The WHO wants to prevent all women of "child-bearing age" from drinking alcohol

El_Duderino 09 · 18-06-2021 4:46pm

Greyfox wrote: »

I dont agree. Theirs a huge difference between shouldn't drink and saying drinking can effect fertility

Absolutely no difference as long as all they plan to do is inform them of the risks. If they planned to enforce a ban then there would be a difference.

Beyond that it's just an opportunity for people who want to get cross about things, to get cross about something.

I wonder if it has anything to do with the victimhood complex some posters have fostered around the pubs being shut. Maybe they're thinking, "if they inform women of the risks to their health, then the might start a similar campaign to inform men of the risks to us". I just can't see any reason to be cross about this.

El_Duderino 09 · 18-06-2021 4:47pm

jim o doom wrote: »

I think the intended message is that women should do as they're told and not drink if they are of child bearing age.

So? And when you see medical advice to not be overweight, or be fit, how does it affect you? Do you consider yourself injured by the experience?

iffandonlyif · 18-06-2021 4:50pm

The article repeatedly inserts the word prevent after a partial quote, without any evidence that that is what the WHO intends.

One eyed Jack · 18-06-2021 4:53pm

jim o doom wrote: »

The thing is, my perspective is not all that unique. There are many women who either cant have or who simply dont want to have children and who never do. honestly, more power to them, there are far too many humans destroying the planet.

Their advice is that any woman of childbearing age abstain from alcohol, regardless of her ability or wishes regarding future kids.

It's completely patronising, lacking in any degree of nuance, and like I said before, it can go get f#cked. So can anyone in the organisation who thought publishing this sort of massive generalisation was a good idea.

Now I dont actually believe this, but I do briefly muse on the admittedly conspiracy theory sounding thought.. I wonder is there a drive in China against alcohol or women of child bearing drinking alcohol.

It lacks nuance for sure, because it was never intended to be specifically aimed at individuals who are choosing to take what was written out of context rather than understanding the context in which it was written.

They do give plenty of advice too about abstaining from having children or prevention of unwanted pregnancies and so on if that’s your bag, but it’s more in the context of carbon footprinting, adopting a vegan lifestyle and all the rest of it, if one is on a mission to save humans from themselves with the idea that it’s better for the environment. I don’t tend to take their declarations on those fronts too seriously either, even though the scientific evidence behind their declarations is sound, as it is in this case again where they advise that women and children and people generally should be prevented from being introduced to alcohol from an early age and throughout their lives that message should be reinforced in society.

Don’t know anything about China really, other than their one-child policy turned out to be a bit of a disaster, not sure about how beneficial it was for the environment in any case tbh.

El_Duderino 09 · 18-06-2021 4:55pm

iffandonlyif wrote: »

The article repeatedly inserts the word prevent after a partial quote, without any evidence that that is what the WHO intends.

This is the wording copied from the report.
Page 17, Para 2 of the report
"Appropriate attention should be given to prevention of the initiation of drinking among children and adolescents, prevention of drinking among pregnant women and women of childbearing age, and protection of people from pressures to drink, especially in societies with high levels of alcohol consumption where heavy drinkers are encouraged to drink even more".

Not sure what "appropriate attention" would amount to. If it's an information campaign, that's grand.

BrianD3 · 18-06-2021 5:14pm

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

So? And when you see medical advice to not be overweight, or be fit, how does it affect you? Do you consider yourself injured by the experience?

The comparison with obesity is a poor one. If you want to go down that road, a better comparison would be if the WHO stated that "appropriate attention should be given to the prevention of consumption of high calorie foods" and apply that to...everyone. Would you support this?

The wording of this is all wrong, "prevention" and "women of child bearing age". The latter should set off alarm bells as it means that what follows will be an assumption that pregnancy will happen.

Certain drugs such ibuprofen are not recommended during pregnancy. You can imagine the uproar if a woman went into a pharmacy looking for it and the following happened

Woman: I have a sore back, I'd like some ibuprofen
Pharmacist: What age are you
Woman: 25
Pharmacist: You're of child bearing age, ibuprofen is not recommend for pregnant women. I'll give you paracetamol instead.
Woman: But I'm not pregnant
Pharmacist: Doesn't matter, you might get pregnant.

El_Duderino 09 · 18-06-2021 5:22pm

BrianD3 wrote: »

The comparison with obesity is a poor one. If you want to go down that road, a better comparison would be if the WHO stated that "appropriate attention should be given to the prevention of consumption of high calorie foods" and apply that to...everyone. Would you support this?

The wording of this is all wrong, "prevention" and "women of child bearing age". The latter should set off alarm bells as it means that what follows will be an assumption that pregnancy will happen.

...

Would I support that? If they were going to inform people of the risks of eating high calorie foods (in excess), then I'd be fine with it. I wouldn't get excited about it either way.

