New Houses Kilcock

highdef · 23-11-2017 1:58pm

Whilst I am with you on this to some extent, I'm trying to read it as the vast majority would read it.

If any other Boardsie's who have seen the flooding (whether or not if it was expected and went as per plans) read the statement, I could be pretty sure that most, if not all will say that the statement "There was no flooding within the Millerstown development" is both untrue and misleading.

I shall bow out of this one as well :P

greg1981 · 23-11-2017 2:09pm

I would be more concerned about the damage that yesterday's and any future flood is gonna cause to the houses and the estate: apart from the park not being used by anyone for extended periods of time, there is a big chance of rats running around the estate putting everyone in danger, the soil being constantly damp which may lead to a house foundations being wet too and that means mouldiness issue inside.
That worries me i have to say..

Graham · 23-11-2017 2:14pm

Given the height above water of the houses I can't imagine the ground would stay particularly wet but you should maybe have a chat with your surveyor if you're worried that damp may be an issue.

Would there be any rats in the vicinity given the entire site has been pretty much completely bulldozed recently?

highdef · 23-11-2017 2:29pm

I agree with Graham. Assuming flood waters don't go much higher and/or reach the houses, I don't think there will be any structural issues to any of the buildings.

As for rats, there are likely to be some about, given that the area is surrounded by open country and rivers/streams. Unlikely to be a big issue, maybe more of them closer to the edges of the estates. As Graham said, the building work will be driving them out of the area and they would only return to some extent, as would be expected.

If you are concerned, get yourself a cat. I live in a fairly rural area and my cat has resulted in me only ever seeing one live mouse. Have seen plenty of dead rats and mice (and some birds too, unfortunately) though.

greg1981 · 23-11-2017 2:30pm

One would think they should be gone but they live in wet areas so again...will have to wait and see

Bristolscale7 · 23-11-2017 2:37pm

brillo pad wrote: »

The housing development is located outside the 1.0 % AEP Fluvial
Event flood zone as identified in the Kilcock FRAMS.

I'm looking at the map on page 81 of the Kilcock Local Area Plan. On the map attached, the estate appears to be in the green flood plain. It's a low resolution map, so perhaps brillo pad you could confirm that the estate is not within the green area on the map. Edit: is the Kilcock FRAMS map different than the one from the Kilcock Local Area Plan?

http://www.kildare.ie/CountyCouncil/Planning/DevelopmentPlans/LocalAreaPlans/KilcockLocalAreaPlan2015-2021/Draft%20Kilcock%20LAP%202015-2021red(1).pdf

listermint · 23-11-2017 2:38pm

Whatever about the ins and outs of protections for this specific estate and predefining its own personal flood plain. It begs the question why we are still building on natural flood plains in the first place. This construction whilst may not impact the individual homes on it, can impact further up or further downstream as the original flood zone is no longer available and has been leveled up to install housing.

This stuff is the insanity that went on 10 years ago, except with higher houses.

Building on flood planes, When will Europe give us a smack around the ear for this stuff.

Graham · 23-11-2017 2:57pm

Bristolscale7 wrote: »

I'm looking at the map on page 81 of the Kilcock Local Area Plan. On the map attached, the estate appears to be in the green flood plain. It's a low resolution map, so perhaps brillo pad you could confirm that the estate is not within the green area on the map.

Would the green flood plain not have changed with the extensive ground works?

Wasn't that the point of the works?

liam7831 · 23-11-2017 3:08pm

PR disaster for the development I wouldn't consider buying one now no matter what the price, disaster waiting to happen as these weather events become more prevalent

Bristolscale7 · 23-11-2017 4:00pm

Graham wrote: »

Would the green flood plain not have changed with the extensive ground works?

Wasn't that the point of the works?

I think the only way to move a flood plain is to move the river but I'm not a limnologist.

highdef · 23-11-2017 4:11pm

I got the An Bord Pleanala report from Meath CoCo. Interesting point 18:

"The areas of public open space shown on the lodged plans shall be reserved for such use and shall be levelled, contoured, soiled, seeded and landscaped in accordance with the detailed requirements of the planning authority. This work shall be completed before any of the dwellings are made available for occupation and shall be maintained as public open space by the developer until taken in charge by the local authority. The delivery of the riverside open space shall be completed in Phase 1 of the proposed development.

