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Investigatory discipline meeting

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  • 17-06-2019 8:19pm
    #1
    Frankie Cortese
    Registered Users Posts: 177 ✭✭


    Just looking for advice on this, I’m sure it’ll come to nothing but it’s rightly pissed me off.

    Today I was handed a letter stating the above by my supervisor for a meeting with HR tomorrow on the grounds that I left my work station for ‘excess of 12 minutes & unapproved use of mobile phone during work hours’

    I’m currently working minimum 52 hours a week last 6-8 weeks including most Sunday's & 2 different times did 12 days straight just to help out.

    I’m left my work station last Monday to go to the toilet to speak to my mechanic who was fixing my exhaust on my car that broke down on my way to work the Saturday evening gone, something which my line leader knew about but supervisor didn’t.

    We have production rates at our work station & I started work 10 minutes earlier that day to get ahead in case I would have to move to use the phone. My production rate for that day ‘I left my work station for 12mins’ was 103%.

    Surely, the reasons I’ve stated above makes it harsh on me? Do I have a valid point in regards the work rate percentage for grounds not to be disciplined even?

    Thanks.


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    #2
    topcat72
    Registered Users Posts: 195 ✭✭topcat72


    Union rep if you have one - but i'm guessing you don't given the conditions you describe.
    Seriously woeful.
    How do they know you used your mobile? Are you monitored in the toilets?
    Are employees given full statutory breaks ?


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    #3
    Frankie Cortese
    Registered Users Posts: 177 ✭✭Frankie Cortese


    topcat72 wrote: »
    Union rep if you have one - but i'm guessing you don't given the conditions you describe.
    Seriously woeful.
    How do they know you used your mobile? Are you monitored in the toilets?
    Are employees given full statutory breaks ?

    No union inside there. They know I used the phone because when I went back to the work station my surpervisor was waiting & called me into his office & asked me where was I. I told him on the phone in the toilet to a mechanic.

    We get a 10 minute tea break & 30 minute lunch break, but as I explained to him, I needed someone to drop my car to him, someone to get the exhaust from a scrap yard, I needed to know the price & damage & then someone to collect & pay it for me to be able drive to work on Tuesday (I got a drive with a neighbour on the Monday because they had room for that day). I was told company policy is to inform my supervisor of me planning to make a phone call which I didn’t do.

    That’s fair enough seeing as I didn’t do it but feel severely under appreciated from it giving the work load, hours & performance Ive been doing lately.


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    #4
    Jim2007
    Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators Posts: 10,028 Mod ✭✭✭✭Jim2007


    Frankie Cortese wrote: »
    No union inside there. They know I used the phone because when I went back to the work station my surpervisor was waiting & called me into his office & asked me where was I. I told him on the phone in the toilet to a mechanic.

    Well it is pretty hard for any supervisor to ignore it, when you have straight out admitted to doing exactly what you were not supposed to do. No one is going to risk having it come back on them again at a later stage.

    Based on your good work record is it likely that the supervisor is likely to be on your side at the meeting? Presumably if you’re a solid team they should be willing to push for cutting you a bit of slack.


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    #5
    beauf
    Closed Accounts Posts: 22,651 ✭✭✭✭beauf


    You need a better job.


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    #6
    OMM 0000
    Registered Users Posts: 3,733 ✭✭✭OMM 0000


    They're being incredibly harsh.

    I feel there's two possibilities going on here:

    Unlikely:
    Your supervisor and HR are incredibly unreasonable and stupid.

    Likely:
    They're unhappy with you (past behaviour, attitude, etc.) and have decided they want to get rid of you, so they're building a case against you.

    Either way, if I were you I'd start looking for a new job.


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    #7
    beauf
    Closed Accounts Posts: 22,651 ✭✭✭✭beauf


    OMM 0000 wrote: »
    ...:
    Unlikely:
    Your supervisor and HR are incredibly unreasonable and stupid.
    ...

    Rather than unlikely I would say this is very common.


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    #8
    OMM 0000
    Registered Users Posts: 3,733 ✭✭✭OMM 0000


    beauf wrote: »
    Rather than unlikely I would say this is very common.

    I do think HR often attracts a certain type of person (busybody) and often has to invent things to justify her job, but I don't agree supervisors are commonly stupid or unreasonable.

    The issue I consistently see is the workers don't understand things from the supervisor's perspective, and don't have the data the supervisor has, so the supervisors decisions don't always make sense.

