Toyota Rav 4 hybrid

ELM327 · 08-01-2019 9:47am

CramCycle wrote: »

True but does the distance covered per charge not lower over time? Second, for some, not all, if the car is still grand, a new battery might be fine for some users rather than replacement.
This was related to the distance per charge, which I could be wrong about but the new bigger batteries and newer cars far exceed what I need, so even with reductions in distance per charge Id get a helluva long time. At the minute a newer Kona would only come down to 50% on my longest trip.

I don't have an EV though so could be talking rubbish.

Ignore the nissan leaf, it's the only EV without active cooling and the battery suffers terrible degradation as a result.
Other EVs are much better, even the Zoes from 2013/14 onwards are still around with 1-2% degradation after 100k km+.

More modern EV like Ioniq, i3, Teslas etc have active cooling and will not suffer the same degradation as the leaf. Newer EVs again like Kona, ENiro and probably the new VW MEB EVs too have liquid cooling meaning they will not suffer much degradation at all.

zilog_jones · 08-01-2019 10:25am

ELM327 wrote: »

Ignore the nissan leaf, it's the only EV without active cooling and the battery suffers terrible degradation as a result.

The second generation 24kWh batteries are seeing nothing resembling "terrible" degradation, from what I've heard. The early ones and 30kWh have not been so great, though. But even then, 2011 Leafs are still on the road and are totally usable, albeit with reduced battery capacity (maybe around 70% now?).

ELM327 · 08-01-2019 10:42am

zilog_jones wrote: »

The second generation 24kWh batteries are seeing nothing resembling "terrible" degradation, from what I've heard. The early ones and 30kWh have not been so great, though. But even then, 2011 Leafs are still on the road and are totally usable, albeit with reduced battery capacity (maybe around 70% now?).

The 24kWh second gen ones were much better (i had one and sold it on at ~110k!)
But they were much better than a very low floor (the first gen leaf) and were not as good as competition offerings.

The second gen 24kWh still shows a lot of degradation and a lot of owners on facebook are losing bars now. In other EVs from the era other owners are at 98% (eg the irish youtube guy with a Zoe)

Shefwedfan · 08-01-2019 11:28am

CramCycle wrote: »

True but does the distance covered per charge not lower over time? Second, for some, not all, if the car is still grand, a new battery might be fine for some users rather than replacement.

This was related to the distance per charge, which I could be wrong about but the new bigger batteries and newer cars far exceed what I need, so even with reductions in distance per charge Id get a helluva long time. At the minute a newer Kona would only come down to 50% on my longest trip.

I don't have an EV though so could be talking rubbish.

You are talking about battery degradation. As mentioned above disregard the Leaf and every other electric car is seeing minimal degradation. The only case I have for eGolf was in US and after 80k km's they had no degradtion. The US is harder on battery than ireland due to cold/hot climate

With larger batteries you won't need to charge fully everyday to get to your distance. So you can set to charge to a max 80% this will help preserve the battery even better.

Standard home charging has no affect on battery. Based on some initial reports they say fast charger can affect the battery but this is yet to be fully proven. The standard user who has a home charger will maybe use fast charging 10-20 times max a year which again will not have an affect.

They are talking about fast charging for a london taxi which could be doing 2-3 fast chargers per day

Battery degradation is blown up a bit too much....Ok the first leaf had some issues but my mother has one and no problem. People look at their 1 year old iPhone and see the battery is at 86% and think the same can happen with a car. They are different batteries and also a few cells on a phone will knock a lot of percent out, a few cells on a cars won't even touch it. Most companies are padding their batteries as well.

CramCycle · 08-01-2019 11:34am

If this is all true my next car could be the last car I buy before retirement, bar crashes or spare parts becoming unfindable.

Mach Two · 12-01-2019 3:06pm

Just after test driving the new Rav 4. Hybrid. Fully automatic. Salesman says 5l to 100 km. I was hoping that the radar would stop you in a traffic jam. But apparently it won't work under a certain speed.

CramCycle · 12-01-2019 4:21pm

City or motorway driving, because if it's the latter it's a joke. My 99 Saab was getting under 5l/100km nearly 20 years ago.

Mach Two · 12-01-2019 4:40pm

CramCycle wrote: »

City or motorway driving, because if it's the latter it's a joke. My 99 Saab was getting under 5l/100km nearly 20 years ago.

Can't say. I never asked for specifics. Would that be with the electric miles or without?

AlanD · 12-01-2019 10:25pm

Test drove one today. Giving consideration to it, moving from a mazda 3 2.2 diesel where I average around 5.4l/100km. Lovely car to drive, very impressive.

But I need some real world fuel efficiency figures, not the claimed.

Once per month I do an 800km round trip and don't want it to cost a fortune in petrol.

