Should people on the dole be made do community service?

Pmacv1 · 11-11-2019 11:14pm #1

Obviously long-term "job seekers" who are able bodied.

Ten of Swords · 11-11-2019 11:14pm

Finally, an original thread

Thank you op

elperello · 11-11-2019 11:15pm

No.

Pmacv1 · 11-11-2019 11:16pm

elperello wrote: »

No.

Why?

Stacksofwacks · 11-11-2019 11:18pm

I'm pretty sure people who are long term unemployed and repeatedly refuse work are forced onto community work schemes, are they not?

Pmacv1 · 11-11-2019 11:20pm

Stacksofwacks wrote: »

I'm pretty sure people who are long term unemployed and repeatedly refuse work are forced onto community work schemes, are they not?

Nope, you generally have to apply for those. I'm just talking about litter picking a few hours a week or something similar. Maybe 10 hours a week?

Stacksofwacks · 11-11-2019 11:26pm

Pmacv1 wrote: »

Nope, you generally have to apply for those. I'm just talking about litter picking a few hours a week or something similar. Maybe 10 hours a week?

I remember a few years ago when I was unemployed I was told by my job officer that if I didn't apply for jobs or pick up work soon I would be forced to do some community work scheme, she sounded pretty serious maybe she was just putting the frighteners on me. I wouldnt be against the overall idea but picking up litter would be kind of humiliating for someone of my intellect

SCOOP 64 · 11-11-2019 11:26pm

Like the sort of thing offenders do for petty crime?

beggars_bush · 11-11-2019 11:26pm

Pmacv1 wrote: »

Obviously long-term "job seekers" who are able bodied.

Define long term?

Feisar · 11-11-2019 11:28pm

Stacksofwacks wrote: »

I remember a few years ago when I was unemployed I was told by my job officer that if I didn't apply for jobs or pick up work soon I would be forced to do some community work scheme, she sounded pretty serious maybe she was just putting the frighteners on me. I wouldnt be against the overall idea but picking up litter would be kind of humiliating for someone of my intellect

What would your intellect have to do with it?

ytpe2r5bxkn0c1 · 11-11-2019 11:30pm

Not only the weekly dole bashing thread but your very own weekly edition.

Ronaldinho · 11-11-2019 11:31pm

Wouldn't kill them to rake up some of the leaves out there.

11-11-2019 11:34pm

Pmacv1 wrote: »

Obviously long-term "job seekers" who are able bodied.

Well firstly being on the dole is not a crime and more often than not, it isnt by choice.

Secondly, im pretty sure you've described a CE scheme, of which there is many willing participants. A great way of obtaining work experience. Id certainly reccommend.

brevity · 11-11-2019 11:34pm

No.

The legit people who are on the dole don’t need this sort of **** making them feel worse.

The people you are thinking about would laugh at you until their next dole payment and then laugh some more.

Stacksofwacks · 11-11-2019 11:38pm

Offer them an hourly wage on top of there dole. If they do 10 hours a week at 10 euro per hour that's an extra 100 euro a week. Incentivise it. If they refuse it(assuming they are able bodied, no medical conditions etc) then dock their dole by 50%

riffmongous · 11-11-2019 11:41pm

Stacksofwacks wrote: »

I remember a few years ago when I was unemployed I was told by my job officer that if I didn't apply for jobs or pick up work soon I would be forced to do some community work scheme, she sounded pretty serious maybe she was just putting the frighteners on me. I wouldnt be against the overall idea but picking up litter would be kind of humiliating for someone of my intellect

Yeah that happened to me, back in 2011. Not picking litter but caretaker of the local community hall. I had the first talk and everything. It's basically what made my mind up to emigrate.

Quantum Erasure · 11-11-2019 11:41pm

SCOOP 64 wrote: »

Like the sort of thing offenders do for petty crime?

yeah, but they get paid for it through their dole

Pmacv1 · 11-11-2019 11:44pm

beggars_bush wrote: »

Define long term?

18 months and above.

Pmacv1 · 11-11-2019 11:45pm

Zayd Whining Sidearm wrote: »

Not only the weekly dole bashing thread but your very own weekly edition.

