Single Use Plastics

cfuserkildare · 16-09-2019 12:58pm #1

Why O Why are we the consumers always being hammered over things like Single Use PLastics?

We, the consumers, are not responsible for whatever packaging Manufacturers decide to wrap the items we buy up in.

The consumer did not decide to wrap all items in PLastic/polythene, that is the manufacturer,

We consumers did not ask for Plastic ear buds, or non-biodegradable baby wipes, that is the responsibility of the manufacturer.

So Stop penalising consumers for manufacturing Short-cuts!!!

Other opinions obviously are welcome.

Insect Overlord · 16-09-2019 12:59pm

What penalty?

YFlyer · 16-09-2019 1:18pm

Insect Overlord wrote: »

What penalty?

Increase cost.

kneemos · 16-09-2019 1:23pm

Are single use plastics non recyclables?

Dravokivich · 16-09-2019 1:25pm

kneemos wrote: »

Are single use plastics non recyclables?

Doesn't matter if its recyclable. Feck all stuff can actually be recycled here becuase we dont have the facilities. What we need are incinerators.

YFlyer · 16-09-2019 1:51pm

I don't understand how Lidl can sell organic fair trade bananas without plastic and everywhere else these bananas are sold in plastic.

Insect Overlord · 16-09-2019 1:53pm

YFlyer wrote: »

I don't understand how Lidl can sell organic fair trade bananas without plastic and everywhere else these bananas are sold in plastic.

I actually hate shopping in Tesco these days. You can't get tomatoes or kiwis without buying more than you need, all covered in useless plastic.

Neyite · 16-09-2019 2:18pm

Getting rid of single use plastics is fine by me, but what will happen is manufacturers will turn to a non-recyclable container that looks eco friendly because it's cardboard colour and it will end up in landfill anyway.

I'd like to see better information. Most people don't know what kind of plastics can be recycled, so buy wrapped stuff under the assumption that it will be recycled.

Also labelling - it needs to be clear. Penalise manufacturers who claim something is biodegradable or flushable when it is anything but.

Thelonious Monk · 16-09-2019 2:27pm

Yep the thing is if we replace all this plastic with vegware and other substances made from plants etc we still need to use loads of land to make them.
The problem is overconsumption and too much choice of absolutely everything. We kinda need to dial that back a bit, but no one is interested and never will be. So onwards forth into oblivion.
As far as I know Ireland has never recycled any plastic, just shipped it to places like China where they prob just dumped it in the sea anyway.

beggars_bush · 16-09-2019 2:28pm

Aldi are brutal for packaging
literally none of their yoghurt, crisps and a range of stuff is recyclable

FFVII · 16-09-2019 2:34pm

Dravokivich wrote: »

What we need are incinerators.

Greenland is black now and it's snowing plastic in the arctic.

Incinerate me hole, where do you think it goes!!!!

freshpopcorn · 16-09-2019 2:41pm

Mod NoteMoved from After Hours to Recycling and Domestic Waste disposal, please follow local guidelines.

jam_mac_jam · 16-09-2019 2:46pm

Other packaging is more expensive so yes the consumer will have to pay a couple of pence more for it. This is why there is plastic everywhere, the only way to stop people using so much is give them a choice in what they buy or charge the real cost of dealing with all the rubbish which the consumer is not currently paying.

Del.Monte · 16-09-2019 2:49pm

Dravokivich wrote: »

Doesn't matter if its recyclable. Feck all stuff can actually be recycled here becuase we dont have the facilities. What we need are incinerators.

The last thing we need are more incinerators.

AirAmp2019 · 16-09-2019 2:54pm

Our whole culture has gone to one of single use. Many people want "quick meals" and want to get to places faster. Take away coffee, take away lunch, take away dinner. Sell in bulk. Christmas, Hallowe'en, Summer breaks. Staycations. "World day of..."

It is all consumerism and fast paced. That has been down to demand and advertising.

When it becomes "cool" to learn about recycling, people will. When it becomes "cool" to bake rather than buy, people will do that too.

Thelonious Monk · 16-09-2019 3:21pm

Yes why doesn't a politician come out and dare to suggest we cont buy any plastic crap this Christmas? The amount of absolute garbage sold that goes to landfill is heart breaking.

