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Golfgate: Multiple public figures breach COVID-19 restrictions

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    #92
    Dual wheels
    Registered Users Posts: 711 ✭✭✭Dual wheels


    People talking about Mairead McGuinness as the next commissioner, surely that’s a step down from first VP of parliament? Bearing in mind there’s no guarantee she would get the trade post?


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    #93
    L1011
    Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 67,829 Mod ✭✭✭✭L1011


    Bellview wrote: »
    Did the social democratic and Sinn Fein councillors resign from their council seats Who like hogan broke the quarantine rules or is there one rule For hogan and another for the councillors .. especially as both parties have been preaching a lot recently

    SD councillor in Kildare has been suspended for 6 months at least.


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    #94
    Bellview
    Registered Users Posts: 2,678 ✭✭✭Bellview


    L1011 wrote: »
    SD councillor in Kildare has been suspended for 6 months at least.

    why not resign like Hogan and pack in the job.. if Roisin Shorthall wants to preach then the councillor needs to go off the council not a SF type joke suspension.. he is a copy exact of Hogan, he took a test was negative and moved within the 14 days.. so he should go and get the same publicity as Hogan & Co


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    #95
    Sam Russell
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 19,406 Mod ✭✭✭✭Sam Russell


    Bellview wrote: »
    why not resign like Hogan and pack in the job.. if Roisin Shorthall wants to preach then the councillor needs to go off the council not a SF type joke suspension.. he is a copy exact of Hogan, he took a test was negative and moved within the 14 days.. so he should go and get the same publicity as Hogan & Co

    Hogan took 9 attempts to explain himself - each one slightly worse, including a matter the Gardai were involved in.

    How many did the councillor require?


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    #96
    FrancieBrady
    Registered Users Posts: 67,049 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    Sam Russell wrote: »
    Hogan took 9 attempts to explain himself - each one slightly worse, including a matter the Gardai were involved in.

    How many did the councillor require?

    Why sugar coat it? Hogan lied to his boss and had to be more or less told to think again and tell the truth and the whole truth next time. That is why he lost his job. His own doing.


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    #97
    looksee
    Registered Users Posts: 28,112 ✭✭✭✭looksee


    And it was not the Irish government that sacked him, specificially not the government. The decision came from Brussels and any pushing by the government was more likely to save him his job than lose it, so that the EU Commission could be seen not to be bowing to governments.


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    #98
    L1011
    Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 67,829 Mod ✭✭✭✭L1011


    Kenny Egan (FG) has been suspended for a breach of quarantine rules also


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    #99
    WishUWereHere
    Registered Users Posts: 2,285 ✭✭✭WishUWereHere


    Wonder who the limelight will turn to next?

    The supreme judge or Hayes? I think Hayes has got off lightly so far. I also would love to know who else was at that function.


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    #100
    Sam Russell
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 19,406 Mod ✭✭✭✭Sam Russell


    WishUWereHere wrote: »
    Wonder who the limelight will turn to next?

    The supreme judge or Hayes? I think Hayes has got off lightly so far. I also would love to know who else was at that function.

    The supreme court judge has to go.

    He should not have been at such a do even in normal times. It was a political do, and with the 'separation of powers' precluding such hobnobbing for supreme court judges to be mixing in political circles, he must go.

    For example, the President has to be extremely careful of where he goes and who he meets, at all times. He must be above reproach at all times. The same applies to supreme court judges. How would it be if he was a judge on a political matter involving parties who attended such a shindig? Would there be calls for him to recuse himself?

    As for Hayes, he is a lobbyist and that is what lobbyists do.


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    #101
    L1011
    Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 67,829 Mod ✭✭✭✭L1011


    Cole wrote: »
    A very interesting interview with Clare Daly on Prime Time tonight re. the whole Phil Hogan matter. The one person I thought would be leading the charge against him and twisting the knife after his resignation, was more or less suggesting he'd been hard done by. Especially given that EU policy is that MEPs can avoid quarantines due to regular testing, according to Daly.

    Forgot to reply at the time, but her saying this meant it was obvious that Daly or Wallace broke the rules. She would have joined the dogpile otherwise

    Wallace is refusing to answer questions about whether he quarantined before coming back for a FAI board meeting at the start of the month as per the Times today


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    #102
    Bellview
    Registered Users Posts: 2,678 ✭✭✭Bellview


    Sam Russell wrote: »
    Hogan took 9 attempts to explain himself - each one slightly worse, including a matter the Gardai were involved in.

