Are The Girl-Guides Almost Dead?

Agent Smith · 07-03-2006 1:50am #1

Was Talking to a Friend of mine tonight whos a Guide Leader, Her complaint was that they were losing Guides left right and center, to scouts, hockey, whatever.

Now as a Scout leader, I Dont think my troop have lost a single Female scout to The Girl guides, ( gender is an issue with the male's)

Can a Guide leader comment on This? Also, is this happening to Anyone else's Troops?

poll? why not!

tSubh Dearg · 07-03-2006 10:34am

In our company and in our parish in general there are a good amount of girls who join ladybirds, brownies and guides. I think this might be cause our Scout troop is currently inactive and the only other alternative is the Girl's Brigade, and certainly to my mind there are two types of girl, Guidey girls and GB girls.

However, we do tend to lose quite a few of them once they get into secondary school. As a result of this we have quite a young company, the majority of them being around the 11 mark. This means we can't really do a lot with them as they're not really mature enough.

We take them on hikes when we can and do try to do some sort of camping or cottage visit. The cottage visits tend to work better with them as most of our girls just aren't ready for the shock to the system that is camping.

In the five odd years I've been with this company we've only lost one girl to Scouts. The rest have just "out-grown" guides. We've this year managed to hang on to 2 girls to do Gold Award but generally we're lucky if we get them to stay to finish their Silver Birch section.

I think that the ones that leave see Guides as being a bit childish but again this is probably because the majority we have of them are quite young. If we had a more balanced age grouping we would be able to do more things with them.

neilled · 07-03-2006 12:54pm

My perception is that girl gudies offer a better "thinking" programme in realation to society. This aspect is good. However i feel that their leadership is quite old across the board and this restricts some of the activites that they can do. Not saying its always the case but sometimes older leaders ain't as fit as they used to be.

There isn't so much of a threat here - see my SANO's thread as there is very little interaction. But in the uk i believe that there is a fair amount of "stealing" that goes on from GGUK by the UKSA. Of course they endure slagging for the rest of their lives for once having been a guide. This stealing would normally take place after a jamboree etc. It could just be my imagination but the Uk guides i've come across seem to be closer to scouts than irish guides in the activites they do.

ON sunday i had a igg member and her mother who was about 13 who was in pricing gear off me. The thing was she was told she was not to get boots as they wouldn't be needed for the forseeable future. Would this be typical? My concern was that if she went and got walking shoes for the trip she'd have to buy a pair of boots latter. However a phone call to the leader soon sorted things out - boots would be needed for a long time.

Would that be normall?

neilled · 07-03-2006 1:05pm

Ps, in a reacent survey conducted inhouse by SI on what attracted you to scouts approx 1 % of all surveys other and gave the other reason as "boys, fellas etc."

Perhaps IGG are losing a few members to hormones?:rolleyes:

tSubh Dearg · 07-03-2006 1:23pm

It's funny what you've said about the leaders being quite old. In our district the average age of the guide leaders would probably be 30. The brownie and ladybird leaders tend to be a bit older as they're quite often mothers of girls who were in the pack but have stayed on.

There does seem to be quite an active senior branch in Guides but it's not something I ever go involved in (I was too busy doing crazy stuff in college)

Our programme does tend to be quite "thinking" based. There's a lot of stuff on the Promise and Law and the thinking behind them, we do a lot of crafts and would also do a fair bit of community work too. We try and encourage the guides to think about others, before themselves.

The equipment thing there sounds a bit weird tbh. I don't know what that would be about.

neilled · 07-03-2006 1:31pm

In fairness the scouting programme here is more do than think - after all the first groups sprang out of military garrisons and well - Catholicism doesn't appreciate free thinking either for that matter. Like i said, the guide thing was a generalisation and there are certainly some young and ummmm attractive *blush* leaders out there as well. Note - severe lack of young female leaders in scouts at present! Its kind of problematic for my venture group as its just three of us lads running it. It'd be an awful lot easier for us as 50% of our venture groups membership is female

The equipment thing was the leader saying that she would not be needing boots as they wouldn''t be going on hikes for the next two or years anyway!

tSubh Dearg · 07-03-2006 1:50pm

Ah! That can happen. It wouldn't be the norm though. In our company we would try to have at least 2 big outings a year where we go for a hike or away for a weekend or something like that. We still do active stuff with the guides from week to week like Street Orienteering, Scout's Pace, trangia cooking outside the hall and what not.

