Winters wrote: »
    Pop quiz, which ex Ireland and Lions player is due to make his league debut for Malahide this weekend in Leinster League Division 1B?

    Willie John Mcbride? Ronan O'Gara? Shane Byrne?


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  • #217
    RuggieBear
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,958 ✭✭✭✭RuggieBear


    Big Mal


  • #218
    Winters
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,761 ✭✭✭✭Winters


    Bingo!


  • #219
    Yeah_Right
    Registered Users Posts: 6,034 ✭✭✭Yeah_Right


    Who is Bingo? Which Lions tour was he on?


  • #220
    The Lost Sheep
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,967 ✭✭✭✭The Lost Sheep


    Russia play Uruguay in first leg of tie to decide the last world cup place tomorrow.
    The winner of the tie joins group with Australia, England, Wales and Fiji in next years world cup.

    Russian team named below
    1. Grigory Tsnobiladze (Krasny Yar)
    2. Valery Tsnobiladze (Krasny Yar)
    3. Evgeny Pronenko (Enisey-STM)
    4. Alexander Voytov (cap., VVA Saracens)
    5. Kirill Kulemin (USA Perpignan)
    6. Andrey Temnov (Enisey-STM)
    7. Andrey Garbuzov (Krasny Yar)
    8. Viktor Gresev (Krasny Yar)
    9. Alexander Yanyushkin (VVA Saracens)
    10. Yury Kushnarev (Enisey-STM)
    11. Vladimir Ostroushko (Kuban Krasnodar)
    12. Alexey Makovetsky (Krasny Yar)
    13. Dimitry Gerasimov (Enisey-STM)
    14. Mikhail Babaev (VVA Saracens)
    15. Vasily Artemyev (Krasny Yar)

    16. Vladislav Korshunov (VVA Saracens)
    17. Andrey Igretsov (Slava-CSP)
    18. Andrey Ostrikov (Sale Sharks)
    19. Pavel Butenko (Enisey-STM)
    20. Ramil Gaisin (Enisey-STM)
    21. Rushan Yagudin (Krasny Yar)
    22. Denis Simplikevich (Enisey-STM)


  • #221
    CatFromHue
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 18,217 Mod ✭✭✭✭CatFromHue


    Ouch London Welsh went down 10-46 at home to Gloucester tonight!

    From the 4 games they've played this season they've conceded 46, 46, 52, and 53.

    Ouch!


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  • #222
    OldRio
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,142 ✭✭✭OldRio


    CatFromHue wrote: »
    Ouch London Welsh went down 10-46 at home to Gloucester tonight!

    From the 4 games they've played this season they've conceded 46, 46, 52, and 53.

    Ouch!


    I just have to say this.

    No I shouldn't.

    No easy games in the ............

    No no no.


  • #223
    irishbucsfan
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 37,978 ✭✭✭✭irishbucsfan


    They're an embarrassment really. It just annoys me that they have a team of journeymen and this is all they can achieve. The RFU had it right a few years ago when they denied them their license for promotion, they're clearly nowhere near the standard.


  • #224
    matthew8
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,599 ✭✭✭matthew8


    They played a bit better tonight, probably the better team in the first half. Just had nothing left after 60 minutes. Newcastle will be the litmus test as to just how bad they are in 2 weeks. Bristol had better get promoted this year.

    Despite the scoreline Gloucester looked nothing like the playoff side they aspire to become. They look far off the pace of Exeter and Wasps, the more likely dark horses.


  • #225
    sydneybound
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,557 ✭✭✭sydneybound


    Can't believe the RFU even allowed LW in the prem it should be Bristol in there


  • #226
    irishbucsfan
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 37,978 ✭✭✭✭irishbucsfan


    sydneybound wrote: »
    Can't believe the RFU even allowed LW in the prem it should be Bristol in there

    LW took them to court over it and tied their hands a couple of years back.


  • #227
    Buer
    Registered Users Posts: 24,258 ✭✭✭✭Buer


    sydneybound wrote: »
    Can't believe the RFU even allowed LW in the prem it should be Bristol in there

    John Taylor was on Brian Moore's podcast recently. He's a director with LW these days. He had some interesting comments that gave a bit of insight into their plight.

    Unless a club builds for the long term and has significant money behind them to take the risk, they cannot prepare for the Premiership. It would be a massive risk to sign players ahead of knowing whether you're promoted or not. So, they did not know they were promoted until the start of June at which point they can start signing players for the Premiership.

    As Taylor said, by that point, the bulk of players you'd like to sign are already committed elsewhere. That leaves them with scraps and trying to integrate those guys into the existing squad some of whom are not fully professional.

