The scandal and thrill of watching same-sex kissing on TV

JupiterKid · 25-06-2020 2:40am #1

So, AHers...as it’s Pride week and all that shebang...

...can you remember where you you were and what you were doing when you saw your first gay/lesbian kiss on the telly?

We’re you shocked/sickened/disgusted/outraged etc... ?

Or were you a little thrilled and intrigued at the - daring for its time - spectacle?

These was, of course, THAT lesbian kiss in the Spring of 1994 on Channel 4’s Brookside, between Kate and Beth. And the gay kiss on BBC’s Eastenders between Colin and Guido in 1989 which shocked and outraged the viewing public at the time...

..and then there was the not quite moment on Fair City...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ubcBX9BEIfU

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fxFjIp_agYg

Rubberchikken · 25-06-2020 2:57am

Absolutely no idea when or where.
Probably didn't register. Same as the fact that this is 'pride'week.

Why a whole week?

Btw have never seen either show referenced in op.

*Sigh*

Dr. Kenneth Noisewater · 25-06-2020 3:31am

I was about 11, this was in 1996. I remember my mother nearly falling off the couch when it happened, I thought it was gas.

I Am Nobody · 25-06-2020 7:30am

We didn't own a tv until the late 80's/early 90's,and even then it was restricted by my old man.So while we didn't see it on tv,I did see it with my sister and her partner in the back garden one night.Don't think I was shocked but was fascinated by it.

When she was 18 she came out to our parents,and well you can imagine the response.She ended up leaving for NY and has a great life now.I visit her at least once a year,best decision she ever made imo.

Mad_maxx · 25-06-2020 7:45am

Watching gays kiss makes me look away, nothing against gays otherwise

jim salter · 25-06-2020 7:49am

It seems that every TV show now has to have some sort of gay character and some sort of love scene.

IMO it is over representation and unnecessary (in most instances its thrown in just to be there, doesn't really add to the storyline).

25-06-2020 8:10am

I think the first one I saw was the Eastenders one and I think I was 16 at the time. From what I remember, I was aware that it was supposed to be a big deal, but didn't get why.

The level of my interest/disgust is based on the attractiveness or otherwise of the kissers, regardless of genders.

Kylta · 25-06-2020 8:16am

I get a thrill from watching lesbian porn. And after saying that I don't think thats what the OPs was looking for in reply to their post.

25-06-2020 8:25am

I can not recall it ever feeling like a scandal or a thrill at all. Or even registering all that much with me on any level. Not sure why. Maybe it did and I just forget. Or maybe it just was not a "Thing" in my mind.

In fact thinking hard I can not even recall all that much same sex kissing at all in TV or Movies. I never did watch a lot of Soap TV early in life - and I do not even own one now. So that probably does not help.

The only same sex kiss I can think of right now in fact is in the movie American Beauty. And even that took me a few minutes to think of.

JohnnyFlash · 25-06-2020 8:44am

I don’t like seeing two dudes kissing each other on TV. Especially if they have beards. Nothing against gay men, but I just don’t like to watch it.

Edgware · 25-06-2020 9:21am

JohnnyFlash wrote: »

I don’t like seeing two dudes kissing each other on TV. Especially if they have beards. Nothing against gay men, but I just don’t like to watch it.

Wait till they start showing a bit of rimming

paw patrol · 25-06-2020 9:37am

JohnnyFlash wrote: »

I don’t like seeing two dudes kissing each other on TV. Especially if they have beards. Nothing against gay men, but I just don’t like to watch it.

beards :eek:

jim salter · 25-06-2020 9:41am

Kylta wrote: »

I get a thrill from watching lesbian porn. And after saying that I don't think thats what the OPs was looking for in reply to their post.

I really hope you are female :pac:

Kylta · 25-06-2020 9:45am

jim salter wrote: »

I really hope you are female :pac:

Unfortunately not

nibtrix · 25-06-2020 9:55am

There was a lesbian kiss on Deep Space 9 in 1995, I think that's the first time I saw it on tv.

Flickerfusion · 25-06-2020 9:59am

I don't really get why anyone's shocked or offended by two women or two lads kissing other than they’re a bit homophobic, which can be something you’ve absorbed from being brought up in a society (and I don’t just mean Ireland but the whole anglophone media culture we all grew up in) that made anything gay taboo for a very long time.

