Print Auction [BPB2012]

Tiriel · 18-10-2012 11:08pm #1

So we were thinking, how's about we kick off a discussion around having a print auction as part of the Boards Photobook 2012.

We need discussion, fire out the pro's and con's. What we were thinking is a minimum bid price, set print size and postage included.

From there, all proceeds go to the Santa Strike Force. People can choose to have their print in or out of the auction, which will be organised through Pixie.

Thoughts?!

Adrian.Sadlier · 18-10-2012 11:21pm

Cork_girl wrote: »

So we were thinking, how's about we kick off a discussion around having a print auction as part of the Boards Photobook 2012.

We need discussion, fire out the pro's and con's. What we were thinking is a minimum bid price, set print size and postage included.

From there, all proceeds go to the Santa Strike Force. People can choose to have their print in or out of the auction, which will be organised through Pixie.

Thoughts?!

Would you have each person produce a print themselves or get them printed collectively by one printer? Centralised/standardised printing would help reduce unit costs and (hopefully) keep quality high

Would you limit it to only the prints submitted for the book? For example, I would gladly let people bid on any image I have posted on pix.ie, if they were mad enough to do so, especially if I didn't have to do the printing :-)

Tiriel · 18-10-2012 11:25pm

Adrian.Sadlier wrote: »

Would you have each person produce a print themselves or get them printed collectively by one printer? Centralised/standardised printing would help reduce unit costs and (hopefully) keep quality high

Would you limit it to only the prints submitted for the book? For example, I would gladly let people bid on any image I have posted on pix.ie, if they were mad enough to do so, especially if I didn't have to do the printing :-)

Well, I think we'd have to centralise it to one printer - and include postage costs etc. so that for any photos bid on and purchased, the winning bidder would get their image in the post and not have to go getting in touch with the Photographer etc. to arrange details. Of course, the Copyright infomation and Photographer details will be on each image on Pixie - so if the person wants to contact them directly they can :-)

picaaf · 18-10-2012 11:29pm

Similar auction was done for Haiti a few years back. It was quite tough to get it started off. How will it be "broadcasted" or "advertised"? Will pix.ie have a banner or something like that on their explore page for instance? Find a good hashtag to be used on twitter? Maybe some people who do facebookings could put some info or link there?
Sorry, just some random thoughts.

Tiriel · 18-10-2012 11:40pm

picaaf wrote: »

Similar auction was done for Haiti a few years back. It was quite tough to get it started off. How will it be "broadcasted" or "advertised"? Will pix.ie have a banner or something like that on their explore page for instance? Find a good hashtag to be used on twitter? Maybe some people who do facebookings could put some info or link there?
Sorry, just some random thoughts.

Thanks - totally makes sense. Not much use having an auction if we can't get the word out there! Hash tag is a great idea and will ask Pixie if it is possible to get a banner

Open to all suggestions of how to get this off the ground and how best approach the print sizes/options!

EyeBlinks · 19-10-2012 10:55am

You'll need to get a way of handling both photos and bids for people who are not on pixie.

Tiriel · 19-10-2012 10:59am

EyeBlinks wrote: »

You'll need to get a way of handling both photos and bids for people who are not on pixie.

Yes absolutely, the email address will be available for that. Plus, I think it would be good to keep it open until after the launch, so you can see the images in the book and if there are some you really love, you go bid on them

EyeBlinks · 19-10-2012 11:05am

Where will the photo be shown for those not on pixie ?

Tiriel · 19-10-2012 11:08am

EyeBlinks wrote: »

Where will the photo be shown for those not on pixie ?

I'm not sure - open to suggestions. The photos will be in the book - for one, but I guess it will depend a LOT on what photographer's are willing to allow in terms of their copyright. We could put them on Facebook, but that would have to be at the permission of the photographer.

We have the blog, so we can link from there. Any other ideas?

EyeBlinks · 19-10-2012 11:24am

I think having the photos in one place is the way to go. I ran the Haiti one on pixie (raised about 1.4K, I think) but last year the Danny O'Brien (raised 2.5 K :rolleyes:) one we ran a small website. A lot of the photos and most of the bids were not from pixie people though.