    Not only that but, oddly, a promoted team receives less cash than the other top flight sides so they don't have a level playing field.

    So, essentially, after a 30 game season, they've a couple of weeks off to sign some players they never really wanted and try to get them down to pre-season and integrate about a dozen signings into the squad ahead of an early September start against sides with far more money and preparation.

    It's simply not feasible for them to hold their own.


  • #228
    Swan Curry
    Registered Users Posts: 1,805 ✭✭✭Swan Curry


    Bristol had their chance and they lost it.Actually,they had two chances and lost both.


  • #229
    Buer
    Registered Users Posts: 24,258 ✭✭✭✭Buer


    Swan Curry wrote: »
    Bristol had their chance and they lost it.Actually,they had two chances and lost both.

    Oh they'll be back. They're owned by a billionaire. They've no such issues aside from gelling and when they do get promoted, I suspect they'll stay there.

    Newcastle Falcons must have been delighted when LW were promoted this year.


  • #230
    irishbucsfan
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 37,978 ✭✭✭✭irishbucsfan


    Buer wrote: »
    It's simply not feasible for them to hold their own.

    It's not feasible for THEM to hold their own because of the standard to which they've been managed. It is feasible for others, Exeter being a good example, to do so. They've made stunningly incompetent decisions over the past few years (the ground move, the financial decisions, their recruiting on and off the field) and it wouldn't be surprising if they end up staring down the barrel of bankruptcy very soon.


  • #231
    Winters
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,761 ✭✭✭✭Winters


    It goes to show that the rugby system in England doesn't assist the development of players as well as other systems do. It's a shame really as it denies the likes if Worchester and Bristol representation.


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  • #232
    irishbucsfan
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 37,978 ✭✭✭✭irishbucsfan


    Winters wrote: »
    It goes to show that the rugby system in England doesn't assist the development of players as well as other systems do.

    How does it show this exactly? I have no idea how LW can be used to reach this conclusion.


  • #233
    Buer
    Registered Users Posts: 24,258 ✭✭✭✭Buer


    irishbucsfan wrote: »
    It's not feasible for THEM to hold their own because of the standard to which they've been managed. It is feasible for others, Exeter being a good example, to do so. They've made stunningly incompetent decisions over the past few years (the ground move, the financial decisions, their recruiting on and off the field) and it wouldn't be surprising if they end up staring down the barrel of bankruptcy very soon.

    You're right. They absolutely have not helped themselves but it is a very difficult position for a side to be promoted and not be relegated within their first couple of seasons. Exeter are a fantastic success story of a very well run club who have scrapped their way to success.

    I think we'll see the same 3 or 4 teams bouncing up and down between the divisions for the foreseeable future though.


  • #234
    English Lurker
    Registered Users Posts: 609 ✭✭✭English Lurker


    Buer wrote: »
    You're right. They absolutely have not helped themselves but it is a very difficult position for a side to be promoted and not be relegated within their first couple of seasons. Exeter are a fantastic success story of a very well run club who have scrapped their way to success.

    I think we'll see the same 3 or 4 teams bouncing up and down between the divisions for the foreseeable future though.

    I think in the last ten seasons of the Premiership, only two teams have gone straight back down; London Welsh and Leeds. In that time, Quins, Exeter, Northampton, Wuss (twice), Newcastle, Bristol and Leeds have all managed to stay up for at least two seasons. Quins, Exeter, Northampton, Bristol and Wuss (once) have all managed stays of more than two seasons. It's not as difficult overall as London Welsh make it seem.

    Of course, there is a huge difference between pretty much all of the clubs listed, with RFU backed academies and 10,000+ stadiums and regular 5k-6k crowds even in the Championship, and London Welsh, who have none of these things. It's not overly surprising London Welsh have a really hard time of it. But going up and staying up is very doable for clubs with the infrastructure behind them.

    The bolded bit is entirely right though. Wuss, Leeds/Yorkshire and Newcastle all fit into a profile where they've got too many resources to not regularly be at the top of the Championship, but not enough to comfortably stay in the Premiership. If London Welsh do manage to include themselves in that company, despite neither having the same level of resources nor the means to easily acquire them, that would be hugely impressive, but I don't expect it to happen.


  • #235
    Winters
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,761 ✭✭✭✭Winters


    irishbucsfan wrote: »
    How does it show this exactly? I have no idea how LW can be used to reach this conclusion.

    I am not going to be drawn into another argument with you, this is just my opinion.

    Bouncing between divisions with such disparity of revenue isn't a sustainable business model. Rugby development needs long term planning and secure regular revenue streams and elite matches to fund the 5+ year development of players and support. It's no surprise New Zealand, Australia and South Africa have been consistently competing at the top for so long. LW bought in 25 or so players this season, if they go down where will those players go? What happened to their Championship winning players? Exeter are an fine example of a good business model built on long term planning and against tough odds. What would happen if they were relegated?


