TUF 13: Lesnar V Dos Santos.

11-01-2011 11:46pm #1

http://www.ufc.com/news/tuf-13-coaching-announcement

UFC.COM wrote:

UFC President Dana White announced today that former UFC heavyweight champion Brock Lesnar and number one contender Junior dos Santos will match wits as the coaches of season 13 of the hit Spike TV reality series.

Following the season, which begins filming this month and begins airing on March 30, Lesnar and dos Santos will then match fists in the Octagon later in 2011.

This will be the first time either fighter has appeared on The Ultimate Fighter, which began airing on Spike in 2005. The last time heavyweights coached the show was during season eight in 2008, when dos Santos’ mentor, “Minotauro” Nogueira, faced off against former champion Frank Mir. This season, the two will coach a host of welterweight hopefuls looking to secure a UFC contract.

One of the biggest success stories of recent years, Brock Lesnar’s rise to the top of the UFC has been well-documented. A former NCAA Division I wrestling champion for the University of Minnesota, Lesnar brought size, speed, and power to the Octagon in 2008, and in only his fourth professional fight, he defeated Randy Couture for the heavyweight crown. After successful defenses against Mir and Shane Carwin, Lesnar lost his belt to Velasquez at UFC 121 last October. Determined to get his championship back, Lesnar knows the quickest way to do so is through dos Santos.

Unheralded Brazilian prospect Junior dos Santos turned into a contender overnight in 2008 when he knocked out highly-regarded veteran Fabricio Werdum in the first round. This spectacular debut was followed by finishes of Stefan Struve, Mirko Cro Cop, Gilbert Yvel, and Gabriel Gonzaga before earning a shot at the heavyweight title with a three round win over Roy Nelson. Yet instead of choosing to wait for Velasquez to return to action, dos Santos will risk his number one contender’s spot by coaching against - and then fighting - Lesnar later this year.

scudzilla · 11-01-2011 11:57pm

This just proves that UFC is now more about money making than the fights themselves.

How can a guy, as inexperienced as Brock, be a coach? He's still got so much to learn himself.

I'm thinking this was a sweetener for him to keep him in the UFC as lot of rumours going around about him returning to that circus show.

Ridiculous choice

odin_ie · 12-01-2011 12:01am

To be fair, Brock has years of experience as a collegeite wrestler, and also trains hard, I think it is going to be an interesting season. Remember Forest Griffin had a 2 year turn around from being a contestant on TUF to being a coach, although he was 9-2 at that stage.

12-01-2011 12:02am

scudzilla wrote: »

Ridiculous choice

I think Edgar-Maynard made more sense. It'll be interesting because Deathclutch is a heavyweight specific team, the Ultimate Fighter contenders are Welterweights.
EDIT: Also Lesnar=Ratings.

bret69 · 12-01-2011 12:30am

I think this is an excellent choice.

It will make this season very interesting and build up a very interesting fight.

Regarding inexperience, Lesnar isn't the only one they'll learn from, he'll have a team of top guys, so I wouldn't worry about that. Plus that's not to say Brock will have nothing to teach them...being a former hugely successful collegiate wrestler and former UFC Heavyweight champion!

Odats · 12-01-2011 12:40am

Fcuking subtitles on Dos Santos now. I hate when they do that on TUF even when they do it to the UK lads.
What's the point in having Brock as a coach as no one will be allowed to hit him hard if he spars if rumours about his last camp are correct.
He would bring a good insight into the wrestling aspect being an NCAA Div 1 Champion but I'd say this is a pure ratings move.
IMO with the merger of the UFC and WEC this TUF should have concentrated on feathers and bantams or one this season and one next season rather than welterweights to be honest.
The heavyweight division will be lacklustre now for some months now up to 3rd quarter of new year with Cain out injured, Big Country out over contract irregularities. Only viable heavyweight match up now is Carwin vs Struve/Madsen and both options Carwin would win or Mir vs Struve or Struve vs Cro Cop or assuming Barry beats Beltran Barry vs Struve. Doesn't look good here.

unknown13 · 12-01-2011 12:48am

Brock is only coach to boost ratings. He will be one of the worst coaches that have coached on TUF since if he let no one hit in sparring than he wont know what proper sparring is.