Nobody is dole bashing, I'm looking for ways to get unemployed more integrated with society.

Stacksofwacks · 11-11-2019 11:49pm

Pmacv1 wrote: »

Nobody is dole bashing, I'm looking for ways to get unemployed more integrated with society.

Most people who are looking for a job or are employable will get a job. But there are a number of people who are not employable. Forcing them on some scheme wont make them anymore employable.

Pmacv1 · 11-11-2019 11:51pm

Stacksofwacks wrote: »

Most people who are looking for a job or are employable will get a job. But there are a number of people who are not employable. Forcing them on some scheme wont make them anymore employable.

Well no, but it gives them the ability to give back and become a contributing member of society. Great for self-esteem aswell.

debok · 11-11-2019 11:52pm

Pmacv1 wrote: »

Nobody is dole bashing, I'm looking for ways to get unemployed more integrated with society.

Your like some sort of super hero. Doleman

Stacksofwacks · 11-11-2019 11:55pm

Pmacv1 wrote: »

Well no, but it gives them the ability to give back and become a contributing member of society. Great for self-esteem aswell.

Ok well lets say the person has an anti-social personality disorder and is a danger to the society at large, isn't it better to let the guy have his dole than mugging someone on street

Annasopra · 11-11-2019 11:56pm

Pmacv1 wrote: »

Obviously long-term "job seekers" who are able bodied.

Have we not done this thread 30 times already

Pmacv1 · 11-11-2019 11:57pm

Stacksofwacks wrote: »

Ok well lets say the person has an anti-social personality disorder and is a danger to the society at large, isn't it better to let the guy have his dole than mugging someone on street

If someone is going to mug someone, they'll do it regardless if they're getting dole or not. Frankly, paying people not to commit violent acts is a cop out.

Annasopra · 11-11-2019 11:59pm

Stacksofwacks wrote: »

Ok well lets say the person has an anti-social personality disorder and is a danger to the society at large, isn't it better to let the guy have his dole than mugging someone on street

5/10

Stacksofwacks · 12-11-2019 12:02am

Pmacv1 wrote: »

If someone is going to mug someone, they'll do it regardless if they're getting dole or not. Frankly, paying people not to commit violent acts is a cop out.

Add to the legal costs of prosecuting him and the prison costs of jailing him, the dole isn't a bad price to pay. Some will commit crimes anyway but the number of crimes will be a lot less

LaFuton · 12-11-2019 12:03am

lets just shoot them all. at dawn.

Pmacv1 · 12-11-2019 12:04am

Stacksofwacks wrote: »

Add to the legal costs of prosecuting him and the prison costs of jailing him, the dole isn't a bad price to pay. Some will commit crimes anyway but the number of crimes will be a lot less

Dreadful attitude. Also, that's a completely baseless assertion.

high_king · 12-11-2019 12:04am

LaFuton wrote: »

lets just shoot them all. at dawn.

Who's going to pay for that ?

high_king · 12-11-2019 12:06am

Stacksofwacks wrote: »

I remember a few years ago when I was unemployed I was told by my job officer that if I didn't apply for jobs or pick up work soon I would be forced to do some community work scheme, she sounded pretty serious maybe she was just putting the frighteners on me. I wouldnt be against the overall idea but picking up litter would be kind of humiliating for someone of my intellect

What's picking up litter got to do with intellect ? No one should ever be above it, or think they are.

Stacksofwacks · 12-11-2019 12:10am

Pmacv1 wrote: »

Dreadful attitude. Also, that's a completely baseless assertion.

Its a common sense assertion. But I agree with your overall point that those looking for and fit for work should be put onto those schemes, but as Ive pointed out for certain people it would be pointless

Pmacv1 · 12-11-2019 12:11am

Stacksofwacks wrote: »

Its a common sense assertion. But I agree with your overall point that those looking for and fit for work should be put onto those schemes, but as Ive pointed out for certain people it would be pointless

Nobody should be above working, nor should abandoning people as lost causes be acceptable.

nthclare · 12-11-2019 12:12am

Stacksofwacks wrote: »

I remember a few years ago when I was unemployed I was told by my job officer that if I didn't apply for jobs or pick up work soon I would be forced to do some community work scheme, she sounded pretty serious maybe she was just putting the frighteners on me. I wouldnt be against the overall idea but picking up litter would be kind of humiliating for someone of my intellect

I know what you mean, I know a guy in North Clare he's a multimillionaire and love's nothing more than to pick up rubbish from the beach in Fanore now and again, he's not humiliated.
I'm telling you there's money in dirt....