  • #236
    irishbucsfan
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 37,978 ✭✭✭✭irishbucsfan


    Winters wrote: »
    I am not going to be drawn into another argument with you, this is just my opinion.

    Bouncing between divisions with such disparity of revenue isn't a sustainable business model. Rugby development needs long term planning and secure regular revenue streams and elite matches to fund the 5+ year development of players and support. It's no surprise New Zealand, Australia and South Africa have been consistently competing at the top for so long. LW bought in 25 or so players this season, if they go down where will those players go? What happened to their Championship winning players? Exeter are an fine example of a good business model built on long term planning and against tough odds. What would happen if they were relegated?

    Exeter are a fine example of exactly why saying:

    "It goes to show that the rugby system in England doesn't assist the development of players as well as other systems do."

    Makes no sense. I don't know why it needs to turn into a competition for people really, the English system is clearly capable of developing players perfectly well.

    Trying to use London Welsh as an example of why English rugby is incapable of developing players is extremely puzzling. Their decision to jettison their Championship winning squad was not forced upon them by English rugby, it was forced upon them by terrible management. Their decision to move to Oxford was not forced upon them by the English rugby system (in fact it was actively discouraged by it) it was again forced upon them by poor management.

    Trying to use London Welsh as an example of why English rugby doesn't develop players is like try to use Carlow RFC as an example of why Irish rugby doesn't develop players. It doesn't make sense really, it just comes across as opportunistic. The long term planning and secure regular revenue streams that you're talking about are all available in English rugby to full member clubs of PRL.


    Also, relegation is employed in South Africa, New Zealand, Australia and even Ireland. It is also used by South Africa at Super Rugby level. So don't really know what you're talking about there...


  • #237
    matthew8
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,599 ✭✭✭matthew8


    Northampton playing Bath now. Should be an absolute cracker.


  • #238
    errlloyd
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,616 ✭✭✭✭errlloyd


    matthew8 wrote: »
    Northampton playing Bath now. Should be an absolute cracker.

    Great game so far.


  • #239
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    http://www.ulsterrugby.com/News/LatestNews/TabId/149/ArtMID/793/ArticleID/1870/Paddy-Jacksons-Blog.aspx


  • #240
    sydneybound
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,557 ✭✭✭sydneybound


    Buer wrote: »
    John Taylor was on Brian Moore's podcast recently. He's a director with LW these days. He had some interesting comments that gave a bit of insight into their plight.

    Unless a club builds for the long term and has significant money behind them to take the risk, they cannot prepare for the Premiership. It would be a massive risk to sign players ahead of knowing whether you're promoted or not. So, they did not know they were promoted until the start of June at which point they can start signing players for the Premiership.

    As Taylor said, by that point, the bulk of players you'd like to sign are already committed elsewhere. That leaves them with scraps and trying to integrate those guys into the existing squad some of whom are not fully professional.

    Not only that but, oddly, a promoted team receives less cash than the other top flight sides so they don't have a level playing field.

    So, essentially, after a 30 game season, they've a couple of weeks off to sign some players they never really wanted and try to get them down to pre-season and integrate about a dozen signings into the squad ahead of an early September start against sides with far more money and preparation.

    It's simply not feasible for them to hold their own.

    Funnily enough I did listen to that podcast of Brian Moore's and heard John Taylor speak about his time as chief executive at LW.

    He said it cost around 2 million to run a championship side and more like 8/9 to run a premiership team. He also stated the difficulties of signing top players. 

    At the end of the day Bristol should have gone up and if they did I'd say they would have strengthened even further and stayed up while Newcastle would have been relegated. On a seperate note Bristol is a great rugby town.

    Believe it or not many in England want Leeds, or Yorkshire as they are called now, to go up as its a part of the UK which has a great rugby academy producing good players and is an area not represented well enough in the prem. Also they could tap into some rugby league fans.

    On a side note Brian Moore's show must be the best rugby chat show in the UK & Ire on either TV or radio. Regardless if you don't like him his topics and guests every week are top class.


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  • #241
    CatFromHue
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 18,217 Mod ✭✭✭✭CatFromHue


    Deleted User wrote: »
    http://www.ulsterrugby.com/News/LatestNews/TabId/149/ArtMID/793/ArticleID/1870/Paddy-Jacksons-Blog.aspx

    That's gas!


  • #242
    Buer
    Registered Users Posts: 24,258 ✭✭✭✭Buer


    Absolutely, I enjoy going for a stroll on Monday, laughing at whatever comes from Jackman's mouth on Newstalk (seriously, he's Hook in waiting in terms of knowledge of facts) and then listening to Moore's podcast. Some very insightful discussion and a great round up of the Premiership.

