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County Council Advising Tenants to overhold !

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  • 13-01-2019 4:53pm
    #1
    Visconti
    Registered Users Posts: 301 ✭✭


    I gave tenants the required notice in 2018 and following that gave a further two months grace to find somewhere. I initiated proceedings with RTB just incase the tenants tried to overhold further.
    The tenants are happy to go but cant find anywhere.
    The council have told them if they become homeless the end of this month they will not be housed in a hotel or any other accommodation and advised the tenants to overhold till they find somewhere.
    Is this legal ? Can a county council advise tenants to break the law and in my opinion bully them into staying by saying they wont get a hotel or any form of accomadation?
    Seems crazy but this is Ireland.


Comments

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    #2
    Samuel T. Cogley
    Registered Users Posts: 10,684 ✭✭✭✭Samuel T. Cogley


    TBH everyone is united in screwing LLs and then wondering why we're all saying feck it, but I suppose from the other side, what do you do in a crisis?

    To answer your question I can't think of anything illegal about advising someone to over hold as mad as that is.


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    #3
    Gatling
    Registered Users Posts: 40,291 ✭✭✭✭Gatling


    Highly doubt the council told them to overhold ,the council can't help the tenants until they actually present as homeless and then it's up to them and their homeless unit to help accommodate them with emergency accomodation
    360_F_102352090_ie3kLjDIvgrT1sxVDknWCUh8PxgMYzM7.jpg




  • Options
    #4
    Fann Linn
    Registered Users Posts: 7,771 ✭✭✭Fann Linn


    Visconti wrote: »
    I gave tenants the required notice in 2018 and following that gave a further two months grace to find somewhere. I initiated proceedings with RTB just incase the tenants tried to overhold further.
    The tenants are happy to go but cant find anywhere.
    The council have told them if they become homeless the end of this month they will not be housed in a hotel or any other accommodation and advised the tenants to overhold till they find somewhere.
    Is this legal ? Can a county council advise tenants to break the law and in my opinion bully them into staying by saying they wont get a hotel or any form of accomadation?
    Seems crazy but this is Ireland.


    I'd say it was a county councillor.


  • Options
    #5
    Visconti
    Registered Users Posts: 301 ✭✭Visconti


    Samuel T. Cogley wrote: »
    TBH everyone is united in screwing LLs and then wondering why we're all saying feck it, but I suppose from the other side, what do you do in a crisis?

    To answer your question I can't think of anything illegal about advising someone to over hold as mad as that is.

    If I could get out I would. Feel like a slave to banks, tenants, government bodies , and any twat that can push a pen. I resent how landlords are being treated its disheartening.


  • Options
    #6
    Visconti
    Registered Users Posts: 301 ✭✭Visconti


    Fann Linn wrote: »
    I'd say it was a county councillor.

    Was a county council employee I believe the tenant, so thats where my taxes go to pay someone to screw me over.


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    #7
    Visconti
    Registered Users Posts: 301 ✭✭Visconti


    Gatling wrote: »
    Highly doubt the council told them to overhold ,the council can't help the tenants until they actually present as homeless and then it's up to them and their homeless unit to help accommodate them with emergency accomodation

    Genuinely believe the tenant it was the council.


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    #8
    4ensic15
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 4,691 ✭✭✭4ensic15


    I know a landlord who had a determination order in his favour from the RETB. The council advised the tenant to overhold. He had to get a solicitor and barrister involved.


  • Options
    #9
    Graces7
    Registered Users Posts: 32,634 ✭✭✭✭Graces7


    Visconti wrote: »
    Genuinely believe the tenant it was the council.

    It was. The rule is the same as in the UK,, watch the Slum Landlord series on youtube

    If you vacate a property then you are deemed to have made yourself homeless and therefore you do not qualify as an emergency homeless.

    So they tell tenants to wait to be evicted by bailiffs as then they are totally homeless and qualify for emergency housing.

    It is not overholding as such. Not wilfully so , Just to qualify for emergency council accommodation

    Threshold get accused of telling folk to overhold but they are simply trying to avoid them being left with no access to emergecny accommodation

    ie being on the street

    Down totally to the council this one


  • Options
    #10
    mrslancaster
    Registered Users Posts: 1,763 ✭✭✭mrslancaster


    Graces7 wrote: »

    It is not overholding as such. Not wilfully so , Just to qualify for emergency council accommodation

    Genuine question as to how the system works.

    How do tenants that overhold qualify as being homeless and does it mean that they will be included on a waiting list for social housing once they receive notice to leave?
    Or can the council just forget about them until they actually have nowhere to live?


  • Options
    #11
    4ensic15
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 4,691 ✭✭✭4ensic15


    mrslancaster wrote: »
    Genuine question as to how the system works.

