Would a Star Trek Voyager movie have been better than Nemesis?

AMKC · 21-08-2018 9:48pm #1

So just came across this link talking about if a Voyager movie would have been better than Nemesis.

https://comicbook.com/startrek/2018/08/19/star-trek-voyager-movie-nemesis-garrett-wang/

I agree Nemesis was not perfect but there are parts of it I like and if they had been given a decent budget it would have been even better. The story was a bit of a mess do.

I think a Voyager movie might have worked but the actors would have had to act way better than they did in the series. A few of them like Tim Russ, Kate Mulgrew and maybe Duncan McNeill would have been ok I think but others would have had to up there game.

Evade · 21-08-2018 10:11pm

AMKC wrote: »

I agree Nemesis was not perfect but there are parts of it I like and if they had been given a decent budget it would have been even better. The story was a bit of a mess do.

Being directed by someone who had watched an episode of Star Trek before really would have helped too.

A Voyager movie as a finale could have worked but as a part two an episode that was on TV would never work.

TheValeyard · 22-08-2018 9:25pm

Dont think a Voyager movie would have worked. The story was done. All loose ends sorted out.

Cookie_Monster · 23-08-2018 5:41am

Not post finale, no. it wouldn't have made much sense. The Equinox storyline could have been extended into a good movie, add another 30-50 mins of footage in there. Has another Fed ship for interest etc.

jacksie66 · 23-08-2018 5:59am

This post has been deleted.

23-08-2018 7:50am

It would have to have been during the run of the series, so a movie killer there.

I actually think that Voyager's action heavy episodic nature would lend itself to a film than the more cerebral TNG (which never really worked in film)

Year of Hell or Equinox would have worked well.
A Species 8472 film would have worked, post show, if they hadn't neutered them before close.

Benefits:
Voyager action format (hated on TV) would work
Not restricted to the Alpha storyline
Not a "super" ship, like 1701-#
The Doctor and few other cast

Problems:
Rest of cast (make Troi positively engaging)
Story ends on return
Not at all popular outside of fractured Trek fanbase

LeBash · 23-08-2018 8:08am

Not if Harry Kim was in it

SimonTemplar · 28-10-2018 11:57pm

Murray TheDemonic TalkingSkull wrote: »

Dont think a Voyager movie would have worked. The story was done. All loose ends sorted out.

I actually don't think all loose ends were sorted out. There were so may unanswered questions about how Seven and The Doctor would be integrated into society, if there were any repercussions for Chakotay and B'Elanna due to their Maquis membership. Even a few scenes of Janeway debriefing with the admirals and maybe meeting Reg would have been great.

It really annoys me that we never got to see that. The whole series the characters were longing to return to Earth and they never actually did in the finale, only close to Earth.

In terms of a movie, as mentioned above, I think it suited an action heavy story more than TNG. I think the Borg was done to death by the time of Endgame so maybe there could be another threat that required knowledge of the delta quadrant to solve. Perhaps a full on assault of the alpha quadrant by species 8472.

Not sure if there would have been much of a public interest in this, but they could have done a TV or direct to DVD movie (or two) like they did at the end of Stargate SG-1

Samuel T. Cogley · 30-10-2018 2:05pm

How you can feck up remaking TWOK is beyond me.

30-10-2018 2:09pm

Samuel T. Cogley wrote: »

How you can feck up remaking TWOK is beyond me.

Easy how to below
Step 1: Think remaking TWOK is a god idea
Step 2: Inevitable car crash from Step 1

Inviere · 30-10-2018 4:12pm

SimonTemplar wrote: »

I actually don't think all loose ends were sorted out. There were so may unanswered questions about how Seven and The Doctor would be integrated into society, if there were any repercussions for Chakotay and B'Elanna due to their Maquis membership. Even a few scenes of Janeway debriefing with the admirals and maybe meeting Reg would have been great. It really annoys me that we never got to see that. The whole series the characters were longing to return to Earth and they never actually did in the finale, only close to Earth.

