first time buyer

cinnamonsticks · 13-11-2020 11:37pm #1

HI All

I am complete novice in buying a home. Need advice please.

So i have spotted a house i am interested in

I rang the estate agent for a viewing, whilst on the call she told me an offer had been made on the property which was 3k below asking price.
She said bidder No.1 as we call them is organising a survey for Friday gone (6th Oct) and could fit me in for a viewing that day before they arrive.

So i like the property and give a verbal and email (written) offer of asking price.
I am still in process of finishing off mortgage documents from the bank - payslips/savings/salary cert from work/existing car loan whats left to pay off etc)which im told can take 10-15 days once received.

i have spoke with my bank and have been told they cant see a problem with the mortgage request (loan compared to my salary) but it still has to go through the channels etc

Anyways 4 days went by Saturday to Tuesday (4pm) and i had heard nothing back from the estate agent so i called her as i really want the house the location suits me perfectly and the property itself.

I speak to her and she says a new bidder "Bidder No.2" has now made an offer of 2k over asking price. I ask why wasn't i told. She says oh its all just happened suddenly. I ask was the initial Bidder informed and she says no not yet.

I ask has the owner been informed and again "no its all just happened recently"

So i say ok i will put offer 2k more than last offer verbally over phone and also sent a email stating same.

I called today for an update and was told "they are waiting on the surveyor report from original bidder first" and also that the owner has been made aware of my offer but no response on it as in accepted etc

MY QUESTION IS

When someone gets a survey done on the house does that mean i cannot bid ? does it mean all action stops til the results of that survey come back to the initial bidder ?

Should my offer be forwarded straight to the owner as soon as possible ? i.e. with in the day /couple of days ?

Also should the person who has got the survey done be updated on the latest bidding immediately ?

And one last question - if i for example put an offer in , and it is accepted , i then move towards getting a survey done which i believe can be 2-300 euro ? and then they accept another offer do i just lose my 2-300 euro ?

any feedback appreciated i have tried googling but google is too vague for that questions.

Thanks

KaneToad · 13-11-2020 11:44pm

A survey means nothing in relation to 'securing' the sale. The Irish system is a joke...both parties can pull out - at any stage - up until contract signing.

It doesn't matter that you've already spent €€€'s on surveys/engineer reports/solicitor fees.

My advice would be not to get too hung up on one house. There will always be another house suitable for you. Buy with your head, not your heart. The process is so fickle that you are as well to keep a few properties on the go for consideration.

13-11-2020 11:46pm

Bidding continues until no more higher bids are received and the seller agrees to the sale. A survey means nothing during the bidding process, I would be surprised if a survey is being arranged while bidding is still ongoing. Yes, you do lose the cost of the survey if you are not successful in buying the property, it is your choice to pay for it.

To be honest, without a formal mortgage approval, I’m not sure that your bid will be accepted by the vendor, certainly you are a less appealing bidder than someone with approval or a cash buyer.

hurleronditch · 13-11-2020 11:51pm

The survey is an irrelevance, it may be a tactic by bidder 1 to show their seriousness but it holds no water if you can show means you outbid them. What you’re doing is fine and correct.

An estate agent may not like you bidding if you’re not fully mortgage approved, we bid on a few houses before we secured ours, and one big brand firm said they couldn’t recognise our bid unless we sent a copy of our mortgage approval. I told her to get lost, why would I tell the representative of the seller what my spending capacity was. She reneged quick enough.

CarMc · 13-11-2020 11:53pm

All sounds a bit odd, normally you only get a survey done after your offer is accepted as they cost roughly €400 so you don’t get one on every house you bid on,

And yes your bids should be communicated to the seller and the ‘under bidders’ immediately,

Also you shouldn’t be bidding on houses until you have mortgage approval.

13-11-2020 11:55pm

KaneToad wrote: »

A survey means nothing in relation to 'securing' the sale. The Irish system is a joke...both parties can pull out - at any stage - up until contract signing.

It doesn't matter that you've already spent €€€'s on surveys/engineer reports/solicitor fees.

My advice would be not to get too hung up on one house. There will always be another house suitable for you. Buy with your head, not your heart. The process is so fickle that you are as well to keep a few properties on the go for consideration.

A survey/engineers report isn’t a legal requirement.

