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Seller unwilling to negotiate

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    #92
    jimmycrackcorm
    Registered Users Posts: 14,330 ✭✭✭✭jimmycrackcorm


    maestroamado wrote: »
    Any agent who cannot value a property is in my opinion a ****e agent.

    It's made quite easy nowadays when you can refer to property price register to see actual sale prices.


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    #93
    maestroamado
    Registered Users Posts: 4,426 ✭✭✭maestroamado


    jimmycrackcorm wrote: »
    It's made quite easy nowadays when you can refer to property price register to see actual sale prices.

    Well the agents seem not be aware of this.
    I called an EA a few days ago and asked for the selling price of a house they have on books for €000 and I interested, he asked me what I thought it was worth? I said I thought not for me to say. He suggested showing and I said I only interested if I have selling price as person looking has cash. EA said save my number and come back to me.
    As someone said here it's sellers market which is fine but EA should be able to give a selling price in my view, give the buyer a chance to buy.
    I totally think this wrong way of doing business.


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    #94
    hurleronditch
    Registered Users Posts: 656 ✭✭✭hurleronditch


    maestroamado wrote: »
    Well the agents seem not be aware of this.
    I called an EA a few days ago and asked for the selling price of a house they have on books for €000 and I interested, he asked me what I thought it was worth? I said I thought not for me to say. He suggested showing and I said I only interested if I have selling price as person looking has cash. EA said save my number and come back to me.
    As someone said here it's sellers market which is fine but EA should be able to give a selling price in my view, give the buyer a chance to buy.
    I totally think this wrong way of doing business.


    You are going around in circles to describe what you would like to happen as a buyer.

    We are describing what happens in reality, because the seller is the only person the EA has a duty towards.

    What you are describing will never happen.

    You are not buying a bag of pasta in Tesco or a TV in Curry’s. It’s an open market selling process where the EA is trying to maximise value for their client. Openly telling you the minimum price they will sell for would be nonsensical.


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    #95
    knucklehead6
    Registered Users Posts: 6,741 ✭✭✭knucklehead6


    maestroamado wrote: »
    Well the agents seem not be aware of this.
    I called an EA a few days ago and asked for the selling price of a house they have on books for €000 and I interested, he asked me what I thought it was worth? I said I thought not for me to say. He suggested showing and I said I only interested if I have selling price as person looking has cash. EA said save my number and come back to me.
    As someone said here it's sellers market which is fine but EA should be able to give a selling price in my view, give the buyer a chance to buy.
    I totally think this wrong way of doing business.

    Sorry, but can i just ask for clarification on what you're saying here?
    maestroamado wrote: »
    I called an EA a few days ago and asked for the selling price of a house they have on books for €000 and I interested, he asked me what I thought it was worth? I said I thought not for me to say.

    I can follow your comment here. You rang up an Estate Agent, and essentially asked what's the best price, he countered with "what do you think it's worth?" and you responded with "that for you to say, not me" or words to that effect.
    maestroamado wrote: »
    He suggested showing and I said I only interested if I have selling price as person looking has cash. EA said save my number and come back to me.

    This is where I get confused.

    Are you acting as a purchasing on behalf of a third party?

    Or are you asking for yourself, and you are a cash purchaser i.e. not in a chain?


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    #96
    maestroamado
    Registered Users Posts: 4,426 ✭✭✭maestroamado


    hurleronditch wrote: »
    You are going around in circles to describe what you would like to happen as a buyer.

    We are describing what happens in reality, because the seller is the only person the EA has a duty towards.

    What you are describing will never happen.

    You are not buying a bag of pasta in Tesco or a TV in Curry’s. It’s an open market selling process where the EA is trying to maximise value for their client. Openly telling you the minimum price they will sell for would be nonsensical.

    I was asking for maximum, then I have to decide if I want to buy, that's my very point.
    The EA asked me what I thought value.
    For me this practice is Unprofessional.


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    #97
    knucklehead6
    Registered Users Posts: 6,741 ✭✭✭knucklehead6


    maestroamado wrote: »
    I was asking for maximum, then I have to decide if I want to buy, that's my very point.
    The EA asked me what I thought value.
    For me this practice is Unprofessional.