For the last one we got two nice pieces on thejournal.ie and worldirish.com that really raised the profile a lot.

dave66 · 19-10-2012 12:23pm

I think the idea of a central printer would be great, at least the print quality would all be the same for all prints & if some body like Steve in 360-dpi was able to take on the printing, I think we'd be in safe hands both from printing and in terms of security of copyright in uploading files to him.

In relation to set print sizes, the only minor issue is that the print size/ratio is dependant on the camera used to get the image. For example I shoot with a 1.5 crop sensor so most of my images are best suited to 7.5x5, 12x8, 15x10 rather than "standard" 7x5, 10x8 etc. At this stage if I'm having a print made I go for 15x10 in preference to 12x8.

Just so the BPB2012 team know, I've no problem with my image(s) being posted on pix.ie, a blog or site, but would prefer not to share them on FB.

picaaf · 19-10-2012 12:27pm

dave66 wrote: »

Just so the BPB2012 team know, I've no problem with my image(s) being posted on pix.ie, a blog or site, but would prefer not to share them on FB.

as i don't ˚do˚ facebookings, i have same feelings

Adrian.Sadlier · 19-10-2012 12:46pm

I don't like posting any images on Facebook, ever!

Tiriel · 19-10-2012 1:12pm

Adrian.Sadlier wrote: »

I don't like posting any images on Facebook, ever!

That's what I was thinking

Anything to do with images is 100% the decision of the photographer. The BPB team will never post any image anywhere without requesting permission, we promise

dave66 · 19-10-2012 1:26pm

EyeBlinks wrote: »

For the last one I got two nice pieces on thejournal.ie and worldirish.com that really raised the profile a lot.

As I recall thejournal.ie did a piece about the book last year, so hopefully they'd get behind the auction too. Just a suggestion, I believe a number of people involved in the book are members of camera clubs, perhaps they could ask their club to mention the auction at meetings and on club websites.

stcstc · 19-10-2012 1:49pm

yes i could handle the printing etc

well if people want em to lol

I would suggest the simplest was to do the images is like tommie said, set up a freeby website with a gallery, even if people have to email their images to someone for upload that wouldnt be too hard

Tiriel · 19-10-2012 2:06pm

stcstc wrote: »

yes i could handle the printing etc

well if people want em to lol

I would suggest the simplest was to do the images is like tommie said, set up a freeby website with a gallery, even if people have to email their images to someone for upload that wouldnt be too hard

I am not familiar with setting up a website like that and I don't think that Dani is.. can anyone help us on this? Otherwise it will be Pixie.

xia · 19-10-2012 2:11pm

Maybe I'm jsut too tired to understand...but why not Pixie? You don't have to be registered there to see picutes...as long as people get a link to find them...and if they then can bid via mail that's perfect...actually maybe best to have everyone to bid via mail. Otherwise it might be too messy to check both mail and pixie...

EyeBlinks · 19-10-2012 2:58pm

xia wrote: »

Maybe I'm jsut too tired to understand...but why not Pixie? You don't have to be registered there to see picutes...as long as people get a link to find them...and if they then can bid via mail that's perfect...actually maybe best to have everyone to bid via mail. Otherwise it might be too messy to check both mail and pixie...

You have to be registered to put up a photo though !

dinneenp · 19-10-2012 4:01pm

Hi,
I'd be interested. I think submitting 1 (or maybe 2 photos) makes it easier that telling people they can bid on any photo in your portfolio/blog/site (Customers given too many choices are less likely to buy.

Some observations & questions-

1. We have a location hosting our image.
2. Publicise the auction
3. People bid
4. Winners annonced
4b.payment
5. Photos printed & sent out.
6. Publicise the resutls

1. should be easy to get a location. Obviously could piggyback on someones website but I'm sure most people wouldn't want that as it's taking focus away from the auction & promoting the person's website.
2. again shouldn't be hard-social media, blogs, word of mouth, media etc.
3. Is there any way to show what the highest current bid?
So that someone is bidding they can see the highest bid and therefore bid higher. this would lead to bid price growing exponentially. Otherwise could end up with a load of bids around the same price.

When is the end date? Is this going to tie in with the Book launch date?
Do more people besides 'us' go to the launch night? If prints could be available at the launch it'd be good way to get extra footfall, winning bidder could meet the photographer, talk to them etc.