The alternative would be to tie a buyer to the sale pre-contract, that could carry huge risk and expense. There is no commitment until a legal contract is signed, that allows both parties to walk away, which can be a benefit as well as a hindrance. People sometimes change their mind and circumstances change.

cinnamonsticks · 13-11-2020 11:58pm

HI Guys

thanks the above is kind of how i understood it too.

The seller may choose to go with a lower bid than mine "bird in the hand " i would be the same, especially if the risk/reward is not much.

I should have noted this property to my knowledge is up for around one year, and the initial bidder No.1 was organizing the surveyor before i came in , officially i'm bidder no.2 and then after me is bidder no.3

I agree totally tho on that if a offer is accepted and the buyer starts spending money i.e. surveyor solicitor etc then if the seller changes their mind or sells to someone else then they should have to cover them costs imo ( i know thats not how it works tho ) its a bad set up and im sure in really rural parts of the country where there is one surveyor and one estate agent there must be shenanigans happening.

14-11-2020 12:24am

cinnamonsticks wrote: »

HI Guys

thanks the above is kind of how i understood it too.

The seller may choose to go with a lower bid than mine "bird in the hand " i would be the same, especially if the risk/reward is not much.

I should have noted this property to my knowledge is up for around one year, and the initial bidder No.1 was organizing the surveyor before i came in , officially i'm bidder no.2 and then after me is bidder no.3

I agree totally tho on that if a offer is accepted and the buyer starts spending money i.e. surveyor solicitor etc then if the seller changes their mind or sells to someone else then they should have to cover them costs imo ( i know thats not how it works tho ) its a bad set up and im sure in really rural parts of the country where there is one surveyor and one estate agent there must be shenanigans happening.

Do you think a sale agreed buyer who pulls out pre-contract should have to compensate the seller for the legal costs/re-advertisement costs/any loss incurred by the property seller if the property sells later for less than the previous underbidder was willing to pay? Perhaps the buyer should have to forfeit the booking deposit.

Due to difficulties with drawing down mortgages at the moment, I suspect buyers pull out of sales a lot more than sellers do.

The current situation isn’t perfect, but binding both parties to the deal before contracts are signed is fair on neither.

cinnamonsticks · 14-11-2020 2:32am

Actually i see your point when you say it like that.

poker--addict · 14-11-2020 2:35am

KaneToad wrote: »

Buy with your head, not your heart.

Best advice so far.

The auctioneer story could be true, but it does sound a bit weird. House for sale for over 1 year, you express an interest and someone else is already doing a survey on a house before it is sale agreed (unusual). And suddenly there is a 3rd person interested.

Is it possible the auctioneer knows you REALLY like the property and may be working very well for the owner and not very well for you?

I would look at another few properties, and dont get sucked into any nonsense just because you like a single property.

cinnamonsticks · 14-11-2020 1:47pm

Yes to the above. I made a blunder. As mentioned above by hurleronditch

I sent my letter from the bank the "approved in Principle" showing exactly how much i was subject to checks approved for.

so she knows my limit for the property which is double the asking price (as i am doing a purchase to renovate mortgage) basically 50% property value and 50% renovations loan.

i was super hyped for the property but my emotions have gone off the boil after the dealings with the estate agent. It feels like i have made a genuine offer (i even offered a 2k deposit/down payment that they could keep should my mortgage not go through if they just wait 2 week while my paper work is finalised just to show i was a genuine bidder and not there to waste anyones time) and she basically said that means nothing to anyone and said no.

As i say this is my first time buying a house so literally have zero knowledge on how these things work

poker--addict · 14-11-2020 1:52pm

Live and learn.

If you believe you made a genuine offer then stick with it, if someone else makes a bigger genuine offer, good luck to them. Next house.

Given auctioneer knows your status, don’t be afraid to play hardball/cold (Firm/hardball and being a dick are two different things and don’t be afraid to be firm. It’s business).

Dolbhad · 14-11-2020 9:35pm

cinnamonsticks wrote: »

HI All

I am complete novice in buying a home. Need advice please.

So i have spotted a house i am interested in

I rang the estate agent for a viewing, whilst on the call she told me an offer had been made on the property which was 3k below asking price.
She said bidder No.1 as we call them is organising a survey for Friday gone (6th Oct) and could fit me in for a viewing that day before they arrive.