You'd see him there with s sack of wrope, plastic bottle s etc he doesn't give a ****...

That's humility for your intellect....

Maybe you should go panning for gold instead

Stacksofwacks · 12-11-2019 12:15am

nthclare wrote: »

I know what you mean, I know a guy in North Clare he's a multimillionaire and love's nothing more than to pick up rubbish from the beach in Fanore now and again, he's not humiliated.
I'm telling you there's money in dirt....

You'd see him there with s sack of wrope, plastic bottle s etc he doesn't give a ****...

That's humility for your intellect....

Maybe you should go panning for gold instead

Any chance of a loan? You would be investing in a fine intellect..:)

PinotNero · 12-11-2019 12:19am

They need to be isolated and studied so it can be determined what nutrients they have that might be extracted for our personal use.

The Oort Cloud · 12-11-2019 12:19am

No to your question - "Should people on the dole be made do community service?".
Prisoners that have been sentenced for a crime are given community service in certain cases and as your question posted assumes that all people on the dole are criminals in some case.

Very long term unemployed people quite possibly have mental health issues and lack of skills to enter the work-force. My personal thoughts in regards to very long term unemployed people is that there should be a special detailing mental-health system set up to see if these very long-term unemployed people are suffering from issues stopping them from gaining employment. No-one knows what their circumstances might be, it could be deep depression in their life or the way their life is going or has gone and in this case they need to be treated with respect from the social service system and not demonised by being unemployed. There is definitely a health reason involved (in my personal opinion) mental/physical associated with being long-term unemployed.

There is an issue, but here you have people making new threads constantly to do such thing as to demonise and treat these folk as nasty people or wasters or worse of course of which has been shown constantly on many boards threads. Maybe it's time to find out in regards to a health standard test to see if these very long-term unemployed people are suffering from the above health issues before putting them down. But logic doesn't have a place in some boards posters, they are basically the same trolls as existed from 2006.

Long-term unemployed folk that probably have issues nonetheless should still be treated as human beings as well as being welcome into our societal structure of which is based on peace and harmony for a better society for all.

Pmacv1 · 12-11-2019 12:24am

The Oort Cloud wrote: »

No to your question - "Should people on the dole be made do community service?".
Prisoners that have been sentenced for a crime are given community service in certain cases and as your question posted assumes that all people on the dole are criminals in some case.

Very long term unemployed people quite possibly have mental health issues and lack of skills to enter the work-force. My personal thoughts in regards to very long term unemployed people is that there should be a special detailing mental-health system set up to see if these very long-term unemployed people are suffering from issues stopping them from gaining employment. No-one knows what their circumstances might be, it could be deep depression in their life or the way their life is going or has gone and in this case they need to be treated with respect from the social service system and not demonised by being unemployed. There is definitely a health reason involved (in my personal opinion) mental/physical associated with being long-term unemployed.

There is an issue, but here you have people making new threads constantly to do such thing as to demonise and treat these folk as nasty people or wasters or worse of course of which has been shown constantly on many boards threads. Maybe it's time to find out in regards to a health standard test to see if these very long-term unemployed people are suffering from the above health issues before putting them down. But logic doesn't have a place in some boards posters, they are basically the same trolls as existed from 2006.

Long-term unemployed folk that probably have issues nonetheless should still be treated as human beings as well as being welcome into our societal structure of which is based on peace and harmony for a better society for all.

