A Smoker? You're Fired!

Diceicle · 14-02-2019 9:46pm

Sardonicat wrote: »

What's the problem with nicotine patch wearers?

They still have nicotine in their systemat time of testing and high levels of relapse.

mcmoustache · 14-02-2019 10:14pm

In most places that I worked, smokers took a break at the same time as everyone else - 11:00, 13:00 and 16:00.

Even now, as a programmer, it's the same. It would be a bit silly not to hire people who smoke. When you think about how often we slack off and go on boards or wherever, a smoke is insignificant. And in some jobs, many a problem has been solved by leaving the desk for a smoke.

If smokers in a factory or something like that are getting extra breaks, that's not on though.

Salt Lake Stallion · 14-02-2019 10:21pm

As a non smoker, it always annoys me that smokers are allowed to take frequent fag breaks whereas non smokers are expected to stay working. I don't think preventing someone from obtaining a job becasue they smoke is fair either though. Stricter laws on where and when employees can smoke in the workplace, would be a better solution IMO.

Mainly have worked in construction, but this has been the case at some factory/warehouses I have worked at too.

questionmark? · 14-02-2019 10:53pm

Purple Mountain wrote: »

Just smoke on yer frigging break people.
Managements should have a clear policy that the only time non scheduled breaks should be taken is for bathroom or medical reasons.
And if the nicotine junkies can't cope with that then jog on.

Once the same rule is applied to those that go and get coffee/tea then it would be equally fair.

Purple Mountain · 14-02-2019 11:17pm

questionmark? wrote: »

Once the same rule is applied to those that go and get coffee/tea then it would be equally fair.

I don't know anybody who drinks tea who abuses this.
There's only so much tea you can drink and if you have 2 breaks and a lunch in the day I can't see how you would be forcing more tea into you!

hullaballoo · 15-02-2019 9:27am

There are two kinds of smokers, those who make sure smoking doesn't interfere with their workday and those who make sure the work day doesn't interfere with their smoking.

I'm a smoker but I'm self employed and I work stupid long days anyway so I'm in a different game to most here. But as a smoker, I've noticed that some smokers are contrite about smoking and won't use it to take extra breaks whereas others use it as an excuse to take more breaks.

Those of us who are contrite and even apologetic about smoking get pretty annoyed by the other lot when conversations like non hiring of smokers come up!

15-02-2019 9:37am

hullaballoo wrote: »

There are two kinds of smokers, those who make sure smoking doesn't interfere with their workday and those who make sure the work day doesn't interfere with their smoking.

I'm a smoker but I'm self employed and I work stupid long days anyway so I'm in a different game to most here. But as a smoker, I've noticed that some smokers are contrite about smoking and won't use it to take extra breaks whereas others use it as an excuse to take more breaks.

Those of us who are contrite and even apologetic about smoking get pretty annoyed by the other lot when conversations like non hiring of smokers come up!

I'm a (sometimes) smoker and I can see some justification behind this policy. But yeah - there's definitely a minority of smokers who exaggerate the supposed benefits enjoyed by employees who smoke cigarettes.

I'm wary of drawing a parallel like this, but it reminds me of workers who are convinced that people who rely on social welfare are necessarily taking the piss.

When I smoke, I'm super conscious of it, I have one of those small bottles of cologne in my desk drawer just so I don't smell of cigarettes. Non smokers: we're not all out to disrupt your day.

Having said all that, I'm not sure I disagree with a policy of only hiring non smokers. But how would à HR team even know that?

....... · 15-02-2019 10:24am

I used to work with a guy who would go for a 10 minute smoke break every hour. Two of these smoke breaks coincided with breaks.

I smoked myself at the time but not nearly as often, however, I did occasionally see him outside in the smoking area.

One day I noticed he was standing outside beside the smoking area, but not smoking. Saw him go out an hour later, had a look out and there he was again, standing outside for 10 minutes, but not smoking.

Turned out he had actually quit smoking, but wasnt willing to give up his 10 minutes * 6 smoke breaks per day so he would just walk outside and look off into space for 10 minutes every hour.

15-02-2019 10:27am

....... wrote: »

I used to work with a guy who would go for a 10 minute smoke break every hour. Two of these smoke breaks coincided with breaks.

I smoked myself at the time but not nearly as often, however, I did occasionally see him outside in the smoking area.

One day I noticed he was standing outside beside the smoking area, but not smoking. Saw him go out an hour later, had a look out and there he was again, standing outside for 10 minutes, but not smoking.

