Farm workers wages!

C4d78 · 02-01-2015 4:01pm

arctictree wrote: »

Biggest problem I have is part time labour. How can I expense it in my books if I can't get a receipt for €50?

I just right a cheque for the €50 and accountant puts it in as casual labour

Timmaay · 02-01-2015 4:10pm

C4d78 wrote: »

I just right a cheque for the €50 and accountant puts it in as casual labour

My accountant says we can't put down for causal labour anymore, every employee has to give a pps number.

ihatewinter · 02-01-2015 4:40pm

Fuxake wrote: »

Problem is that most farmers cant afford to hold these in the economy we have. I would fear that as the economy recovers and the building kicks off again we're gonna have a mighty struggle to get enough help to cover existing requirements and that's before we figure who's gonna milk all the extra cows.

However, this is a really important thread insofar as it raises the question who's gonna do all the work on Irish farms over the next 10 years as we plan expansion yet the actual farmers are mostly over 55 already.

What I do know from experience is that good farm workers have become more available in recent years due to downturn but it was a hell of a job to get anyone in the boom years.

Im just saying that there will be more people looking to hire than people worth hiring. In an ideal world Teagasc or somesuch should be running courses to train youngsters from a non-farming background into being farm workers, foremen etc. But in turn, there will have to be a relatively respectable career path to attract anyone. We simply wont get enough workers from farming backgrounds cos they are either off pursuing professional careers or are unsuitable for other reasons.

Surely with the increase in attendance of young people in Agricultural Colleges, there will be enough to milk and do general farm work. They have a practical element to them as well so most will have experience. I' m female so found it very hard to get work on farms especially during busy times. All I got you're too small, not strong enough, your father doesn't farm etc. A local farmer fell and hurt his back, he had no one else, reluctantly took me on and still there 5 years later. I milk 5 days per week and do feeding and anything else. One thing I can't do is heat detection or AI.

mahoney_j · 02-01-2015 5:10pm

Reading this thread thanks be to Jaysus I can depend on my own and dads labour with the odd bit of casual labour relief milking from June on.invested heavily here in last few years in parlour,sheds andcaroundvthevyard so I can have a place where I can handle 100/120 cows and followers with above help and no more.whenever dad decides he can't cope with work load in spring(feeding and bedding calves and cleaning down cubicles)I'll have to look into getting a guy or girl in for 5 1/2 days per week.that way I aint a total slave and will keep my 6.30 to 6 o clock days as they are now.

Coonagh · 02-01-2015 5:26pm

mahoney_j wrote: »

Reading this thread thanks be to Jaysus I can depend on my own and dads labour with the odd bit of casual labour relief milking from June on.invested heavily here in last few years in parlour,sheds andcaroundvthevyard so I can have a place where I can handle 100/120 cows and followers with above help and no more.whenever dad decides he can't cope with work load in spring(feeding and bedding calves and cleaning down cubicles)I'll have to look into getting a guy or girl in for 5 1/2 days per week.that way I aint a total slave and will keep my 6.30 to 6 o clock days as they are now.

very hard to find anyone to do 5 1/2 days a week trust me I've been there. Reason being we found anyone that was any good had or wanted full time work. I'd say in your situation and with your setup a student would be most practical. Providing accommodation is no longer a deal breaker in getting one

Greengrass1 · 02-01-2015 5:53pm

Coonagh wrote: »

very hard to find anyone to do 5 1/2 days a week trust me I've been there. Reason being we found anyone that was any good had or wanted full time work. I'd say in your situation and with your setup a student would be most practical. Providing accommodation is no longer a deal breaker in getting one

I'd agree with that too. Man I did a bit for when I came home found it hard to get any one after I finished with him. Too much work here.
He has a lad now who has sucklers cones to him every morning in spring from Feb to may to feed calves and all that has him then odd days to do other jobs. Works well for both.
Students very hard to get I'm told.
A ag student should be able to go to any farm he wishes IMO instead of thus bull they can only go to approaved farms.
I learned more in the few months I spent with that farmer than I did on my first placement

Feckthis · 02-01-2015 7:10pm

Dawggone wrote: »

It's all about vision Base. If somebody comes to work talking hours and takehome pay they can go...
Blackgrass is correct about full hours/wage and subbing...

