NBA Regular Season & Playoffs 2018-19 Thread

ButtersSuki wrote: »

Bill Simmons on the Dunk contest this morning - it's for kids and middle aged white guys.

He (and Ryen Russillo - who I like) also came down hard on AD, Rich Paul and LeBron on the failed trade and basically said they handed it very badly. Simmons went so far as to give the Lakers a bit of a pass on it and said they probably had very little to do it with in reality as it was primarily a Klutch move and that they (Klutch) judged the whole thing very badly. He did though describe LA as a terrible franchise over the last few years from a management perspective. Hard to argue with that given the evidence.

Lowe Post and Windhorst (again) heavy on the criticism of Klutch and co. I'm surprised with Windhorst given his LeBron connections but fair play he's calling it as he sees it.

You never give the LBJ stuff a break. I don't know how it doesn't bore you at this stage.

Yes, he played a part in the move and all its failings. The Lakers played a part, they looked like fools, disrupted the team, lost leverage and left a stale taste in the mouth of many fans and NBA players/coaches/execs.

So why is it still a discussion point here or on Simmons podcast?
There must be more interesting actual basketball related things to discuss at this stage of the season than re-assigning the blame for a botched AD trade. Attempting to dissect this once again is completely futile imo.

ButtersSuki wrote: »

I just relayed what was on it, I didn't actually comment on "the LBJ stuff" (as you put it) from any personal perspective at all.

Just because you don't want to talk about doesn't however mean no one else does. It's a topic because it's one of the biggest stories of the NBA season.

Wasn't arguing or trying to start an argument, as I said I just relayed what was on the respective pods......you know, in case anyone would want to hear them who might not tune into same regularly or even be unaware of them? No biggie.

My point is exactly that. I suspect nobody wants to discuss it at this stage.

The politics and power dynamics of who were the primary players in this is largely irrelevant especially at this stage given it has been discussed so much on here.
Additionally, I think it's fair to say that if a similar scenario arose with KD, Kawhi, Steph etc, it wouldn't be repeatedly shared on this forum even to the extent that their relative influence warrants.

ButtersSuki wrote: »

Well with all due respect if some of the biggest podcasts in the basketball world are discussing it as recently as last night in Simmons’ case and late last week (Lowe Post and Windhorst), I think you comment that noone wants to discuss it is inaccurate. You may not want to, many others do.

Ok, well I can't disagree with that, it's a discussion point. I think my primary issue and an issue that many people posting on the forum likely share is that there is a clear and obvious bias at play here.

It's fair to say that you share criticisms of LBJ rather frequently, many of which I suspect wouldn't be shared if LBJ wasn't the protagonist.

It's the frequency of the LBJ related discussions, this in isolation is likely worth discussing but the discussion seems to constantly revolve around critiquing LBJ so it feels like over-saturation at this point.

ButtersSuki wrote: »

Thanks for acknowledging the first point - genuinely.

On the rest - I've frequently and repeatedly said that he's the best player on the planet - and although that may be up for debate this year, that's an aside.

My issue with LeBron primarily is the I believe immunity from/disproportionate lack of criticism both he and his game gets from a lot of the media, and a lot of fans; and conversely the disproportionate amount of praise levelled at his feet when things go right and they win or are successful. I'm a Celtics fan, if he joined the Celtics I'd be like "great!". I'm not such a hater that would be like "I don't want him because he's LeBron". The "if they win it's 100% down to LeBron and if they lose it's because LeBron had no help" narrative that I dislike.

Similarly, I do think this GOAT talk is just bonkers though, having seen/lived MJ in his prime (whole career basically) and been a witness (no pun intended) to LeBron's career too.

And - a point I've frequently discussed here - I do think there are flaws to his game that are overlooked. I won't go into that now deeply as I've discussed them so frequently but I'm talking about in-game decisions, shot selection, crunch time, etc. And I'm talking about on court stuff only in relation to that, nothing to do with philanthropy etc. Yet some media and some fans think he has no weaknesses in his game, which I find daft.

I have other criticisms too around how he's conducted his contracts and his relationships with teams, but again won't go into that stuff now.

I also disagree with your assertion that I wouldn't say the same about others and only focus on LeBron. I've said way, way, way worse things about Melo over the years than LeBron, but because it's Melo no-one really cares. Now there's a wasted talent and a deeply flawed player on many levels. Compared to him LeBron has overachieved on every level. Similarly I've shat all over Dwight and John Wall repeatedly. I don't get much reaction when I criticise any of them.

I don't really have much interest in discussing LBJ vs MJ as it's a discussion that has been so frequently raised that it is boring.
Similar to most debates, it is very rare for one person to hold an opinion that is mutually exclusive to another and in turn change their mind after one debate.
This is the issue with debating LBJ vs MJ. My only point which echoes what you said regarding the latest LBJ debate, if the conversation arises often enough, there must be some merit.
Given we both know LBJ vs MJ seems to be the only GOAT talk in town anymore, we can probably conclude that the distance between them is not that vast.