Turned out he had actually quit smoking, but wasnt willing to give up his 10 minutes * 6 smoke breaks per day so he would just walk outside and look off into space for 10 minutes every hour.

not just 10 minute smoke breaks, but every hour. Yeah that definitely happened.

ingo1984 · 15-02-2019 10:37am

Don't see what the issue is. Most companies for standard 9-5 job will provide an hour lunch break and then 2 separate 15 minute breaks in the morning and afternoon. Those 15 minute breaks could be the fag breaks.

....... · 15-02-2019 11:56am

ingo1984 wrote: »

Don't see what the issue is. Most companies for standard 9-5 job will provide an hour lunch break and then 2 separate 15 minute breaks in the morning and afternoon. Those 15 minute breaks could be the fag breaks.

????

Wow - what utopia do you work in?

In my last job we had a 15 minute morning break and then a half hour lunch.

In my current job we have an hour lunch break and thats it.

In both jobs it was a regular occurrence to be too busy to take lunch.

Maybe you are referring to public sector jobs?

15-02-2019 11:59am

....... wrote: »

????

Wow - what utopia do you work in?

In my last job we had a 15 minute morning break and then a half hour lunch.

In my current job we have an hour lunch break and thats it.

In both jobs it was a regular occurrence to be too busy to take lunch.

Maybe you are referring to public sector jobs?

That's not so unusual. Maybe you have a really old-fashioned employer. I work in the private sector and I take regular breaks, work from home when I need to. The idea of sitting at your desk for eight hours, and the notion that such a thing is optimal, is quickly dying away.

Gravelly · 15-02-2019 12:09pm

A Tyrant Named Miltiades! wrote: »

That's not so unusual. Maybe you have a really old-fashioned employer. I work in the private sector and I take regular breaks, work from home when I need to. The idea of sitting at your desk for eight hours, and the notion that such a thing is optimal, is quickly dying away.

Depends on the role really - in our company we have people with flexi time, people who work from home, and people who are, literally, expected to sit at a desk for 8 hours a day (excluding breaks!).

Skatedude · 15-02-2019 12:12pm

ingo1984 wrote: »

Don't see what the issue is. Most companies for standard 9-5 job will provide an hour lunch break and then 2 separate 15 minute breaks in the morning and afternoon. Those 15 minute breaks could be the fag breaks.

WOW, where do you work? I've worked 12 hour shifts most of my life for various companies and we would end up being fired if we took hour long lunch breaks.

Dial Hard · 15-02-2019 12:14pm

mcmoustache wrote: »

When you think about how often we slack off and go on boards or wherever, a smoke is insignificant. And in some jobs, many a problem has been solved by leaving the desk for a smoke.

This argument comes up all the time and it makes no sense whatsoever because it presupposes that smokers don't also do things like slack off on Boards and take tea breaks and whatnot.

DEFTLEFTHAND · 15-02-2019 12:14pm

To increase productivity in the workplace we should abolish the 2004 smoking ban.

moonage · 15-02-2019 2:13pm

biko · 15-02-2019 2:26pm

First of all, the title says that you can get fired for being a smoker.
This is not the case here, it's about not getting hired, totally different.

Secondly, the blog post mentions this article (without linking it of course...)
http://usatoday30.usatoday.com/money/industries/health/story/2012-01-03/health-care-jobs-no-smoking/52394782/1
These hiring non-smoking policies seems to be about hospitals, and even then they considered radical.

Another clickbait shot down

orourkeda1977 · 15-02-2019 2:32pm

eviltimeban · 15-02-2019 2:33pm

A guy I knew used to go out with the smokers when they had their smoke breaks. He didn't smoke, he just stood with them and chatted. He felt why should they just get to do it?

RWCNT · 15-02-2019 3:56pm

facehugger99 wrote: »

I work with a smoker. I reckon his fag breaks throughout the day easily add up to around 45 minutes.

He could be using this time to do some actual work or even post sh;te on Boards like I do.

He's on smoko, so leave 'im alone.

Flyingsnowball · 15-02-2019 6:56pm

eviltimeban wrote: »

A guy I knew used to go out with the smokers when they had their smoke breaks. He didn't smoke, he just stood with them and chatted. He felt why should they just get to do it?

Why would you go outside if you didn’t think you had to?

lawred2 · 15-02-2019 7:00pm

Diceicle wrote: »

I read about this on a blog that sometimes browse. Its news to me (though I now understand some places have had this since the 90's).

Nicotine Free Hiring Policy (NFHP).

First-off, I don't smoke so I've no dog in this fight, but thought it was an unsual development in the denormalisation of smoking in society, and that its something thats certainly not been on my radar - but in many instances, when the US sneezes, Ireland catches a cold so its probable it will crop up here in the future.