It’s very much like being brought up in a racist society and if you’re thoughtful enough to recognise that, you are capable of getting past it too.

It’s 2020, we’ve very broad LGBT rights, plenty of us have gay family members and neighbours, two women or two guys can get married and about time people got over themselves on this issue.

If you’re somehow sensitive to it, go watch some gay themed drama on Netflix and get past it. It’s actually very boring in reality. It’s just that you’re getting giddy thrills from getting past a taboo, like victorians and their concerns about seeing bare ankles!

If we don’t get past this stuff, it’s a world where gay couples can’t even hold hands without risking being given verbal abuse.

Randy Archer · 25-06-2020 10:31am

Edgware wrote: »

Wait till they start showing a bit of rimming

I think they did that for the Channel 4 , they did a tv series about the ghays , rather graphic. Called queer as folk. Yer man from Dublin was in it - the lad who does all the big tv shows eg Love Hate , Peaky Blinders, Game of Thrones ...Aidan Gillan

arybvtcw0eolkf · 25-06-2020 11:37am

I was much younger for the Brookside kiss so I probably had a quick peddle & crank, the two lads, well I don't watch EastEnders so I didn't see it.

Same sex kissing on TV doesn't bother me, unless it was someone like my hero's John Wayne, Clint Eastwood, Paul Newman etc

Same sex kissing in pubic, like on TV it doesn't bother me but as with straight couples I think its an intimate semi-private moment so don't stick it in my face and I'm cool with that. And hey, the softie in me says its nice to see a couple in love so I don't care if they're same sex or not, kissing is lovely so enjoy it I say.

D3V!L · 25-06-2020 11:41am

Willie Stale Subway wrote: »

I was much younger for the Brookside kiss so I probably had a quick peddle & crank, the two lads, well I don't watch EastEnders so I didn't see it.

Same sex kissing on TV doesn't bother me, unless it was someone like my hero's John Wayne, Clint Eastwood, Paul Newman etc

Same sex kissing in pubic, like on TV it doesn't bother me but as with straight couples I think its an intimate semi-private moment so don't stick it in my face and I'm cool with that. And hey, the softie in me says its nice to see a couple in love so I don't care if they're same sex or not, kissing is lovely so enjoy it I say.

Awww, look who's a big softie

25-06-2020 11:42am

The first one that comes to mind was Willow and Tara in Buffy.

LillySV · 25-06-2020 11:53am

Flickerfusion wrote: »

I don't really get why anyone's shocked or offended by two women or two lads kissing other than they’re a bit homophobic, which can be something you’ve absorbed from being brought up in a society (and I don’t just mean Ireland but the whole anglophone media culture we all grew up in) that made anything gay taboo for a very long time.

It’s very much like being brought up in a racist society and if you’re thoughtful enough to recognise that, you are capable of getting past it too.

It’s 2020, we’ve very broad LGBT rights, plenty of us have gay family members and neighbours, two women or two guys can get married and about time people got over themselves on this issue.

If you’re somehow sensitive to it, go watch some gay themed drama on Netflix and get past it. It’s actually very boring in reality. It’s just that you’re getting giddy thrills from getting past a taboo, like victorians and their concerns about seeing bare ankles!

If we don’t get past this stuff, it’s a world where gay couples can’t even hold hands without risking being given verbal abuse.

You sound hetrophobic... you should go watch some straight porn on pornhub and get past/ off on it

Feisar · 25-06-2020 11:54am

Flickerfusion wrote: »

I don't really get why anyone's shocked or offended by two women or two lads kissing other than they’re a bit homophobic, which can be something you’ve absorbed from being brought up in a society (and I don’t just mean Ireland but the whole anglophone media culture we all grew up in) that made anything gay taboo for a very long time.

It’s very much like being brought up in a racist society and if you’re thoughtful enough to recognise that, you are capable of getting past it too.

It’s 2020, we’ve very broad LGBT rights, plenty of us have gay family members and neighbours, two women or two guys can get married and about time people got over themselves on this issue.

If you’re somehow sensitive to it, go watch some gay themed drama on Netflix and get past it. It’s actually very boring in reality. It’s just that you’re getting giddy thrills from getting past a taboo, like victorians and their concerns about seeing bare ankles!

