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Veterinary medicine

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  • 28-06-2016 11:38am
    #1
    Tiacorrigan
    Registered Users Posts: 2 ✭


    I want to study veterinary medicine but I didn't do chemistry. I was going to go the graduate entry route but €19,500 p/a in UCD would be extremely difficult to pay! I was wondering does anyone have any information on studying veterinary medicine abroad as a post graduate and what under graduate course should you study?
    Any information or advice would be deeply appreciated!


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    #2
    LSP
    Registered Users Posts: 100 ✭✭LSP


    Hi, I'm starting graduate entry vet this september. I studied Zoology in Trinity at undergrad, but with any biological degree you are eligible for graduate entry courses. Budapest and Kosice in Slovakia are popular places to study vet for Irish students, you don't need to wait till after your undergrad as you can take an entry test to get in once you finish school. Kosice is ~7,500 a year (and is 4 years), Budapest is ~10,000 a year (And is 5.5 years). Word of caution though, Kosice lost its EAEVE accreditation this year, which used to mean nothing as EU allows free movement of labour, but with the UK out now that could mean that EU degrees will not be accepted to practice there unless they sit board exams, if working in the UK was in your future plans. The UK may use EAEVE accreditation instead in the future to decide whether you can practice there without boards, or all EU degree holders may be required to sit boards, so it's important to keep this in mind. I'd be very surprised if they don't allow free movement of vets to practice between UK and Ireland though so UCD is a much safer bet, although I know it's expensive.
    Your other option is to apply to UK but that requires lots of extra work experience and some are also very expensive. Also now I don't know what will happen whether UK vets will be able to register in Ireland since at the moment all non-EU vets must sit boards here to practice in Ireland, and by the time you graduate it looks like UK won't be EU, so....


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    #3
    Tiacorrigan
    Registered Users Posts: 2 ✭Tiacorrigan


    LSP wrote: »
    Hi, I'm starting graduate entry vet this september. I studied Zoology in Trinity at undergrad, but with any biological degree you are eligible for graduate entry courses. Budapest and Kosice in Slovakia are popular places to study vet for Irish students, you don't need to wait till after your undergrad as you can take an entry test to get in once you finish school. Kosice is ~7,500 a year (and is 4 years), Budapest is ~10,000 a year (And is 5.5 years). Word of caution though, Kosice lost its EAEVE accreditation this year, which used to mean nothing as EU allows free movement of labour, but with the UK out now that could mean that EU degrees will not be accepted to practice there unless they sit board exams, if working in the UK was in your future plans. The UK may use EAEVE accreditation instead in the future to decide whether you can practice there without boards, or all EU degree holders may be required to sit boards, so it's important to keep this in mind. I'd be very surprised if they don't allow free movement of vets to practice between UK and Ireland though so UCD is a much safer bet, although I know it's expensive.
    Your other option is to apply to UK but that requires lots of extra work experience and some are also very expensive. Also now I don't know what will happen whether UK vets will be able to register in Ireland since at the moment all non-EU vets must sit boards here to practice in Ireland, and by the time you graduate it looks like UK won't be EU, so....

    Thanks for your help! Can you go straight to Budapest from LC? I didn't do biology or chemistry...


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    #4
    LSP
    Registered Users Posts: 100 ✭✭LSP


    Tiacorrigan wrote: »
    Thanks for your help! Can you go straight to Budapest from LC? I didn't do biology or chemistry...

    I'm not totally sure actually, on their site it says if you have Chem and bio high scores you can skip the entrance exam. But it doesn't say that you need a leaving cert with Chem or bio. However you'd have to sit their entrance exam which has Chem and bio on it, so you would have to study them anyway unofficially. I would give them an email and ask, look up szent istvan university for more info. I think applications may be closed for this year, they wanted me to pay a deposit to secure my place ages ago.


