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Will we be the last generation to experience death?

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    #62
    AMKC
    Registered Users Posts: 15,669 ✭✭✭✭AMKC
    Ms


    wakka12 wrote: »
    Yes technically you have to die to upload your consciousness. So it really is technically cloning yourself. But what does it matter, it will just feel like going to sleep and waking up to you, if you died in your sleep and woke up the next morning and doctors said they managed to save you by putting your consciousness in a new body you wouldnt be able to tell unless they told you

    But the body your conscious is in would surely be different. Would you have all the memory's you had before you died or loose them too. Surely its memory's and experiences that make a person the person they are. So if you still had all your memory's then you would be the same person but without them you would be starting all over again.
    Necrominus wrote: »
    But does consciousness live on after death?
    What about those that are declared brain dead before they could have this miraculous treatment?
    A lot of people die very suddenly and quickly, you'd need to plan the precise moment of your death, or make a copy of your consciousness and store it somewhere in case you had a heart attack/got into a car crash/ran over by a pack of sulky racers/tripped and smashed your skull on a patch of ice....


    Right?

    Maybe there could be a sensor attached to us that is linked somehow to our consciousness and it would upload it to some mainframe at the moment of death. So it could be put in a new body, robot or whatever option was chosen
    riffmongous wrote: »
    But my understanding is that you won't wake up. It's the copy that will and you won't experience it

    But would that not be you with all your memory's and experiences? So would your consciousness not remember what your body was like before and what if the new body that had been got for you then was of the opposite sex lol than you were before? Sure some people might that mind but others might go berserk.
    eviltimeban wrote: »
    Would it not still be a copy? Like, I can create an Excel file, then make a copy of it, then delete the original, and what I'd have is an identical version, but not the original. The original is in the trash.

    If you uploaded your consciousness seamlessly, IOW, your current consciousness that carried on without stopping, it would be "you". Any other option and you're just making a copy

    If the body ages to it's death point, or is ravaged by cancer / disease etc, I wonder could there be an option to remove your brain from you body and it be kept alive, consciousness and all, remotely? The literal "brain in a jar".

    Just like in Futurama. Brainy brains lol. Can't see that as a fun way to live on after death.

    Live long and Prosper

    Peace and long life.



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    #63
    brainfreeze
    Registered Users Posts: 208 ✭✭brainfreeze


    FishOnABike wrote: »
    Cell reproduction is not perfect, telomeres shorten, random and environmentally induced mutations affect DNA, death is not a moment, it is a continuous multifaceted process and as much a part of life as is conception and birth.

    Not for all life.

    Not all species are subject to the Hayflick limit. Biological immortal species exist naturally in that theirs telomeres don't shorten. They don't die from aging. It's not that rare either, from certain bacteria to animals like Jellyfish.

    The concept that everything ages and dies isn't true, we've just embedded it into our culture because it's currently a part of our reality.


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    #64
    eviltimeban
    Registered Users Posts: 5,087 ✭✭✭eviltimeban


    FishOnABike wrote: »
    Meeeh, I'll believe it when I see it. I'm still waiting for my flying car, unlimited free power, anti gravity, (real) hoverboard and all the other 'just around the corner' miriacles promised by futurists.

    The reason we don't have flying cars is that people generally don't want flying cars. Otherwise they would've been made. I'm sure they wouldn't be too hard to make. Hoverboards are really just for fans of Back to the Future. :-)

    Nobody knew we all wanted smart phones. I've a feeling in general people don't want VR either, but they do want their phones and a marketable way (read: not scary) of connecting them further with the content could be something that happens pretty quickly.
    FishOnABike wrote: »
    Cell reproduction is not perfect, telomeres shorten, random and environmentally induced mutations affect DNA, death is not a moment, it is a continuous multifaceted process and as much a part of life as is conception and birth.

    Well if death is just a process, then restoration is just a process too. It just depends on whether death is a process that can be halted, or dramatically slowed down. If scientists could slow death down logarithmically, it would lead to people being virtually immortal, e.g. living for 10,000 - 100,000 years.


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    #65
    jimgoose
    Registered Users Posts: 20,176 ✭✭✭✭jimgoose


    eviltimeban wrote: »
    The reason we don't have flying cars is that people generally don't want flying cars...