If we don’t get past this stuff, it’s a world where gay couples can’t even hold hands without risking being given verbal abuse.

I watched gay porn to get over the "icky" factor I feel when it comes to two men kissing etc. Didn't work, it's too hard wired into me.

arybvtcw0eolkf · 25-06-2020 11:59am

D3V!L wrote: »

Awww, look who's a big softie

Don't let the biker or martial arts people know

Speedsie · 25-06-2020 12:21pm

Willie Stale Subway wrote: »

Same sex kissing in pubic, like on TV it doesn't bother me but as with straight couples I think its an intimate semi-private moment so don't stick it in my face and I'm cool with that. And hey, the softie in me says its nice to see a couple in love so I don't care if they're same sex or not, kissing is lovely so enjoy it I say.

Not a big fan of public displays of affection myself, but I'm not entirely sure I've witnessed pubic kissing on mainstream TV myself!

greenspurs · 25-06-2020 12:56pm

Imagine my surprise that a certain "MR" didn't start this thread !!! …

yerwanthere123 · 25-06-2020 1:06pm

Mad_maxx wrote: »

Watching gays kiss makes me look away, nothing against gays otherwise

JohnnyFlash wrote: »

I don’t like seeing two dudes kissing each other on TV. Especially if they have beards. Nothing against gay men, but I just don’t like to watch it.

Oops my finger slipped!

Vita nova · 25-06-2020 1:15pm

Deleted User wrote: »

...
The only same sex kiss I can think of right now in fact is in the movie American Beauty. And even that took me a few minutes to think of.

Definitely one that's remembered but was a non-consensual kiss and a prelude to something awful.

One funny one that I remember is Sarah Michelle Geller teaching Selma Blair how to kiss on Cruel Intentions because as we all know, girls learn how to kiss boys by practicising with other girls.

One eyed Jack · 25-06-2020 1:39pm

Flickerfusion wrote: »

I don't really get why anyone's shocked or offended by two women or two lads kissing other than they’re a bit homophobic, which can be something you’ve absorbed from being brought up in a society (and I don’t just mean Ireland but the whole anglophone media culture we all grew up in) that made anything gay taboo for a very long time.

It’s very much like being brought up in a racist society and if you’re thoughtful enough to recognise that, you are capable of getting past it too.

It’s 2020, we’ve very broad LGBT rights, plenty of us have gay family members and neighbours, two women or two guys can get married and about time people got over themselves on this issue.

This is just daft. You say you really don’t get why anyone’s shocked or offended by two lads or two women kissing other than they’re a bit homophobic, yet you’re not thoughtful enough yourself to recognise that some people just aren’t into that sort of shìte no matter who the participants are. There’s nothing to get past, plenty of people just aren’t into it and don’t find it attractive or interesting or something they want to watch. It has nothing to do with it being 2020 or any other time, but it’s about time you drop the persecution complex because people aren’t into what you’re into.

Flickerfusion wrote: »

If you’re somehow sensitive to it, go watch some gay themed drama on Netflix and get past it. It’s actually very boring in reality. It’s just that you’re getting giddy thrills from getting past a taboo, like victorians and their concerns about seeing bare ankles!

No interest in getting past it tbh, though as for your point about gay themed dramas on Netflix, there’s plenty of good ones to watch, and there’s plenty that don’t make their characters sexual orientation the theme of the film or series and it doesn’t have to stink of mere tokenism thinking they’re helping anyone “get over” anything.

Flickerfusion wrote: »

If we don’t get past this stuff, it’s a world where gay couples can’t even hold hands without risking being given verbal abuse.

All adults risk verbal abuse for holding hands in public, not just people who are gay. Perhaps if they just did it and didn’t give a shìt what other people thought, they might realise that actually people aren’t all that interested in whether they’re holding hands or they’re kissing or anything else. Same as it is for most people. You’d realise that if you grew up in an anglophone media culture or Ireland that we’ve neither been racist nor homophobic as a society, but rather it was more likely the circumstances in which you were raised that instilled in you an irrational fear of other people.

25-06-2020 1:45pm

One eyed Jack wrote: »

All adults risk verbal abuse for holding hands in public, not just people who are gay.

Straight couples might get a jeering, but they're not going to be physically assaulted for it.