    How many did the councillor require?

    not condoning hogan but if the poicy is people need to resign the those that compain need to do the same... min for ag went, hunt is on for the judge so if alan, Mary lou & Rosiin want to preach let them kick their offenders off the council not joke suspensions


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    #103
    Sam Russell
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 19,406 Mod ✭✭✭✭Sam Russell


    Bellview wrote: »
    not condoning hogan but if the poicy is people need to resign the those that compain need to do the same... min for ag went, hunt is on for the judge so if alan, Mary lou & Rosiin want to preach let them kick their offenders off the council not joke suspensions

    Mary Lou attended a funeral in Belfast at least as contrary t Covid regulations as the Golf shindig, along with many of her long travelling party councillors.

    Of course no resignations from that quarter.


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    #104
    McMurphy
    Registered Users Posts: 13,365 ✭✭✭✭McMurphy


    Sam Russell wrote: »
    Mary Lou attended a funeral in Belfast at least as contrary t Covid regulations as the Golf shindig, along with many of her long travelling party councillors.

    Of course no resignations from that quarter.

    So too did Charlie Flanagan, Michael Ring and Frank Feighan among many members of AGS to Garda Horkans funeral, many of which could be seen breaking the social distancing guidelines.

    Have you been calling for resignations there?

    Neither those in attendance at Garda Horkans funeral or that of Bobby Storey's funerals actions were comparable with Hogan's tbh.


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    #105
    Sam Russell
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 19,406 Mod ✭✭✭✭Sam Russell


    McMurphy wrote: »
    So too did Charlie Flanagan, Michael Ring and Frank Feighan among many members of AGS to Garda Horkans funeral, many of which could be seen breaking the social distancing guidelines.

    Have you been calling for resignations there?

    Neither those in attendance at Garda Horkans funeral or that of Bobby Storey's funerals actions were comparable with Hogan's tbh.

    The only resignation I am calling for is that of the supreme court judge - not because of Covid, but for attending an inappropriate political rally.


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    #106
    Cole
    Registered Users Posts: 1,491 ✭✭✭Cole


    The more I hear and read about the whole Phil Hogan/new commissioner issue, the more I think the government have made an absolute mess of this...taken a double barrelled shotgun and blown off both feet.


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    #107
    Hermy
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 11,313 Mod ✭✭✭✭Hermy


    This is all Phil Hogan's doing.

    He ignored the restrictions and when he was caught he was incapable of showing a bit of contrition.

    Genealogy Forum Mod



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    #108
    Sam Russell
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 19,406 Mod ✭✭✭✭Sam Russell


    Hermy wrote: »
    This is all Phil Hogan's doing.

    He ignored the restrictions and when he was caught he was incapable of showing a bit of contrition.

    That is true.

    But the Gov, or more so, the Taoiseach should have killed it from its first appearance. He should have declared that P. Hogan is an EU Commissioner and answerable only to the EU Commission, not the Irish Government - end of.

    He should then have announced his actions against the Gov side, and what sanctions he would impose. He could have suggested that all those attending make a contribution to a suitable charity (of say €1,000 per head - I am sure the outing cost in that order).

    But that would be leadership.


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    #109
    Good loser
    Registered Users Posts: 3,181 ✭✭✭Good loser


    I see the Farmer's Journal this week has 22 letters condemning the outing of Phil Hogan from his EU position. None supporting the Govt action.
    The details within some of the letters outlining the breadth and depth of his outstanding contributions were a revelation to me.

    Such as


    'Everytime I visited the EU Commission in recent years, I was struck by the high esteem in which he is held'


    'He was seen as a forceful, effective, intelligent and no-nonsense Commr, who got things done'

    'Always equipped with a common touch, coupled with an amazing intellect and unique understanding of the challenges for farmers and small food businesses, he has served our industry and Ireland exceptionally well.'

    'Writing as president of the German Irish Council in Berlin to express the dismay that I have heard from numerous German politicians since the witch hunt of Phil Hogan that has removed a brilliant negotiator and a respected heavy hitter that achieved so much for Europe.'


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    #110
    Cole
    Registered Users Posts: 1,491 ✭✭✭Cole


    L1011 wrote: »
    Its exceptionally unlikely they'll reshuffle the Commission so we'll still have Trade.
    Cole wrote: »
    I hope you're right.

    Mairead McGuinness and Andrew McDowell...we've clearly lost trade.


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    #111
    Larbre34
    Registered Users Posts: 23,841 ✭✭✭✭Larbre34


    Cole wrote: »
    Mairead McGuinness and Andrew McDowell...we've clearly lost trade.

    Ursula van der Leyen likely sees McGuinness as one of Europe's biggest hitters and a Godsend to even out her 50/50 gender Commission. I wouldn't write off Trade yet by a long shot.

    A week ago I said the best thing to do would be to nominate McGuinness and a male stooge to take one for the team. Andrew McDowell is that person. No eejit by any means, but he is not political and not well known, so there is no public ego to bruise.