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    #5
    kiwi27
    Registered Users Posts: 9 ✭kiwi27


    Hi OP, firstly good luck to you, I hope you find yourself in veterinary med someday! I am in UCD doing undergrad vet med myself, and we were told that going abroad to Budapest or to Poland for example to do the course has some repercussions. One being you aren't qualified to work in as many places as you can with an Irish degree. I know UCD is probably not where you will end up seeing as post grad fees are crazy but just make sure you research the degree in other countries before committing to it. Some are not the same. I do unfortunately feel as though most countries will require chemistry, and it would be a good idea to maybe sit the chem LC exam as an external candidate and get a good grade.

    Alternatively you could do biology and chemistry in the LC. As in just sit those two subjects and get the minimum grade requirements in both and then apply to UCD through the CAO. That would only work if you got the points in your other LC though of course, but just an idea in case you hadn't thought of it.

    Either way, if vet is what you really want, do what you have to do to get there. It's an amazing course, it is hard work but it is very enjoyable!


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    #6
    omicron
    Registered Users Posts: 818 ✭✭✭omicron


    Tiacorrigan wrote: »
    I want to study veterinary medicine but I didn't do chemistry. I was going to go the graduate entry route but €19,500 p/a in UCD would be extremely difficult to pay! I was wondering does anyone have any information on studying veterinary medicine abroad as a post graduate and what under graduate course should you study?
    Any information or advice would be deeply appreciated!

    If you've just done the leaving cert and have the points but no Chemistry, the easiest way by far of getting veterinary will be to repeat the leaving cert. It's a short time in the long run of things, won't ave any significant cost and you won't be out of place, half the UCD course repeat to get in.

    Tiacorrigan wrote: »
    Thanks for your help! Can you go straight to Budapest from LC? I didn't do biology or chemistry...

    You can go straight to Budapest without biology or chemistry but you have to pass an entrance exam (which you'd find tough without those subjects) and you have to pay roughly €10k in fees per year for 5.5 years. Either way, I'm fairly sure you've missed the deadline for applications.

    You can also go to Warsaw, similar enough circumstances to Budapest as far as I know, although it may be tougher get jobs in Ireland as it has less of a proven record than Budapest.


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    #7
    deisedays
    Closed Accounts Posts: 30 ✭deisedays


    Stay a mile away
    It's a dud career
    Low pay long hours no job security you'd get better opportunuties working for a fast food chain or major supermarket
    Don't be a fooleejit apply for some other course
    As for leaving the country to study veterinary medicine. The mind boggles. There must be something else you could do as a career


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    #8
    rianmcentee
    Registered Users Posts: 4 ✭rianmcentee


    Hi Tia, I'm studying veterinary medicine in Budapest atm. The entrance exam is held at the end of May in Dublin. You can gain entry to the college by applying through your university results (I studied animal science in UCD and this is how I go into it) To do the entrance exam you need a good understanding of both biology and chemistry. However I would recommend going to college for a year before heading to Budapest as the course is extremely difficult and partying is kept to a minimum. ALSO please don't listen to duds on this forum saying Budapest hasn't a proven track record and it's harder to find a job in Ireland because of it. The university has been open for 120 years, I think they know what they're at. And you can practice in America without having to do an entrance exam, unlike UCD.


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    #9
    deisedays
    Closed Accounts Posts: 30 ✭deisedays


    rianmcentee wrote: »
    Hi Tia, I'm studying veterinary medicine in Budapest atm. The entrance exam is held at the end of May in Dublin. You can gain entry to the college by applying through your university results (I studied animal science in UCD and this is how I go into it) To do the entrance exam you need a good understanding of both biology and chemistry. However I would recommend going to college for a year before heading to Budapest as the course is extremely difficult and partying is kept to a minimum. ALSO please don't listen to duds on this forum saying Budapest hasn't a proven track record and it's harder to find a job in Ireland because of it. The university has been open for 120 years, I think they know what they're at. And you can practice in America without having to do an entrance exam, unlike UCD.

