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TG4 9.30 new series on IRA volunteers

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  • 12-01-2011 4:13pm
    #1
    PatsytheNazi
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,260 ✭✭✭


    Tonight it's Dan Breen - My Fight for Irish Freedom at 9.30 tonight Wednesday. Tom Barry will also be featured in the series. If it's anything as good as the recent series on TG4 about the 1916 leaders, it will be well worth watching.

    " 'My Fight For Irish Freedom, Scéal Dan Breen.' A documentary on the colourful life of Dan Breen who started the War of Independence at Soloheadbeg, Co. Tipperary, in 1919 on the day the First Dáil sat in Dublin and who spread rebellion like an infection in his travels around the country. "

    http://www.tg4.ie/bearla/scei/scei.asp


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    #2
    Morlar
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,273 ✭✭✭Morlar


    PatsytheNazi wrote: »
    Tonight it's Dan Breen - My Fight for Irish Freedom at 9.30 tonight Wednesday. Tom Barry will also be featured in the series. If it's anything as good as the recent series on TG4 about the 1916 leaders, it will be well worth watching.

    " 'My Fight For Irish Freedom, Scéal Dan Breen.' A documentary on the colourful life of Dan Breen who started the War of Independence at Soloheadbeg, Co. Tipperary, in 1919 on the day the First Dáil sat in Dublin and who spread rebellion like an infection in his travels around the country. "

    http://www.tg4.ie/bearla/scei/scei.asp

    Looks good - thanks.


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    #3
    deise go deo
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,677 ✭✭✭deise go deo


    I wounder will it be Dan Breen's version as per his book or the truth?


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    #4
    PatsytheNazi
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,260 ✭✭✭PatsytheNazi


    My Fight for Irish Freedom was ghost written, though Dan Breen came in for criticism for it. Much of the criticism was inspired by Seamus Robinson's jealousy of him. There is a newer book on him by Joe Ambrose. I have read it, it's quite good and fair to him.

    http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/images/1856355063/ref=dp_image_0?ie=UTF8&n=266239&s=books


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    #5
    Denerick
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 6,488 ✭✭✭Denerick


    Dan Breen, the Action Man of the IRA. Ran through a shower of bullets, jumped over St. Pats wall only to wander into the canal and discover that he was personally responsible for it turning red.


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    #6
    paky
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 2,138 ✭✭✭paky


    PatsytheNazi wrote: »
    Tonight it's Dan Breen - My Fight for Irish Freedom at 9.30 tonight Wednesday. Tom Barry will also be featured in the series. If it's anything as good as the recent series on TG4 about the 1916 leaders, it will be well worth watching.

    " 'My Fight For Irish Freedom, Scéal Dan Breen.' A documentary on the colourful life of Dan Breen who started the War of Independence at Soloheadbeg, Co. Tipperary, in 1919 on the day the First Dáil sat in Dublin and who spread rebellion like an infection in his travels around the country. "

    http://www.tg4.ie/bearla/scei/scei.asp

    does tg4 have this on repeat anytime? dont think i'll make it home on time


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    #7
    walrusgumble
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 3,062 ✭✭✭walrusgumble


    paky wrote: »
    does tg4 have this on repeat anytime? dont think i'll make it home on time

    TG4 has a player just like RTE, so it should not be a problem


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    #8
    PatsytheNazi
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,260 ✭✭✭PatsytheNazi


    Well I have obviously read both My Fight for Irish Freedom and Joe Ambrose's book mentioned above (glad to see he featured on the programme), so for me, I knew most of what was shown, but I hope for others it was informative.

    One point I would take up was the ambush to execute Lord French near the Phoenix Park. Now obviously the makers can only get so detail in and have a limited budget, but the scene showed only one car in the ambush and how it went badly wrong with Dan Breen getting badly wounded and 1916 Volunteer Sean Savage from Sligo been mortally wounded. However there was actually four cars in the ambush, all containing soldiers. Off hand cannot think of the British casualties.

    Was gald to see the interviews with him, a tough man for tough times. He kept his beliefs all his life, for example been against the Vietnam War and spoke out publically on it. Warts and all,his generation of Fianna Fail men, have nothing to do with the crowd that took over after Lemass such as Lynch, Reynolds, Haughey, Aherne etc :rolleyes: Also gald the view of the great grandson of one the RIC men,McDonnell, was also included.

    Looking foward to the next one on Tom Barry. Well done TG4 again.