I don't want/need a youngster talking hours.
Before Xmas I had a young lad (Irish) looking for work on HIS terms. His "wishes" were 1. €600/week in hand for 40hrs. 2. House. 3. Car. 4. Phone. 5. Free flights home.

This child comes from home farm with 35 sucklers in Mayo.
FFS.

That guy needs a slap!!

Cattlepen · 02-01-2015 7:15pm

ihatewinter wrote: »

Surely with the increase in attendance of young people in Agricultural Colleges, there will be enough to milk and do general farm work. They have a practical element to them as well so most will have experience. I' m female so found it very hard to get work on farms especially during busy times. All I got you're too small, not strong enough, your father doesn't farm etc. A local farmer fell and hurt his back, he had no one else, reluctantly took me on and still there 5 years later. I milk 5 days per week and do feeding and anything else. One thing I can't do is heat detection or AI.

I used to take on students. The best I had was a girl. She saved more ewes for me than I can remember and never questioned authority. Male students were the reason I stopped taking students

Bullocks · 02-01-2015 7:22pm

Dawggone wrote: »

It's all about vision Base. If somebody comes to work talking hours and takehome pay they can go...
Blackgrass is correct about full hours/wage and subbing...

I don't want/need a youngster talking hours.
Before Xmas I had a young lad (Irish) looking for work on HIS terms. His "wishes" were 1. €600/week in hand for 40hrs. 2. House. 3. Car. 4. Phone. 5. Free flights home.

This child comes from home farm with 35 sucklers in Mayo.
FFS.

If you're stuck Dawg I'll do the job and won't look for a phone or car , 600 quid a week in good weather would be just what the doctor ordered

whelan2 · 02-01-2015 7:49pm

Impossible to get a student here, will be using farm relief to source what labour i need for the few months of spring, did my head in advertising and listening to people that hadnt a clue, one big weight off my mind if they are the ones hiring and firing

paddysdream · 02-01-2015 8:04pm

Dawggone wrote: »

It's all about vision Base. If somebody comes to work talking hours and takehome pay they can go...
Blackgrass is correct about full hours/wage and subbing...

I don't want/need a youngster talking hours.
Before Xmas I had a young lad (Irish) looking for work on HIS terms. His "wishes" were 1. €600/week in hand for 40hrs. 2. House. 3. Car. 4. Phone. 5. Free flights home.

This child comes from home farm with 35 sucklers in Mayo.
FFS.

This attitude puzzles me to be honest.
What else would anyone come to work and worry about only how much they had to do and how much they were getting for it?
Its like a farmer being told to rear those cattle,milk those cows etc and not to worry about what you are going to receive for the produce.Bit rich?
Whats the point of working unless its to make money?

stretch film · 02-01-2015 8:06pm

whelan2 wrote: »

Impossible to get a student here, will be using farm relief to source what labour i need for the few months of spring, did my head in advertising and listening to people that hadnt a clue, one big weight off my mind if they are the ones hiring and firing

Closed shop the student placements.. agree with using relief for labour re hiring and firing . Good value per hour worked also.

Rang a number on donedeal not too long ago looking for hosts for foreign students. Whites iirc in cork. Spoke to an american guy and they place the students for varying lenghts of time in ireland .its eu funded so there is no wage obligations . The objective is for the students to live almost as a family member and help them improve their English . broadband availability was another stipulation.
He offered me a vet student from Hungary the day I rang looking for info . .the live in situation didn't suit cos I've a young family.

It might suit some.

Coonagh · 02-01-2015 8:22pm

Plenty of Ucd students looking for placements, guy came to me last year looking for work this coming spring. i duly obliged.

Farmer Pudsey · 02-01-2015 9:41pm

Labour will be the limiting factor in Dairy expansion. Do not expect FRS to provide the answers. They are quite good at present however down the line if demand expands then they will have issue hiring labour as well. Do not think they will not have the same issue as you have finding people

Getting employees to act as subcontractors is risky as well. Revenue has already cracked down on this in the IT sector in particular where workers were working for one employer and only providing own labour.

So what is the answer. One particular answer is for 2-3 farmers to come together and employ a individual. The worker could then work as a subcontractor and sort out own Tax, PRSI, USC etc with the obvious benefits. However lots of workers are incapable of this. The worker would have the benefit of decent earnings. However there would be a bit of work in arranging same. Purchasing groups might have a head start in this type of set up.