It doesn't "assume" that all people on the dole are criminals. Stop making stuff up. I litter pick at weekends, I consider that to be community service. You don't have to be a criminal to make structured contributions to society.

nthclare · 12-11-2019 12:31am

Stacksofwacks wrote: »

Any chance of a loan? You would be investing in a fine intellect..:)

Ah I have a few fertilizer sacks, they're a bit grubby, but you can use them

LirW · 12-11-2019 1:03am

There are CEs already.
Also it doesn't help in the unemployment blackspots in this country where there simply aren't enough jobs to keep local population permanently employed.
The same people kicking down on unemployed are the ones that suggest they should just pack up and move "closer to the jobs" where the majority of the low-skilled workforce can't afford to live and still have to commute 1,5h.
The issue is far more complex than putting all the nasty leeches on forced work contracts.

Stacksofwacks · 12-11-2019 1:08am

The only thing in the rural areas now is farming. Unless you have a farm or are working on one then you have to move to the town or city. If your living near one then you might be able to commute.

LillySV · 12-11-2019 1:10am

Stacksofwacks wrote: »

I remember a few years ago when I was unemployed I was told by my job officer that if I didn't apply for jobs or pick up work soon I would be forced to do some community work scheme, she sounded pretty serious maybe she was just putting the frighteners on me. I wouldnt be against the overall idea but picking up litter would be kind of humiliating for someone of my intellect

I love that attitude...all our Irish millennials are too good for most jobs after their art degrees ... yet qualified for fuk all! They go to Australia and Will do anything... scrub toilets .... u name it... but won’t do any lower paid work at home ... rather stay on dole...

Stacksofwacks · 12-11-2019 1:15am

LillySV wrote: »

I love that attitude...all our Irish millennials are too good for most jobs after their art degrees ... yet qualified for fuk all! They go to Australia and Will do anything... scrub toilets .... u name it... but won’t do any lower paid work at home ... rather stay on dole...

But but but..ah millennials didn't know I was one til you told me

Mules · 12-11-2019 1:20am

I know someone who's long term on the dole (very bad alcoholic) and social welfare have him out picking up rubbish. The downside is there's the potential for employers to take the piss and use it so they don't have to pay wages, like CE schemes.

d8491prj5boyvg · 12-11-2019 1:26am

How can they seek a job if they are busy. Seems contradictory. Many might be happy with the community service and it becomes a first choice! Then we have even more on the dole!

Tl;dr. No. It'll make it worse.

dartboardio · 12-11-2019 1:28am

To be honest I think people that are on JSA for 3/4 years or more with no obvious action being taken to find work at all, their payment should be reduced every so often.

People that have no excuse or reason to work other than 'Why not if I can get handed 200 euro per week to sit at home'
should be somewhat forced to either take courses or payments reduced until they show they are actively seeking employment

and for the record I'd have alot more respect for someone picking up litter or driving the bin truck than somebody sitting at home for 5 years on jobseekers allowance with no disability or inability to work, after all a job is a job.

Varik · 12-11-2019 2:21am

A few hours here and there isn't going to get in the way of a job search and would benefit society.

Would do more good than banning plastic straws and any of the same.

Twister2 · 12-11-2019 2:24am

Stacksofwacks wrote: »

Offer them an hourly wage on top of there dole. If they do 10 hours a week at 10 euro per hour that's an extra 100 euro a week. Incentivise it. If they refuse it(assuming they are able bodied, no medical conditions etc) then dock their dole by 50%

300 a week tax free for 10 hrs

Tippsman · 12-11-2019 2:25am

Why work when the dole pays as much as a normal job and you've your free time to do as you please.

con___manx1 · 12-11-2019 2:57am

Stacksofwacks wrote: »

Offer them an hourly wage on top of there dole. If they do 10 hours a week at 10 euro per hour that's an extra 100 euro a week. Incentivise it. If they refuse it(assuming they are able bodied, no medical conditions etc) then dock their dole by 50%

If they were getting the full dole payment and 100 for 10 hours work that's around 300 a week.
A person on minimum wage only gets around 400 for 40 hours work.
I don't think that would work somehow.

Stacksofwacks · 12-11-2019 5:33am

Pmacv1 wrote: »

Nobody should be above working, nor should abandoning people as lost causes be acceptable.

You sound quite judgmental. Why should people have their self esteem tied to their work status, shouldn't they just be happy regardless, as citizens of the world? Also why didn't you start a thread praising all those who are working and contributing to society as you put it, rather than focussing on the 5% who aren't?

Should people on the dole be made do community service?

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