Flickerfusion · 25-06-2020 1:46pm

LillySV wrote: »

You sound hetrophobic... you should go watch some straight porn on pornhub and get past/ off on it

Absolutely hilarious point there... such clever wordplay. Well done! (claps very slowly)

I wasn't talking about porn. Nor do I have any issues with straight couples wearing the faces off each other. I strongly encourage it. Although, it's damn hard though an anti-COVID face mask at the moment.

However, what I was saying is that it's just about normal interactions between people in terms of displays of affection, be they straight or gay.

It's not that long ago that Hollywood and US TV wouldn't even allow the depiction of a married couple sharing a bed as it was a bit 'foreign minded' and something they might do in French film. It's why you'll always see the married couples with two bed and a locker in between. Nobody in reality actually lived like that (well other than rather strange people) but Hollywood / TV censors in the US were that concerned about the suggestion that a couple might ... have sex.

People raised eyebrows when Kirk and Uhura kissed on US TV back in 1968, because nobody had seen an interracial kiss on TV before. That's seems racist and utterly ludicrous now, but that's how things were in 1968.

We moved on, got over it and and I think the same applies to gay kisses on screen or on tv, when we've had a world where you really never saw two guys or two women kissing in media or fictional portrayals, then it's something that's going to raise eyebrows when it really is about as boring as it gets.

So, honestly, if you've an issue with it - and you know you do : go watch some LGBT themed drama, plenty of it on Netflix and stop living in the 1970s.

Flickerfusion · 25-06-2020 1:53pm

One eyed Jack wrote: »

All adults risk verbal abuse for holding hands in public, not just people who are gay. Perhaps if they just did it and didn’t give a shìt what other people thought, they might realise that actually people aren’t all that interested in whether they’re holding hands or they’re kissing or anything else. Same as it is for most people. You’d realise that if you grew up in an anglophone media culture or Ireland that we’ve neither been racist nor homophobic as a society, but rather it was more likely the circumstances in which you were raised that instilled in you an irrational fear of other people.

All adults do not risk verbal abuse in public and to be quite honest. You have no idea what you're talking about. I'm bi and I've experience it first hand and it anything but pleasant and I can absolutely give you a full account of the experience of both sides of that particular fence, and one is a hell of a lot easier.

It is absolutely not a brave move to walk hand in hand through the middle of a random part of Dublin, Cork or anywhere else in Ireland, but try doing that with someone of the same sex and while things have improved, rather nasty stuff still happens in terms of verbal abuse and even people throwing stuff (as I experience in Dublin 4 one night!!)

When's the last time you've seen someone scream "f**ing straights!!" out a car window and throw stuff at them!? I would suspect absolutely never, other than in some right-wing fantasy perhaps.

yerwanthere123 · 25-06-2020 1:53pm

One eyed Jack wrote: »

All adults risk verbal abuse for holding hands in public, not just people who are gay.

Yes, I regularly hear about straight couples who're abused/heckled for holding hands in public. It's very common :rolleyes: Stop posting nonsense.

LillySV · 25-06-2020 2:00pm

Flickerfusion wrote: »

Absolutely hilarious point there... such clever wordplay. Well done! (claps very slowly)

I wasn't talking about porn. Nor do I have any issues with straight couples wearing the faces off each other. I strongly encourage it. Although, it's damn hard though an anti-COVID face mask at the moment.

However, what I was saying is that it's just about normal interactions between people in terms of displays of affection, be they straight or gay.

It's not that long ago that Hollywood and US TV wouldn't even allow the depiction of a married couple sharing a bed as it was a bit 'foreign minded' and something they might do in French film. It's why you'll always see the married couples with two bed and a locker in between. Nobody in reality actually lived like that (well other than rather strange people) but Hollywood / TV censors in the US were that concerned about the suggestion that a couple might ... have sex.

People raised eyebrows when Kirk and Uhura kissed on US TV back in 1968, because nobody had seen an interracial kiss on TV before. That's seems racist and utterly ludicrous now, but that's how things were in 1968.

We moved on, got over it and and I think the same applies to gay kisses on screen or on tv, when we've had a world where you really never saw two guys or two women kissing in media or fictional portrayals, then it's something that's going to raise eyebrows when it really is about as boring as it gets.

So, honestly, if you've an issue with it - and you know you do : go watch some LGBT themed drama, plenty of it on Netflix and stop living in the 1970s.