It all about working the system and putting such a system in place that will benefit all parties. This lad for instance might not have to vat register saving both money. If he involved in farming he might take part payment in stock to prevent this. At 14-17/ hour would he be expensive ?

However from a farmers point of view there would be a requirement for flexibility. In this I mean that while he might be at Whelans from 6-10 doing milking and calves he would be gone at 10 as he had to get a bite to eat and be a Mahoneys from 11-4. Now Mahoney would have to accept that his calves would not be fed until then and this lad then did other general work such as spreading fertlizer and feeding the HO bulls for his new beef operation:eek: etc. He then milks Greengrasses cows that evening and feeds his calves while GG finished off his game of golf.

I think it is gas the way some lads are on about lads clock watching and about being upfront about money. Yes I would not accept lads leaving early or arriving late. However if a lad is constantly 10 minutes early or finished his break 15 minutes early and needs an 30 minutes to make football training twice a week then you have to give and take.

Remember working for a lad once and 5.30 was finishing time. Was always on time and always worked hard. On Friday he never arrived with the pay until nearly 6pm. He was a builder and it was summer. So this Friday at 5.30 I sat on the scaffold and broke open a bottle of beer and was sipping it when he arrived a ten to six. Rest of the lads were letting on to brush up this and tidy up that.

Did we have a row.:D

Feckthis · 02-01-2015 10:19pm

With no disrespect to any of the employers here I think farmers need to except that they need to pay workers a decent wage for the hours that they do. Same as if they were working anywhere else!!

whelan2 · 02-01-2015 10:22pm

Feckthis wrote: »

With no disrespect to any of the employers here I think farmers need to except that they need to pay workers a decent wage for the hours that they do. Same as if they were working anywhere else!!

have no problem doing that the problem is sorting out the day dreamers from the workers

Base price · 02-01-2015 10:26pm

Farmer Pudsey wrote: »

Labour will be the limiting factor in Dairy expansion. Do not expect FRS to provide the answers. They are quite good at present however down the line if demand expands then they will have issue hiring labour as well. Do not think they will not have the same issue as you have finding people

Getting employees to act as subcontractors is risky as well. Revenue has already cracked down on this in the IT sector in particular where workers were working for one employer and only providing own labour.

So what is the answer. One particular answer is for 2-3 farmers to come together and employ a individual. The worker could then work as a subcontractor and sort out own Tax, PRSI, USC etc with the obvious benefits. However lots of workers are incapable of this. The worker would have the benefit of decent earnings. However there would be a bit of work in arranging same. Purchasing groups might have a head start in this type of set up.

It all about working the system and putting such a system in place that will benefit all parties. This lad for instance might not have to vat register saving both money. If he involved in farming he might take part payment in stock to prevent this. At 14-17/ hour would he be expensive ?

However from a farmers point of view there would be a requirement for flexibility. In this I mean that while he might be at Whelans from 6-10 doing milking and calves he would be gone at 10 as he had to get a bite to eat and be a Mahoneys from 11-4. Now Mahoney would have to accept that his calves would not be fed until then and this lad then did other general work such as spreading fertlizer and feeding the HO bulls for his new beef operation:eek: etc. He then milks Greengrasses cows that evening and feeds his calves while GG finished off his game of golf.

I think it is gas the way some lads are on about lads clock watching and about being upfront about money. Yes I would not accept lads leaving early or arriving late. However if a lad is constantly 10 minutes early or finished his break 15 minutes early and needs an 30 minutes to make football training twice a week then you have to give and take.

Remember working for a lad once and 5.30 was finishing time. Was always on time and always worked hard. On Friday he never arrived with the pay until nearly 6pm. He was a builder and it was summer. So this Friday at 5.30 I sat on the scaffold and broke open a bottle of beer and was sipping it when he arrived a ten to six. Rest of the lads were letting on to brush up this and tidy up that.

Did we have a row.

I bet the roofs of nearby building were lifted

If the "employee" is registered as a sole trader would that not appease Revenue. As far as I know, one has only to be registered for VAT if turnover is over €70,000 odd per annum.
Comparing the IT sector with Agriculture is like comparing apples with fish.

Greengrass1 · 02-01-2015 10:27pm

Gf sells Strawberry's in summer. 40e/day and bonus if sells over 100 punets. She's delighted with it

AP2014 · 02-01-2015 10:29pm

Greengrass1 wrote: »

Gf sells Strawberry's in summer. 40e/day and bonus if sells over 100 punets. She's delighted with it

Side of the road job?