So i like the property and give a verbal and email (written) offer of asking price.
I am still in process of finishing off mortgage documents from the bank - payslips/savings/salary cert from work/existing car loan whats left to pay off etc)which im told can take 10-15 days once received.

i have spoke with my bank and have been told they cant see a problem with the mortgage request (loan compared to my salary) but it still has to go through the channels etc
Anyways 4 days went by Saturday to Tuesday (4pm) and i had heard nothing back from the estate agent so i called her as i really want the house the location suits me perfectly and the property itself.

I speak to her and she says a new bidder "Bidder No.2" has now made an offer of 2k over asking price. I ask why wasn't i told. She says oh its all just happened suddenly. I ask was the initial Bidder informed and she says no not yet.

I ask has the owner been informed and again "no its all just happened recently"

So i say ok i will put offer 2k more than last offer verbally over phone and also sent a email stating same.

I called today for an update and was told "they are waiting on the surveyor report from original bidder first" and also that the owner has been made aware of my offer but no response on it as in accepted etc

MY QUESTION IS

When someone gets a survey done on the house does that mean i cannot bid ? does it mean all action stops til the results of that survey come back to the initial bidder ?

Should my offer be forwarded straight to the owner as soon as possible ? i.e. with in the day /couple of days ?

Also should the person who has got the survey done be updated on the latest bidding immediately ?

And one last question - if i for example put an offer in , and it is accepted , i then move towards getting a survey done which i believe can be 2-300 euro ? and then they accept another offer do i just lose my 2-300 euro ?

any feedback appreciated i have tried googling but google is too vague for that questions.

Thanks

We had something similar happen. We have bid on a lot of houses over last 18 months (most we were unsuccessful)

We were bidding on a house and were highest bidder when a cash buyer came along and the seller took that offer. We didn’t get a chance to counter bid. Equally I once enquires about a viewing and was told it was sale agreed but deposit not paid yet so we could view/bid.

I asked my solicitor about it. Once a house is sale agreed and a deposit is paid, the auctioneer can’t show the house to any new people seeking to view. Ideally a seller should not dump you for a higher offer but they can. Our solicitor said we could place a higher bid than the cash buyer and the auctioneer would be obliged to bring it to sellers attention but we didn’t bother.

Also looked at a doer upper and had to go out with a tradesperson/engineer. The auctioneer wouldn’t accept a bid or booking deposit without it so we knew what we were getting into and weren’t going to go back and renegotiate the sale price on receipt of engineers report.

Until contracts are signed either party can pull out at any time. The seller can dump you for another purchaser and you will have incurred legal and engineering costs. Equally if you weren’t happy with the report or a better house came on the market, you can dump the seller and move on.

14-11-2020 9:52pm

Dolbhad wrote: »

I asked my solicitor about it. Once a house is sale agreed and a deposit is paid, the auctioneer can’t show the house to any new people seeking to view. Ideally a seller should not dump you for a higher offer but they can. Our solicitor said we could place a higher bid than the cash buyer and the auctioneer would be obliged to bring it to sellers attention but we didn’t bother.

That’s interesting, I wouldn’t have thought either of those things are legally required when sale agreed.

Dolbhad · 14-11-2020 11:29pm

Dav010 wrote: »

That’s interesting, I wouldn’t have thought either of those things are legally required when sale agreed.

It seems once the house is sale agreed and deposit paid, if someone who had viewed the house or had placed a bid and dropped out but decide to place a bid to beat the sale agreed price, that the auctioneer needs to bring it to the attention of the seller. Otherwise they cannot show the house to others.

But unless your bid is significantly higher than the sale agreed or it’s just gone sale agreed and not much process is made, the seller may just stay with the current purchase.

14-11-2020 11:57pm

Dolbhad wrote: »

It seems once the house is sale agreed and deposit paid, if someone who had viewed the house or had placed a bid and dropped out but decide to place a bid to beat the sale agreed price, that the auctioneer needs to bring it to the attention of the seller. Otherwise they cannot show the house to others.

But unless your bid is significantly higher than the sale agreed or it’s just gone sale agreed and not much process is made, the seller may just stay with the current purchase.

Where are you getting that from?

