Help with Death Cert.

pedroeibar1 · 12-12-2011 12:46pm #1

This is a bit of a death cert dated 1905, place of death is Clonmel Asylum.

How can this data be interpreted?
I know phthisis is consumption/tuberculosis, but what is the word after it? Does the ‘1 year certified’ mean having TB or being does it mean certified insane for a year? I know Clonmel was the ‘county home’ but would it have been usual at that time to have a TB patient in an ‘asylum’? All info welcome!
Thanks,
Pedro.

shanew · 12-12-2011 12:49pm

It means the illness which resulted in death is certified medically as being present for 1 year.

Shane

pedroeibar1 · 12-12-2011 1:50pm

Thanks Shane, that clears that bit. However, would it have been usual for a consumptive to be in Clonmel Asylum in that era, or was there another reason? Do records exist for that institution?
Rs
P.

P. Breathnach · 12-12-2011 1:58pm

Agree with what Shane says.

I presume the place where the death occurred was originally a workhouse. Many of them morphed into hospitals before later becoming county homes. It looks to me as if their role was particularly unclear in the early years of the 20th century.

In one case from that time I discerned one workhouse apparently fulfilling three roles simultaneously: poorhouse, especially catering for the aged; general hospital; refuge for unmarried mothers.

shanew · 12-12-2011 2:14pm

Often the Workhouse, Asylum, and Infirmary were all part of the same complex - e.g. N.D.U. at North Great Brunswick Street in Dublin, and seriously ill people had nowhere else to go for long term treatment, other than the workhouse.

Does the place of death (column 2 on the cert) also read Asylum ?

p.s. cant make out the word after phthisis - sometimes you see TB/Consumption described as pulmonary phthisis

Shane

shanew · 12-12-2011 2:30pm

for admission books for the Asylum and/or workhouse the two places to try are the local library, presumably there's one in Clonmel town, or possibly the National Archives.

Shane

shanew · 12-12-2011 2:32pm

found a mention - they seem to be held in the library in Thurles..

see : http://www.tipperarylibraries.ie/local_studies/index.shtml

look for 'Board of Guardians' about half way down the page...

Shane

pedroeibar1 · 12-12-2011 2:39pm

Yes, column 2 also says 'Asylum'. The deceased was 44 yrs and left a wife with a young family on a farm which I believe was part-owned, part leased (need to do more research on that). So he was not without assets, hence my health/sanity queries.
@Shane - thanks, that fits with my initial guess - phthisis pulmonalis (another was trying to make it 'melancholy' !)
Thanks again,
P.

shanew · 12-12-2011 2:46pm

not so sure now that the records held in Thurles are the ones you want... they specifically refer to 'minute books' which record day-to-day operations. The inmate details are recorded in 'Admission books' For Asylums you sometimes also get Case Books which usually contain medical details of longer stay patients

Shane

pedroeibar1 · 12-12-2011 2:46pm

Thanks again; another reason to go there, as I have another relative who was a PLG who died in Tipp during the Famine. The 'list' grows!
Rs
P.

Ponster · 12-12-2011 6:00pm

shanew wrote: »

Often the Workhouse, Asylum, and Infirmary were all part of the same complex -

I believe that from 1850 the asylum and workhouse were 2 distinct building (but next to each other with the same admin people running them). The workhouse became today's regional hospital. The asylum is now St Luke's Hospital.

Help with Death Cert.

Comments