4b. Paypal should make it easy
5. Steve has already offered. Is this at 'cost price'?
6. Same as point 2.

stcstc · 19-10-2012 4:17pm

dinneenp wrote: »

Hi,

5. Steve has already offered. Is this at 'cost price'?

what ya mean cost price?

dinneenp · 19-10-2012 4:43pm

stcstc wrote: »

what ya mean cost price?

Would you be printing the photos at the same price you'd charge to the general public?
Or printing them at 'cost price'- just the cost of time & materials, without a profit...seeing as it's for charity and all that....

dave66 · 19-10-2012 4:53pm

dinneenp wrote: »

Would you be printing the photos at the same price you'd charge to the general public?
Or printing them at 'cost price'- just the cost of time & materials, without a profit...seeing as it's for charity and all that....

I don't see there being an issue with Steve having a markup, he would be providing a professional service & I completely trust him to be very fair.

For me his contribution is in facilitating the printing & distribution of the prints, which I reckon is not a small undertaking.

Just my 2c worth

dinneenp · 19-10-2012 4:54pm

dave66 wrote: »

I don't see there being an issue with Steve having a markup, he would be providing a professional service & I completely trust him to be very fair.

For me his contribution is in facilitating the printing & distribution of the prints, which I reckon is not a small undertaking.

Just my 2c worth

I don't have an issue with him having a markup either; I'm just wondering/asking.

Tiriel · 19-10-2012 5:07pm

EyeBlinks wrote: »

You have to be registered to put up a photo though !

The Boards Photobook account would be putting up the images, not the individuals (once we have their consent, all images will have notes to say who the Photographer is and their Pixie name if appropriate). All images would be in specific folders on one account uploaded to view in the smallest size only, which we have already discussed with Marcus.

With the time window we have, I'm not sure we really have an option?!

AnCatDubh · 19-10-2012 7:49pm

picaaf wrote: »

How will it be "broadcasted" or "advertised"?

Two wee suggestions (well 2.5 really)

Time to 'lean' on our boards.ie overlords - site wide announcement for starters. This was facilitated on previous occasions. Perhaps sponsored advertising banners that are being stuck into all threads now.

Pix.ie also lent a major hand in previous years by sponsoring something like a couple of million advertising impressions in the run up to the book launch.

The idea would be to spread the attention wider than the photography forum.

stcstc · 19-10-2012 8:44pm

if you need a printer to do this for cost then i will need to bow out

Sorry but I earn my living from printing peoples images, i happily help boards whenever i can, including give boards members discounts etc including sponsoring a 100 euro prize last year for the book launch (and the person actually got somethign worth more than the 100 too!!!)

i not sure anyone on boards has actually paid full price from me, even if i havent shown the discounts etc, trust me they are there

Tiriel · 19-10-2012 9:04pm

OK, we'd like to keep this on track to discuss the possibility of there being a print auction.. the team will look for pricing and printers when/if we get to that stage, I have already been in contact with 360dpi and there is no need for this to be discussed here

So, as per AnCatDubh's post - we need to lean on boards.ie and we need to expand our audience outside of this forum.

Nebezpeci Mys · 19-10-2012 10:48pm

...just experimented with my linkedIn profile and added Boards Photo Book 2012 as a Project. It allows short description as well as the URL and should show on the 'front page' of the profile. I'm sure the text is not perfect at the mo but it could also work as a way of promotion... also, perhaps an email or two in the workplace with the link...?

I know that neither of these provide the wide coverage we would love but every little helps...:)

CabanSail · 22-10-2012 3:35am

EyeBlinks wrote: »

You have to be registered to put up a photo though !

Simples ...... We set up an account for this Auction. Images submitted are sent to the same email address that will also be used for bids. Then the images are added to the Auction Pix.ie account.

All can view but only the organisers can add/delete/edit. The current bid could be put in the comments.

Nebezpeci Mys · 25-10-2012 12:13am

CabanSail wrote: »

Simples ...... We set up an account for this Auction. Images submitted are sent to the same email address that will also be used for bids. Then the images are added to the Auction Pix.ie account.

All can view but only the organisers can add/delete/edit. The current bid could be put in the comments.

That was/is the plan precisely. I'm not sure whether bids will be either in the comments below or emailed or emailed only but we'll clarify that in due course...

Adrian.Sadlier · 26-10-2012 9:51pm

I have already submitted my photo for the book and auction. Can I submit all of my pics on pix.ie as up for auction - maybe change the normal heading on my pix.ie account to indicate that and contain a link to the auction page?