Shefwedfan · 12-01-2019 11:09pm

AlanD wrote: »

Test drove one today. Giving consideration to it, moving from a mazda 3 2.2 diesel where I average around 5.4l/100km. Lovely car to drive, very impressive.

But I need some real world fuel efficiency figures, not the claimed.

Once per month I do an 800km round trip and don't want it to cost a fortune in petrol.

Real World for the Rav4? you wont get because it is brand new out. You could check what the 2 wheel drive is getting with other people but it will not be accurate because the new one will be better but might give better idea

Mach Two · 12-01-2019 11:23pm

There is a button at the bottom of the gear stick and if depressed will run on electric only. To be used for short runs. How long a short run is I don't know. Will only work if on a full charge.

I thought 5l/100 km would be ok for a vehicle of that size. But then again I don't have any experience of suv's.

Shefwedfan · 12-01-2019 11:47pm

Mach Two wrote: »

There is a button at the bottom of the gear stick and if depressed will run on electric only. To be used for short runs. How long a short run is I don't know. Will only work if on a full charge.

I thought 5l/100 km would be ok for a vehicle of that size. But then again I don't have any experience of suv's.

It has a small battery so not long, in older model it would run for a while but you had limited speed etc, I think it was under 40km...I done a bit of a test one day and I probably done 1km on battery alone, cant remember now if I went too fast and the engine kicked in.....

AlanD · 13-01-2019 12:45am

I saw the EV mode today but didn't give it a go.

The Internet is a little devoid of info as of yet.

Mach Two · 13-01-2019 12:49am

AlanD wrote: »

I saw the EV mode today but didn't give it a go.

The Internet is a little devoid of info as of yet.

An EV Rav 4?1 km is not too far.

AlanD · 13-01-2019 12:47pm

An equivalent lexus nx300h has a range of about a mile in EV mode. Which would suit me actually for things like the school run.

Mach Two · 13-01-2019 5:25pm

I was hoping to get a vehicle that would move along in a traffic jam without hitting the vehicle in front. Something like the cruise control in the Toyota safety sense. Anybody any suggestions.

CramCycle · 13-01-2019 5:40pm

Mach Two wrote: »

I was hoping to get a vehicle that would move along in a traffic jam without hitting the vehicle in front. Something like the cruise control in the Toyota safety sense. Anybody any suggestions.

This is going to sound smart ass but surely all you need is to pay attention while driving

Charlie-Bravo · 13-01-2019 6:07pm

I think people have a misconception of how to use EV on a Toyota Hybrid. The battery and electric motor is to compliment the petrol engine, by moving the car without having to excessively rev/stop-start the engine. The EV function is more for moving the car a very short distance without the use of a petrol engine - e.g. you have you car parked in an underground car park, and you want to move it without using petrol (stealth mode

), or sitting in traffic to creep along, this function is so helpful with it being an automatic, and the computer decides what to use, battery or ICE, or both.

Sure, you're not going to get more than 1km from EV mode. I wouldn't be driving it like that using up the battery power, then needing to regen/recharge with the petrol engine. I could see the battery health being impact by a persons driving style. If you want the best economic way of moving around, use the ECO mode.

Mach Two · 13-01-2019 7:42pm

CramCycle wrote: »

This is going to sound smart ass but surely all you need is to pay attention while driving

Couldn't agree with you more. But the amount of rear enders on our roads is hugh. Never mind the near misses.

AlanD · 13-01-2019 10:31pm

Mach Two wrote: »

I was hoping to get a vehicle that would move along in a traffic jam without hitting the vehicle in front. Something like the cruise control in the Toyota safety sense. Anybody any suggestions.

The rav4 has full range adaptive cruise control which goes from 0-110 I believe

Shefwedfan · 13-01-2019 10:36pm

astrofluff wrote: »

I think people have a misconception of how to use EV on a Toyota Hybrid. The battery and electric motor is to compliment the petrol engine, by moving the car without having to excessively rev/stop-start the engine. The EV function is more for moving the car a very short distance without the use of a petrol engine - e.g. you have you car parked in an underground car park, and you want to move it without using petrol (stealth mode ), or sitting in traffic to creep along, this function is so helpful with it being an automatic, and the computer decides what to use, battery or ICE, or both.

Sure, you're not going to get more than 1km from EV mode. I wouldn't be driving it like that using up the battery power, then needing to regen/recharge with the petrol engine. I could see the battery health being impact by a persons driving style. If you want the best economic way of moving around, use the ECO mode.

I know how to use hybrid, in the demo I discussed above I was interested to see how long it could go on battery, I was on a private road and I could go at whatever speed I wanted, I would never do on public road

If I had time I should have done it again but I would of had to drive around so the car could self charge ....boring

CramCycle · 13-01-2019 10:45pm

Mach Two wrote: »

Couldn't agree with you more. But the amount of rear enders on our roads is hugh. Never mind the near misses.