    You were feeling him out, he was feeling you out. Not unprofessional at all. Its his job to get the best price possible for the vendor, not to give the purchaser best price


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    #98
    maestroamado
    Registered Users Posts: 4,426 ✭✭✭maestroamado


    knucklehead6 wrote: »
    Sorry, but can i just ask for clarification on what you're saying here?



    I can follow your comment here. You rang up an Estate Agent, and essentially asked what's the best price, he countered with "what do you think it's worth?" and you responded with "that for you to say, not me" or words to that effect.



    This is where I get confused.

    Are you acting as a purchasing on behalf of a third party?

    Or are you asking for yourself, and you are a cash purchaser i.e. not in a chain?

    I am the buyer and I know EA well.
    I did not feel need to say but when asked...


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    #99
    Dav010
    Registered Users Posts: 14,084 ✭✭✭✭Dav010


    maestroamado wrote: »
    I was asking for maximum, then I have to decide if I want to buy, that's my very point.
    The EA asked me what I thought value.
    For me this practice is Unprofessional.


    What “maximum”?

    Like others, I’m struggling to understand what you are asking/posting.

    Sellers, in most cases, want to sell for the maximum price they can get for their property. That price is dictated by the market, and as the EA suggested to you, that in turn is based on what a buyer things it is worth/is willing to pay.

    Sometimes, as in the op’s case, the seller has a minimum value below which they will not consider an offer, but that is not within the EAs remit, it is the vendors.

    Consider advertised price as just a guide, a reference point usually based on sale values of similar properties in the area (available to view on PPR), after viewing you may consider that price too high, or, you may be willing to pay more if you really want that particular house, expecting the EA to know what you will spend/final selling price, as I said, is asking a lot.


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    #100
    knucklehead6
    Registered Users Posts: 6,741 ✭✭✭knucklehead6


    maestroamado wrote: »
    I am the buyer and I know EA well.
    I did not feel need to say but when asked...

    Ok, it was just your use of language had me confused, the " I said I only interested if I have selling price as person looking has cash " seems as if you were talking about a third party.

    Anyway, as has been said to you a number of times now, the Estate agent has a duty to the vendor to get the best possible price, and none at all to the buyer apart from facilitating the sale


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    #101
    maestroamado
    Registered Users Posts: 4,426 ✭✭✭maestroamado


    knucklehead6 wrote: »
    You were feeling him out, he was feeling you out. Not unprofessional at all. Its his job to get the best price possible for the vendor, not to give the purchaser best price

    I will buy today at the listed price.
    I asked for a number and EA not know.
    I want to buy it today, I am not in the business of feeling people out. Unprofessional for me Yes.


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    #102
    Panrich
    Registered Users Posts: 3,776 ✭✭✭Panrich


    maestroamado wrote: »
    I was asking for maximum, then I have to decide if I want to buy, that's my very point.
    The EA asked me what I thought value.
    For me this practice is Unprofessional.

    So there was no asking price at all?


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    #103
    Dav010
    Registered Users Posts: 14,084 ✭✭✭✭Dav010


    maestroamado wrote: »
    I will buy today at the listed price.
    I asked for a number and EA not know.
    I want to buy it today, I am not in the business of feeling people out. Unprofessional for me Yes.

    What you asking is, is there a number at which the seller will sell today?

    That is for the vendor to decide, unless they are in a hurry, most will let the bidding play out.


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    #104
    knucklehead6
    Registered Users Posts: 6,741 ✭✭✭knucklehead6


    maestroamado wrote: »
    I will buy today at the listed price.
    I asked for a number and EA not know.
    I want to buy it today, I am not in the business of feeling people out. Unprofessional for me Yes.

    How would the Estate Agent know what the vendors are willing to accept as a lowest price?

    His job is to act as a go between.

    You make a bid, he presents it to the vendors, they either accept or reject.

    It's not exactly rocket science.