    A very common thing I see is workers who think they're getting away with their bad behaviour (coming in late, surfing the web all day, etc.), but actually their supervisor has just chosen to not say anything, yet.

    Then at the worker's annual review, she receives poor or average marks. The worker feels this is unfair. "I've never had any problems. My supervisor is unreasonable." But actually, the supervisor is not being unreasonable.

    You could make the argument the supervisor should not be letting things go, and should be telling the worker to stop coming in late and stop surfing the web. I think that's fair. Most likely the reason more supervisors don't do this is because they're trying to get a balance between the team being happy (relaxed vibe) and not wanting to be known as a difficult supervisor.

    Saying all that, I have had some ridiculous supervisors in the past. I can think of two. But that's probably two out of twenty?

    I'll also add my opinion of supervisors greatly changed when I became one.


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    #9
    Tomw86
    Registered Users Posts: 932 ✭✭✭Tomw86


    They are being incredibly harsh. I would write down the facts of the matter, including the time you started and have the exact time of the call written down from your phones records. Say nothing else in the meeting other than stating facts, and ask HR to send you minutes of it after.

    Are the long hours you work to do with inadequate staffing?

    If I were you, I would start looking for a job elsewhere, that sounds ridiculous. Is it a specialised industry you work in?


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    #10
    beauf
    Closed Accounts Posts: 22,651 ✭✭✭✭beauf


    OMM 0000 wrote: »
    I do think HR often attracts a certain type of person (busybody) and often has to invent things to justify her job, but I don't agree supervisors are commonly stupid or unreasonable.

    The issue I consistently see is the workers don't understand things from the supervisor's perspective, and don't have the data the supervisor has, so the supervisors decisions don't always make sense.

    A very common thing I see is workers who think they're getting away with their bad behaviour (coming in late, surfing the web all day, etc.), but actually their supervisor has just chosen to not say anything, yet.

    Then at the worker's annual review, she receives poor or average marks. The worker feels this is unfair. "I've never had any problems. My supervisor is unreasonable." But actually, the supervisor is not being unreasonable.

    You could make the argument the supervisor should not be letting things go, and should be telling the worker to stop coming in late and stop surfing the web. I think that's fair. Most likely the reason more supervisors don't do this is because they're trying to get a balance between the team being happy (relaxed vibe) and not wanting to be known as a difficult supervisor.

    Saying all that, I have had some ridiculous supervisors in the past. I can think of two. But that's probably two out of twenty?

    I'll also add my opinion of supervisors greatly changed when I became one.

    Taken at face value, if people are not tracking or following....

    Metrics, performance, output, following procedure, process, efficiency, productivity.

    You could end up firing the person over some trivial issue and losing the most profitable person on the team.

    Generally when these situations arise almost always I find none of this information is being tracked. So how is being managed without it. Answer..it isn't, its a runaway carriage.


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    #11
    C3PO
    Registered Users Posts: 3,742 ✭✭✭C3PO


    Wow ... I would hate to work in that sort of an environment! Is that a common workplace scenario? Serious question!


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    #12
    Purple Mountain
    Registered Users Posts: 13,028 ✭✭✭✭Purple Mountain


    C3PO wrote: »
    Wow ... I would hate to work in that sort of an environment! Is that a common workplace scenario? Serious question!
    Think it sounds like a call centre.
    Did my stint in one when I was young.
    Decided my time was numbered the day I was asked why I spent an extended absence in the bathroom.
    I genuinely was crippled with women's issues the same day and gladly snappily told the nosey witch that.
    We even had a 'traffic management' team watching us for personal breaks.
    Never again.

    To thine own self be true



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    #13
    Frankie Cortese
    Registered Users Posts: 177 ✭✭Frankie Cortese


    I work in manufacturing.

    I explained all what I said here to HR & asked if I was going OTT, she said based on my statements (which she didn’t know about she said) work ethic and unblemished record she could understand my frustrations. Was told they would get back to me with a decision tomorrow (today).

    Got called in at 3:30pm and handed a letter saying they appreciated my honesty & having reviewed it they decided no further action needed to be taken.

    But I agree with most posts, I need to find a new job, I didn’t deserve to be carted in like that.

    Thanks


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    #14
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    Yep. Get a move on. Don't relax.