Reason: In order to ensure satisfactory development of the public open space areas, and their continued use for this purpose"

The above suggests that the riverside park is just that.....a park. Not a flood channel during times of heavy rain. It's reasonable to assume that there will be many times when many parts of the park will not be accessible as a public open space, despite An Bord Pleannala stating that this must be the case.

http://idocswebdpss.meathcoco.ie/iDocsWebDPSS/ViewFiles.aspx?docid=2008143&format=jpeg - From the planning application. This shows the riverside park as being a public open space, with no mentioned of it being anything but. It would be reasonable that the park could be used at any time by the public and that the park is not DESIGNED to flood.

Would An Bord Pleannala be angry if they found out that the public park that they signed off on is actually a flood channel?

Let's not forget that there is another stream (known in the plans as the "upper ditch") at the back of the current development. This will be towards the back of the overall full development and will be another possible issue. This particular stream is a tributary of the bigger stream that runs parallel to straight section of the Moyglare Road, at the Kilcock end - basically, behind the Millerstown development. Even if the developers do mitigate flooding from this other stream, it will be interesting if it has impacts on the stream alongside the Moyglare Road. A flood storage cell is being built so hopefully that will suffice. From past experience, this does already flood during heavy rains so only time will tell.

listermint · 23-11-2017 5:27pm

I could be mad here but there seems to be missing pages from the 2003 Flood risk study done for Meath CC on Kilcock and the Rye River.

http://www.meath.ie/CountyCouncil/Publications/PlanningPublications/RatoathMunicipalDistrictPlanningPublications/Archives/File,30675,en.pdf

zoning matrix nor the parking study are missing, but the flooding one isnt there.

Bristolscale7 · 23-11-2017 5:36pm

listermint wrote: »

I could be mad here but there seems to be missing pages from the 2003 Flood risk study done for Meath CC on Kilcock and the Rye River.

http://www.meath.ie/CountyCouncil/Publications/PlanningPublications/RatoathMunicipalDistrictPlanningPublications/Archives/File,30675,en.pdf

zoning matrix nor the parking study are missing, but the flooding one isnt there.

That is strange. Appendix 2, the flood study, does appear to be missing.

highdef · 23-11-2017 6:33pm

That is very strange indeed. I might query Meath Co Co about this.

you2008 · 24-11-2017 1:30am

Have a look the 1st video it is insane.
https://m.facebook.com/kilcockcommunitynetwork/

bbbbb1990 · 24-11-2017 12:38pm

highdef wrote: »

That is very strange indeed. I might query Meath Co Co about this.

If you do please update us on what they have to say very strange circumstances.

Davyation · 24-11-2017 1:11pm

I notice that the second last document (a submission by an objector) in the Meath planning page for this site mentions that an inspectors report was overruled by the planning authority (as a new user on boards I'm not allowed to post the link). Meath CC's own inspector appears to have refused permission based on an underestimation of the flood risk, adn this was overruled by the planning board. Whilst this appears to be based on a previous iteration of this current submission, and there may be nothing substantial to it, it may still warrant querying:

Jonting · 24-11-2017 6:58pm

You can now get the Eircode for this estate. I called Axa Home Insurance today with the exact address and before the rep checked, she stated that if it was on a flood plain Axa would not quote. She returned quickly and confirmed it was NOT on a flood plain and they would supply full cover, flood included.

you2008 · 24-11-2017 7:09pm

Jonting wrote: »

You can now get the Eircode for this estate. I called Axa Home Insurance today with the exact address and before the rep checked, she stated that if it was on a flood plain Axa would not quote. She returned quickly and confirmed it was NOT on a flood plain and they would supply full cover, flood included.

and the cover is bout €?

greg1981 · 24-11-2017 7:23pm

Great news that is...

highdef · 24-11-2017 7:55pm

Jonting wrote: »

You can now get the Eircode for this estate. I called Axa Home Insurance today with the exact address and before the rep checked, she stated that if it was on a flood plain Axa would not quote. She returned quickly and confirmed it was NOT on a flood plain and they would supply full cover, flood included.

Brilliant news....delighted to hear this

Jonting · 24-11-2017 7:56pm

you2008 wrote: »

and the cover is bout €?

I honestly don't know if this is cheap or expensive as it will by first time buying home insurance.

