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Why no bottle return deposit in Ireland?

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    #32
    Stovepipe
    Registered Users Posts: 2,979 ✭✭✭Stovepipe


    In Berlin, the pfand system gives you a reciept from the machine that takes in the bottles that you can then use to reduce your bill for any other purchase in the same shop. Everybody used it, even the homeless,who went around local public events and public places collecting them. On one occasion, as my family and I were watching an open air concert, a homeless guy with a small trolley came up and asked us for our empty water and juice bottles. We weren't yet finished with them but he simply waited and thanked us for them. When you bought beer or water or juice from the stalls,they handed out glasses and you didnt get another beer unless you brought the glass back. You could give the bottle to a collecting person or save it for the pfand machine. The whole system works really well and the only opposition here is from the soft drinks firms who don't want to get involved,plain and simple and won't do so unless they are forced. I'll be Repak don't want to get involved either.
    Incidentally,glass bottles for milk and juices have been making a comeback and a local firm where Ilive in West Wicklow has a thriving delivery custom.


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    #33
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 13,712 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    whisky_galore wrote: »
    The wha abou da homeless refrain.

    Maybe something could be done to prevent them becoming homeless in the first place, instead of assuaging guilty consciences becoming litter pickers for pennies.
    Honest to God, some people are just agin everything.

    I have no illusion that such a scheme would solve homelessness, I'm simply suggesting that the homeless could benefit from a glass-recycling scheme like this, OK?


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    #34
    Chinasea
    Registered Users Posts: 1,568 ✭✭✭Chinasea


    Would solve our litter problem. The discarded plastic bottle and can scourge.


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    #35
    whisky_galore
    Registered Users Posts: 15,746 ✭✭✭✭whisky_galore


    Chinasea wrote: »
    Would solve our litter problem. The discarded plastic bottle and can scourge.

    No it wouldn't, unless you pay people to bring in everything.


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    #36
    Stovepipe
    Registered Users Posts: 2,979 ✭✭✭Stovepipe


    It works in America.You get a cent or two back on every "soda can" or plastic bottle and the homeless collect them and cash them in. Homed people collect them too. Not every State does it, but most do. There is no justifiable reason not to have a refund scheme in Ireland, if it works so well in other countries.


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    #37
    Lurching
    Registered Users Posts: 1,239 ✭✭✭Lurching


    whisky_galore wrote: »
    No it wouldn't, unless you pay people to bring in everything.

    Only that, yes, it does work. I'm not sure what you're basing your negative perspective on, but it works in Germany.

    Come up to the Dublin mountains. 90% of the rubbish is either plastic bottles or cans. People would be much more inclined to carry their rubbish home if it had a deposit.


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    #38
    duffmann
    Registered Users Posts: 50 ✭✭duffmann


    https://twitter.com/EamonRyan/status/1267418230295060480?s=20
    Hope this guy walks the walk


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    #39
    jester77
    Registered Users Posts: 11,262 ✭✭✭✭jester77


    whisky_galore wrote: »
    No it wouldn't, unless you pay people to bring in everything.

    It's 25c a can for the pfand in Germany, so you would only need to bring back 4 empty cans to pay for a beer (pfand included)


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    #40
    whisky_galore
    Registered Users Posts: 15,746 ✭✭✭✭whisky_galore


    Lurching wrote: »
    Only that, yes, it does work. I'm not sure what you're basing your negative perspective on, but it works in Germany.

    Come up to the Dublin mountains. 90% of the rubbish is either plastic bottles or cans. People would be much more inclined to carry their rubbish home if it had a deposit.

    Germany is not Ireland. Trying to get companies to organise to get behind this is your biggest hurdle. And then you have the fickle Irish public who were oh so concerned about the environment and Greta a few months ago but now not so much as the circus has moved on.

    Guaranteed people here will only gather or bring back what they get a deposit on and leave the "worthless" rubbish there. That includes the plastics, the shïtty nappies, the bags of dog shït hanging from trees like Xmas decorations.
    But sure, have your deposit system, but let's not pretend it's a magic bullet for cleaning up ALL waste.


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    #41
    Potential-Monke
    Registered Users Posts: 13,808 ✭✭✭✭Potential-Monke


    Hairy Japanese BASTARDS! wrote: »
    Here, there are no plastic crates. Just horrid slabs with a sheet of recyclable cardboard and soft plastic that cannot be recycled and must go into the black rubbish bin.