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    #9
    johnny_doyle
    Registered Users Posts: 1,021 ✭✭✭johnny_doyle


    Caught the programme on the TG4 player. 2 of the "foot soldiers" at Knocklong were the wife's grandfather and his brother from the Galbally company. The unit was officially no longer part of the Volunteers/IRA as it had been kicked out following ructions between Manahan and Hannigan.

    Thomas Twomeys book The War of Independence in Limerick is a good read for some of the details re Soloheadbeg and Knocklong.


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    #10
    V480
    Closed Accounts Posts: 593 ✭✭✭V480


    Very good programme but less so every time that actor playing Dan Breen came on screen. It seems to be kind of a recurring problem in Irish historical documentaries - crap actors.

    Breen was a fit and physically able man, yet the guy who plays him looks like Peter Kay. It was the same in the TG4 1916 documentaries, great programmes but the guy who played Pearse irritated me so much I had to turn it off every time he started talking. In fairness he did look a bit like Pearse, but woeful actor.


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    #11
    PatsytheNazi
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,260 ✭✭✭PatsytheNazi


    V480 wrote: »
    Very good programme but less so every time that actor playing Dan Breen came on screen. It seems to be kind of a recurring problem in Irish historical documentaries - crap actors.

    Breen was a fit and physically able man, yet the guy who plays him looks like Peter Kay. It was the same in the TG4 1916 documentaries, great programmes but the guy who played Pearse irritated me so much I had to turn it off every time he started talking. In fairness he did look a bit like Pearse, but woeful actor.
    True enough, Breen had the build of a boxer or weight lifter from his years working on the shovel repairing railway lines. Well in fairness to them, their budget would be a big factor. Not having a go at you, but I'm more concerned about the historical accuracy and the possible additional information in a historical documentary than the acting.


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    #12
    Dioluin
    Closed Accounts Posts: 45 ✭Dioluin


    Is this the first episode in the series?
    Also does anyone know will this be released as a DVD in the future?
    Oh, and for anyone that missed this, it will be on again tonight around 8 I think.
    Go raibh maith agat.


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    #13
    baldbear
    Registered Users Posts: 5,531 ✭✭✭baldbear


    Tom Barry on now. Should be interesting. From a fighter in the great war to the Kilmichael ambush.


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    #14
    gooch2k9
    Registered Users Posts: 1,648 ✭✭✭gooch2k9


    Glad I followed this thread didn't want to miss the Tom Barry one!


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    #15
    baldbear
    Registered Users Posts: 5,531 ✭✭✭baldbear


    Was this documentary made recently? I don't believe Harte's claims stand up about the false surrender. In his book he claims to have got an account from a scout alive in the 80's but he was actually dead by that date.


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    #16
    gooch2k9
    Registered Users Posts: 1,648 ✭✭✭gooch2k9


    Well Hart died in July 2010, so any interviews with him were before that. No idea about the rest.


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    #17
    V480
    Closed Accounts Posts: 593 ✭✭✭V480


    Dioluin wrote: »
    Is this the first episode in the series?
    Also does anyone know will this be released as a DVD in the future?
    Oh, and for anyone that missed this, it will be on again tonight around 8 I think.
    Go raibh maith agat.


    Not too sure about a dvd release but I would doubt it. It's a pity RTE never released the Hidden History programmes on dvd, I reckon it would sell pretty well.


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    #18
    mikemac
    Closed Accounts Posts: 19,986 ✭✭✭✭mikemac


    For a DVD release probably don't mind TG4 or RTÉ and go straight to the production company, they'll know what's planned

    And if enough people contact them they would release a DVD

    RTÉ had a series on the 1798 and showed them in 1998. I'd do anything to get a copy of them and have made a lot of calls and the odd letter and got nowhere.
    There is a market for these things.
    Or even host them on your website and put in some ads and you can make some money. Better then locking them away for nobody to see


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    #19
    PatsytheNazi
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,260 ✭✭✭PatsytheNazi


    baldbear wrote: »
    Was this documentary made recently? I don't believe Harte's claims stand up about the false surrender. In his book he claims to have got an account from a scout alive in the 80's but he was actually dead by that date.
    Hart has been totally discredited. For example some of the men he claimed to have interviewed who had been invovled at Kilmicheal were dead for several years.


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    #20
    jonniebgood1
    Registered Users Posts: 3,577 ✭✭✭jonniebgood1


    PatsytheNazi wrote: »
    Hart has been totally discredited. For example some of the men he claimed to have interviewed who had been invovled at Kilmicheal were dead for several years.

    I thought he did not name his source for this so thus could not be completely discredited?