    As for buying at the listed price today, making an offer, it being accepted and going sale agreed all in the one day, you might be being a touch optimistic


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    #105
    Interested Observer
    Registered Users Posts: 13,021 ✭✭✭✭Interested Observer


    maestroamado wrote: »
    Well the agents seem not be aware of this.
    I called an EA a few days ago and asked for the selling price of a house they have on books for €000 and I interested, he asked me what I thought it was worth? I said I thought not for me to say. He suggested showing and I said I only interested if I have selling price as person looking has cash. EA said save my number and come back to me.
    As someone said here it's sellers market which is fine but EA should be able to give a selling price in my view, give the buyer a chance to buy.
    I totally think this wrong way of doing business.

    If this conversation actually happened, you realise it is not up to the estate agent to decide what the selling price of a house is right? It is up to the buyer. The estate agent can't pick a figure and decide that is the price. If you want to buy the house then make a bid.


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    #106
    maestroamado
    Registered Users Posts: 4,426 ✭✭✭maestroamado


    Interested Observer wrote: »
    If this conversation actually happened, you realise it is not up to the estate agent to decide what the selling price of a house is right? It is up to the buyer. The estate agent can't pick a figure and decide that is the price. If you want to buy the house then make a bid.

    I bought quite a few properties and last 10+ years ago and this practice was not there at that time except as guide price at auction.
    From meomory all property i bought were around asking price.
    Now people are being asked to pay mpore than asking price.
    For me this is DODGY it be interesting to see if anyone here agrees..


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    #107
    vinnie_cork
    Registered Users Posts: 71 ✭✭vinnie_cork


    EA acts for the seller whom is the client not the buyer.


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    #108
    maestroamado
    Registered Users Posts: 4,426 ✭✭✭maestroamado


    Panrich wrote: »
    So there was no asking price at all?

    Yes and it is listed on daft.ie with the NUMBER in €€€


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    #109
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 18,749 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    maestroamado wrote: »
    Yes and it is listed on daft.ie with the NUMBER in €€€

    Well why don't you offer whatever you feel is a good price?


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    #110
    knucklehead6
    Registered Users Posts: 6,741 ✭✭✭knucklehead6


    maestroamado wrote: »
    I bought quite a few properties and last 10+ years ago and this practice was not there at that time except as guide price at auction.
    From meomory all property i bought were around asking price.
    Now people are being asked to pay mpore than asking price.
    For me this is DODGY it be interesting to see if anyone here agrees..

    No one is being asked to pay more than asking price. If you are in a situation where more than one person wants to buy the property then they may each try to out bid each other, and may well go over the asking price.

    But the vendor is under no obligation to sell, they can pull the house from the market at any time up to money and contracts changing hands.

    This happened to me 12 years ago, went sale agreed (admittedly it was for below the asking price but we were in the depths of a recession) on a Wednesday and got a phone call the following Friday to say the vendor had pulled the plug


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    #111
    maestroamado
    Registered Users Posts: 4,426 ✭✭✭maestroamado


    bubblypop wrote: »
    Well why don't you offer whatever you feel is a good price?

    That is not the way i think it should be done.
    I expect he will come back to me before it closes and i will decide then.
    It EA knew his job i possibly buy today.


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    #112
    knucklehead6
    Registered Users Posts: 6,741 ✭✭✭knucklehead6


    maestroamado wrote: »
    That is not the way i think it should be done.
    I expect he will come back to me before it closes and i will decide then.
    It EA knew his job i possibly buy today.

    So because in your opinion it shouldn't be done in that way (where you make a bid) you are possibly (and i'd say probably tbh) going to miss out on a house you have spotted that suits your needs.

    Okaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay then. Talk about cutting your nose off to spite your face


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    #113
    Grueller
    Registered Users Posts: 5,117 ✭✭✭Grueller


    Grueller Baby wrote: »
    It's a sellers market at the moment. If the seller won't budge, you can be sure someone else is going to offer more.

    To share my experience (from a sellers perspective), I've had an apartment on the marketplace for close to 9 months. 5 months ago I got offered 30k less than asking and I was told that it was the best I was going to get.


    Two weeks ago the apartment sold for 2.5k over asking price.

    How did I not know you existed


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    #114
    vinnie_cork
    Registered Users Posts: 71 ✭✭vinnie_cork


    maestroamado wrote: »
    I expect he will come back to me before it closes and i will decide then.