    Mairead McGuinness is going to finish her 5 years in the Commission in mid 2025 and she will succeed Michael D as Uachtaráin na hÉireann in November of that year. Get onto Paddy Power now.


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    #112
    Sam Russell
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 19,406 Mod ✭✭✭✭Sam Russell


    Sam Russell wrote: »
    Mairead McGuinness

    I should have gone down to Paddy Power myself. (That post was 23rd Aug)


    She will do well if she gets it.


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    #113
    Cole
    Registered Users Posts: 1,491 ✭✭✭Cole


    Larbre34 wrote: »
    Ursula van der Leyen likely sees McGuinness as one of Europe's biggest hitters and a Godsend to even out her 50/50 gender Commission. I wouldn't write off Trade yet by a long shot.

    A week ago I said the best thing to do would be to nominate McGuinness and a male stooge to take one for the team. Andrew McDowell is that person. No eejit by any means, but he is not political and not well known, so there is no public ego to bruise.

    Yeah...you could be right...I hope so. I'm no expert (who is), but a lot of the analysis I've heard suggests it's likely that we've lost Trade. My sense of it is that Coveney withdrew because he knows a lesser portfolio will be given to Ireland. But maybe it's that Trade is still ours if we send Mairead.


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    #114
    L1011
    Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 67,829 Mod ✭✭✭✭L1011


    Larbre34 wrote: »

    Mairead McGuinness is going to finish her 5 years in the Commission in mid 2025 and she will succeed Michael D as Uachtaráin na hÉireann in November of that year. Get onto Paddy Power now.

    She (assuming UvdL doesn't pick the bloke) gets the remainder of Hogan's term; so May 2024.


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    #115
    L1011
    Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 67,829 Mod ✭✭✭✭L1011


    Cole wrote: »
    Mairead McGuinness and Andrew McDowell...we've clearly lost trade.

    Yep. Wouldn't call her a donkey as I said we'd need to send to lose it but she was not the right female candidate to retain it - Day was

    One of the finance portfolios so not one of the paperclip management nonsense ones


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    #116
    Cole
    Registered Users Posts: 1,491 ✭✭✭Cole


    L1011 wrote: »
    One of the finance portfolios so not one of the paperclip management nonsense ones

    I'm not knowledgeable enough about these portfolios to assess if it's influential or not, but I presume we can all agree that losing Trade is a big blow to us.

    Fair enough that Phil Hogan made incredibly poor judgements/broke the rules/was slow to apologise/arrogant etc. But the government should have pulled out all the stops to help sort that mess out, rather than push the in the opposite direction. Well done Micheal, Leo and Eamon for showing us all how upstanding and principled you all are.

    Any damage caused by Phil Hogan is likely to be far outdone by the loss of the Trade portfolio imo.


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    #117
    expectationlost
    Registered Users Posts: 11,769 ✭✭✭✭expectationlost


    Former Fianna Fáil TD Donie Cassidy and Independent TD Noel Grealish are to be charged with breaches of Covid-19 regulations for allegedly organisng the #Golfgate dinner. https://www.independent.ie/news/two-politicians-to-be-prosecuted-for-golfgate-dinner-40102766.html

    and two of the hotel employees as well but its confusingly vague about them


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    #118
    newman10
    Registered Users Posts: 975 ✭✭✭newman10


    expectationlost wrote: »
    Former Fianna Fáil TD Donie Cassidy and Independent TD Noel Grealish are to be charged with breaches of Covid-19 regulations for allegedly organisng the #Golfgate dinner. https://www.independent.ie/news/two-politicians-to-be-prosecuted-for-golfgate-dinner-40102766.html

    and two of the hotel employees as well but its confusingly vague about them

    Should all attendees not be charged ?


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    #119
    expectationlost
    Registered Users Posts: 11,769 ✭✭✭✭expectationlost


    newman10 wrote: »
    Should all attendees not be charged ?
    its the organisers who are being charged, don't think there were laws relating to attendance at the time


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    #120
    Larbre34
    Registered Users Posts: 23,841 ✭✭✭✭Larbre34


    newman10 wrote: »
    Should all attendees not be charged ?

    No.

    Giving the benefit of the doubt to some of them, as an ordinary golf society member, you would reasonably expect the committee and the hotel to have addressed any Covid protocol issues.

    The right people are being prosecuted in my opinion.


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    #121
    Sam Russell
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 19,406 Mod ✭✭✭✭Sam Russell


    Larbre34 wrote: »
    No.

    Giving the benefit of the doubt to some of them, as an ordinary golf society member, you would reasonably expect the committee and the hotel to have addressed any Covid protocol issues.

    The right people are being prosecuted in my opinion.

    Let us hope they do not pursue an appeal as far as the Supreme Court.


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