    Indeed not. Flying cars would be a dangerous, costly pain-in-the-arse - we're bad enough. The other thing that used to be presented as a good, desirable thing in many of the old sci-fi shows was food in the form of a small pill or bland-looking disc. Why would this be a good thing, aside from in the mind of an individual or group of individuals who happened to dislike eating food?? :pac:


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    #66
    AMKC
    Registered Users Posts: 15,669 ✭✭✭✭AMKC
    Ms


    wexie wrote: »
    Eh, Netflix and chill!!

    Or go explore space when we get decent spaceships and faster than light travel.
    wexie wrote: »
    They tried that in multiplicity, just didn't work, especially once the made a copy from one of the copies. Wasn't quite as sharp as the original...

    Stargate is another example with Thor and his race that were cloned multiple times..
    Captain Chaos wrote: »
    It's called The Sixth Day.

    A better story than that one.

    brainfreeze:

    Most people in the tech industry don't think it will happen like that, just uploading your brain at the end of your life.

    It's a slow transition, more and more technology blends with your own mind. Starting off as little brain enhancements to improve whatever it is you are trying to improve. Imagine you could access google in your mind by just thinking, etc. Stuff like that. With the recent rise of A.I you will augment yourself to an A.I, making you exponentially smarter. This in the industry is called "The Singularity". The moment in time when A.I becomes to powerful that humans will have to merge with it in order to keep up. Then eventually, since your brain and the A.I are working in unison, your "sense of self" in terms of your biological brain and the software running in the cloud are one and the same. You don't see them as enhancements or separate intelligences, you are that person. You are the A.I. Your biological brain dying will not be a concern to you because at that stage it works in unison and copied by the software, which you identify as being you anyway.

    There is two competing theories in terms of the recent inevitable rise of A.I
    "Be afraid, we need to control this or we will become slaves to the A.I" - Elon Musk, Stephen Hawking, and others.
    "Relax, we will be the A.I" - Bill Gates, Ray Kurzweil, Larry Page and others.


    Current predictions are we will have human level intelligence by 2029, and the "Singularity" when we have super intelligence beyond anything we can comprehend as a species, by 2045. The hypothesis is we will start to merge with A.I between those dates with it being normal in 2045.

    So we could say we start to become the Borg then or just like them. Soon all our consciousnesses will be linked and we will no longer be individuals so.

    Live long and Prosper

    Peace and long life.



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    #67
    wexie
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,480 ✭✭✭wexie


    AMKC wrote: »
    . Soon all our consciousnesses will be linked and we will no longer be individuals so.

    To be honest if the options are that or the global war against Skynet scenario I think I'd personally choose the global war.


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    #68
    Hector Savage
    Registered Users Posts: 8,810 ✭✭✭Hector Savage


    In Homo Deus the author talks about it.
    Right now , no one minds dying cos everyone dies, but in the future when the elites are the 1st to get it, there will be social unrest, why should they be the only ones to have eternal life ?

    It's an interesting concept ..


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    #69
    DEFTLEFTHAND
    Registered Users Posts: 16,500 ✭✭✭✭DEFTLEFTHAND


    Living in this state of being forever sounds like hell tbh.

    Could you imagine working in an office for the next 1000 yrs.


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    #70
    eviltimeban
    Registered Users Posts: 5,087 ✭✭✭eviltimeban


    DEFTLEFTHAND wrote: »
    Living in this state of being forever sounds like hell tbh.

    Could you imagine working in an office for the next 1000 yrs.

    You just ruined it for me.


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    #71
    SafeSurfer
    Registered Users Posts: 6,421 ✭✭✭SafeSurfer


    Where would you go for your 100,000th wedding anniversary?

    Multo autem ad rem magis pertinet quallis tibi vide aris quam allis



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    #72
    brainfreeze
    Registered Users Posts: 208 ✭✭brainfreeze


    DEFTLEFTHAND wrote: »
    Living in this state of being forever sounds like hell tbh.

    Could you imagine working in an office for the next 1000 yrs.

    Yeah but you don't have to. You wouldn't be invincible, so just end it.

    I'd rather it be my choice than to have a genetic best before date that we are limited to now. Just because it's possible to live x amount of years doesn't mean you will.


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    #73
    Franz Von Peppercorn
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,070 ✭✭✭Franz Von Peppercorn


    AMKC wrote: »
    Or go explore space when we get decent spaceships and faster than light travel.