I don't think your analogy is great because there's nothing wrong with eating high calorie foods up to your expenditure of calories. Do you think it's a good analogy?

You didn't answer my question which was whether you would feel injured by seeing information aimed to prevent people being overweight or prevent people being unfit. Would you have a problem with them trying to prevent those things through information?

Porklife · 18-06-2021 5:39pm

Hadron Collider wrote: »

There are also millions of women whose drinking during pregnancy led to miscarriage, stillbirth, or a range of lifelong physical, behavioral, and intellectual disabilities inflicted on their children.

Why can't a 25-year-old pregnant woman act responsibly and lay off the bottle for 9 months for the sake of her child?

Do you even know what the article is about? Who said anything about a 25 year old pregnant woman? Im talking about a 25 year old woman who isn't pregnant, she's just of child bearing age. She may not even want children, she may simply want a nice cold beer!

Pregnant women obviously shouldn't drink alcohol but that's not what this is about.

Greyfox · 18-06-2021 5:44pm

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

Absolutely no difference as long as all they plan to do is inform them of the risks.

People know the risks and its already been established that drinking in moderation is ok as long as you have a balanced diet.

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

So? And when you see medical advice to not be overweight, or be fit, how does it affect you? Do you consider yourself injured by the experience?

Thats fine as this advice is not saying you shouldn't eat junk food. Now if people wanted to prevent people from eating junk food rather than cutting down then i'd be annoyed

maudgonner · 18-06-2021 5:46pm

Think of the poor teenagers - now instead of trying to look 18 on their fake IDs they'll have to look 51 :eek:

As for the WHO report, I'm barely surprised by it, let alone outraged. It's not that long ago that a friend of mine had difficulty getting her doctor to prescribe her the pill because she was a young woman of prime child-bearing years and sure she might meet someone soon and decide to settle down.

appledrop · 18-06-2021 5:46pm

Coming home from work listing to radio and I really am wondering have we gone back to 1950s.

Husband not allowed in with his partner when she miscarried, even though Maternity hospitials told to stop restricting partners.

Then next headline was that new National Matetnity hospitial won't be owned by state as religious organisation will only allow them rent the land.

Handmaid's Tail here we come.

Tony EH · 18-06-2021 5:48pm

NIMAN wrote: »

They don't "want", they are advising.

The same advice that's been floating around for, literally, decades.

:pac:

punisher5112 · 18-06-2021 5:49pm

Who and holohan etc are dead set against alcohol it's pretty obvious.

Will I Am Not · 18-06-2021 5:58pm

People are free to disregard advice. I’ve been doing it for years.

18-06-2021 9:39pm

Will I Am Not wrote: »

People are free to disregard advice. I’ve been doing it for years.

Ahah - but what if I advise you to keep doing that?

NewbridgeIR · 18-06-2021 9:54pm

pappyodaniel wrote: »

I never listen to anything Roger Daltrey has to say.

Watch your backs!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=STZvFmmGviM

18-06-2021 10:31pm

Porklife wrote: »

It absolutely is about controlling women. As a recently pregnant woman I can strongly say I've never felt under more scrutiny or judgement from ordering a coffee in starbucks and being asked should I have decaf instead, to getting funny looks in the park drinking a non alcoholic beer on a sunny day. It's my body, my baby and my choice.
There are millions of women of child bearing age conceiving and delivering perfectly healthy babies who drink alcohol. Why shouldn't a 25 year old girl enjoy a glass of wine? It's absolutely ridiculous.
Drinking sensibly is highly advisable and should be advocated but that applies to everyone and not just women of a certain age.

It's only advising women to avoid drinking alcohol during childbearing years - not forcing them to. I don't get the "my body" thing either - it's irrelevant, they're referring to the foetus's or potential foetus's body. And yeah plenty of my friends drank the odd beer and smoked the odd fag when they were pregnant, and I don't blame them one bit - I know I would too. I'm just saying the opening post is completely misrepresenting what the story is about. I'd only consider it bad form if the mother kept getting drunk (as FAS is a risk) but not the odd drink, that's just being human.

18-06-2021 10:36pm

honeyjo wrote: »

Welcome to Gilead. Blessed be the fruit

Ah here, we can't work, read/write, own property, drive, have bank accounts, choose partners or stay single, use contraception, are forced into surrogacy via rape? It's a recommendation, which people won't take seriously - that's all.

HerrKapitan · 18-06-2021 10:43pm

This is kite flying for the future tax hikes on alcohol to come. Paint an evil picture on alcohol and it will soften the impact of large tax hikes.

There is a MOMMA bill being proposed by Democrats in the US that would see 1000%+ increase on tobacco tax. I don't think alcohol is going to escape such treatment.

The WHO wants to prevent all women of "child-bearing age" from drinking alcohol

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