    Budapest and other colleges are for dud students who could not make the grade to gain entry to the Vet School in UCD. A home for rich kids who can't accept that they don't have what it takes, academically, to become a vet. Instead they buy their degree abroad. All these people have done is lower the standards of the veterinary profession and drag salary levels down to that of the dole by flooding the market with vets.
    I wouldn't bring my dog to anybody other than an MVB degree holder in Ireland. Ucd are the only quality vet college and I wouldn't trust grads from elsewhere bar good UK or US school


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    #10
    omicron
    Registered Users Posts: 818 ✭✭✭omicron


    rianmcentee wrote: »
    And you can practice in America without having to do an entrance exam, unlike UCD.

    Budapest is not affiliated with the AVMA so you cannot practice in America. UCD is one of a small number of European colleges that is affiliated with the AVMA so you can practice in America by doing the NAVLE exam, the same exam all American colleges have to sit.


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    #11
    deisedays
    Closed Accounts Posts: 30 ✭deisedays


    omicron wrote: »
    Budapest is not affiliated with the AVMA so you cannot practice in America. UCD is one of a small number of European colleges that is affiliated with the AVMA so you can practice in America by doing the NAVLE exam, the same exam all American colleges have to sit.[/quote

    second rate students and second rate degree course. Agree


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    #12
    LSP
    Registered Users Posts: 100 ✭✭LSP


    omicron wrote: »
    Budapest is not affiliated with the AVMA so you cannot practice in America. UCD is one of a small number of European colleges that is affiliated with the AVMA so you can practice in America by doing the NAVLE exam, the same exam all American colleges have to sit.

    This is true - Budapest is not AVMA accredited and UCD is, but apparently they are looking to gain accreditation this year

    Even though I am going to UCD to do grad entry veterinary I don't consider Budapest to be 'lesser' so don't let anyone get you down on this. Even in my interview for UCD they noted that many capable candidates just don't make it after the LC simply because there are not enough places, even if academically they would have no problem. I myself got 550 points in my LC without the extra maths points crap (1 A1, 5 A2s) and that was not enough to study veterinary at UCD after my LC, but with the HPAT it would have been enough for human medicine so anyone saying you're not good enough to be a vet just because you didn't get the frankly ridiculous points for UCD is off their rocker. Instead I did a science degree first and applied for grad entry, and while I got in it's crazy expensive (almost 20k a year) and unfortunately for many it won't be an option, so those people are left with no option but to go abroad even if they would be capable of studying at UCD.

    There are many employers who are open minded and will see a student who has gone abroad as determined, strong willed and passionate enough to go far away to study veterinary. I know of several vets who have graduated from both Kosice and Budapest and had a job immediately after graduation; and one previous grad of Kosice who had opened her own practice only after 2 years which is amazing.

    It is an incredibly hard degree no matter where you study, and if you've researched it and have a passion for veterinary and are ready for the long hours of studying, don't let others get you down about where you end up doing it.


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    #13
    deisedays
    Closed Accounts Posts: 30 ✭deisedays


    LSP wrote: »
    This is true - Budapest is not AVMA accredited and UCD is, but apparently they are looking to gain accreditation this year

    Even though I am going to UCD to do grad entry veterinary I don't consider Budapest to be 'lesser' so don't let anyone get you down on this. Even in my interview for UCD they noted that many capable candidates just don't make it after the LC simply because there are not enough places, even if academically they would have no problem. I myself got 550 points in my LC without the extra maths points crap (1 A1, 5 A2s) and that was not enough to study veterinary at UCD after my LC, but with the HPAT it would have been enough for human medicine so anyone saying you're not good enough to be a vet just because you didn't get the frankly ridiculous points for UCD is off their rocker. Instead I did a science degree first and applied for grad entry, and while I got in it's crazy expensive (almost 20k a year) and unfortunately for many it won't be an option, so those people are left with no option but to go abroad even if they would be capable of studying at UCD.

    There are many employers who are open minded and will see a student who has gone abroad as determined, strong willed and passionate enough to go far away to study veterinary. I know of several vets who have graduated from both Kosice and Budapest and had a job immediately after graduation; and one previous grad of Kosice who had opened her own practice only after 2 years which is amazing.