Mellor · 12-01-2011 12:53am

scudzilla wrote: »

This just proves that UFC is now more about money making than the fights themselves.

How can a guy, as inexperienced as Brock, be a coach? He's still got so much to learn himself.

I'm thinking this was a sweetener for him to keep him in the UFC as lot of rumours going around about him returning to that circus show.

Ridiculous choice

i thought that at first, Brock's MMa exp is weak.

But on further thinking, his wrestling exp is huge, and he would make a pretty good wrestling coach for WW guys. And will then have a striker and BJJ guy on hand to "aid" him.

The "coach" isn't always the coach, if you get me.

Niall0 · 12-01-2011 12:56am

Cant see much banter/rivalry between Brock and JDS happening, could make for a boring season.

unknown13 · 12-01-2011 1:01am

What pisses me off the most is that Brock is basically getting a chance to get a title shot so soon after Cain beat his ass. The next fight after you get your ass beat is a #1 contender fight. Bloody joke.

bret69 · 12-01-2011 1:02am

Odats wrote: »

The heavyweight division will be lacklustre now for some months now up to 3rd quarter of new year with

Really?

You got Lesnar v Dos Santos, Mir v Nelson, Cro Cop v Schaub as well as the return of Shane Carwin, possibly fighting Ben Rothwell.

That's all happening before the 2nd quarter is through.

rivalius13 · 12-01-2011 1:36am

Niall0 wrote: »

Cant see much banter/rivalry between Brock and JDS happening, could make for a boring season.

Brock needs to go back to his WWE days and get his acting on to make it interesting.

fedor.2. · 12-01-2011 1:44am

scudzilla wrote: »

This just proves that UFC is now more about money making than the fights themselves.

How can a guy, as inexperienced as Brock, be a coach? He's still got so much to learn himself.

I'm thinking this was a sweetener for him to keep him in the UFC as lot of rumours going around about him returning to that circus show.

Ridiculous choice

Lucky you have a choice not to watch it so isnt it

Gerard.C · 12-01-2011 1:47am

scudzilla wrote: »

This just proves that UFC is now more about money making than the fights themselves.

How can a guy, as inexperienced as Brock, be a coach? He's still got so much to learn himself.

I'm thinking this was a sweetener for him to keep him in the UFC as lot of rumours going around about him returning to that circus show.

Ridiculous choice

The real question is, how can a guy as "inexperienced" as Brock win, and defend, the UFC Heavyweight title?

Tones69 · 12-01-2011 1:52am

odin_ie wrote: »

To be fair, Brock has years of experience as a collegeite wrestler, and also trains hard, I think it is going to be an interesting season. Remember Forest Griffin had a 2 year turn around from being a contestant on TUF to being a coach, although he was 9-2 at that stage.

I agree, he might not be world class kickboxer or anything but his wrestling attributes speak for themselves, and his work rate will be second to none, i bet its a great season!

Tones69 · 12-01-2011 1:54am

unknown13 wrote: »

What pisses me off the most is that Brock is basically getting a chance to get a title shot so soon after Cain beat his ass. The next fight after you get your ass beat is a #1 contender fight. Bloody joke.

JDS is no 1 contender but he doesnt wanna sit around for another 7 or 8 months without a fight, so this is a logical option for him! Gets to fight in June now

SanoVitae · 12-01-2011 1:59am

Niall0 wrote: »

Cant see much banter/rivalry between Brock and JDS happening

"Your wrestling sucks!" :mad:

"Que?!"

calex71 · 12-01-2011 2:01am

Think I'ill just watch the final and the coaches fight, or skip the bs and watch the fighter per episodes.