Feckthis · 02-01-2015 10:31pm

whelan2 wrote: »

have no problem doing that the problem is sorting out the day dreamers from the workers

???? Surely if someone wants to work. You want to employ. Find someone with similar interest and experience that you are looking for? And agree terms. If it turns out is not what you are looking for. Get rid and go again. It's the same in any business you will find good and bad workers. What do you mean by day dreamers?? People asking for to high wages??

mf240 · 02-01-2015 10:32pm

AP2014 wrote: »

Side of the road job?

no she sell strawberries on line:rolleyes:

Feckthis · 02-01-2015 10:34pm

Greengrass1 wrote: »

Gf sells Strawberry's in summer. 40e/day and bonus if sells over 100 punets. She's delighted with it

She is getting robbed. Know a fella getting 50

AP2014 · 02-01-2015 10:36pm

mf240 wrote: »

no she sell strawberries on line:rolleyes:

she could sell them at a stand at different events etc....if it's the side of the road it would be some pain in the ass and how many hours does she do it for €40...

whelan2 · 02-01-2015 10:38pm

Feckthis wrote: »

???? Surely if someone wants to work. You want to employ. Find someone with similar interest and experience that you are looking for? And agree terms. If it turns out is not what you are looking for. Get rid and go again. It's the same in any business you will find good and bad workers. What do you mean by day dreamers?? People asking for to high wages??

have had enough of them, lads that tell you to fook off when you try to correct them. lads that watch a 9 month pregnant woman doing the work they are being paid to do, lads that think that i should cover the milk quality penalties when they are the ones milking. lads that say they will treat your machinery as their own and run it with no oil...............

mf240 · 02-01-2015 10:39pm

AP2014 wrote: »

she could sell them at a stand at different events etc....if it's the side of the road it would be some pain in the ass and how many hours does she do it for €40...

Ya but its all profit cos she spreads no p and k or does no fencing.

Greengrass1 · 02-01-2015 10:41pm

AP2014 wrote: »

she could sell them at a stand at different events etc....if it's the side of the road it would be some pain in the ass and how many hours does she do it for €40...

Sure its hardly hard work? Someone stops you sell strawberrys.
Easy money

AP2014 · 02-01-2015 10:42pm

mf240 wrote: »

Ya but its all profit cos she spreads no p and k or does no fencing.

Ha....jaysus you are a bitter man....get over it!

AP2014 · 02-01-2015 10:44pm

Greengrass1 wrote: »

Sure its hardly hard work? Someone stops you sell strawberrys.
Easy money

Guess not and she probably reads a book or something...wouldn't fancy it though.

Feckthis · 02-01-2015 10:44pm

Ah so your looking for someone with manners and initiative?

Maybe you have just had very bad luck on the matter.

Greengrass1 · 02-01-2015 10:45pm

AP2014 wrote: »

Guess not and she probably reads a book or something...wouldn't fancy it though.

Either would I but she's happy. If she had no job she'd be sitting around all summer any way.
Gets loads of tips and so are change. Came hone with over 100e some days iirc

whelan2 · 02-01-2015 10:47pm

Feckthis wrote: »

Ah so your looking for someone with manners and initiative?

Maybe you have just had very bad luck on the matter.

ye the other one was getting texts of "what will i do next" last straw was in a and e with child and i got another one of these, this lad had been working with me for 2 years at this stage

Feckthis · 02-01-2015 10:56pm

whelan2 wrote: »

ye the other one was getting texts of "what will i do next" last straw was in a and e with child and i got another one of these, this lad had been working with me for 2 years at this stage

Yea but you have to have a bit of leeway each way. Maybe he had 2 things to do but was wondering which you would like done first??

whelan2 · 02-01-2015 10:58pm

Feckthis wrote: »

Yea but you have to have a bit of leeway each way. Maybe he had 2 things to do but was wondering which you would like done first??

nope i know from past form he would wait til i said what to to do, despite being told many times to look around its a farm theres always something to be done. He was being paid well, he also forgot to feed the cows twice

Coonagh · 02-01-2015 11:00pm

whelan2 wrote: »

nope i know from past form he would wait til i said what to to do, despite being told many times to look around its a farm theres always something to be done. He was being paid well, he also forgot to feed the cows twice