€607.28

Bristolscale7 · 24-11-2017 8:36pm

Jonting wrote: »

You can now get the Eircode for this estate. I called Axa Home Insurance today with the exact address and before the rep checked, she stated that if it was on a flood plain Axa would not quote. She returned quickly and confirmed it was NOT on a flood plain and they would supply full cover, flood included.

The computer must be right.

Jonting · 24-11-2017 9:28pm

Bristolscale7 wrote: »

The computer must be right.

The computer being right is what matters so people can get insurance on their homes.

I understand in reality things may change or unforeseen issues could arise but it's one box ticked for now.

Also the opinion of an insurance company, with money on the line, could be considered a fairly valuable opinion.

brillo pad · 25-11-2017 12:03pm

I got refused flood cover through a broker yesterday. 4/5 insurance companies refused cover and the 5th has yet to come back.

ixus · 25-11-2017 12:06pm

Bank of Ireland might cover it. They're backing the development.

Jonting · 26-11-2017 8:10am

brillo pad wrote: »

I got refused flood cover through a broker yesterday. 4/5 insurance companies refused cover and the 5th has yet to come back.

Are you thinking of buying here?

Try Axa insurance? They quoted me.

1890247365

Do you know which companies refused insurance via the broker? I'd like to try call them direct and see what they have to say.

SQ2 · 26-11-2017 9:59pm

It's gently raining this evening... Time to play Millerstown roulette!

Ehrconsulting · 27-11-2017 12:19pm

brillo pad wrote: »

I got refused flood cover through a broker yesterday. 4/5 insurance companies refused cover and the 5th has yet to come back.

Cover available via 123.ie no problem. 500 euro approx for 3 bed semi.

brillo pad · 27-11-2017 12:41pm

You all have cover no problem you say? The insurance companies terms are "is this place at risk of flooding?" Did you all answer No? Axa asked me that question this morning?

You'd want to watch that term of insurance.

Refusals were tgrough:
Zurich
Allianz
MAS
Patrona (patrona have their own flood maps and risk assessment)

Graham · 27-11-2017 12:46pm

brillo pad wrote: »

You all have cover no problem you say? The insurance companies terms are "is this place at risk of flooding?" Did you all answer No? Axa asked me that question this morning?

So you're calling the insurers and saying I'm looking at a house that's at risk of flooding will you cover me?

Your assessment of 'risk of flooding' being based on recent demonstrations that the flood planning has worked and there's nothing to suggest there's any risk to the houses.

Bristolscale7 · 27-11-2017 12:48pm

123.ie specifically makes you agree to the following statement:

The property, including domestic outbuildings:

Has never suffered damage due to flooding.
Is not in an area with a history of flooding.

I'm no solicitor, but point #2 may be relevant?

brillo pad · 27-11-2017 1:23pm

Graham wrote: »

So you're calling the insurers and saying I'm looking at a house that's at risk of flooding will you cover me?

Your assessment of 'risk of flooding' being based on recent demonstrations that the flood planning has worked and there's nothing to suggest there's any risk to the houses.

Did I state those words? The insurance companies are asking me the question. If I answer no. Then my insurance may be null and void. The houses on the front at the right are within 100m of a river and a flood plain. That "riverside park" that's supposed to be fit for purpose before any dwellings are occupied, is a flood defence. That was clearly evident from last week and from the plans it is a flood defence.

Would you buy a house there? Are you buying a house there? Because I am, and am extremely worried and contemplating withdrawing.
After going through a broker and being refused is quite worrying.

Why live in a place that every time it rains you are looking out the window at the play area fill up with water wondering if it will reach your house.

Graham · 27-11-2017 1:33pm

brillo pad wrote: »

Why live in a place that every time it rains you are looking out the window at the play area fill up with water wondering if it will reach your house.

Living next to a river is probably something you should pass on.

brillo pad · 27-11-2017 1:37pm

Graham wrote: »

Living next to a river is probably something you should pass on.

Thanks for your contribution to this thread.

Graham · 27-11-2017 1:41pm

brillo pad wrote: »

Thanks for your contribution to this thread.

No problem.

Thanks for your ongoing efforts to investigate the insurability of a development you have apparently have no interest in living in. It's no at all odd that you joined specifically for that purpose

marieholmfan · 27-11-2017 1:48pm

Graham wrote: »

No problem.