So you know I’ve an issue? . and I must watch a tv program because you learn everything from tv and what your told online is it? And I should do the same? And if someone doesn’t want to get involved in virtual signaling , then clearly they are living in the 70s? You are very tolerant, aren’t you?

Necro · 25-06-2020 2:04pm

Mod:

Flickerfusion and LilySV, take it down a notch please. The thread is becoming a bickerfest between you both. Any issues take it to PM

gmisk · 25-06-2020 2:09pm

Queer as folk....I knew then! Ahhh I am definitely into this and not girls!

One eyed Jack · 25-06-2020 2:09pm

Flickerfusion wrote: »

All adults do not risk verbal abuse in public and to be quite honest. You have no idea what you're talking about.

They do, for any number of reasons, however according to your logic if people who have issues with being verbally abused in public would just watch more of it on tv, they would become desensitised to it, like it’s their responsibility and not the responsibility of the people giving off verbal abuse to sort themselves out.

I’ve been subjected to verbal abuse and harassment many times in public, been beaten up a couple of times too. Throughout my life I’ve known plenty of people with similar stories. The only reason you imagine I couldn’t know what I’m talking about is because you’re only thinking of yourself.

Bobblehats · 25-06-2020 2:10pm

I kissed a fish. (and I liked it)

Ultima Thule · 25-06-2020 2:11pm

No problems with it in particular but I generally dislike sex scenes in movies. I think they are just stocking fillers. Its an easy fix as many of us are interested in seeing it, and IMO it shows that the producers are short on other stories to keep interest.

The great movies dont need to resort to sex scenes. There are exceptions to where its important for the story, ie, shawshank redemption (NOOONOTTHESISTERS!!)

c.p.w.g.w · 25-06-2020 2:14pm

A little off topic, but in season 1 of friends when they have the lesbian wedding. The network had set up extra phone lines to deal with complaints...they got next to no extra complaints...that was in 1994

irishguitarlad · 25-06-2020 2:14pm

Ultima Thule wrote: »

No problems with it in particular but I generally dislike sex scenes in movies. I think they are just stocking fillers. Its an easy fix as many of us are interested in seeing it, and IMO it shows that the producers are short on other stories to keep interest.

The great movies dont need to resort to sex scenes. There are exceptions to where its important for the story, ie, shawshank redemption (NOOONOTTHESISTERS!!)

I agree sex scenes in movies and series are generally just filler bállocks or pandering to teenage boys or people with that mentality. They could be using that time to explain a thing in the plot.

Ger Roe · 25-06-2020 2:24pm

Flickerfusion wrote: »

People raised eyebrows when Kirk and Uhura kissed on US TV back in 1968, because nobody had seen an interracial kiss on TV before. That's seems racist and utterly ludicrous now, but that's how things were in 1968.

That kiss wasn't as positive as it is now made out to be on retrospective reflection. In the storyline of the episode, Kirk and Uhura were forced to kiss by an alien power exerting mind control. The characters actually strongly resisted the encounter and fought against the mind manipulation that was being exerted on them.

It is now seen as a great cultural breakthrough, but it would have been a far more positive development if it had been consensual and based on mutual attraction.

Even from a plotline aspect, it portrayed a commanding officer being forced to kiss a subordinate crew member - it was a controversial scene on several levels that is now looked back on in a more favourable light than it might otherwise deserve.

If it was actually an attempt to break down race prejudice, it was a fairly botched attempt.

Church on Tuesday · 25-06-2020 3:24pm

Yeah I remember the Fair City kiss, I was about 10 and even back then I failed to see what the big deal was, my mother was shocked by it.

Didn't have "the channels" so I missed out on the Brookside kiss. Sadly.

It's bizarre to me how that could be such a big deal as recently as 1996, it's good to see how far we have come.

JupiterKid · 25-06-2020 6:11pm

Great to see that this thread has stayed on AH and wasnt quickly moved by the mods to the LGBT forum. I wasn't intending for it to be. I'm an old timer veteran now here on boards and I think most of the mods know I'm not a troll or a sh*t- stirrer.

Yep, society has moved on hugely since those first portrayals of same sex affection. I've been out myself since I was 21/22, after my J1 visa summer in San Francisco where there was no going back for me. I have never looked back.