    It is an incredibly hard degree no matter where you study, and if you've researched it and have a passion for veterinary and are ready for the long hours of studying, don't let others get you down about where you end up doing it.

    If you can't make the grade for UCD you're not good enough period. Of course employers will give job to overseas grads- they will work for peanuts- what employer wouldn't love that ???
    The points for Ucd reflect the high standards in that vet school. They make no apologies for that. Division 2 players can go elsewhere to get a game


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    #14
    LSP
    Registered Users Posts: 100 ✭✭LSP


    deisedays wrote: »
    If you can't make the grade for UCD you're not good enough period. Of course employers will give job to overseas grads- they will work for peanuts- what employer wouldn't love that ???
    The points for Ucd reflect the high standards in that vet school. They make no apologies for that. Division 2 players can go elsewhere to get a game

    Um no, they reflect the lack of places and the demand for the course. That's how the points system works.
    In 2010 I would have had enough points. In 2016? Not a chance. What it takes to be a vet hasn't changed, just the demand and competition is higher and the places are few.
    UCD is a good school but it is the only one on this entire Island and so that makes it even harder to get into than some of the UK schools. It is not the only good vet school out there.
    Also I might add after you get your first job after graduation no one gives a damn what school you go to they will go off how you did in your last job and if you are a good vet.


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    #15
    omicron
    Registered Users Posts: 818 ✭✭✭omicron


    deisedays wrote: »
    Budapest is not affiliated with the AVMA so you cannot practice in America. UCD is one of a small number of European colleges that is affiliated with the AVMA so you can practice in America by doing the NAVLE exam, the same exam all American colleges have to sit.

    second rate students and second rate degree course. Agree


    I wouldn't say that, AVMA accreditation doesnt mean a huge amount, not having it doesn't make a degree "second rate".
    LSP wrote: »
    Also I might add after you get your first job after graduation no one gives a damn what school you go to they will go off how you did in your last job and if you are a good vet.

    This sums it up exactly, once you've had one job all that matters is how good of a vet you are.


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    #16
    deisedays
    Closed Accounts Posts: 30 ✭deisedays


    I think posters here are refusing to recognise the damage that overseas veterinary grads have done to the profession in Ireland.
    The degree course was always very difficult in UCD. On the other hand, because places were limited, qualified vets could look forward to a decent career which would pay them a good salary and allow them to live comfortably.There were just enough vets for the jobs available. The salary at the time was a reasonable reward for a job that was difficult, had unsocial hours etc etc. Reward for effort and all that....
    Fast forward to 2016. Irish market flooded with vet grads. Salaries rubbish. Profession swamped by vets who have graduated from the University of Far Away in God Knows Where.

    All because some kiddies can't accept they don't pack what it takes to get into UCD Vet School. Ok lads. Head for Budapest or Warsaw or Tibet or wherever vet degrees are being sold .... then come back here and work in a Veterinary McJob for the rest of your life.

    You deserve it of course, seeing as UCD and all those mean Irish vet people refused to recognise your genius and ability as a vet and wouldn't let you in to their club... boohooo

    Who are we codding here??????


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    #17
    spurious
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Education Moderators Posts: 27,130 CMod ✭✭✭✭spurious


    deisedays wrote: »
    The points for Ucd reflect the high standards in that vet school.

    The points for UCD reflect the demand for the course.
    This is not the same thing.

    Not sure why you are so viciously anti a course you yourself are not doing.


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    #18
    deisedays
    Closed Accounts Posts: 30 ✭deisedays


    spurious wrote: »
    The points for UCD reflect the demand for the course.
    This is not the same thing.

    Not sure why you are so viciously anti a course you yourself are not doing.