A “sale agreed” is no more than an informal agreement, until contracts are signed the deposit is fully refundable, the agreement has no legal standing.

Edgware · 15-11-2020 12:18am

The property is on the market for a year and once you show an interest another person suddenly goes off getting a survey and another bidder appears on the scene!
Make up your mind exactly how much you are willing to pay. If these"other" bidders go above that walk away. Don't be fooled into chasing bids

Dolbhad · 15-11-2020 5:36am

Dav010 wrote: »

Where are you getting that from?

A “sale agreed” is no more than an informal agreement, until contracts are signed the deposit is fully refundable, the agreement has no legal standing.

If you read my earlier post I did say until contracts are signed either party can withdraw. I was discussing what normally happens once sale agreed if another person wants to view the house or place a bid (so the purchaser who is sale agreed is guzumped). It was my solicitor who explained the common practice of what happens but as I also outlined, until contracts are signed, a seller can pull out of a sale and go with another purchaser.

hurleronditch · 15-11-2020 8:15am

Dolbhad wrote: »

It seems once the house is sale agreed and deposit paid, if someone who had viewed the house or had placed a bid and dropped out but decide to place a bid to beat the sale agreed price, that the auctioneer needs to bring it to the attention of the seller. Otherwise they cannot show the house to others.

But unless your bid is significantly higher than the sale agreed or it’s just gone sale agreed and not much process is made, the seller may just stay with the current purchase.

There is nothing of that sort that the agent “cannot” do!! Can not and should not are two totally different things. What you have described is the common understanding of what broadly should happen, but these things frequently get pushed and twisted. Agents broadly get an unwarranted bad name, and whilst most of them are straight up with prospective buyers these phantom rules you seem to be implying are in place simply are not. The agents role is to get the biggest price that is certain of execution for their client, the seller. Assuming as a potential buyer than an agent won’t go down the blindside at the last minute is nonsense.

Darc19 · 15-11-2020 9:07am

Dolbhad wrote: »

If you read my earlier post I did say until contracts are signed either party can withdraw. I was discussing what normally happens once sale agreed if another person wants to view the house or place a bid (so the purchaser who is sale agreed is guzumped). It was my solicitor who explained the common practice of what happens but as I also outlined, until contracts are signed, a seller can pull out of a sale and go with another purchaser.

You are mixing up "gentleman's agreement" and legality.

A decent estate agent will take it off the market when sale agreed, but there is absolutely nothing whatsoever to stop additional viewings and offers once the seller permits it.

An agent must follow the directions of the seller (assuming the directions are permitted)

I was selling an investment property a few years ago and the buyer kept coming up with excuses not to sign. So I instructed the agent to inform people that I'd be open to counter offers.

Got a counter offer at the same price and took it. Original buyer kicked up, but was his own fault.

Dolbhad · 15-11-2020 9:54am

Darc19 wrote: »

You are mixing up "gentleman's agreement" and legality.

A decent estate agent will take it off the market when sale agreed, but there is absolutely nothing whatsoever to stop additional viewings and offers once the seller permits it.

An agent must follow the directions of the seller (assuming the directions are permitted)

I was selling an investment property a few years ago and the buyer kept coming up with excuses not to sign. So I instructed the agent to inform people that I'd be open to counter offers.

Got a counter offer at the same price and took it. Original buyer kicked up, but was his own fault.

I am not mixing them up. I’m pretty clear about it.
I’ve never said legally they have to do x, y and z but how it works in practice and how I’ve found in my experience on a few properties what has happened.

15-11-2020 11:30am

Dolbhad wrote: »

I am not mixing them up. I’m pretty clear about it.
I’ve never said legally they have to do x, y and z but how it works in practice and how I’ve found in my experience on a few properties what has happened.

Just to be clear, which one of these are you claiming is correct, that going sale agreed places no legal restrictions on whether an auctioneer can continue to show the property to new bidders, or as you have claimed below, and in your first post, that the auctioneer cannot show the property to new bidders and has to brings bids to the vendor after it goes sale agreed.?

Dolbhad wrote: »

It seems once the house is sale agreed and deposit paid........ Otherwise they cannot show the house to others.
.

Dolbhad wrote: »

I asked my solicitor about it. Once a house is sale agreed and a deposit is paid, the auctioneer can’t show the house to any new people seeking to view.