What the justification?
From an employers perspective, those who offer insurance to employees as part of a package - they get cheaper rates from not having any smokers (or nictoine patch wearers) on their staff.

NFHP is seemingly and understandably more common in the healthcare area, for fairly obvious reasons, but is apparently becoming more common in banking etc.

It should be noted that its also not legal in all States at present.

Bit more detail here

Unproductive smoke breaks and a vile stink in the office

I'd have little issue with it. You can wait for the same breaks that everyone else has.

theguzman · 15-02-2019 7:07pm

Smokers are mentally weak and unstable, they are drug addicts and no different to the junkies in the Dublin quays, addicted and unable to stop it.

15-02-2019 7:14pm

theguzman wrote: »

Smokers are mentally weak and unstable, they are drug addicts and no different to the junkies in the Dublin quays, addicted and unable to stop it.

No different!

Yes, when we're not quietly smoking on our lunch breaks from work, we're hawking our phones for fags and stealing bicycles. Definitely no difference.

theguzman · 15-02-2019 7:16pm

A Tyrant Named Miltiades! wrote: »

No different!

Yes, when we're not quietly smoking on our lunch breaks from work, we're hawking our phones for fags and stealing bicycles. Definitely no difference.

Both are equally mentally weak and unstable. Watch a smoker go off fags for a few hours and the tantrums and mood swings are totally irrational. It is sign of low intelligence and lack of self discipline.

15-02-2019 7:22pm

theguzman wrote: »

Both are equally mentally weak and unstable. Watch a smoker go off fags for a few hours and the tantrums and mood swings are totally irrational. It is sign of low intelligence and lack of self discipline.

Or, a temporary, naturally occuring biochemical reflex. But yeah, lets go with 'low intelligence', I hope it makes you feel better, or that this reaction provides you with sufficient attention (endorphins).

CalamariFritti · 15-02-2019 7:22pm

I'm not sure its legal to discriminate on someone's legal outside work activity. I hope someone takes them all the way on that.

As for the people being on about the breaks that amount to x number of minutes. Good little drones you are. You're actually encouraged to get up and stretch and walk every 30 minutes or so anyway. Sitting down for all those hours with no break is really bad for you.

I don't smoke btw.

MonkieSocks · 15-02-2019 7:23pm

Capt'n Midnight · 15-02-2019 8:09pm

Gravelly wrote: »

In our Irish HQ, the smokers have to go down the lift, sign out at the front desk, walk 200m across the car park to smoke, and then repeat the whole process in reverse.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VGBv8j4Xb3E

wiggle16 · 15-02-2019 9:14pm

theguzman wrote: »

Smokers are mentally weak and unstable, they are drug addicts and no different to the junkies in the Dublin quays, addicted and unable to stop it.

Oh... because that makes sense.

Obvious Desperate Breakfasts · 15-02-2019 9:47pm

mcmoustache wrote: »

In most places that I worked, smokers took a break at the same time as everyone else - 11:00, 13:00 and 16:00.

Even now, as a programmer, it's the same. It would be a bit silly not to hire people who smoke. When you think about how often we slack off and go on boards or wherever, a smoke is insignificant. And in some jobs, many a problem has been solved by leaving the desk for a smoke.

If smokers in a factory or something like that are getting extra breaks, that's not on though.

Yeah but some people slack off AND take fag breaks too. I’ve had smokers say that they make sure to be more productive at their desks to make up for their smoking breaks. I didn’t doubt them but not all smokers are like that. Just like non-smokers, some are slackers.

mcmoustache · 15-02-2019 10:13pm

Dial Hard wrote: »

This argument comes up all the time and it makes no sense whatsoever because it presupposes that smokers don't also do things like slack off on Boards and take tea breaks and whatnot.

Fair point. I do both.

mcmoustache · 15-02-2019 10:15pm

theguzman wrote: »

Both are equally mentally weak and unstable. Watch a smoker go off fags for a few hours and the tantrums and mood swings are totally irrational. It is sign of low intelligence and lack of self discipline.

Your post history makes me think you're a smoker, based on this.

McCrack · 15-02-2019 10:19pm

theguzman wrote: »

Smokers are mentally weak and unstable, they are drug addicts and no different to the junkies in the Dublin quays, addicted and unable to stop it.

I think we have a winner

Spannerplank · 16-02-2019 10:02pm

facehugger99 wrote: »

I work with a smoker. I reckon his fag breaks throughout the day easily add up to around 45 minutes.

He could be using this time to do some actual work or even post sh;te on Boards like I do.

BrokenArrows · 16-02-2019 10:12pm

Disregarding the "employee health" and free employee health insurance aspects of I was an employer I would be very harsh with office workers and smoking breaks.