    Then they have Jackman on to discuss the Pro12. You just can't win, sometimes.


  • #243
    sydneybound
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,557 ✭✭✭sydneybound


    Buer wrote: »
    Absolutely, I enjoy going for a stroll on Monday, laughing at whatever comes from Jackman's mouth on Newstalk (seriously, he's Hook in waiting in terms of knowledge of facts) and then listening to Moore's podcast. Some very insightful discussion and a great round up of the Premiership.

    Then they have Jackman on to discuss the Pro12. You just can't win, sometimes.

    The Brian Moore podcast is my Monday morning listening. Relly like when Nigel Owens comes on plus the last three weeks they had John Taylor, Nick Evans and James Haskell as special guests. Each quite different but all extremely interesting. Brian is doing a big push for women's rugby on the show too.


  • #244
    Buer
    Registered Users Posts: 24,258 ✭✭✭✭Buer


    Deleted User wrote: »
    http://www.ulsterrugby.com/News/LatestNews/TabId/149/ArtMID/793/ArticleID/1870/Paddy-Jacksons-Blog.aspx

    Some brilliant stuff. He's not lacking in confidence, is young Patrick.


  • #245
    matthew8
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,599 ✭✭✭matthew8


    Northampton doing their best to bottle it. Austin Healey doing his best to take Bath's side in everything.


  • #246
    matthew8
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,599 ✭✭✭matthew8


    Simply incredible from Hartley, 3 Bath men over the line and he holds it up. Match won but they've bottled my handicap. Great win missing Lawes and Wood but Bath look like the real deal.


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  • #247
    The Lost Sheep
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,967 ✭✭✭✭The Lost Sheep


    Russia beat Uruguay 22-21 in first leg of world cup qualifier. Second leg in 2 weeks time in Uruguay who're probably favourites to qualify after that result


  • #248
    croket
    Registered Users Posts: 251 ✭✭croket


    European Challenge cup :
    Femi-CZ Rugby Rovigo and Bucharest Wolves have secured places in the 2014/15 European Rugby Challenge Cup following today's second leg matches in the qualifiying play-offs.
    Second legs

    At Lokomotivi Stadium: Tbilisi Caucasians 21 (L Khmaladze 2 tries, conversion; B Gogishvili try, B Tsiklauri 2 conversions) Femi-CZ Rugby Rovigo 24 (S Basson 3 penalties, conversion, drop goal; B Ngawini, A De Marchi tries)

    (Aggregate result: Femi-CZ Rugby Rovigo 46 Tbilisi Caucasians 39)

    At Peroni Stadium: Cammi Rugby Calvisano 13 (B Seymour 2 penalties, conversion; R Ambrosio try) Bucharest Wolves 10 (S Morrell try, L Samoa penalty, conversion)

    (Aggregate result: Bucharest Wolves 28 Cammi Rugby Calvisano 26)

    The following are the confirmed pools for the 2014/15 European Rugby Challenge Cup:

    Pool 1: Cardiff Blues, London Irish, Grenoble, Femi-CZ Rugby Rovigo
    Pool 2: Exeter Chiefs, Bayonne, Connacht Rugby, La Rochelle
    Pool 3: Stade Francais Paris, Newport Gwent Dragons, Newcastle Falcons, Bucharest Wolves
    Pool 4: Edinburgh Rugby, Bordeaux-Begles, London Welsh, Lyon
    Pool 5: Gloucester Rugby, Brive, Zebre, Oyonnax


  • #249
    CatFromHue
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 18,217 Mod ✭✭✭✭CatFromHue


    Exeter could win this.

    No drop downs from the ERC into the QF's so this would be a good chance for Connacht to get into the knock outs.

    Bayonne are 3 from 7 and La Rochelle 2 from 7 in the Top 14, Exeter are 3 from 4.


  • #250
    English Lurker
    Registered Users Posts: 609 ✭✭✭English Lurker


    Pool 1 looks a stinker. Grenoble started the season strong from the looks of it, Cardiff and LI decent teams as well. Pool 5 slightly hard to pick the other way. Exeter, Stade and Bordeaux would be the odds on to win their pools.


  • #251
    errlloyd
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,616 ✭✭✭✭errlloyd


    Twickenham have been approached by Chelsea FC to use the Stadium for the 2016-2017 season apparently.

    I did occur to me today as slightly mad that Twickers only hosts a handful of games a years. (Like 6 England games, a Barbarians Game, Army v Navy and I guess about 5 club games).

    Anyway, it'd be good money for the RFU.


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