I know you couldn't put all the photos in the auction library but maybe you could put a "dummy" picture or "icon" with a "pick any" text with the pix.ie use name link and explaination in the description of the "photo".

Something along the lines of

http://pix.ie/asadlier invites bids for any of the pictures in their pix.ie account. Please email the picture title, url and bid to boardsbook@gmail.com

Am I trying to be to clever (never mind presumptious that anybody would want to bid) - but it might work for others!

Tiriel · 26-10-2012 10:01pm

Adrian.Sadlier wrote: »

I have already submitted my photo for the book and auction. Can I submit all of my pics on pix.ie as up for auction - maybe change the normal heading on my pix.ie account to indicate that and contain a link to the auction page?

I know you couldn't put all the photos in the auction library but maybe you could put a "dummy" picture or "icon" with a "pick any" text with the pix.ie use name link and explaination in the description of the "photo".

Something along the lines of

http://pix.ie/asadlier invites bids for any of the pictures in their pix.ie account. Please email the picture title, url and bid to boardsbook @ gmail.com

Am I trying to be to clever (never mind presumptious that anybody would want to bid) - but it might work for others!

That is very kind of you and we would certainly like to arrange that

I thought of something the other night, if we put the photos from the book up on Pix.ie before the launch, then the surprise of the photos in the book is ruined! So.. how should we approach this? Put images up one by one, build the excitement? With the bulk not going up until the day *after* the launch?

Adrian.Sadlier · 26-10-2012 10:24pm

Cork_girl wrote: »

That is very kind of you and we would certainly like to arrange that

I thought of something the other night, if we put the photos from the book up on Pix.ie before the launch, then the surprise of the photos in the book is ruined! So.. how should we approach this? Put images up one by one, build the excitement? With the bulk not going up until the day *after* the launch?

Let me know how to proceed and I'll do it.

Rather than reveal the photos included in the book on pixie before the launch, how about posting people's second choice photos - the one's that didn't quite make it. It would be a great teaser and maybe give people a chance to bid on two pics from each tog rather than one? And still keep the photos in the book a secret until launch night...

Morrisseeee · 28-10-2012 6:04pm

Q................what's the print size ?

stcstc · 28-10-2012 11:19pm

A....................not really up to me, but i would suggest either a 12"long print in a 16" mount or a 15" print in a 20" mount

all sizes i am suggesting there are the long side

so a 3:2 ratio would give 12*8 in 16*12 mount and 15*10 in 20*16 mount

but like i say not really up to me:-)

Nebezpeci Mys · 29-10-2012 2:00pm

Morrisseeee wrote: »

Q................what's the print size ?

We were thinking either A3 or A4 but no decision has been made yet. Will clarify that in the next few days.

trooney · 29-10-2012 2:22pm

Adrian.Sadlier wrote: »

Rather than reveal the photos included in the book on pixie before the launch, how about posting people's second choice photos - the one's that didn't quite make it. It would be a great teaser and maybe give people a chance to bid on two pics from each tog rather than one? And still keep the photos in the book a secret until launch night...

What's the point in that? Why not just keep all the photos in the pixie account private until the evening of the book launch, rather than complicate the entire process. I also think the auction should be reserved for only the photos in the book, again, for the sake of simplicity and haste. Can't see how adding in additional photos from anybody does anything other massage egos, and if there is one thing this should not be about, it's massaging egos. IMO.

Adrian.Sadlier · 31-10-2012 3:21pm

trooney wrote: »

What's the point in that? Why not just keep all the photos in the pixie account private until the evening of the book launch, rather than complicate the entire process. I also think the auction should be reserved for only the photos in the book, again, for the sake of simplicity and haste. Can't see how adding in additional photos from anybody does anything other massage egos, and if there is one thing this should not be about, it's massaging egos. IMO.

Trooney, my suggestions had nothing to do with massaging egos, mine or anybody elses. It has more to do with being unsure of why anybody would be intererested in bidding for any of my photos, never mind the specific one I chose for the photobook and hedging my bets by offering people to have a choice of any image of mine that they may be foolish enough to fancy.

Obviously, such a lack of confidence in ones ability is not something you suffer from.

Adrian

Tiriel · 31-10-2012 3:41pm

Please keep this thread on topic!