There was a time when we were lucky to get one outing done a year, this was due to work/exam pressures on the leaders. Plus we're still short indoor and outdoor licenses as we're all only recently warranted, which makes it difficult for us to organise weekends away as we have to have a licensed leader with us and that takes a bit of bribing.

I'd say that this is also a problem in other companies, as it can be difficult to find someone with a license willing to go away with you if you don't already know them.

Another problem we've encountered when trying to organise a trip is all the other activities that our guides are involved in. It means we get a very low turnout. Which is a little disheartening when you've spent 3 + months putting it all together.

neilled · 07-03-2006 1:57pm

Liscence? Do tell i'm curious about that!

tSubh Dearg · 07-03-2006 2:15pm

In order to stay overnight somewhere one of the leaders there must have; an indoors license for staying in the cottages or hostels etc. Or if under canvas, a camper's license.

The details are here: http://www.irishgirlguides.ie/outdoors/eventpacks/HolQuals.pdf

As you can see, you have to have at least one licensed guider with you when you take the girls away. You get tested for these licenses by qualified guiders.

There isn't something similar in scouts?

neilled · 07-03-2006 2:19pm

Ehhhh no, nothing equivlent!

tSubh Dearg · 07-03-2006 2:25pm

Well that would make life a lot easier for trips and the like.

neilled · 07-03-2006 2:37pm

Ah ok. Theres a certain degree of logic to that, although knowing Scouting, they'd invite tripplicated forms for all of them!

Ragazza · 07-03-2006 2:46pm

Is it true you scouts have no child protection policy either?
And no the guides are not dead!
Most of the units in north Kildare have waiting lists!!

neilled · 07-03-2006 3:12pm

CSI had one and most groups contined to work off that in SI. There has been an update adult code good conduct - a best practise document that deals with many issues including child protection.

As you know there is no equivlent of the uks PECS system down here so all would be leaders must get two references, only one of whom may be a scouter.

neilled · 07-03-2006 3:15pm

Actually SAI did have a policy as well, there was a leader who got in trouble because he was going out with a venture - the only thing was the venture was older than him! I think she was 19 and he was 18, but because he was technically a leader and in a position of responsability......

Agent Smith · 07-03-2006 7:08pm

I think I know The Troop neilled, i wont say tho...

This Was Just An Idea that was Planted in my head, Thankls To tSubh Dearg For the Girl-Guide side of Things...

Joe

neilled · 07-03-2006 8:26pm

I'm not sure of which group that was in and nor would i post it here but i was told that (i'm pretty sure) by a member of sai's venture team or a former member of said team!

Ragazza · 08-03-2006 6:38pm

Letter in today's Irish Times
>
> GUIDING GIRLS TO LEADERSHIP
>
> Madam, - As the theme for International Women's Day
> 2006 is celebrating women's
> leadership, it is not surprising that the Irish Girl
> Guides are celebrating
> with particular pride this year. This is because
> Irish women are currently at
> the forefront of the world's largest voluntary
> organisation for girls and young
> women.IGG's Elspeth Henderson is chairman of the
> World Association of Girl
> Guides and Girl Scouts (WAGGGS) and Diane Dixon is
> chair of the Europe Region.
> WAGGGS represents 10 million members and is active
> in 145 countries.
>
> We have come a long way in the past 20 years in
> reducing gender inequalities in
> Ireland but there is much work to be done. There is
> still a significant pay
> gap. In the private sector men still earn 23 per
> cent more than women. And when
> 51 per cent of the population are female it just
> doesn't make sense that only 13
> per cent of our TDs are women.
>
> Our leadership is constantly working towards
> empowering girls and women to make
> a positive contribution to their own communities. By
> fostering leadership
> skills the Irish Girl Guides are encouraging the
> next generation to become the
> leaders of tomorrow.
>
> With membership numbers rising, The Irish Girl
> Guides look forward to continuing
> to enable girls and women of all ages to fulfil
> their potential as active
> citizens of Ireland, Europe and the wider world. -
> Yours, etc,
>
> SUSAN GRIFFIN, Public Relations Officer, The Irish
> Girl Guides, 27 Pembroke
> Park, Dublin 4.
>

neilled · 08-03-2006 8:11pm

Ragazza wrote:

Letter in today's Irish Times
>
>
> We have come a long way in the past 20 years in
> reducing gender inequalities in
> Ireland but there is much work to be done. There is
> still a significant pay
> gap. In the private sector men still earn 23 per
> cent more than women. And when
> 51 per cent of the population are female it just
> doesn't make sense that only 13
> per cent of our TDs are women.