Every player has flaws, I'd probably say that very few people discuss MJ's flaws, I don't think LBJ is better but MJ is on an unattainable pedestal with many people. Many people think the prospect of MJ being dethroned is sacrilegious, no matter what any other player achieves they'll never reach his heights.
I don't think that's true. I think it would be a nearly impossible feat but the probability is not non-zero. Many MJ fans would disagree.

My issue with your LBJ related posts is that I think given his achievements, ability and longevity that you are disproportionately critical of him.
He has flaws(non-bball flaws don't interest me, he's not my mate), there are no doubts he has flaws but when was the last time you posted "What a play by LBJ" even though he warrants that more than most.

His achievements & abilities far outweigh his flaws but you seem avid on consistently playing devil's advocate even when LBJ isn't being praised.

It should be a case that LBJ is praised more than he's critiqued even when held to a higher standard but you criticise him more than you praise him which seems logically incorrect and you seem to critique him more individually than the entire forum praises him.

That seems disproportionately wrong given that as the best player in the game (or wherever you rank him) the asymmetry should exist the other way around.

Angliru wrote: »

Apparently a mild knee sprain. Should be okay for March. Bizarre situation though, it was like his shoe was made out of bread. Lot of buzz advising him to sit out the rest of the year, including pros. Think his attitude and desire to be #1 in the draft will ensure he plays though.

He's 1/100 shot now to get drafted first so sitting won't impact his stock. It may actually aid it because teams will be happy to see that a player with questions around long term durability isn't rushing back.
Apparently he'll be the 2nd heaviest player in the league, 2.5kg lighter than 7ft 3in Boban. It's cool but frightening too.

On a separate note the Lillard talking about not leaving Portland, some took his "sell myself out" comments as a shot at KD, I agree with T-mac that they weren't but Portland at doomed to being a perpetual bridesmaid with this roster.

I don't think Dame & CJ can be the two best players on a team that makes waves in the playoffs. Backcourt ends up as such a defensive liability.
Both have huge contracts and in isolation I don't think they're overpaid per se but the combination is quite poor imo.

Given the return you get for Dame would be higher, I think I'd look to make a similar trade as Raptors did with DeRozan-Kawhi and flip Dame for AD.

This means that the Trail Blazers wouldn't have to re-mortgage their future to get a 3rd piece that likely wouldn't lead to a championship anyway and they get out from under a backcourt combo that will leave them in perpetual mediocrity.

It's probably not a trade that's been discussed too much but I think it makes a lot of sense for both sides.

Angliru wrote: »

Think Barrett has a small shout at #1 but given that Zion looks a once in a generation athlete he probably has #1 regardless. It'll be interesting to see if Zion grows much more. He is a freak but if he starts pushing 300lbs I'm not sure about his long term potential in the league.

Extremely exciting draft class overall, Morant and Reddish look phenomenal as well. Bol Bol looks to be a steal too given how far he's fallen in the mock drafts after injury.

I would have been taking a punt on Barrett if there was an EU market after seeing him go down but after the prognosis set a quick enough time line I think he's a lock.
I suspect his weight will be monitored very closely, Nike or whoever he signs for, Knicks or whoever gets him know he's a potentially billion dollar commodity so even from a financial perspective I can't imagine he's passed on or he'll ever cook a meal for himself.

Morant looks great, obviously questions around opposition he is playing against though. Reddish might slip a tad, he can't seem to create his own shot, looks a tad lost at times.

Bol Bol might be this years Mo Bamba, they remind of that quote Fran Fraschilla had about Bruno Caboclo:
This is the all time swing for the fences pick. First of all he is described as the Brazilian Kevin Durant. He really doesn’t know how to play yet. I’m blown away. I’ve been doing this for 10 years. He’s 2 years away from being 2 years away.


I like Bol Bol, love that quote, he needs about 50 pounds. I like Jaxson Hayes to make a move up the board, lots of upside there.

Simmons must have attempted to rebuild his shot a few years ago because in this video his form is far more fluid.
It could be shooting a low % but the jumpshot does look better

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

Big comeback by the Lakers versus Houston, 19 points downin the third quarter, behind a playoff like LeBron performance. I think they need something huge down the stretch to get in. 16 - 8 might sneak them in, but seems like a tall enough order at this point.

Tall enough order but I think he carries them to the playoffs. That said I'm sure it's the best plan LT though as he's putting himself under tremendous pressure. I think Lonzo will make a big difference on the defensive side.

Also, last night all but solidified my thoughts that Harden is not winning MVP. I actually think it's between Giannis and PG. I think Giannis is the fav now and over the last 30 games PG will make a solid case.
I think for PG13 to win, OKC need to finish 2nd in the West, he needs to average 30 pts and Raptors need to get No1 in the East. Giannis needs to stand pat.