FFVII · 16-09-2019 3:45pm

Liquid soaps/shower gels

How many tonnes are those alone?

cfuserkildare · 16-09-2019 6:55pm

AirAmp2019 wrote: »

Our whole culture has gone to one of single use. Many people want "quick meals" and want to get to places faster. Take away coffee, take away lunch, take away dinner. Sell in bulk. Christmas, Hallowe'en, Summer breaks. Staycations. "World day of..."

It is all consumerism and fast paced. That has been down to demand and advertising.

When it becomes "cool" to learn about recycling, people will. When it becomes "cool" to bake rather than buy, people will do that too.

The big problem is,

What alternative choice is there??

How else is normal shampoo, or washing liquid, or most other products sold now packaged?

And how many normal people have the option of buying a greener alternative??

Thelonious Monk · 16-09-2019 7:20pm

cfuserkildare wrote: »

The big problem is,

What alternative choice is there??

How else is normal shampoo, or washing liquid, or most other products sold now packaged?

And how many normal people have the option of buying a greener alternative??

I buy bars of soap, they last ages. No need for all that shower gel crap.

adox · 16-09-2019 7:52pm

A lot of plastic trays and containers are moving to biodegradable alternatives, although they aren’t a solution for everything.

A lot of the newer trays used for packing fruit and veg are made from a pulp type material. While they are seen as more environmentally friendly as they are biodegradable, they actually use a lot of energy in their production and also a huge amount of water too in the process.

There are also compostable food containers that are home compostable which have a very limited shelf life so are only suitable for certain situations. These are made from a natural waste product in the harvesting of sugar cane so are using a product that is usually disposed of.
There are also products similar to these labeled as compostable too and, while technically they are, they are industrial compostable only, which means they will only break down at a certain temperature in certain conditions(basically need to be sent to an industrial composter)

There is also a corn based “plastic” ( it’s a see through material that looks nearly identical to plastic which in itself causes a lot of problems) called PLA, which again is industrial compostable but pushed as compostable. It also causes bigger problems as it looks exactly like a normal plastic container and the end user will most likely throw it into the recycle bin. It’s not a recyclable material and will contaminate the recycling bin content.

A lot of the plastic containers used in the supermarket for food are made from PET which is 100% recyclable and a lot of the manufacturers are now using RPET which means that a large percentage of the container produced is made from already recycled plastic.

There is a huge amount of misinformation out there and oversimplification of the problem. Not all plastic is bad per say, at least in theory. The likes of over wrapping film, plastic forks, plates etc that are single use are certainly top of the plastic tree problem.

From a food producers point of view, a large amount of products that there is demand for need to be packaged, and packaged in a product that will have a shelf life, maybe be waterproof/leak proof, air tight etc while still being able to see the product. At present there isn’t really any viable alternatives to a PET container.

Cardboard is also being hugely pushed again for tray alternatives. How environmentally friendly is that? Is it sustainable? I know manufacturers are coming up with solutions where the cardboard trays will have their own built in lid of sorts. Pack your fruit on the tray and instead of overwrapping it in plastic you fold some cardboard bits that are part of the tray over the top. It doesn’t cover the fruit completely so they are still visible but enough to hold them securely in place.

An adult conversation is needed by all involved, from government level down to the consumer with an idea of what we really want to do. “Plastic bad” is an incredibly simplistic and dumbing down view of the problem and doesn’t begin to address what may need to be done going forward.

adox · 16-09-2019 7:55pm

jam_mac_jam wrote: »

Other packaging is more expensive so yes the consumer will have to pay a couple of pence more for it. This is why there is plastic everywhere, the only way to stop people using so much is give them a choice in what they buy or charge the real cost of dealing with all the rubbish which the consumer is not currently paying.

The alternatives are no longer more expensive or if they are, it is negligible.
The problem is, there isn’t a real alternative for a large amount of plastic products currently.

adox · 16-09-2019 7:56pm

beggars_bush wrote: »

Aldi are brutal for packaging
literally none of their yoghurt, crisps and a range of stuff is recyclable

I don’t think any crisp packets are recyclable.

Dravokivich · 16-09-2019 8:01pm

FFVII wrote: »

Greenland is black now and it's snowing plastic in the arctic.

Incinerate me hole, where do you think it goes!!!!