I lol'd at the list dos santos had beaten, world class alright, and brock barely our of his nappy in mma terms. Don't mean to take away from them as fighters / athletes just shows the HW division in the UFC and i guess other promotions for what they are. If you merged every pomotions HW;s right now you would barely scratch a credible top 10

YouSavedMyLife · 12-01-2011 2:05am

Dana needs to get off Brocks cock. If he beats JDS after TUF 13 he gets another title shot after being smashed by Cain with JDS being undisputed number one contender? I mean the fight wasnt even close, Cain demolished him. Brock should have fallen right down the ladder and have to fight some gate keeper like Cro Cop or Gonzaga or some ****.

I hope JDS knocks Lesnar clean out and "retires" Lesnar from his MMA career. Nothing against Brock himself, but the UFC and Dana needs to stop sucking his dick

Tones69 · 12-01-2011 2:18am

Whats the big deal? Its a decent fight and it could go either way depending if JDS can keep it on the feet etc, brock has done well before the cain fight so no i dont think he should be just thrown down the bottom of the ladder, had a good win against undefeated Shane Carwin and nobody is saying he should be down the bottom of the ladder are they?! AND remember at the end of the day apart from everything else the Ultimate Fighter is a TV series, which means ratings count for everything, and this will make a lot of money.

DrPhilG · 12-01-2011 2:53am

I think its a great plan.

TUF needs coaches and JDS needs a fight. Who's near the top of the division and not scheduled? Lesnar or Carwin. Carwin is a nice guy but dull as hell, while Lesnar is a cranky loudmouth. So guess who fits the bill!

Impressed that Brock took the fight too. After getting battered like he did, taking a fight against possibly an even better striker says something about his character and intentions if nothing else.

cian68 · 12-01-2011 3:25am

I'm interested in hearing brock cornering guys. Also it is sort of win-win for the ufc. Coaching Tuf with the company's biggest draw and then beating him will boost JDS's drawing power something crazy right? And if Brock wins well I don't see a rematch with cain being much different but it could make a ton of money

Mellor · 12-01-2011 3:45am

DrPhilG wrote: »

TUF needs coaches ...

This is it tbh.

Assuming they want touse one of the original weght classes for coaches (FW and BW will get a shot once get get more exposure.
A by-product of TUF is setting up either a title shot, or a No.1 spot, and drum up interest

LW - Edgar/Maynard rematch is it's own promotion, no 1 spt announced already
WW - Just be used
MW - Division is dying, could of been an option, but who?
LHW - Top guys are Rampage/Evans/Machida/Rua - between the rampage/evans season, and the fights just gone and coming up, nothing here for TUF at the minute

The more I think about it, HW is the right choice, as is JDS. I can see some argument for Carwin over Lesnar. But Lesnar = better ratings, more exciting, and less of a chance of getting caught for PEDs in the near future

TheProdigy · 12-01-2011 4:03am

YouSavedMyLife wrote: »

Dana needs to get off Brocks cock. If he beats JDS after TUF 13 he gets another title shot after being smashed by Cain with JDS being undisputed number one contender? I mean the fight wasnt even close, Cain demolished him. Brock should have fallen right down the ladder and have to fight some gate keeper like Cro Cop or Gonzaga or some ****.

I hope JDS knocks Lesnar clean out and "retires" Lesnar from his MMA career. Nothing against Brock himself, but the UFC and Dana needs to stop sucking his dick

It might be a bit extreme for him to leave the organisation to fight Gabe after a loss tbh.