True, but unfortunately, they won't help you if someone rear ends you. Regrettably, as is my experience on the M50 and on most roads around. If you leave enough space for safe breaking and reaction, someone will move into it when traffic is busy. regrettably, I don't think what your looking for will help in these scenarios either.

I'm lucky myself at the minute, with work I have limited reason to drive and on those days I leave with an hour in hand before the heavy traffic begins, and even then its often annoying the messing you see.

We have an eVan in work but its not got a good enough range for my stuff, so stuck on Diesel there but they hope to have a decent range van or two on the books by the end of the year.

I cannot wait, aside from my pro EV views, the fact that I won't have to expense Diesel etc. anymore is great.

Chatted with the other half tonight. We have agreed that the next car has to be full EV, and that we will buy within 3 years. There was talk from the other half about a compromise on Hybrid etc. but to be honest, I just cannot see the benefit for the amount and type of driving we do.

Mach Two · 14-01-2019 1:15am

CramCycle wrote: »

True, but unfortunately, they won't help you if someone rear ends you. Regrettably, as is my experience on the M50 and on most roads around. If you leave enough space for safe breaking and reaction, someone will move into it when traffic is busy. regrettably, I don't think what your looking for will help in these scenarios either.

When everyone has some sort of adaptive cruise control maybe rear ending cars will become a thing of the past. I think the Toyota adaptive cruise control will not work below a certain speed. I was hoping that the Toyota adaptive cruise control would stop you if you were to come too close to the car in front even if you were only moving at a slow speed of 5 km or 10 km/hr.

AlanD · 15-01-2019 10:52pm

I'm surprised at how little real world reviews are out their for the new rav4. I know it's new, but there are no owner experiences and no reviews.

All I need is real world fuel economy.

CptMackey · 15-01-2019 11:09pm

AlanD wrote: »

I'm surprised at how little real world reviews are out their for the new rav4. I know it's new, but there are no owner experiences and no reviews.

All I need is real world fuel economy.

Drove one today. Lovely drive but I couldn't find anything either. Hardly a review either only a few bad ones from the states on YouTube

carsfan2 · 16-01-2019 10:53pm

https://www.autoexpress.co.uk/toyota/rav4/105711/new-toyota-rav4-2019-review

Loomis · 17-01-2019 1:03pm

Mach Two wrote: »

I don't particularly want to buy a new one. Too expensive. And my existing car is on the way out. I was hoping to get something about 2 yrs old. Is it not possible to tow something with the existing hybrid.

I've a deposit down on the new model which should be ready soon, so Toyota in Sandyford will have my trade in for sale if that's of any interest.
It's a 171 Luna Sport Hybrid.

AlanD wrote: »

I'm surprised at how little real world reviews are out their for the new rav4. I know it's new, but there are no owner experiences and no reviews.

All I need is real world fuel economy.

The two dealers I spoke with said supply if very limited (at least here anyway); they'd only be getting 3 initially, and then no more til April or possibly the summer. Not sure what the reason is for it though.

kennethsmyth · 17-01-2019 1:16pm

Nope, older hybrid not type approved, if you can find it you can put a towbar on it but essentially your insurance is considered invalid due to an illegal modification of the car, you will still have third party insurance but the insurance company can come after you for the costs. Obviously this is only if you have an incident. Additionally the nct tests towbars and electrics of towbars now so not sure if they will be aware of type approval or not for your vehicle.

CramCycle · 17-01-2019 1:44pm

kennethsmyth wrote: »

Nope, older hybrid not type approved, if you can find it you can put a towbar on it but essentially your insurance is considered invalid due to an illegal modification of the car, you will still have third party insurance but the insurance company can come after you for the costs. Obviously this is only if you have an incident. Additionally the nct tests towbars and electrics of towbars now so not sure if they will be aware of type approval or not for your vehicle.

I got caught out by that at the NCT, (Rav4 Petrol, not Hybrid) water ingress in my tow bar socket meant the power fluctuated. It still operated but the power was not steady. I never use it so removed the socket and and tow bar, instead of paying for a retest.

Shefwedfan · 17-01-2019 8:36pm

Loomis wrote: »

I've a deposit down on the new model which should be ready soon, so Toyota in Sandyford will have my trade in for sale if that's of any interest.
It's a 171 Luna Sport Hybrid.

The two dealers I spoke with said supply if very limited (at least here anyway); they'd only be getting 3 initially, and then no more til April or possibly the summer. Not sure what the reason is for it though.

What mileage on the 171? 2 wheel drive?

I would guess the UK are getting first dips on the new RAV. With the move towards petrol/hybrid in UK I would guess demand is high.

Toyota Rav 4 hybrid

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