>

In otherwords, we men still have one weapon in their arsenal that needs to be commissioned the glass ceiling...........:eek:

I actually seen an artical in todays Guardian (Yes Guardian reader) that stated 30% of women earn more than their spouses (i know - thats based on being married, as opposed to taking singles into account). Seems like some progress is being made but the gap is still there.

Ragazza · 09-03-2006 11:24am

I have to say, I think some of the salary difference may be down to a few reasons.
Baby’s, a year is a big dent in a career. The Irish average is two babies per woman.
Aggression, Women tend not to ask for the big bucks or the better positions. (This impression has formed from my experience, correct me if I am wrong)
Overtime, Pains me to say it, but I am saying it as I am seeing it. I have never seen a married woman do overtime.

I earn the same as my male colleagues, I do the same job, same overtime and I have the same qualifications. If I take a year out to have babies I will earn less. If they take a year out to travel round the world they earn less.
Fair is fair.

I have worked public and private sector. Currently Private.
Slightly off topic tho!!

Ron DMC · 09-03-2006 11:47am

neilled wrote:

I actually seen an artical in todays Guardian (Yes Guardian reader)

A Guardian reader should know better.

tumeltyni · 19-09-2006 11:14am

The Girl Guides aren't dead by any means, just suffering a lack of leaders in my area. Waiting lists miles long, but we only have three leaders between the sections! Anyone want to help us out?

--
www.spanglefish.com/templeogueguides

Nightwish · 19-09-2006 8:50pm

We've waiting lists too! Our group started back last week and the amount of girls that showed up was unreal. The same for Brownies and Ladybirds. They are very much in demand at the moment.

EBrohoon · 20-09-2006 3:30pm

yep i agree

We started back 2 weeks ago and we have 50 Guides

30 Brígíns

and a new Ranger company with parents wanting us to form a Cygnet company

so girl guides is definitly not dead.

campervan · 10-05-2007 4:03pm

Nightwish wrote:

We've waiting lists too! Our group started back last week and the amount of girls that showed up was unreal. The same for Brownies and Ladybirds. They are very much in demand at the moment.

Absolutely, we are a rural village unit and we even have waiting lists. The girls in the local school love Guiding, its all they talk about.

Lucan also has huge demand for Brownie age.

jolville · 27-05-2007 9:43pm

Folks

Bit amazed by the thread. Sounds a bit South Dublin-centric. SI/IGG referenced everywhere but not CGI. I am not involved in Scouting now (was back in the 80s with SAI) but married a CGI guide. They seem to be flying at the moment with their units growing and unable to take more members in due to the ratios for leaders / guides. Info from North County Dublin with lots of stories around the country to back it up. The Girl-Guides are not dead at all despite the desires of the Scouting to get them to join their organisations ! Any question on hormones may be directed straight to the scouting organisations !

tumeltyni · 19-06-2007 10:08pm

Ebrohoon and I were both talking about CGI units, although we are on the south-side alright.

I'm still desperately looking for leaders and afraid the company will close next year if we don't get them. Just one year from having a Ranger of leader age (if I can keep her, and we don't close before then).

HELP!!! If anyone's in or around the Templeogue area let me know.

tSubh Dearg · 19-06-2007 11:05pm

We've a similar problem in the same area Tumeltyni with the IGG. Too many girls, not enough leaders.

One company in our district already closed a few years ago and we almost lost the same place's brownie pack too.

It's a bit tiring too as I would love to take a sabbatical from it for a year or two and I suspect the other leaders feel the same but we've no one to take over if we do.

tumeltyni · 21-06-2007 11:19pm

Yeah, it's really a shame. If we can get one more we'll have no worries, could even organise a night off each month then. It's just impossible to do anything interesting with only two leaders. AND I don't even live there any more, I'm crossing the city to run the meeting every week.

CiaraBelle · 25-06-2007 11:22pm

Our company has over 100 brigins and a little less guides and rangers. Loads of girls that have gotten too old for guides have been enrolled as leaders, and our leaders spend so much time organising things for us. But I do know that a good few of the guides dont seem to appreciate this, only turn up when goin on trips, dont participate in competitions etc, and i believe this is totally unfair when so many other companys have waiting lists! I wouldnt say the girl guides are almost dead, definitely not, but i would say that unless all the guides are actually there for tyhe right reasons it can really ruin things for others. :mad: Has anyone else had an experience like this?

But personally, I love being a ranger, have made so many friends and done so many things i never would have been able to. Theres no other organisation like it.;)

Are The Girl-Guides Almost Dead?

Are the Girl guides almost dead? 19 votes

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