Fozzy · 12-01-2011 5:58am

I'm surprised that Lesnar agreed to this, he refused it in the past because he didn't want to be away from his family for six weeks. Part of me wonders if it is in return for a favour from Dana

I'm also surprised at people who think that Brock is being treated specially. I don't really think that he is here, but even if he was, why wouldn't they treat him special? He brings in more money for them than any other fighter! They are a business first and foremost and always have been

If there are any fighters complaining about hard work on Brock's team I can just imagine how angry he will get

Sid_Justice · 12-01-2011 8:03am

just querying this thing about brock lesnar being such a hard worker and great wrestler.

i heard a fairly well substantiated rumour that brock works very hard during his training camp for fights but basically doesn't train outside of these relatively short windows.

while brock's wrestling credentials speak for themselves, let's not lose sights of the fact that brock's wrestling, like his mma, is based on athleticism and not on technically superiority. while someone with brock's wrestling ability will look very impressive to people that have never wrestled it's worth mentioning there are far far far more technical wrestlers than brock and the majority people can't emulate what brock does.

so what use is he as a coach? his areas of expertise are wrestling, but a style that can't really be taught "this is how you shoot, now just do it faster" and theatrics which have little relevance to up and comers.

let's just hope JDS and BL bringsa good team to actually coach the atheltes on this tuf.

scudzilla · 12-01-2011 8:06am

Gerard.C wrote: »

The real question is, how can a guy as "inexperienced" as Brock win, and defend, the UFC Heavyweight title?

Now there's my problem, i was sucked into the Hype about Brock, i know a few others who were too.

I hated Brock from the moment he came into the Octagon, before that even, he just seemed a bully, like that Biff guy from Back to the Future.

Was happy when Mir beat him, but a really good friend of mine, who's opinion i totally respect, told me to give him a second chance as he's the real deal.

I did, and he won his next 4 fights, and i was so sucked up into the hype that i didn't notice that those 4 fights were against pretty inferior opponents (Mir- Never know which Mir will show up, Randy- 46 and past his prime, plus giving away 60lbs, Heath - Way past his prime, Carwin - Gas tank of a frog)

Sure he defended against these guys but the first real, bona-fide, challenger he met he got totally destroyed, this, now with hindsight, IMO was his first real test, and he failed dismally.

Should he be a coach on TUF? Damn No

Is this good business by Zuffa? Probably the best move they have made in a LONG time (businesswise)

Charlie3dan · 12-01-2011 11:00am

scudzilla wrote: »

Should he be a coach on TUF? Damn No

Is this good business by Zuffa? Probably the best move they have made in a LONG time (businesswise)

Yea that about sums it up. Brock is not a great fighter, he is a beast who can wrestle. I wouldn't want him coaching me if I was a UFC Fighter.

Having said that, Brock will pull in ratings and the Heavyweights should make for a good series. whether he deserves to be there or not, we'll all be watching him.

bret69 · 12-01-2011 11:43am

scudzilla wrote: »

those 4 fights were against pretty inferior opponents (Mir- Never know which Mir will show up, Randy- 46 and past his prime, plus giving away 60lbs, Heath - Way past his prime, Carwin - Gas tank of a frog)

Sure he defended against these guys but the first real, bona-fide, challenger he met he got totally destroyed, this, now with hindsight, IMO was his first real test, and he failed dismally.

I think this is a bit harsh. He came in with no experience whatsoever and fought seven heavyweight fighters. He beat five and avenged his loss against Frank Mir, a former world champion and top heavyweight contender.

So really, after 7 fights his only loss (other than the avenged) is Cain Velasquez, who is probably the top heavyweight in the world right now.

That's not bad at all, in fact it's pretty damm amazing. And who's to say Brock won't come back and avenge the loss against Cain, like he did against Mir. He shouldn't have been caught by a ground expert in mir but he learned, came back and destroyed Mir.

Will he come back and totally dominate Cain with his wrestling and surprise us all? Even Kongo took Cain down in their fight remember!

SanoVitae · 12-01-2011 12:40pm

bret69 wrote: »

Even Kongo took Cain down in their fight remember!

He took him down by punching him in the face!

Gunsfortoys · 12-01-2011 12:48pm

I would love to have seen a Cain vs Dos Santos TUF.

This will be a very interesting TUF as it could make or break Brocks MMA career. Also if JDS beats him in the match up I cant see Brock lasting too much longer in MMA.

martineatworld · 12-01-2011 1:07pm

Echoing whats been said before, great business move, I'll watch it for Brock alone. He can create his own hype with his carry on, I've a bad feeling it will revolve around him shouting at Dos Santos. For the whole season. Whether you like Brock or not, you want to watch him.