To my knowledge, there is nothing to prohibit an auctioneer continuing to market/show the property up to the point where the contracts are signed. Though most do inform new bidders that the property is sale agreed and do not continue to show the house, that is not the same as saying they cannot continue new viewings.

antoinolachtnai · 15-11-2020 12:13pm

In practice ‘sale agreed’ means that the vender has chosen a preferred purchaser and no further bids are being invited and for that reason no further viewings are being carried out. This is not legally binding. It’s just a practice.

poker--addict · 15-11-2020 1:07pm

And to accept a higher bid would usually net the auctioneer pennies compared to the cost of a bad rep if done frequently.

antoinolachtnai · 15-11-2020 1:26pm

poker--addict wrote: »

And to accept a higher bid would usually net the auctioneer pennies compared to the cost of a bad rep if done frequently.

Estate agents don’t accept or reject bids. The seller does. The estate agent may well have a practice of not soliciting bids, and late bids are not a good thing for the agent because they slow down the sale, but if he gets one nonetheless, he must make it known to the seller.

poker--addict · 15-11-2020 1:27pm

Ok. Replace accept with seek. Same point. They don’t routinely like to go down the road. Of course it’s sellers decision.

Dolbhad · 15-11-2020 2:09pm

Dav010 wrote: »

Just to be clear, which one of these are you claiming is correct, that going sale agreed places no legal restrictions on whether an auctioneer can continue to show the property to new bidders, or as you have claimed below, and in your first post, that the auctioneer cannot show the property to new bidders and has to brings bids to the vendor after it goes sale agreed.?

To my knowledge, there is nothing to prohibit an auctioneer continuing to market/show the property up to the point where the contracts are signed. Though most do inform new bidders that the property is sale agreed and do not continue to show the house, that is not the same as saying they cannot continue new viewings.

Having have a few of this circumstances myself and asking my solicitor on the house, what I was saying is:

1. Obviously until contracts are signed by both parties, it’s not legally binding and anyone can withdraw from the sale.

2. What happens it appears in practice is once sale agreed and deposit paid, the auctioneer does not show the house to new potential purchasers. As I outlined in a previous message, I was enquired about a viewing and auctioneer said it was sale agreed but deposit was not paid yet so he would show the house to us.

3. Once deposit is paid, if someone who has Viewed the house or placed bids comes back with a further bid, they should bring the offer to the purchaser.

As I also said, recently we were bidding on a house and were the highest bid until a cash buyer came along and they want sale agreed. We didn’t get the chance to place a further bid and would have as we had the money. Our solicitor said we can put in the offer and auctioneer would need to ask the seller so they want to take the offer. However we didn’t bother as I can understand a seller taking a cash buyer. We also lost a bid on a house even though we were the highest bid to a cash buyer who had a lower offer.

To the original post I was responding to where they asked about engineers report and where the status was, I was highlighting what they could do which is put in another offer and ensure the seller is aware of it.

brisan · 24-11-2020 4:46pm

poker--addict wrote: »

Best advice so far.

The auctioneer story could be true, but it does sound a bit weird. House for sale for over 1 year, you express an interest and someone else is already doing a survey on a house before it is sale agreed (unusual). And suddenly there is a 3rd person interested.

Is it possible the auctioneer knows you REALLY like the property and may be working very well for the owner and not very well for you?

I would look at another few properties, and dont get sucked into any nonsense just because you like a single property.

The EA is only working for the vendor
They have no interest in who buys the house once they can pay
I would have serious reservations as to weather the other 2 bidders actually exist
Put in a bid you are happy with
If its not accepted walk away
The other supposed bidders may have trouble finalizing finance drawdown so keep an eye on the property

brisan · 24-11-2020 5:23pm

hurleronditch wrote: »

There is nothing of that sort that the agent “cannot” do!! Can not and should not are two totally different things. What you have described is the common understanding of what broadly should happen, but these things frequently get pushed and twisted. Agents broadly get an unwarranted bad name, and whilst most of them are straight up with prospective buyers these phantom rules you seem to be implying are in place simply are not. The agents role is to get the biggest price that is certain of execution for their client, the seller. Assuming as a potential buyer than an agent won’t go down the blindside at the last minute is nonsense.