I'm wondering what the hell he was doing with you for 2 years

whelan2 · 02-01-2015 11:05pm

Coonagh wrote: »

I'm wondering what the hell he was doing with you for 2 years

yup, i am a fool. now i do alot of the work myself, in fairness kids are older and i have more time. Money i did pay in wages/milk penalties comes to better use

farm14 · 02-01-2015 11:06pm

Know a lad who sometimes does 3 milkings morning & evening for each farmer. Hard going but he's getting €50/milking so earning serious money

eric prydz · 02-01-2015 11:08pm

Farmer Pudsey wrote: »

Labour will be the limiting factor in Dairy expansion. Do not expect FRS to provide the answers. They are quite good at present however down the line if demand expands then they will have issue hiring labour as well. Do not think they will not have the same issue as you have finding people

Getting employees to act as subcontractors is risky as well. Revenue has already cracked down on this in the IT sector in particular where workers were working for one employer and only providing own labour.

So what is the answer. One particular answer is for 2-3 farmers to come together and employ a individual. The worker could then work as a subcontractor and sort out own Tax, PRSI, USC etc with the obvious benefits. However lots of workers are incapable of this. The worker would have the benefit of decent earnings. However there would be a bit of work in arranging same. Purchasing groups might have a head start in this type of set up.

It all about working the system and putting such a system in place that will benefit all parties. This lad for instance might not have to vat register saving both money. If he involved in farming he might take part payment in stock to prevent this. At 14-17/ hour would he be expensive ?

However from a farmers point of view there would be a requirement for flexibility. In this I mean that while he might be at Whelans from 6-10 doing milking and calves he would be gone at 10 as he had to get a bite to eat and be a Mahoneys from 11-4. Now Mahoney would have to accept that his calves would not be fed until then and this lad then did other general work such as spreading fertlizer and feeding the HO bulls for his new beef operation:eek: etc. He then milks Greengrasses cows that evening and feeds his calves while GG finished off his game of golf.

I think it is gas the way some lads are on about lads clock watching and about being upfront about money. Yes I would not accept lads leaving early or arriving late. However if a lad is constantly 10 minutes early or finished his break 15 minutes early and needs an 30 minutes to make football training twice a week then you have to give and take.

Remember working for a lad once and 5.30 was finishing time. Was always on time and always worked hard. On Friday he never arrived with the pay until nearly 6pm. He was a builder and it was summer. So this Friday at 5.30 I sat on the scaffold and broke open a bottle of beer and was sipping it when he arrived a ten to six. Rest of the lads were letting on to brush up this and tidy up that.

Did we have a row.:D

That would work well alright provided all the farmers agreed and didn't delay the workman from moveing to the next farmer.

whelan2 wrote: »

have had enough of them, lads that tell you to fook off when you try to correct them. lads that watch a 9 month pregnant woman doing the work they are being paid to do, lads that think that i should cover the milk quality penalties when they are the ones milking. lads that say they will treat your machinery as their own and run it with no oil...............

I wouldn't blame you with that sort of carry on with workman I hope you ran the lad who told you to fook off .

whelan2 · 02-01-2015 11:08pm

farm14 wrote: »

Know a lad who sometimes does 3 milkings morning & evening for each farmer. Hard going but he's getting €50/milking so earning serious money

yes but is he doing them properly, have had them lads rushing to get to next place... doesnt work out for anyone

Farmer Pudsey · 02-01-2015 11:12pm

Base price wrote: »

I bet the roofs of nearby building were lifted
If the "employee" is registered as a sole trader would that not appease Revenue. As far as I know, one has only to be registered for VAT if turnover is over €70,000 odd per annum.
Comparing the IT sector with Agriculture is like comparing apples with fish.

The answer is No to lad being registered as a sole trader, maybe if he had being working for himself for a few years however if he just set up revenuse would be on the case after a while. Revenue have been on this for a while the building sector is targeted as well where trades people provide only there own labour to a single employers longterm.

Remember it is an employer responsibility to deduct all taxes due to government. In the particular cases I saw I think the employee had to pay the personnel taxes but the employers had to cough up the employers PRSI. Lads would want to understand the risks associated with not being compatible with employer law whether terms of employment or collecting taxes.