I am of the generation- born in the mid 1970s where Ireland was undergoing a social and economic revolution in the 1990s - that directly benefited from these changes and it was an amazing time to be young - and especially young and gay - and finding the courage to be myself.

These days, no-one really appears to get upset and displays of same-sex affection on TV or in film, except for a sizeable rump of homophobes who can always change the channel if it offends them that much. As it should be.

But back in the late 1980s and early 90s, at the time of AIDS and the right-wing political backlash at the LGBT community who had emerged from the shadows in the 1970s after Stonewall, it was a very different matter.

And so many of my straight mates were very very happy to see the girls snog on Brookside!

eviltwin · 25-06-2020 6:12pm

Dr. Kenneth Noisewater wrote: »

I was about 11, this was in 1996. I remember my mother nearly falling off the couch when it happened, I thought it was gas.

The only thing shocking about that is the acting

Mad_maxx · 25-06-2020 6:15pm

Flickerfusion wrote: »

Absolutely hilarious point there... such clever wordplay. Well done! (claps very slowly)

I wasn't talking about porn. Nor do I have any issues with straight couples wearing the faces off each other. I strongly encourage it. Although, it's damn hard though an anti-COVID face mask at the moment.

However, what I was saying is that it's just about normal interactions between people in terms of displays of affection, be they straight or gay.

It's not that long ago that Hollywood and US TV wouldn't even allow the depiction of a married couple sharing a bed as it was a bit 'foreign minded' and something they might do in French film. It's why you'll always see the married couples with two bed and a locker in between. Nobody in reality actually lived like that (well other than rather strange people) but Hollywood / TV censors in the US were that concerned about the suggestion that a couple might ... have sex.

People raised eyebrows when Kirk and Uhura kissed on US TV back in 1968, because nobody had seen an interracial kiss on TV before. That's seems racist and utterly ludicrous now, but that's how things were in 1968.

We moved on, got over it and and I think the same applies to gay kisses on screen or on tv, when we've had a world where you really never saw two guys or two women kissing in media or fictional portrayals, then it's something that's going to raise eyebrows when it really is about as boring as it gets.

So, honestly, if you've an issue with it - and you know you do : go watch some LGBT themed drama, plenty of it on Netflix and stop living in the 1970s.

Thanks roe mcdermot

25-06-2020 7:45pm

The "straight people can get abuse sometimes too" approach just rings a little bit like the thread about "AllLivesMatter" we have over on the other forum. It is like you can clearly see the point the people pushing that thought have - but it is so tiny and misses so many points that it gets everything from disdain - to outright hostility. Though these days what doesn't get outright hostility from _some_ on social media sites?

It is not quite 5 years ago that we had a story about a couple of gay lads who were asked to leave a restaurant for what was reported as being the "crime" of holding hands and looking into each others eyes. And a minority then too argued either in favour of them being asked to leave - or in favour of the expectation that the management _should_ be expected to do something about it. But it's a minority. A sad angry lonely minority is the impression I get when I think back on those moaning about it at the time.

I am in a slightly "different" relationship myself too. The level of random hostility my relationship draws now is so massively smaller than it was 10 years ago that it is impossible to compare. While I do not rush to engage in PDAs when out in public - I certainly do not rush to withhold them either any more on the rare occasions it feels like something I want to do. There is a certain background level of fear and trepidation I recall that simply is not there any more. Like a mild case of tinnitus that dissolved so slowly over time that you surprise yourself when you notice it is gone.

I kinda like that I look back and struggle to think of any examples of such on screen kissing as the thread is about. I must have seen them but it simply did not register with me at the time. And I kinda like that. Just like I personally wish we lived in an entirely color blind society when it comes to race - I think I was sexuality blind most of my life. Two people kissing was two people kissing and I simply did not even see - or think to see - the genders who were doing it. So when I saw it it didn't register with me at all. Perhaps I missed out on the "thrill of the scandal" but that is a small price to pay I think.

Ten of Swords · 25-06-2020 7:52pm

No kissing in this but I always remember this ad in particular, kind of warmed my heart when I first saw it.

First time I can recall seeing something like this on Irish TV, plenty of instances on UK or US TV at the time but nothing (that I recall) that was homegrown. Can't remember when this ad was first shown, there's Youtube clips from 2012 but it certainly feels older.