I would not be certain of that

24-11-2020 5:27pm

brisan wrote: »

I would have serious reservations as to weather the other 2 bidders actually exist

What are these “serious reservations” based on?

brisan · 24-11-2020 5:31pm

Dav010 wrote: »

What are these “serious reservations” based on?

The fact that the property sat idle for a year and then once the OP showed an interest 2 other interested parties arrived to the dance
Surely you are not that naïve
Ever heard of bidding against the wall in an auction room ??
Ever heard of an underbidder being asked to put his bid in again as the highest bidder pulled out ,
It can happen but with certain EAs it happens more often

24-11-2020 5:40pm

brisan wrote: »

The fact that the property sat idle for a year and then once the OP showed an interest 2 other interested parties arrived to the dance
Surely you are not that naïve
Ever heard of bidding against the wall in an auction room ??
Ever heard of an underbidder being asked to put his bid in again as the highest bidder pulled out ,
It can happen but with certain EAs it happens more often

I’ve heard of it, it is often claimed on here, just that no one has ever been able to substantiate it.

To be honest, I’ve looked at properties and waited to see if the owner will drop the price more, then bid on them when someone else showed interest.

brisan · 24-11-2020 5:43pm

Dav010 wrote: »

I’ve heard of it, it is often claimed on here, just that no one has ever been able to substantiate it.

To be honest, I’ve looked at properties and waited to see if the owner will drop the price more, then bid on them when someone else showed interest.

When we as property flippers had to deal with a certain EA we would bid with the EA and then put our bid in writing and drop it into the vendors door
EA never happy about it but he knew we knew the games he played

brisan · 24-11-2020 5:47pm

Dav010 wrote: »

I’ve heard of it, it is often claimed on here, just that no one has ever been able to substantiate it.

To be honest, I’ve looked at properties and waited to see if the owner will drop the price more, then bid on them when someone else showed interest.

How do you know if someone else genuinely showed interest
In areas where properties move quickly fair enough ,but this property was on the market for over a year and no interest
Granted deals fall through because of surveys ,mortgage approval failures ,change of circumstances but I have found it happens more regularly with some EAs than others
2 spring to mind straight away
it cannot be substantiate because EAs cover their tracks
They are supposed to keep a record of all bids on all properties
I and others have asked to see the book, invariably told its away being updated ,or its in Paul desk and he is out ,or its in the bosses office and he is out at meeting

24-11-2020 6:47pm

brisan wrote: »

How do you know if someone else genuinely showed interest
In areas where properties move quickly fair enough ,but this property was on the market for over a year and no interest
Granted deals fall through because of surveys ,mortgage approval failures ,change of circumstances but I have found it happens more regularly with some EAs than others
2 spring to mind straight away
it cannot be substantiate because EAs cover their tracks
They are supposed to keep a record of all bids on all properties
I and others have asked to see the book, invariably told its away being updated ,or its in Paul desk and he is out ,or its in the bosses office and he is out at meeting

Reading the opening post, the op is actually the second bidder, not the first. Using your logic, the existing bidder could have come here claiming the op isn’t real.

This pops up every now and again, usually from the same posters, yet no one seems to have anything other than mere speculation. You have “serious reservations”, but the op was informed from the off that another bid is on the table, why would you have reservations about this? Is it unusual?

brisan · 24-11-2020 6:55pm

Dav010 wrote: »

Reading the opening post, the op is actually the second bidder, not the first. Using your logic, the existing bidder could have come here claiming the op isn’t real.

This pops up every now and again, usually from the same posters, yet no one seems to have anything other than mere speculation. You have “serious reservations”, but the op was informed from the off that another bid is on the table, why would you have reservations about this? Is it unusual?

The OP was told he was the second bidder
Weather he is or not is open to question in my mind

24-11-2020 7:06pm

brisan wrote: »

The OP was told he was the second bidder
Weather he is or not is open to question in my mind

Why?

As “property flippers”, is there only ever one bidder on the properties you sell?

brisan · 24-11-2020 7:52pm

Dav010 wrote: »

Why?

As “property flippers”, is there only ever one bidder on the properties you sell?