    Wait, what? You can't recycle the plastic? Oops.... Does that include the branded wrapping from like 24 packs of Coke?

    Edit: I Googled. TIL.


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    #42
    ED E
    Registered Users Posts: 36,164 ✭✭✭✭ED E


    whisky_galore wrote: »
    Germany is not Ireland. Trying to get companies to organise to get behind this is your biggest hurdle. And then you have the fickle Irish public who were oh so concerned about the environment and Greta a few months ago but now not so much as the circus has moved on.

    Guaranteed people here will only gather or bring back what they get a deposit on and leave the "worthless" rubbish there. That includes the plastics, the shïtty nappies, the bags of dog shït hanging from trees like Xmas decorations.
    But sure, have your deposit system, but let's not pretend it's a magic bullet for cleaning up ALL waste.

    The finish system is run by the shops. It's an industry body, not a quango. Can be done.


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    #43
    SEPT 23 1989
    Registered Users Posts: 43,024 ✭✭✭✭SEPT 23 1989


    If only we some sort of site to build a glass bottle factory


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    #44
    Phil.x
    Registered Users Posts: 1,723 ✭✭✭Phil.x


    Who's this aimed at? As a home owner I pay for general waste and recycling, i also recycle bottles to keep the weight down.
    So why should I pay extra on purchased bottles, cans and plastic, I also dont want to spend a a few hours per week nevermind the hassle of lugging cans, bottles and plastic bottles to a supermarket.

    Maybe it's more suited to apartment living like in German and Dutch cities like the greens keep spouting about.


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    #45
    SnowyMay
    Closed Accounts Posts: 544 ✭✭✭SnowyMay


    Phil.x wrote: »
    Who's this aim at? As a home owner I pay for general waste and recycling, i also recycle bottles to keep the weight down.
    So why should I pay extra on purchased bottles, cans and plastic, I also dont want to spend a a few hours per week nevermind the hassle of lugging cans, bottles and plastic bottles to a supermarket.

    Maybe it's more suited to apartment living like in German and Dutch cities like the greens keep spouting about.

    Well, the aim is to get these bottles and cans recycled.

    There’s a small difference between going to a bottle bank, or going to a Pfand (deposit) bank. In fact, I’d say the Pfand is even more convenient, as they are at pretty much every supermarket in Germany. Also, it’s a cool word... Pfand.

    It also means that you won’t see bottles and cans littered around the street or parks, as, if you don’t recycle your stuff, somebody else will come along and do it, for money!

    I’ve been to football matches in Ireland, where the streets are filled with all kinds of rubbish, left to be cleared up by some public service. I don’t know - but I doubt all of this is sorted and recycled where appropriate. That’s not the case in Germany, where the streets are clean by the time the first goal is scored.

    With a deposit system, somebody will recycle the recyclables - for money!

    The system also means that people are aware and conscious about recycling.

    Can’t complain about it at all.


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    #46
    screamer
    Registered Users Posts: 6,131 ✭✭✭screamer


    whisky_galore wrote: »
    Germany is not Ireland. Trying to get companies to organise to get behind this is your biggest hurdle. And then you have the fickle Irish public who were oh so concerned about the environment and Greta a few months ago but now not so much as the circus has moved on.

    Guaranteed people here will only gather or bring back what they get a deposit on and leave the "worthless" rubbish there. That includes the plastics, the shïtty nappies, the bags of dog shït hanging from trees like Xmas decorations.
    But sure, have your deposit system, but let's not pretend it's a magic bullet for cleaning up ALL waste.

    Agree, also the Germans are very compliant, their towns are clean, unbelievably so. I think there’s a sense of civic pride there that’s lacking here. Deposit would have to be punitively expensive to have Irish people lug bottles back to shops. I also think the shops would kick up hell about having to manage the logistics of this.


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    #47
    vicwatson
    Registered Users Posts: 28,403 ✭✭✭✭vicwatson


    screamer wrote: »
    Agree, also the Germans are very compliant, their towns are clean, unbelievably so. I think there’s a sense of civic pride there that’s lacking here. Deposit would have to be punitively expensive to have Irish people lug bottles back to shops. I also think the shops would kick up hell about having to manage the logistics of this.