It looks like in order to keep the prints in the book a surprise, we are going to launch the print auction on the night of the book launch.

With regard to sizes, what do you all think? 12"long print in a 16" mount or a 15" print in a 20" mount as suggested by stcstc?

Would there be a preference to also include a smaller print?

dave66 · 31-10-2012 5:31pm

Cork_girl wrote: »

Please keep this thread on topic!

It looks like in order to keep the prints in the book a surprise, we are going to launch the print auction on the night of the book launch.

Good idea.

Cork_girl wrote: »

With regard to sizes, what do you all think? 12"long print in a 16" mount or a 15" print in a 20" mount as suggested by stcstc?

Would there be a preference to also include a smaller print?

Personally, I would think that 12" would be the minimum size I'd print and I've reached the point where I tend to not print smaller than 15x10. That said I'll go along with whatever is decided. The advantage of the sizes steve (stcstc) mentions is that the suit a cropped sensor, how would they work with a full frame sensor?

stcstc · 31-10-2012 6:27pm

actually the sizes i suggested will be the same for almost all slrs. with a few exceptions

most slr camers be they crop sensor or full frame are still the same aspect ration. ie the same shape rectangle

one of the exceptions is micro four thirds, as its 4:3 ratio

CabanSail · 04-11-2012 3:15am

Just a suggestion.

Rather than have this as an auction, there are other bidding models which can bring in more revenue. I have seen these methods work in other areas.

Method 1 - Maximum Donation

I have seen this at a charity night. The bidders gift a donation for each print that they like. All donations are accepted but only the highest donation receives the print. Results are kept secret until the end. The minimum donation can be set and a caveat placed that total donations must reach the set price before it will be printed.

The advantages here are the charity gets both successful and unsuccessful bids, not just the winner and we get the money up front.

Method 2 - Tender

In this model a bid is registered, which has to be above the minimum set price. The highest bid is accepted. The difference is that the current high bid is not known. In a normal auction you bid to beat the next bid and stay within your budget. Often a bidder will win and still be well below their budget, but in a tender they will tend to place their bid at their budget level.

Adrian.Sadlier · 04-11-2012 4:27pm

Another possible variation:

A straight auction, higest bidder over the minimum threshold gets the print, but with a slight twist - if unsuccessful bidders were to match the highest bid they could also get a print!

From the high standard I've seen in previous editions I'm sure that there will be some images that multiple people would be bidding on!

Just a thought ......

Tiriel · 04-11-2012 4:43pm

Adrian.Sadlier wrote: »

Another possible variation:

A straight auction, higest bidder over the minimum threshold gets the print, but with a slight twist - if unsuccessful bidders were to match the highest bid they could also get a print!

From the high standard I've seen in previous editions I'm sure that there will be some images that multiple people would be bidding on!

Just a thought ......

I like this idea a lot

CabanSail · 05-11-2012 2:40am

Adrian.Sadlier wrote: »

Another possible variation:

A straight auction, higest bidder over the minimum threshold gets the print, but with a slight twist - if unsuccessful bidders were to match the highest bid they could also get a print!

From the high standard I've seen in previous editions I'm sure that there will be some images that multiple people would be bidding on!

Just a thought ......

Sounds good but has a fatal flaw.The thing that drives the price up in an auction is the competition. In this model once the reserve has been met the bidders know they only have to match the top bid to also win. There is no incentive to place a higher bid.

Tiriel · 04-12-2012 12:50am

Auction is now live! See it here: www.pix.ie/boardsbook

dinneenp · 10-12-2012 2:46pm

I was going to call my blog post promoting the auction Suffer Little Children but think Santa Claus is coming to town fits better

Tiriel · 10-12-2012 4:00pm

Auction closes midnight tomorrow!

Nebezpeci Mys · 20-12-2012 11:13pm

Guys, just a quick note in relation to the auction prints - we have collected them today and will send them out in the upcoming days. Those of you who wanted to pick their prints up from Steve and haven't done so by today, please, pm me to arrange handover.

Happy Christmas!

Nebezpeci Mys · 29-12-2012 3:53am

Just a quick update on the auction prints: all have been posted, so you should receive them next week.

Those of you who wanted to collect them, please, pm me so we can arrange the handover.

Thank you very much for your support, Guys, and Happy New Year!

Print Auction [BPB2012]

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