No
No point in flipping properties in areas where there would be little or no interest
At times we have gone sale agreed before finishing or going near an EA
Little interest in properties we are buying because the money needed to upgrade them would not be advanced by banks and most of the prospective purchasers would not have the savings to commission the work themselves

24-11-2020 7:57pm

brisan wrote: »

No
No point in flipping properties in areas where there would be little or no interest
At times we have gone sale agreed before finishing or going near an EA
Little interest in properties we are buying because the money needed to upgrade them would not be advanced by banks and most of the prospective purchasers would not have the savings to commission the work themselves

So if someone new were to enquire after a bid is made that you haven't yet accepted, would you/your EA inform the new bidder of the existing bid, or do you just say there is no bid on it and no interest in it?

brisan · 24-11-2020 8:02pm

Dav010 wrote: »

So if someone new were to enquire after a bid is made that you haven't yet accepted, would you/your EA inform the new bidder of the existing bid, or do you just say there is no bid on it and no interest in it?

Of course once no bid is accepted by the vendor all bidders should be kept abreast of all genuine bids as should the vendor
Once a bid has been accepted ,no new bids should be allowed
I certainty would not accept a new bid after going sale agreed

24-11-2020 8:10pm

brisan wrote: »

Of course once no bid is accepted by the vendor all bidders should be kept abreast of all genuine bids as should the vendor
Once a bid has been accepted ,no new bids should be allowed
I certainty would not accept a new bid after going sale agreed

You can see where I'm going with this? The EA informed the op from the off that there was an existing bid of 3k below asking (which has not been accepted apparently), you would keep bidders "abreast" of bids when they enquire, yet paradoxically, you have "serious reservations" that another bid exists on the property the op is interested in when the EA does just that.

brisan · 24-11-2020 8:21pm

Dav010 wrote: »

You can see where I'm going with this? The EA informed the op from the off that there was an existing bid of 3k below asking (which has not been accepted apparently), you would keep bidders "abreast" of bids when they enquire, yet paradoxically, you have "serious reservations" that another bid exists on the property the op is interested in when the EA does just that.

The property was on the market a while with no bids
The OP enquires and suddenly a bidder is getting a survey done
Why would you get a survey done unless your bid was accepted
If the bid was accepted why would the EA take more bids
Legally nothing stopping him but bad business practice

24-11-2020 8:28pm

brisan wrote: »

The property was on the market a while with no bids
The OP enquires and suddenly a bidder is getting a survey done
Why would you get a survey done unless your bid was accepted
If the bid was accepted why would the EA take more bids
Legally nothing stopping him but bad business practice

But there was a bid on it, why are you saying there wasn’t? You said yourself that you would keep new bidders abreast of any existing bids, that is what has happened here.

brisan · 24-11-2020 8:45pm

Dav010 wrote: »

But there was a bid on it, why are you saying there wasn’t? You said yourself that you would keep new bidders abreast of any existing bids, that is what has happened here.

I just find it hard to imagine that
A Two bids arrive in a short space of time after months of no bids
B Bidder doing a survey when his bid has not been accepted potentially throwing 300-500 euro down the tubes

Have you ever or would you ever get a survey done on a house when your bid has not been accepted ??

24-11-2020 8:57pm

brisan wrote: »

I just find it hard to imagine that
A Two bids arrive in a short space of time after months of no bids
B Bidder doing a survey when his bid has not been accepted potentially throwing 300-500 euro down the tubes

Have you ever or would you ever get a survey done on a house when your bid has not been accepted ??

I wouldn’t, but it is conceivable that the bidder, mistakenly, didn’t expect another bidder.

I also wouldn’t do what the op did and put a bid on a property without being mortgage approved.

That is not to say that both didn’t happen though.

brisan · 24-11-2020 9:00pm

Dav010 wrote: »

I wouldn’t, but it is conceivable that the bidder, mistakenly, didn’t expect another bidder.

I also wouldn’t do what the op did and put a bid on a property without being mortgage approved.

That is not to say that both didn’t happen though.