One eyed Jack · 26-06-2020 3:13am

JupiterKid wrote: »

But back in the late 1980s and early 90s, at the time of AIDS and the right-wing political backlash at the LGBT community who had emerged from the shadows in the 1970s after Stonewall, it was a very different matter.

20 years before Stonewall, in the 50s, was an even more important victory for gay rights in the States when the State Equalisation Board in California tried to have the Black Cat bar license suspended, and the owner challenged them in the State Supreme Court -

Stoumen v. Reilly , 37 Cal.2d 713

Good documentary film on Netflix I’m watching right now which gives a good idea of the history and politics of the time, right through to the present day, about one of the most famous landmarks in Los Angeles -

’Circus of Books’ Review: A Community Takes Pride in Its Porn Store

One eyed Jack · 26-06-2020 5:05am

[Deleted User] wrote: »

It is not quite 5 years ago that we had a story about a couple of gay lads who were asked to leave a restaurant for what was reported as being the "crime" of holding hands and looking into each others eyes. And a minority then too argued either in favour of them being asked to leave - or in favour of the expectation that the management _should_ be expected to do something about it. But it's a minority. A sad angry lonely minority is the impression I get when I think back on those moaning about it at the time.

They were asked to leave, by management -

”When we said we had every right to show each other affection, the manager said that it was unfortunate that other customers were uncomfortable, and suggested that we leave. He told us we wouldn’t be charged for our meal.”

The writer of the letter revealed that he was “humiliated” by the actions of the manager and as he left the restaurant a diner at another table called him disgusting.

“As we were leaving the restaurant, feeling humiliated, a woman at one of the tables, probably the one who had complained about us, said the word “disgusting”.

Gay couple celebrating anniversary “humiliated” after being asked to leave Dublin restaurant

There was no reporting that they were engaged in any sort of criminal behaviour, simply that they were making other customers uncomfortable with their PDA. It was the couple in question who formed the conclusion that customers must have complained because they were a gay couple. It didn’t occur to them that most people don’t appreciate other people’s PDA while they’re just as entitled to enjoy their meal as the couple in question. A sad and angry lonely minority is the impression I get of anyone who thinks public PDA are ok, regardless of the sexual orientation or number of participants.

Nothing to do with homophobia, just basic manners.

Gruffalux · 26-06-2020 6:12am

Sex scenes in series have in some cases become gratuitous and therefore utterly boring. I got through a lot of Power but fcuk me they were forever shagging and eventually I got bored watching it. Felt sorry for the actors, to have such nice acting roles, and then to have to be so porny all the time.
Re OP I remember the Saturday night a good few years ago, when me and my husband watched my movie picks, The Birdcage and then Brokeback Mountain, one after another, both of which I loved. At the end he sighed and said, well fcuk that sh1t, thats the last movie night I am having with you. He has kept his word.

People like what they like.

26-06-2020 6:51am

One eyed Jack wrote: »

There was no reporting that they were engaged in any sort of criminal behaviour

No one suggested they were

That is why I put the "" around "crime". They were asked to leave by the management - which I already pointed out - after some customers - probably only one customer - complained about it -which I also already pointed out.

They were doing nothing wrong at all but it seems a vocal minority of idiots - in this case as you pointed out probably just one woman - still get bothered by this kind of stuff even today.

I suspect "most people" do not actually care. You even said it yourself in an earlier post on the thread when you wrote "people aren’t all that interested in whether they’re holding hands or they’re kissing or anything else. Same as it is for most people"

One eyed Jack wrote: »

A sad and angry lonely minority is the impression I get of anyone who thinks public PDA are ok, regardless of the sexual orientation or number of participants. Nothing to do with homophobia, just basic manners.

Nothing to do with manners at all. You are projecting what _you_ personally want to be "manners" onto the subject as if it is some kind of universal. I suspect most people do not care at all and in fact for the most part probably do not even _notice_ let alone notice enough to care in the first place. PDA goes on all the the time and seemingly no one notices - but when it is PDA that is somehow out of the ordinary I suspect it makes it more noticeable.

Just saying it is no ok does not make it not ok. You certainly have never actually explained a single thing wrong with it. It's _hands_. Touching _hands_. It is hardly some world ending event. It's something all humans of all ages and all genders do.

The scandal and thrill of watching same-sex kissing on TV

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