Maynard - Edgar would've been immense, but I would've liked to have seen something involving the new WEC fighters as coaches, some way of breaking them into the public eye and getting a bit of hype about the smaller guys. And WEC fights are usually hectic!

SanoVitae · 12-01-2011 1:40pm

I wonder if they'll encourage Brock to get up to his old WWE antics again.

They already have that wafer-thin door on the show for coaches to punch holes in - Brock will probably walk right through it.

Logical Fallacy · 12-01-2011 1:46pm

Makes complete sense to me. Name me one Season where a coach was picked simply because he was a draw????

Or are you all honestly foolish enough to believe that big fights for belts and TUF coincide with each other by accident.

bledmillennium · 12-01-2011 1:52pm

martineatworld wrote: »

Echoing whats been said before, great business move, I'll watch it for Brock alone. He can create his own hype with his carry on, I've a bad feeling it will revolve around him shouting at Dos Santos. For the whole season. Whether you like Brock or not, you want to watch him.

Maynard - Edgar would've been immense, but I would've liked to have seen something involving the new WEC fighters as coaches, some way of breaking them into the public eye and getting a bit of hype about the smaller guys. And WEC fights are usually hectic!

Indeed, WEC fighters should have been the coaches for this year's season of TUF. However, putting Brock on TUF will most definitely dispel rumors about Brock doing Wrestlemania this year. Sound move, in my opinion.

However, JDS is a poor choice for his opponent. It should have been Mir for two reasons:

(1) Brock does deserve to be in the title picture after being brutalized and murdered by Velasquez, and
(2) Setting up Mir vs. Lesnar III is HUGE draw and money, business-wise

With that said, JDS should have been set up with Carwin instead. Two knockout artists in the octagon = mountains of epicness.

hisholinessnb · 12-01-2011 2:36pm

I'm surprised at people saying Edgar and Maynard should have been the coaches.
Its a reality show in truth and people want to see personality as much if not more than ability in the coaches.
Maynard is dull as dishwater, can't imagine being entertained at all watching him.

JoeyJJ · 12-01-2011 3:30pm

Not sure Brock would be the best choice as coach however you seen last season GSP wasn't really the coach he was acting as Sparring/training partner with a little more than that. Brock will have to rely on bringing in coaches too, however he will be so much bigger than the WW's, I'm not sure how they will benefit too much from him apart from his wrestling techniques, which should be of benefit.

I'm wondering will Brock use established gyms like Extreme Coutoure, American Top Team etc to prepare himself for the next fight? Maybe a move to Vegas/Cal for a few months prefight might be the best thing all round? He needs independant advice and not yes men. (if thats what he has, cannot say for certain it is) and also top Sparring partners at HW and LHW

Jayo_M · 12-01-2011 3:51pm

Lesnar has Greg Nelson and Erik Paulson in his training camp. It doesn't come much better than that.

Logical Fallacy · 12-01-2011 4:02pm

Despite his hands and despite his winds the general public is still cold on JDS, this entire season is about building him, not Brock.

RebelSoul · 12-01-2011 4:38pm

Brock has stated in the past that he didn't want to be a part of TUF. I can't help but think that his uturn is somehow motiviated, at least partly, by the fact that he has an autobiography coming out. A spot on a weekly mainstream TV show is bound to drum up more interest in it than if he continued to stay MIA in the woods.

Tones69 · 12-01-2011 5:38pm

RebelSoul wrote: »

Brock has stated in the past that he didn't want to be a part of TUF. I can't help but think that his uturn is somehow motiviated, at least partly, by the fact that he has an autobiography coming out. A spot on a weekly mainstream TV show is bound to drum up more interest in it than if he continued to stay MIA in the woods.