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    #15
    NSAman
    Registered Users Posts: 3,389 ✭✭✭NSAman


    Jesus man.... why.. and I sincerely mean this... WHY would you want to work in such an environment? There are many better places than this that exist.

    OK we all work hard, but to have even a toilet break be noted (and I say this as a boss) is scary.

    I know when people are slacking off, everyone has targets and if those targets are met I am a happy boss. The thought that I would have to monitor their bodily excrement breaks or female issues honestly, it sickens me.

    Leave... find something more human!!! You ain't a robot.

    Best of luck to you, you sound like a genuine person.


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    #16
    C3PO
    Registered Users Posts: 3,742 ✭✭✭C3PO


    As per the other posters (and I'm also a team manager) - move on!


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    #17
    salonfire
    Registered Users Posts: 3,078 ✭✭✭salonfire


    Frankie Cortese wrote: »
    I work in manufacturing.

    I explained all what I said here to HR & asked if I was going OTT, she said based on my statements (which she didn’t know about she said) work ethic and unblemished record she could understand my frustrations. Was told they would get back to me with a decision tomorrow (today).

    Got called in at 3:30pm and handed a letter saying they appreciated my honesty & having reviewed it they decided no further action needed to be taken.

    But I agree with most posts, I need to find a new job, I didn’t deserve to be carted in like that.

    Thanks

    They were probably going through the motions they have to follow but were never actually going to take direct action against you on it.

    I wouldn't worry about it.


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    #18
    BattleCorp
    Registered Users Posts: 11,758 ✭✭✭✭BattleCorp


    salonfire wrote: »
    They were probably going through the motions they have to follow but were never actually going to take direct action against you on it.

    I wouldn't worry about it.

    If it was me in that situation I'd be pi55ed off even though no action was taken.

    HR keep records. That complaint by the supervisor is on file. I wouldn't be happy about that.


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    #19
    kg703
    Registered Users Posts: 988 ✭✭✭kg703


    That is insane behavior from a company. Your are breaking your back and they are treating you like a child / machine. It always makes me laugh how little some companies value their workers and don’t treat them like adults who have lives outside of work that might need to be managed. Happy workers make for better quality of work.

    Either way glad it worked out ok for you but yeah, look elsewhere. And do your supervisor no extra favors in the meantime, if they can’t give you ten mins of the day to sort out your car, don’t give them the extra hours of your personal life.


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    #20
    Irishder
    Registered Users Posts: 927 ✭✭✭Irishder


    love to know the company you work for or even the location


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    #21
    beauf
    Closed Accounts Posts: 22,651 ✭✭✭✭beauf


    I've seen this a few times it's often a manager or team leader who decides to do it. Usually this micro managing is a productivity killer. People stop doing that extra.


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    #22
    razorblunt
    Registered Users Posts: 17,300 ✭✭✭✭razorblunt


    Excellent news that HR have decided there's no case to answer there.


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    #23
    Jupiter Mulligan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 525 ✭✭✭Jupiter Mulligan


    HR isn't the problem here, the supervisor is. The OP needs to ask HR whether they believe that the supervisor was out of order in reporting him. Because if he was, then he needs to have his arse kicked. Hard.


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    #24
    beauf
    Closed Accounts Posts: 22,651 ✭✭✭✭beauf


    Usually these situations are the result of someone taking the the HR policies and terms and conditions literally.

    .... and having literally zero cop on, and no one overseeing the supervisor.


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    #25
    ILoveYourVibes
    Registered Users Posts: 15,176 ✭✭✭✭ILoveYourVibes


    Purple Mountain wrote: »
    Think it sounds like a call centre.
    Did my stint in one when I was young.
    Decided my time was numbered the day I was asked why I spent an extended absence in the bathroom.
    I genuinely was crippled with women's issues the same day and gladly snappily told the nosey witch that.
    We even had a 'traffic management' team watching us for personal breaks.
    Never again.


    People that work in call centers or people that work on a line or are on call to other people in the business to provide a service =They are often treated very differently to other people in the company. Often very unreasonably.

    And also supervisors making reports they know will never come to anything just for he sake of it even though your staff are hard workers yeah ..that happens.

    Its just a 'keep you on your toes'thing. But it goes on your record etc. And depending on who HR report to can come up etc later for you.
    Frankie Cortese wrote: »

    But I agree with most posts, I need to find a new job, I didn’t deserve to be carted in like that.

    Thanks


    I know what you are going through. I hope you find a better place soon.


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