    So your describing the term gazumping. Where a buyer puts in offer. It’s accepted by seller. And just before exchanging contracts EA phones a 3rd party seeking an other bid?
    If that happened to be I’d never look at a house for sale by that EA again and soon word would get about and affect business.
    EA fee is something like 2% of sale. So in the example the OP put up that’s a difference of €600 in fee... the EA will want a fast sale as they make money either way. Holding out just means more overhead costs for them so that’s no drive to hold. It’s the sellers choice. They Aren’t there to make the buyer a fast buck & saving they are there to protect their own interests.


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    #115
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 18,749 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    maestroamado wrote: »
    That is not the way i think it should be done.
    I expect he will come back to me before it closes and i will decide then.
    It EA knew his job i possibly buy today.

    How or why would be come back to you?
    Have you put an offer in?


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    #116
    maestroamado
    Registered Users Posts: 4,426 ✭✭✭maestroamado


    bubblypop wrote: »
    How or why would be come back to you?
    Have you put an offer in?

    Because he said he would...


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    #117
    maestroamado
    Registered Users Posts: 4,426 ✭✭✭maestroamado


    knucklehead6 wrote: »
    So because in your opinion it shouldn't be done in that way (where you make a bid) you are possibly (and i'd say probably tbh) going to miss out on a house you have spotted that suits your needs.

    Okaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay then. Talk about cutting your nose off to spite your face

    I already have a good house, i know what i am doing.
    Its not just an opinion, i am talking from experience and am simply asking when and why did this practice change..


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    #118
    maestroamado
    Registered Users Posts: 4,426 ✭✭✭maestroamado


    vinnie_cork wrote: »
    So your describing the term gazumping. Where a buyer puts in offer. It’s accepted by seller. And just before exchanging contracts EA phones a 3rd party seeking an other bid?
    If that happened to be I’d never look at a house for sale by that EA again and soon word would get about and affect business.
    EA fee is something like 2% of sale. So in the example the OP put up that’s a difference of €600 in fee... the EA will want a fast sale as they make money either way. Holding out just means more overhead costs for them so that’s no drive to hold. It’s the sellers choice. They Aren’t there to make the buyer a fast buck & saving they are there to protect their own interests.

    I totally agree with you though we coming from different angles, this is why i would rather the price at a higher level.
    If i wanted and agreed pricei would deposit 10% and that it.


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    #119
    maestroamado
    Registered Users Posts: 4,426 ✭✭✭maestroamado


    knucklehead6 wrote: »
    No one is being asked to pay more than asking price. If you are in a situation where more than one person wants to buy the property then they may each try to out bid each other, and may well go over the asking price.

    But the vendor is under no obligation to sell, they can pull the house from the market at any time up to money and contracts changing hands.

    This happened to me 12 years ago, went sale agreed (admittedly it was for below the asking price but we were in the depths of a recession) on a Wednesday and got a phone call the following Friday to say the vendor had pulled the plug

    I got caught with this where i though i agreed a price, the EA came back and said there was an offer 2k more so i went again, he then said a few days later that a 3rd player had arrived with 1k more, i told him i would get back to him...


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    #120
    knucklehead6
    Registered Users Posts: 6,741 ✭✭✭knucklehead6


    maestroamado wrote: »
    I already have a good house, i know what i am doing.
    Its not just an opinion, i am talking from experience and am simply asking when and why did this practice change..

    Where you ask an estate agent what's the best price? As far as I know the practice was always there, but the EA is under no obligation to come back to you.

    I've only been involved in three house purchases, two which fell through and the one I am currently in. In my cases one vendor decided not to sell after going sale agreed for whatever reason, and they are still in that house. I was outbid for the second one, but the EA did come back to me to let me know. I then found the place i'm in now


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    #121
    Gumbo
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 38,526 Mod ✭✭✭✭Gumbo


    Gael23 wrote: »
    Even a cash offer with no chain doesn’t seem to matter. They are happy to wait for more money

    Cash offer makes no difference.
    The seller still ends up with the same amount in their bank account whether it comes from your savings account, the credit union or a banks mortgage account.

    You seem to think you are entitled to a discount for being a "cash buyer" ?


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