Ask the Japanese.

Wanderer78 · 17-09-2019 5:07am

Has our free market really been all that free?

Del.Monte · 17-09-2019 9:32am

Dravokivich wrote: »

Ask the Japanese.

Care to let us all in on this?

is_that_so · 17-09-2019 9:38am

cfuserkildare wrote: »

The big problem is,

What alternative choice is there??

How else is normal shampoo, or washing liquid, or most other products sold now packaged?

And how many normal people have the option of buying a greener alternative??

The problem really is litter and how many of these bottles end up where they shouldn't be.

Wanderer78 · 17-09-2019 10:59am

Del.Monte wrote:

Care to let us all in on this?

Japan has been successfully running incinerators for decades

Dravokivich · 17-09-2019 11:43am

Del.Monte wrote: »

Care to let us all in on this?

Waste is always going to be generated. Japan use it as a fuel source, instead of burning it off as additional carbon waste.

It'll have ecological benifits, such as less need to source other fuel sources.

...or we could use more emissions to export it, but'll more than likely just dump it somewhere.

Del.Monte · 17-09-2019 1:52pm

Dravokivich wrote: »

Waste is always going to be generated. Japan use it as a fuel source, instead of burning it off as additional carbon waste.

It'll have ecological benifits, such as less need to source other fuel sources.

...or we could use more emissions to export it, but'll more than likely just dump it somewhere.

Okay, but isn't that what is already happening at the Poolbeg incinerator in Dublin and the Indaver plant at Duleek in County Louth?

Wanderer78 · 17-09-2019 2:13pm

Del.Monte wrote: »

Okay, but isn't that what is already happening at the Poolbeg incinerator in Dublin and the Indaver plant at Duleek in County Louth?

we need more incinerators operating in the country

Del.Monte · 17-09-2019 7:16pm

Wanderer78 wrote: »

we need more incinerators operating in the country

Have a read of this: https://www.alternative-energy-news.info/negative-impacts-waste-to-energy/

FFVII · 17-09-2019 8:48pm

Dravokivich wrote: »

Ask the Japanese.

https://www.japan.go.jp/tomodachi/2015/winter2015/advanced_waste_disposal_technology.html

Multiple provisions are made to prevent gases and harmful substances emitted during incineration, such as sulfur oxide and particulate matter, from being emitted outside the facilities. Chimneys of waste incineration plants emit vapor—not smoke—that does not contain harmful substances.

If this bit is true (and I doubt it is but thats just me cuz all these things turn out to be bullsh1t or worse in the end) then this is good.

8000 tonnes of waste a day though and it's down nearly by half since 1989, wtf were they at in 1989!!!!

I can't be arsed looking up how many countries have these ones but I'd say it's small - the water flowing down off the Himalayas has plastic in it because of these things.

25-09-2019 8:20pm

Wanderer78 wrote: »

Has our free market really been all that free?

I haven't experienced any shortages of goods I want so its been pretty good to me.

Wanderer78 · 26-09-2019 5:43am

salonfire wrote:

I haven't experienced any shortages of goods I want so its been pretty good to me.

But environmentally speaking, has it really been good for us, and are we now just over producing beyond our planets capacity to do so?

realitykeeper · 25-12-2019 2:02am

Rwanda has recently passed draft legislation that will eventually lead to a ban on the manufacture, sale, importation and use of single use plastics. They have had a ban on plastics bags for a decade now and that policy was a success so the gradual ban on single use plastics will be watched with interest by other countries considering a similar legislation. https://www.downtoearth.org.in/news/waste/going-surgical-on-plastics-in-rwanda-68446
I think ambitious policies are a good idea, especially where the environment is concerned.

bilbot79 · 25-12-2019 3:17am

An Inconvenient Truth - we should not adorn every s*** that our pets do with its own plastic bag in order to protect our children's health and keep the pavements clean.

Poo bags are a disaster seriously. Covering something in plastic that rapidly decomposes anyway??

What about cows***, fox's***, rabbits*** and deers***? Why does dogs*** require a plastic bag?

Bring back the 80s

Wanderer78 · 25-12-2019 10:06am

bilbot79 wrote:

Bring back the 80s

What about bringing forward the 20's!

As above, there's nothing stopping us from banning single use plastics

Single Use Plastics

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