Not sure if there would have been much of a public interest in this, but they could have done a TV or direct to DVD movie (or two) like they did at the end of Stargate SG-1

Voyager was always about 'the journey' rather than the destination, a notion they actually spelled out in a certain episode (Timeless I think). Yes, it was all very sudden how it ended, these characters we had gotten to know over seven years had suddenly got to where they were going, but, that's where the journey ends, and for us, that's where the show ends. I don't think there was scope for continuing Voyager in any way (outside of the usual rubbish non canon books).

coffee_cake · 30-10-2018 4:13pm

I'll ask my spirit animal to see

pixelburp · 30-10-2018 4:24pm

Huh, I forgot Nemesis was the first attempt at a soft-remake of TWOK; crazy that they've now attempted this twice.

Insurrection was probably a flimsier story, a mid-season filler episode extended out to feature length, but Nemesis was pure garbage from top to bottom. A good example of what happens when those in vital creative departments are simply mentally checked-out from the whole franchise (or, as with the director, had never watched Trek before). Not often either you lay the blame at Patrick Stewart either, but AFAIK the terrible buggy chase was his idea 'cos of a love of driving.

elbyrneo · 30-10-2018 4:36pm

That buggy chase was cringe alright.

I'll probably be slated for saying this (and may slate myself) but another time travel mash up this time between current Star Trek movies (Chris Pine etc.) and some members of the TNG crew (in partic Picard) would surely be a massive box office draw.

I know there is a pending new series with Picard, so that might make it a non-runner. I know the writers would probably balls it up, and that should make it a non-runner.

But Patrick Stewart's Picard is so worthy of another big production. Nemesis should not be his last cinematic appearance!!

Evade · 30-10-2018 4:59pm

pixelburp wrote: »

or, as with the director, had never watched Trek before

Back before internet streaming was a thing and I only had a few DVDs I used to listen to the directors' commentaries. I did that for Nemesis and I think I only lasted a few minutes until the director said something like "I wanted the Scimitar's bridge to evoke a mirror image of the Enterprise's because we've never seen something like that before in Star Trek" even though most of the TNG alien bridges were just redresses of the battle bridge which was laid out almost the same as the main bridge.

Rawr · 02-11-2018 11:00am

Evade wrote: »

Back before internet streaming was a thing and I only had a few DVDs I used to listen to the directors' commentaries. I did that for Nemesis and I think I only lasted a few minutes until the director said something like "I wanted the Scimitar's bridge to evoke a mirror image of the Enterprise's because we've never seen something like that before in Star Trek" even though most of the TNG alien bridges were just redresses of the battle bridge which was laid out almost the same as the main bridge.

Also, if it really was a soft TWOK remake....how the hell did he miss the near identical Reliant bridge? I wouldn't be surprised if that bridge set was just Enterprise's bridge, slightly rotated to have the door behind the captain's seat. Otherwise, the whole room is identical.

Nemsis might have worked better with more of a budget and prehaps creating a better sense of danger from the Remans (making them look like the Uruk-kai from LOTR isn't enough on it's own).

I remember being very underwhelmed by their depeiction of the Romulan Senate as well. They managed to reduce this vast and powerful Star Empire into a tiny-ass room. Come on guys...you could of CGI'ed that into something better. That sort of set the tone for me. The Enterprise finally visits the mysterious Romulus...and it was was just so "Meh...."

Also....why B4? Why not Lore? Lore was always more interesting and would have made for an interesting additional villian in all of this.

Evade · 02-11-2018 12:21pm

Rawr wrote: »

Also, if it really was a soft TWOK remake....how the hell did he miss the near identical Reliant bridge? I wouldn't be surprised if that bridge set was just Enterprise's bridge, slightly rotated to have the door behind the captain's seat. Otherwise, the whole room is identical.

I don't think he'd watched any Star Trek beyond catching a few episodes of TOS as a child.

AMKC · 02-11-2018 4:18pm

Rawr wrote: »

Also, if it really was a soft TWOK remake....how the hell did he miss the near identical Reliant bridge? I wouldn't be surprised if that bridge set was just Enterprise's bridge, slightly rotated to have the door behind the captain's seat. Otherwise, the whole room is identical.

Nemsis might have worked better with more of a budget and prehaps creating a better sense of danger from the Remans (making them look like the Uruk-kai from LOTR isn't enough on it's own).

I remember being very underwhelmed by their depeiction of the Romulan Senate as well. They managed to reduce this vast and powerful Star Empire into a tiny-ass room. Come on guys...you could of CGI'ed that into something better. That sort of set the tone for me. The Enterprise finally visits the mysterious Romulus...and it was was just so "Meh...."