Why did the EA let the first bidder get a surveyor in ?
Surely with covid restrictions ( and the fact the bid was not accepted ) the EA should not have allowed this
Why did the EA accept a bid without looking for AIP from the OP
Most EAs will not even allow a viewing without seeing AIP
Plenty of evidence of this in the currently buying or selling thread
Just seems off to me

24-11-2020 9:10pm

brisan wrote: »

Why did the EA let the first bidder get a surveyor in ?
Surely with covid restrictions ( and the fact the bid was not accepted ) the EA should not have allowed this
Why did the EA accept a bid without looking for AIP from the OP
Most EAs will not even allow a viewing without seeing AIP
Plenty of evidence of this in the currently buying or selling thread
Just seems off to me

Having AIP is not a legal requirement to make a bid, so it’s up to the vendor whether or not they want to consider bids without it. The other bidder could be a cash buyer or has AIP. What Covid restrictions prevent a survey?, property business was exempted from restrictions, though I’m not sure if that is still the case.

“seems off to me” = “severe reservations”?

brisan · 24-11-2020 9:29pm

Dav010 wrote: »

Having AIP is not a legal requirement to make a bid, so it’s up to the vendor whether or not they want to consider bids without it. The other bidder could be a cash buyer or has AIP. What Covid restrictions prevent a survey?, property business was exempted from restrictions, though I’m not sure if that is still the case.

“seems off to me” = “severe reservations”?

You seem to like putting words in my mouth to back up your assertions
At no point did I say it was a legal requirement ,they were your words and your words alone
I said most EAs will look for proof of funds or AIP before allowing a viewing in the current pandemic ,and there is anecdotal evidence of the same on another thread
I never said the covid restrictions prevented a survey .that is you again putting words in my mouth to back up your assertions
I said surely the EA should not have allowed this as visitors to another property are limited at this time
A quick glance at thousands of ads on Myhome or Daft will verify this where the EA has a strict set of protocols to allow a viewing
A survey from a bidder who has not had a bid accepted is wasteful of the bidders money and totally unnecessary

24-11-2020 9:45pm

brisan wrote: »

You seem to like putting words in my mouth to back up your assertions
At no point did I say it was a legal requirement ,they were your words and your words alone
I said most EAs will look for proof of funds or AIP before allowing a viewing in the current pandemic ,and there is anecdotal evidence of the same on another thread
I never said the covid restrictions prevented a survey .that is you again putting words in my mouth to back up your assertions
I said surely the EA should not have allowed this as visitors to another property are limited at this time
A quick glance at thousands of ads on Myhome or Daft will verify this where the EA has a strict set of protocols to allow a viewing
A survey from a bidder who has not had a bid accepted is wasteful of the bidders money and totally unnecessary

So there is no restriction on a survey being done, no requirement to have AIP to make a bid, nothing to stop a bidder having a survey done, you yourself would keep bidders abreast of existing bids, and the EA told the op from the outset that there is a bid of 3k under asking, but you have “serious reservations” that there is another bidder.

Logical?

brisan · 24-11-2020 10:19pm

Logical to waste 3-500 euro on a survey you have not had a bid accepted on
Maybe in your world ,but in the sensible world it does not happen
Again you are putting words in my mouth to back up your own arguments
I never said there were legal restrictions I said EAs were placing restrictions
If you cant comprehend that and are intent on continuing a failing and stupid argument there is no point in continuing the argument
I have my reservations based o 38 years buying over 40 properties both as homes and investments and dealing with multiple EAs
You have yours based on your own experiences

24-11-2020 10:26pm

brisan wrote: »

Logical to waste 3-500 euro on a survey you have not had a bid accepted on
Maybe in your world ,but in the sensible world it does not happen
Again you are putting words in my mouth to back up your own arguments
I never said there were legal restrictions I said EAs were placing restrictions
If you cant comprehend that and are intent on continuing a failing and stupid argument there is no point in continuing the argument
I have my reservations based o 38 years buying over 40 properties both as homes and investments and dealing with multiple EAs
You have yours based on your own experiences

I do, that is why I think your posts about phantom bidders and severe reservations are pointless because they are baseless. Not all bidders bid/act like experienced property buyers, that does not mean they don’t exist though. If a bidder wants to waste €500 or a vendor wants to consider a bid without AIP, so be it, you or I wouldn’t do it, but that comes with experience.

I think it is pretty stupid to on the one hand say you would inform a bidder of an existing bid, and then speculate that the bidders don’t exist when an EA informs the op of a bid 3k below asking. Nothing you have posted supports your view that other bidders don’t exist.

first time buyer

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