    How do tenants that overhold qualify as being homeless and does it mean that they will be included on a waiting list for social housing once they receive notice to leave?
    Or can the council just forget about them until they actually have nowhere to live?

    They qualify as homeless when told the sheriff is on the way to take possession.


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    #12
    Gumbo
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 38,438 Mod ✭✭✭✭Gumbo


    Visconti wrote: »
    Genuinely believe the tenant it was the council.

    Tell them to get it in writing from them.


  • Options
    #13
    Gatling
    Registered Users Posts: 40,291 ✭✭✭✭Gatling


    Graces7 wrote: »

    If you vacate a property then you are deemed to have made yourself homeless and therefore you do not qualify as an emergency homeless.

    So they tell tenants to wait to be evicted by bailiffs as then they are totally homeless and qualify for emergency housing.

    It is not overholding as such. Not wilfully so , Just to qualify for emergency council accommodation

    Threshold get accused of telling folk to overhold but they are simply trying to avoid them being left with no access to emergecny accommodation

    ie being on the street

    Down totally to the council this one


    That's not how it works here ,to access local authorities homeless emergency accomodation you physically have to be homeless when you go to the county council before being sent to emergency accomodation,

    Overholding does not come into it ,it well documented staff at threshold advise people to over hold ,
    But you wouldn't get any help from your local authorities until you are homeless not refusing to leave
    360_F_102352090_ie3kLjDIvgrT1sxVDknWCUh8PxgMYzM7.jpg




  • Options
    #14
    dar100
    Registered Users Posts: 1,735 ✭✭✭dar100


    Graces7 wrote: »
    It was. The rule is the same as in the UK,, watch the Slum Landlord series on youtube

    If you vacate a property then you are deemed to have made yourself homeless and therefore you do not qualify as an emergency homeless.

    So they tell tenants to wait to be evicted by bailiffs as then they are totally homeless and qualify for emergency housing.

    It is not overholding as such. Not wilfully so , Just to qualify for emergency council accommodation

    Threshold get accused of telling folk to overhold but they are simply trying to avoid them being left with no access to emergecny accommodation

    ie being on the street

    Down totally to the council this one

    This information is incorrect. Once you have left a property regardless of how that happens, you are considered homeless. You can only access emergency accm once registered, EA is basically a hostel, You cant reg as homeless unless you have left a property.


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    #15
    Gumbo
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 38,438 Mod ✭✭✭✭Gumbo


    Graces7 wrote: »
    It was. The rule is the same as in the UK,, watch the Slum Landlord series on youtube

    If you vacate a property then you are deemed to have made yourself homeless and therefore you do not qualify as an emergency homeless.

    So they tell tenants to wait to be evicted by bailiffs as then they are totally homeless and qualify for emergency housing.

    It is not overholding as such. Not wilfully so , Just to qualify for emergency council accommodation

    Threshold get accused of telling folk to overhold but they are simply trying to avoid them being left with no access to emergecny accommodation

    ie being on the street

    Down totally to the council this one

    Incorrect


  • Options
    #16
    Graces7
    Registered Users Posts: 32,634 ✭✭✭✭Graces7


    Gatling wrote: »
    That's not how it works here ,to access local authorities homeless emergency accomodation you physically have to be homeless when you go to the county council before being sent to emergency accomodation,

    Overholding does not come into it ,it well documented staff at threshold advise people to over hold ,
    But you wouldn't get any help from your local authorities until you are homeless not refusing to leave

    :confused: You are interpreting overholding differently is all. as a sin not a safeguard Threshold tell tenants not to leave until they are forcibly evicted. As in under threat of not being eligible for council help .

    NB I trust Threshold from personal experience over many years to act with integrity and legality which is why I looked into this and am happy with my findings

    Over and out from me on this. Happy day


  • Options
    #17
    Gatling
    Registered Users Posts: 40,291 ✭✭✭✭Gatling


    Graces7 wrote: »
    Threshold tell tenants not to leave until they are forcibly evicted. As in under threat of not being eligible for council help .

    No they don't no county council can help you till you are actually homeless ,not a threat of homeless but actually on the street with no where to go ,

    Threshold advise to overhold in some weird attempt to stop someone becoming actual homeless leading to a worse situation
    360_F_102352090_ie3kLjDIvgrT1sxVDknWCUh8PxgMYzM7.jpg




  • Options
    #18
    the_syco
    Registered Users Posts: 37,295 ✭✭✭✭the_syco


    Graces7 wrote: »
    It was. The rule is the same as in the UK,, watch the Slum Landlord series on youtube
    No, it is not. In the UK, you need a piece of paper saying that you're homeless; you don't here.
    Graces7 wrote: »
    NB I trust Threshold from personal experience over many years to act with integrity and legality which is why I looked into this and am happy with my findings
    I think you're the only poster to put "Threshold" and "legal" into the same sentence.

    If you have "findings" supporting this from Ireland, link it.


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