I work on the 29th floor of my building. If I smoked and wanted to take a quick break for a cigarette it would easily be 10-15 minutes before I would be back at my desk. If you multiply that by a few cigs a day the. The employers is losing out massively.

Same applies to staff who are 10 seconds from fresh air, but they are still given unauthorized smoke breaks.

Strumms · 17-02-2019 1:09am

Aside from health, if you add up the amount of time, extra break time that smokers use AND are facilitated with, the fact that they decide that they will partake in an act that is scientifically proven to damage their health which is actively facilitated in most jobs from what I can tell is mainly due to a number of smokers in management....ballpark you are talking one hour out of everywork day or close to it in round trips, grabbing the obligatory coffee etc...If you decided to go to the back door of your work building and stood there with a glass of water or a cup of coffee five times a day, a ten minute plus round trip including procuring said drink about the same time away as a smoker it’s the best part of an hour to facilitate, thus facilitating a downturn in productivity and penalizing people who persue a more healthy AND productive lifestyle ...you would be told to knock it off and QUIT !

Credit Checker Moose · 17-02-2019 1:20am

Where I work smokers must clock off when they want a smoke and clock back in when finished. They are not paid for smoking.

Flyingsnowball · 17-02-2019 1:31am

Credit Checker Moose wrote: »

Where I work smokers must clock off when they want a smoke and clock back in when finished. They are not paid for smoking.

I hope they hold it in and don’t smoke when they want one. Just sit at their desk angry, making mistakes and costing the company billions.

That’ll teach em.

work · 17-02-2019 1:53am

Have a smoke free employment policy. People are asked if they smoke at interview and will not be employed. We are in healthcare and the smell and example of smoking is horrific

EdgeCase · 17-02-2019 1:57am

I don't think smokers realise how bad the smell. They walk in and you'd literally think someone had been smoking in the room.

CalamariFritti · 17-02-2019 2:50am

work wrote: »

Have a smoke free employment policy. People are asked if they smoke at interview and will not be employed. We are in healthcare and the smell and example of smoking is horrific

Is **** ok?

17-02-2019 4:43am

CalamariFritti wrote: »

I'm not sure its legal to discriminate on someone's legal outside work activity. I hope someone takes them all the way on that.

I'm almost certain it's legal - not aware of any provision in Equality legislation that protects smokers, ie those who smoke during working hours. Obviously, if it doesn't interfere with your working day, that's another matter entirely.

No employer has the right to regulate what an employee does in their spare time, so long as it doesn't affect their work, I would have thought.

m5ex9oqjawdg2i · 17-02-2019 5:40am

2nd and 3rd hand smoke is not healthy. Smoking should be prohibited in every public place. It's disgustingly selfish.

Turtyturd · 17-02-2019 9:44am

Flyingsnowball wrote: »

I hope they hold it in and don’t smoke when they want one. Just sit at their desk angry, making mistakes and costing the company billions.

That’ll teach em.

Non smokers really need a get out clause like this for being sh!t at their jobs.

CalamariFritti · 17-02-2019 10:08am

A Tyrant Named Miltiades! wrote: »

I'm almost certain it's legal - not aware of any provision in Equality legislation that protects smokers, ie those who smoke during working hours. Obviously, if it doesn't interfere with your working day, that's another matter entirely.

No employer has the right to regulate what an employee does in their spare time, so long as it doesn't affect their work, I would have thought.

That would be my thought, too. Hence my **** comment. Basically 'none of your business'.

CalamariFritti · 17-02-2019 10:11am

Zendaya Whispering Jugular wrote: »

2nd and 3rd hand smoke is not healthy. Smoking should be prohibited in every public place. It's disgustingly selfish.

Lol, Whats third hand smoke? Is that smoke from a smoker inhaled by someone else whose breath you then inhale? How would that even happen?

17-02-2019 10:24am

It won't be long until job appointments are finalised only when a certain fitness level, as opposed to the standard medical exam, is achieved, and contracts will be subject to renewal based on having a similar level of fitness for your age at each renewal time.

And in After Hours you'll be labelled "leftwing" if you oppose it.

CalamariFritti · 17-02-2019 10:30am

Deleted User wrote: »

It won't be long until job appointments are finalised only when a certain fitness level, as opposed to the standard medical exam, is achieved, and contracts will be subject to renewal based on having a similar level of fitness for your age at each renewal time.

And in After Hours you'll be labelled "leftwing" if you oppose it.

Personally I reckon the pitchforks will be out long before it comes to that.

A Smoker? You're Fired!

Comments