    Not possible.

    Stargate is another example with Thor and his race that were cloned multiple times..

    Not possible. A fantasy.


    A better story than that one.

    brainfreeze:

    Most people in the tech industry don't think it will happen like that, just uploading your brain at the end of your life.

    It's a slow transition, more and more technology blends with your own mind. Starting off as little brain enhancements to improve whatever it is you are trying to improve. Imagine you could access google in your mind by just thinking, etc. Stuff like that. With the recent rise of A.I you will augment yourself to an A.I, making you exponentially smarter. This in the industry is called "The Singularity". The moment in time when A.I becomes to powerful that humans will have to merge with it in order to keep up. Then eventually, since your brain and the A.I are working in unison, your "sense of self" in terms of your biological brain and the software running in the cloud are one and the same. You don't see them as enhancements or separate intelligences, you are that person. You are the A.I. Your biological brain dying will not be a concern to you because at that stage it works in unison and copied by the software, which you identify as being you anyway.

    There is two competing theories in terms of the recent inevitable rise of A.I
    "Be afraid, we need to control this or we will become slaves to the A.I" - Elon Musk, Stephen Hawking, and others.
    "Relax, we will be the A.I" - Bill Gates, Ray Kurzweil, Larry Page and others.


    Current predictions are we will have human level intelligence by 2029, and the "Singularity" when we have super intelligence beyond anything we can comprehend as a species, by 2045. The hypothesis is we will start to merge with A.I between those dates with it being normal in 2045.

    So we could say we start to become the Borg then or just like them. Soon all our consciousnesses will be linked and we will no longer be individuals so.

    Probably not possible.


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    #74
    Franz Von Peppercorn
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,070 ✭✭✭Franz Von Peppercorn


    We’re prolonging old age at the moment and we can’t cure many of the diseases associated with it: nobody would want to live to 150 with 50 years with dementia, 60 years in a nursing home.

    There’s a lot of hot air and very little action.


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    #75
    wexie
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,480 ✭✭✭wexie


    Franz Von Peppercorn wrote: »
    We’re prolonging old age at the moment and we can’t cure many of the diseases associated with it: nobody would want to live to 150 with 50 years with dementia, 60 years in a nursing home.

    That's the thing that always comes up in these conversations about increased longevity, most people seem to just assume it gives you more good years in the middle and nobody thinks about what if it's just more of the crappy ones at the end.


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    #76
    DEFTLEFTHAND
    Registered Users Posts: 16,500 ✭✭✭✭DEFTLEFTHAND


    Franz Von Peppercorn wrote: »
    We’re prolonging old age at the moment and we can’t cure many of the diseases associated with it: nobody would want to live to 150 with 50 years with dementia, 60 years in a nursing home.

    There’s a lot of hot air and very little action.

    good point. Think I'd rather have about 75 good yrs than living to a over a hundred and dealing with all the assorted problems which come when a human body starts to live outside of average natural range.


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    #77
    Sciprio
    Closed Accounts Posts: 790 ✭✭✭Sciprio


    B0jangles wrote: »
    Seriously though, we're far more likely to accidentally wipe ourselves out than intentionally achieve immortality.

    I've thought for a long time that humanity as a species is both very very clever and extremely stupid - we're like an inventor who develops a supremely efficient, elegant and effective saw, then cannot see why it is not a good idea to use it on the branch we're all sitting on.


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    #78
    brainfreeze
    Registered Users Posts: 208 ✭✭brainfreeze


    DEFTLEFTHAND wrote: »
    good point. Think I'd rather have about 75 good yrs than living to a over a hundred and dealing with all the assorted problems which come when a human body starts to live outside of average natural range.

    Usually when people are talking about immortality (like in this thread) they are talking about biological immortality, i.e - not aging.

    If we get that nailed then the above is not an issue. Aging is not some impossible beast to beat, nature already has. As I said a few posts back, there are biologically immortal species on earth.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Biological_immortality

    Aging is the real enemy here. Aging related illnesses is what causes us to have a **** time in later life.

    There is a Ted Talk on the subject if people are interested.



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    #79
    Sciprio
    Closed Accounts Posts: 790 ✭✭✭Sciprio


    No. I don't think so. even if you could do that it wouldn't be you exactly and your physical body will still have to die.


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