    Read my post again.
    Overseas grads have ruined the veterinary profession in Ireland
    You obviously don't care, you just want the status of being a vet, without being able to meet the requirements in Ireland.
    McJobs and peanuts pay not an issue for you perhaps?
    Remember that veterinary used to be a way to make a living rather than an ego boost for rich kids to say that they're a vet (even though they wouldn't have made the cut 10 or 20 years ago)
    Best of luck in Eastern Europe


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    #19
    Nessa859
    Registered Users Posts: 13 ✭Nessa859


    I don't know if you're sorted out or not as regards a college place, but I myself am considering applying for grad entry veterinary medicine, hoping to start in 2018. What I'm considering is taking a year to work, save, and build up as much work experience as possible and then apply for courses in Scotland. Edinburgh offers a four year graduate entry programme, which requires you to have a 2:1 or higher in a biology, biochemistry, or animal science degree (I'm in final year zoology in Trinity myself), and relevant work experience. Graduates of this programme are eligible to work in Europe, North America, and Australia. As regards work experience, any work with animals is considered relevant (volunteer in places like animal shelters or zoos, ask your local vet if they'd be willing to let you come in and help clean out cages, feed animals, walk dogs, etc). You aren't eligible for student loans for a second degree (unless you want to do medicine or nursing), so you'll have to fund everything yourself, but ~€2,000 a year is an awful lot better than nearly €20,000 a year. The only problem is that we don't know what the story will be in a year's time because of Brexit. It's entirely possible that fees for EU students could go up.


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    #20
    LSP
    Registered Users Posts: 100 ✭✭LSP


    Nessa859 wrote: »
    I don't know if you're sorted out or not as regards a college place, but I myself am considering applying for grad entry veterinary medicine, hoping to start in 2018. What I'm considering is taking a year to work, save, and build up as much work experience as possible and then apply for courses in Scotland. Edinburgh offers a four year graduate entry programme, which requires you to have a 2:1 or higher in a biology, biochemistry, or animal science degree (I'm in final year zoology in Trinity myself), and relevant work experience. Graduates of this programme are eligible to work in Europe, North America, and Australia. As regards work experience, any work with animals is considered relevant (volunteer in places like animal shelters or zoos, ask your local vet if they'd be willing to let you come in and help clean out cages, feed animals, walk dogs, etc). You aren't eligible for student loans for a second degree (unless you want to do medicine or nursing), so you'll have to fund everything yourself, but ~€2,000 a year is an awful lot better than nearly €20,000 a year. The only problem is that we don't know what the story will be in a year's time because of Brexit. It's entirely possible that fees for EU students could go up.

    Hey, don't know if you're planning on applying to UCD too but if you are give me a shout if you need any help with the application/interview process. I did Zoology in TCD too and am in the grad entry program at UCD. They started interviewing Irish candidates my year which they haven't done before, and seem to put less weight on the GAMSAT which is nice.


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    #21
    abnormalnorman
    Registered Users Posts: 453 ✭✭abnormalnorman


    deisedays wrote: »
    Read my post again.
    Overseas grads have ruined the veterinary profession in Ireland
    You obviously don't care, you just want the status of being a vet, without being able to meet the requirements in Ireland.
    McJobs and peanuts pay not an issue for you perhaps?
    Remember that veterinary used to be a way to make a living rather than an ego boost for rich kids to say that they're a vet (even though they wouldn't have made the cut 10 or 20 years ago)
    Best of luck in Eastern Europe

    reading this thread, and sorry but have to comment on your post deisedays.

    If a kid wants to become a vet, and are willing to pursue their life ambitions , then they are very well entitled to become a vet , one way or an other. Maybe they are not as academic as others, and will be unable to get the 560 points, but may make a better vet then those who are doing it just because they have the academic ability to get the points (possibly just have a photographic memory, and the ability to learn-off and regurgitate what they read). I'm sure many a young person would have made far better vets than some of those who got the high points. And i definitely agree with earlier comment that once the person is given the chance, they will be judged by their veterinary capabilities in the real world, and not on where they got the degree from.

    Are Vets wages / conditions really that bad now? :confused:


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