Also....why B4? Why not Lore? Lore was always more interesting and would have made for an interesting additional villian in all of this.

Maybe because after the TNG episode ''Descent'' part 2 at the end when Data shuts him off. I would say that was the last of Lore.

The Enterprise finally visits the mysterious Romulus...and it was was just so "Meh...."

May be thats why the Romulans never wanted anyone to visit. They knew they would be disappointed.

TheValeyard · 02-11-2018 7:29pm

AMKC wrote: »

Maybe because after the TNG episode ''Descent'' part 2 at the end when Data shuts him off. I would say that was the last of Lore.

The Enterprise finally visits the mysterious Romulus...and it was was just so "Meh...."

May be thats why the Romulans never wanted anyone to visit. They knew they would be disappointed.

As Garak would say, everything on Romulus was "so grey"

degrassinoel · 08-11-2018 9:32pm

AMKC wrote: »

Maybe because after the TNG episode ''Descent'' part 2 at the end when Data shuts him off. I would say that was the last of Lore.

The Enterprise finally visits the mysterious Romulus...and it was was just so "Meh...."

May be thats why the Romulans never wanted anyone to visit. They knew they would be disappointed.

TNG got a quick visit there with Spock in the same Episodes, Garak in DS9 mentioned how absolutely grey it was, which was odd as he was a gardiner there at the time too.

I was expecting actual civilization, albeit boot-trodden oppressed cold-war soviet worker types like in TNG with the Remans at the lowest end of the scale. Suppose, he could have done much much worse as his third and final outing as a director too.

Kidchameleon · 11-11-2018 9:26am

Nick Meyer had never seen an episode either

11-11-2018 10:53am

Kidchameleon wrote: »

Nick Meyer had never seen an episode either

Nick Meyer only had a mis-paced film and three seasons to deal with.

Sad Professor · 11-11-2018 11:23am

Baird's lack of knowledge of Trek wasn't the main problem with the Nemesis. In fact, I'm not sure it was a problem at all. The biggest issue was Logan's script. Despite apparently being a huge fan of the show, he didn't know how to write any of the characters. Not to mention construct a compelling narrative. But Logan had just won an Oscar for being on the committee that wrote Gladiator, so everyone trusted him.

I feel a bit sorry for Baird who gets far too much blame for Nemesis. He wasn't the auteur of that film anymore than Frakes was the auteur of First Contact or Meyer was of TWoK. Harve Bennett was the key creative figure behind the original movies. In the TNG movies, Berman and to a lesser extent Stewart were guiding the ship whilst under a lot of pressure from a studio who didn't seem to think they knew what they were doing.

11-11-2018 11:52am

Sad Professor wrote: »

Baird's lack of knowledge of Trek wasn't the main problem with the Nemesis. In fact, I'm not sure it was a problem at all. The biggest issue was Logan's script. Despite apparently being a huge fan of the show, he didn't know how to write any of the characters. Not to mention construct a compelling narrative. But Logan had just won an Oscar for being on the committee that wrote Gladiator, so everyone trusted him.

I feel a bit sorry for Baird who gets far too much blame for Nemesis. He wasn't the auteur of that film anymore than Frakes was the auteur of First Contact or Meyer was of TWoK. Harve Bennett was the key creative figure behind the original movies. In the TNG movies, Berman and to a lesser extent Stewart were guiding the ship whilst under a lot of pressure from a studio who didn't seem to think they knew what they were doing.

Yeah, Nemesis had so many logic breaking elements in the plot.
Argo, B4, Reman control of Senate, Shinzon, Reman supership (oh god, that ship. Huge, super shields, sheilds while cloaked, fire while cloaked, mega beam, faster than Enterprise, DS9 level weapon capacity), stupid transporter for one (didn't TNG have those in series already?), Data sacrifice, action hero picard (again), running from supership through blackout nebula

Baird has blame for the reman bridge, look of Remans, pacing, performances etc. None of which are great

Kidchameleon · 11-11-2018 6:08pm

Deleted User wrote: »

Nick Meyer only had a mis-paced film and three seasons to deal with.

Oh don't get me wrong, I'm not defending Nemesis but my point is that it can be done.

Would a Star Trek Voyager movie have been better than Nemesis?

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