    But I lug mine to a bottle bank at the shops, only diff is another CO are responsible for lifting them. Maybe all supermarkets should be obliged to have a bottle and can bank on their site as part of planning permission. My local Tesco and SuperValu have recycling banks but not one ALDI or Lidl have a facility for example.


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    #48
    maestroamado
    Registered Users Posts: 4,426 ✭✭✭maestroamado


    I think what you saying good idea but our market very small, our problem is quite alot of what we consume is not bottled in Ireland so probably cost considerably less to recycle than return.
    All of the wine we consume is bottled abroad, all beer except what produced by Guinness and craft bottled abroad, a considerable amount of our spirits bottled abroad.
    I think most soft drinks bottled here but they are already being returned...


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    #49
    whisky_galore
    Registered Users Posts: 15,746 ✭✭✭✭whisky_galore


    ED E wrote: »
    The finish system is run by the shops. It's an industry body, not a quango. Can be done.

    Irish owned and Irish based chains would have to be forced to do it, best of luck with that.


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    #50
    whisky_galore
    Registered Users Posts: 15,746 ✭✭✭✭whisky_galore


    screamer wrote: »
    Agree, also the Germans are very compliant, their towns are clean, unbelievably so. I think there’s a sense of civic pride there that’s lacking here. Deposit would have to be punitively expensive to have Irish people lug bottles back to shops. I also think the shops would kick up hell about having to manage the logistics of this.

    Definitely. There's always the sense here that it's someone else's problem or responsibility. Ah shur I pays me taxes, the council will pick them up after me like me Ma picks up after me at home.


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    #51
    SEPT 23 1989
    Registered Users Posts: 43,024 ✭✭✭✭SEPT 23 1989


    .


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    #52
    cj maxx
    Registered Users Posts: 13,359 ✭✭✭✭cj maxx


    SEPT 23 1989 wrote: »
    .

    Well said SEPT :)


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    #53
    Eleven Benevolent Elephants
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 426 ✭✭Eleven Benevolent Elephants


    I see they want to introduce this.
    It's a rubbish watered down version of what works well in Germany and the Netherlands.

    You will it be able to get a voucher for the shop where you returned the items, you should be able to get a cash refund.

    Waste companies are very hostile towards it.

    https://m.independent.ie/news/environment/scheme-to-reward-collection-of-bottles-and-cans-is-trashed-by-waste-industry-39504880.html


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    #54
    Gretas Gonna Get Ya!
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,245 ✭✭✭Gretas Gonna Get Ya!


    Can't we just pay some clever boffins to make this environmental crisis thingy go away... like they did with that big hole in the OZone layer!? ;)


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    #55
    greasepalm
    Registered Users Posts: 5,252 ✭✭✭greasepalm


    I would go down that route as have plenty of plastic bottles and tins i could donate while also using my green bin.Anything that helps to clean up the litter problem will help.


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    #56
    Eleven Benevolent Elephants
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 426 ✭✭Eleven Benevolent Elephants


    I'd also like to see a complete ban on disposable coffee cups.

    Mrs. Elephant works in a certain retail establishment and the amount of coffee cups left lying around on shelves or even atop piles of clothes is disgraceful (it's usually women btw).


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    #57
    greasepalm
    Registered Users Posts: 5,252 ✭✭✭greasepalm


    Getting a pile of used compostable coffee cups on table now which can go in the compost bin when i drop that in and lids into recycling bin for work.No glass bottles in work but have plastic bottles from water.
    I will assume other plastic bottles of say brake fluid,engine oil and other fluids need to go into black bin and not the bring back machines that might be coming to shops.


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    #58
    Stovepipe
    Registered Users Posts: 2,979 ✭✭✭Stovepipe


    oil containers can be washed out with detergents and reused or ground up for plastic chips.


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    #59
    GazzaL
    Registered Users Posts: 1,395 ✭✭✭GazzaL


    The pfand system is great. I always carry a small bottle opener in Germany. It feels like a bonus when you get a few bob off the next lot of drinks or whatever else you get in the shop. If introducing it to Ireland meant more glass bottles being washed and re-used rather than crushed, improved recycling of cans, and less plastic, that would be great.


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