Maybe just maybe he changed his mind? And said feckit il give it a shot, if i beat JDS i get another title shot! Dana probably made him that offer and said if you dont take tyhis TUF coaches spot then you could be waiting years for another shot

Gerard.C · 12-01-2011 6:29pm

scudzilla wrote: »

Now there's my problem, i was sucked into the Hype about Brock, i know a few others who were too.

I hated Brock from the moment he came into the Octagon, before that even, he just seemed a bully, like that Biff guy from Back to the Future.

Was happy when Mir beat him, but a really good friend of mine, who's opinion i totally respect, told me to give him a second chance as he's the real deal.

I did, and he won his next 4 fights, and i was so sucked up into the hype that i didn't notice that those 4 fights were against pretty inferior opponents (Mir- Never know which Mir will show up, Randy- 46 and past his prime, plus giving away 60lbs, Heath - Way past his prime, Carwin - Gas tank of a frog)

Sure he defended against these guys but the first real, bona-fide, challenger he met he got totally destroyed, this, now with hindsight, IMO was his first real test, and he failed dismally.

Should he be a coach on TUF? Damn No

Is this good business by Zuffa? Probably the best move they have made in a LONG time (businesswise)

Imagine some whos job is to beat people up being a bully. The horror of it.

I bet you thought Carwin was his first real test too before Brock had him tapping like no tomorrow. Excuses, excuses.

Fozzy · 12-01-2011 8:10pm

Dave Meltzer said that Carwin wasn't an option for them because he's just had major back surgery and they don't want to rush him at all since he's in his mid-30s

It's funny how some people seem to think that the point of TUF is to give some unknown guys the chance to train with top coaches. It's not a charity show

I don't think that having Brock as a coach would be useless. How many times have we seen fighters lose on TUF by tiring and just losing their will to fight on? Brock works extremely hard and he's going to push his fighters to have the same work ethic. If anything their conditioning should improve at least, and that is a huge thing on TUF

thebostoncrab · 12-01-2011 9:17pm

Good to see Dos Santos is going to have a warm-up fight before meeting Cain

dunkamania · 12-01-2011 9:33pm

Anyone else think its weird having HW coaches for WW's?

13-01-2011 1:28am

dunkamania wrote: »

Anyone else think its weird having HW coaches for WW's?

Yeah they're going to dwarf them, two of the biggest heavyweights too. Brock and JDS' main attributes are their size and strength so I don't know how they can pass it on to WW's. It'll be interesting to see though.
In saying that though when you say JDS you basically have the whole Team Blackhouse at his disposal, A.Silva, Munoz, Aldo etc.

Mellor · 13-01-2011 3:37am

dunkamania wrote: »

Anyone else think its weird having HW coaches for WW's?

Why?
The coaches are rarely the same as the fighters.

The last time they had HW coaches, one half of fighters were lightweight (others were LHW)

Ush1 · 13-01-2011 10:56am

Looking forward to this but kinda annoyed there will not be a top HW match for loooong time now.

Still should be entertaining, and the fight with JDS could be make or break for Brock I reckon.

Jayo_M · 13-01-2011 11:57am

Ush1 wrote: »

Looking forward to this but kinda annoyed there will not be a top HW match for loooong time now.

Still should be entertaining, and the fight with JDS could be make or break for Brock I reckon.

There are, just not in UFC

flahavaj · 13-01-2011 6:32pm

Dana knows that the pro-wrestler is where the buys are at. Lesnar will make for brilliant TV because he has personality and charisma and the ability to work a feud properly, something most MMA fighters have little or no clue about. Someday the penny will drop with these guys that personalities make main event fights and big bucks, fighters just get black eyes and cauliflower ears.

sonic85 · 13-01-2011 7:10pm

why would anybody tune in to mma to watch fighters talk sh!te? there doesnt have to be feuds or any of that crap to make good tv. koscheck talked a lot of sh!te and made himself look like a tool when he couldnt back it up. leave the trash talk to pro wrestling

TUF 13: Lesnar V Dos Santos.

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