Not sure if vat is still 70K if it is happy days for the system I outlined earlier. Just checked it is 35K for services

Markcheese · 02-01-2015 11:21pm

whelan2 wrote: »

yes but is he doing them properly, have had them lads rushing to get to next place... doesnt work out for anyone

I've been the other side- turn up in yard to do a two hour job - parlour not ready , tank needs to be cleaned-cows miles away-next paddock not set up , then 50 cows through a 4 a side- oh and while your there feed the calves - ah sure, that all in the single milking fee to frs-

Feckthis · 02-01-2015 11:23pm

whelan2 wrote: »

nope i know from past form he would wait til i said what to to do, despite being told many times to look around its a farm theres always something to be done. He was being paid well, he also forgot to feed the cows twice

Ahh I see. I was working on a dairy farm last spring. I had all stock fed with adequate amount of meal and minerals. All stock got bedded and I Fed all his sheep and basically everything I was supposed to do I had done. The boss man still wasn't back so I said I'd go ahead a do his daily chore of feeding out the silage. When he got back he said "DID I ask you to do that"!! I said no but I figured it was what needed to be done.!

Soon enough that was also my chore

which I didn't mind. I would rather be busy and get what needs to be done done than fluttering around.

dar31 · 03-01-2015 12:25am

Being using the frs for the last 14 yrs now to employ our full time lad, he worlds 5 11ish hrs a day and works else where for another day we pay fts every forth night and they look after everything else.

Could not work with out local frs, they wanted milking rate then day rate and taking the cream from the sub contractor, moved to the next service down, a lot better service
We allow him a half hour grace on hours every day for travel as it's 35 km up, he needs the hrs to justify travel. Before his family came along he would do 3-4 double milking on a Sunday as well, large pot if coffee was needed of a Monday

Part timer 2 days a week gets €10 in his hand always at the other end of phone if needed

Young lads during summers to help with stone picking , pulling ragworth etc get min agri wage was €7.65 I think
Everything is through books, refuse to pay cash for anything

They all frustrate me at times, but loyal employees

Greengrass1 · 03-01-2015 12:33am

dar31 wrote: »

Being using the frs for the last 14 yrs now to employ our full time lad, he worlds 5 11ish hrs a day and works else where for another day we pay fts every forth night and they look after everything else.

Could not work with out local frs, they wanted milking rate then day rate and taking the cream from the sub contractor, moved to the next service down, a lot better service
We allow him a half hour grace on hours every day for travel as it's 35 km up, he needs the hrs to justify travel. Before his family came along he would do 3-4 double milking on a Sunday as well, large pot if coffee was needed of a Monday

Part timer 2 days a week gets €10 in his hand always at the other end of phone if needed

Young lads during summers to help with stone picking , pulling ragworth etc get min agri wage was €7.65 I think
Everything is through books, refuse to pay cash for anything

They all frustrate me at times, but loyal employees

35km away. Typo surely? That's some travel

just do it · 03-01-2015 12:35am

Greengrass1 wrote: »

35km away. Typo surely? That's some travel

I'd love such a short commute

keep going · 03-01-2015 12:47am

I have teenage nephew and nieces and the advice I give them when they looking for summer jobs etc is go to the businesses at 9 in the morning , dont amble in in the afternoon and always say you are looking for work not a job.being there early is very important

dar31 · 03-01-2015 12:50am

Greengrass1 wrote: »

35km away. Typo surely? That's some travel

Hope, might be out by 5km or so
N11 the whole way up

whelan2 · 03-01-2015 12:53am

keep going wrote: »

I have teenage nephew and nieces and the advice I give them when they looking for summer jobs etc is go to the businesses at 9 in the morning , dont amble in in the afternoon and always say you are looking for work not a job.being there early is very important

out of interest how much are they looking/hour?

'

Greengrass1 · 03-01-2015 12:53am

dar31 wrote: »

Hope, might be out by 5km or so
N11 the whole way up

He must be down me near here. Takes me an hour to get up to where you are

just do it · 03-01-2015 12:55am

Dar31
Don't give him any more details, he might poach him off you!!!

dar31 · 03-01-2015 1:02am

just do it wrote: »

Dar31
Don't give him any more details, he might poach him off you!!!

Some chance, sure he would have to start from scratch to drive them modern tractors gg has Down there

Farm workers wages!

Comments