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    #21
    V480
    Closed Accounts Posts: 593 ✭✭✭V480


    jonniebgood1 wrote: »
    I thought he did not name his source for this so thus could not be completely discredited?

    You are correct. Some of the reaction to Hart's study of Kilmichael was way over the top.


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    #22
    paky
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 2,138 ✭✭✭paky


    why did hart make these allegations?


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    #23
    jonniebgood1
    Registered Users Posts: 3,577 ✭✭✭jonniebgood1


    paky wrote: »
    why did hart make these allegations?

    He was simply questioning the accepted view of events. His version of events is quite plausible given the known facts of the events (specifically Kilmichael in relation to Tom Barry, more generally the Cork area in other cases). The negative reaction to his alternative view came largely from one viewpoint which took Barrys version of events as being fully accepted (the journalistic opposition was from people who accepted Barrys version). Regardless of which version is to be believed I think it is healthy for Hart to put a more neutral point of view forward. In any event it is debatable as to whether Harts alternative view would vary proples opinions of Tom Barrys role.


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    #24
    PatsytheNazi
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,260 ✭✭✭PatsytheNazi


    jonniebgood1 wrote: »
    He was simply questioning the accepted view of events. His version of events is quite plausible given the known facts of the events (specifically Kilmichael in relation to Tom Barry, more generally the Cork area in other cases). The negative reaction to his alternative view came largely from one viewpoint which took Barrys version of events as being fully accepted (the journalistic opposition was from people who accepted Barrys version). Regardless of which version is to be believed I think it is healthy for Hart to put a more neutral point of view forward. In any event it is debatable as to whether Harts alternative view would vary proples opinions of Tom Barrys role.
    " His version of events is quite plausible " According to Harte's anonymous ' sources'. Yes, and Freddie Star ate my pet hamster ( while according to my sources).


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    #25
    jonniebgood1
    Registered Users Posts: 3,577 ✭✭✭jonniebgood1


    PatsytheNazi wrote: »
    " His version of events is quite plausible " According to Harte's anonymous ' sources'. Yes, and Freddie Star ate my pet hamster ( while according to my sources).

    Ahh Patsy, your poor hamster- sorry to hear that...

    Seriously, if you think that his version of Kilmichael (as most prominent example) is not plausible, you should explain what aspects you find to be not plausible.

    I stand over my post that it is healthy to question events as this does.
    I have admiration for Barry but his own version of events is always going to be biased towards himself- thats not a crime, just human nature. Hart bases his view on established facts which as I said I find plausible.


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    #26
    R.Dub.Fusilier
    Closed Accounts Posts: 588 ✭✭✭R.Dub.Fusilier


    jonniebgood1 wrote: »
    I stand over my post that it is healthy to question events as this does.
    I have admiration for Barry but his own version of events is always going to be biased towards himself- thats not a crime, just human nature. Hart bases his view on established facts which as I said I find plausible.

    Hart has a right to his opinion , and by hearing all sides to the story it is easier to see the truth. but Harts opinions were shown to be flawed and lies in the programe , as in people he said he interviewed being dead at the time , which was shown a couple of times.


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    #27
    deise go deo
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,677 ✭✭✭deise go deo


    jonniebgood1 wrote: »
    Hart bases his view on established facts which as I said I find plausible.

    Heart based his view on sources that he never named, however, when he claimed to have interviewed them, there was only one surviver alive and that surviver denied ever meeting heart.

    While there is nothing wrong with open discussion of events, Hearts methods are rather shady at best.


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    #28
    jonniebgood1
    Registered Users Posts: 3,577 ✭✭✭jonniebgood1


    deise go deo wrote: »
    Heart based his view on sources that he never named, however, when he claimed to have interviewed them, there was only one surviver alive and that surviver denied ever meeting heart.

    While there is nothing wrong with open discussion of events, Hearts methods are rather shady at best.

    I agree with the last 2 posts fully. Of course it is shady and creates lack of belief when an author claims a source but won't name it. I didnt see in the program however how harts claims were "shown to be flawed and lies ". As I said his assertions are plausible, this does not mean they are correct.
    plau·si·ble   
    /ˈplɔzəbəl/ Show Spelled
    [plaw-zuh-buhl]

    –adjective
    1. having an appearance of truth or reason; seemingly worthy of approval or acceptance; credible; believable: a plausible excuse; a plausible plot.
    2. well-spoken and apparently, but often deceptively, worthy of confidence or trust: a plausible commentator.

    http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/plausible


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