Thanks for your ongoing efforts to investigate the insurability of a development you have apparently have no interest in living in. It's no at all odd that you joined specifically for that purpose

You seem very motivated to defend a housing estate in Meath even though your location is Dublin? Curiouser and curiouser.

Do McGarrell Reilly have a good reputation from the boom by the way?

Graham · 27-11-2017 2:07pm

marieholmfan wrote: »

You seem very motivated to defend a housing estate in Meath even though your location is Dublin? Curiouser and curiouser.

Do McGarrell Reilly have a good reputation from the boom by the way?

I couldn't tell you about their reputation to be honest and have no professional or personal connection if that's what you're insinuating.

FYI, I don't think I've updated my location since I joined boards just over 16 years ago so I wouldn't read too much into that

ixus · 27-11-2017 5:13pm

Flood insurance is kind of a moot point. If it floods once, you won't get insurance again. Only content etc.

It's a shame they didn't build any walls in the gardens. You could insert a protect gate to raise your protection..

Bristolscale7 · 27-11-2017 7:03pm

ixus wrote: »

Flood insurance is kind of a moot point. If it floods once, you won't get insurance again. Only content etc.

It's a shame they didn't build any walls in the gardens. You could insert a protect gate to raise your protection..

Well, depending on how

The property, including domestic outbuildings:

Has never suffered damage due to flooding.
Is not in an area with a history of flooding.

is interpreted, an insurance company might also be able to claim fraud.

Danny285 · 27-11-2017 9:10pm

Hi All,

Does anybody on this forum have deposit on a house in Millerstown kilcock?

greg1981 · 27-11-2017 9:53pm

I have deposit on 3 bed semi

bigsheepdog · 28-11-2017 11:21am

You'd be mad to buy a house in there. Ive lived here all my life and in those 50 years that field has flooded each winter. Couldnt believe planning was granted for it in the first place. 24 hrs of rain flooded the place last week, imagine what it would be like after 3 or 4 days of rain

Graham · 28-11-2017 11:32am

bigsheepdog wrote: »

You'd be mad to buy a house in there. Ive lived here all my life and in those 50 years that field has flooded each winter. Couldnt believe planning was granted for it in the first place. 24 hrs of rain flooded the place last week, imagine what it would be like after 3 or 4 days of rain

24 hours of rain partially flooded the flood strip.

highdef · 28-11-2017 11:36am

Graham wrote: »

24 hours of rain partially flooded the flood strip.

Being marketed as a "Riverside Park" with no mention of it being a flood strip to prospective buyers!!!

Graham · 28-11-2017 11:41am

highdef wrote: »

Being marketed as a "Riverside Park" with no mention of it being a flood strip to prospective buyers!!!

The park in the centre of Carlow isn't labelled 'flood park' either, it was closed last week while it was underwater.

highdef · 28-11-2017 12:08pm

Graham wrote: »

The park in the centre of Carlow isn't labelled 'flood park' either, it was closed last week while it was underwater.

Whilst I'm not familiar with Carlow, I can only assume that it is the park on the west side of the River Barrow north of the town centre.

I can't say much about this park in question but from what I can tell from satellite imagery, it looks like a council owned park with no residential units connected to it and not a private housing development marketing the most picturesque section of parkland as a feature for people to use for recreation purposes.....well canoeing and swimming could be construed as being recreation, I guess :rolleyes:

marieholmfan · 28-11-2017 12:21pm

bigsheepdog wrote: »

You'd be mad to buy a house in there. Ive lived here all my life and in those 50 years that field has flooded each winter. Couldnt believe planning was granted for it in the first place. 24 hrs of rain flooded the place last week, imagine what it would be like after 3 or 4 days of rain

Granted because it is Meath. Kildare County Council should sue to have the area and its LPT and social housing allocation given to Kildare not to those EXPLETIVE DELETED Royals.

marieholmfan · 28-11-2017 12:22pm

Graham wrote: »

24 hours of rain partially flooded the flood strip.

It is not a flood strip. There is no mention of a flood strip in the planning.

Graham · 28-11-2017 12:36pm

marieholmfan wrote: »

It is not a flood strip. There is no mention of a flood strip in the planning.

"Associated infrastructure works include a partial realignment of the Rye Water River and re-profiling existing river banks as part of flood protection measures"

New Houses Kilcock

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