Live in continental europe.

antix80 · 05-09-2019 9:18pm #1

I'm giving consideration to heading off for a while as I'm bored of my routine and there's no opportunity for career progression in my current job and no decent jobs in my area.

Tbh career isn't important right now but having a job is. I can make a living here but am more interested in living in a nice city abroad for a while even if i only break even. My background is accounts admin, always in demand, usually boring.

Im pushing 38 and have basic Spanish, moreso reading than conversational.

Well I'd like to go to another European country next March or April. They say Germany is an odd country and qualifications are key, while i don't have any. Had ACCA qualification years ago but let it lapse through lack of interest or experience in accounting bar fairly basic bookkeeping. Not great with stress but physically fit besides.

Others say Belgium or Netherlands is a good choice as everyone speaks English .

Has anyone headed off to "Europe" for a bit of metropolitan life, culture, soul searching etc? Where did you end up?

CelticRambler · 06-09-2019 11:31am

antix80 wrote: »

Has anyone headed off to "Europe" for a bit of metropolitan life, culture, soul searching etc? Where did you end up?

Metropolitan? Nope :pac: but culture, soul-searching, quality-of-life, yes. Two years younger than you at the time, closed up the business, sold the house, moved to the geographic middle of France. More than 15 years ago now, and don't regret it at all.

As in everything, you'll get out of it what you put in; and there are many days (weeks!) when it definitely does not feel like you're "living the dream" ... but spending a few weeks back in Ireland or England usually helps put things back in context!

Two points to bear in mind, though:
(1) If you don't speak the local language, you'll never really get to enjoy the full benefit of your adopted home. It doesn't matter that your neighbours - and local admin officers - speak English, you'll still miss out on an awful lot.
(2) Don't fall into the trap of that thinking that countries a lot bigger than Ireland can be summarised in one short paragraph. Different regions within the same nation state might as well be totally different countries in many respects.

Car99 · 06-09-2019 11:43am

Where ever you go you need to learn the local language to have any chance of fitting in and enjoying a full life there. If you don't want to learn the local lingo I would say Holland/Belgium would be easiest to get on in with just English. Anyone under 40 there speaks better English than anywhere else I've bee and tgat includes Ireland/UK/USA.

Strumms · 06-09-2019 7:28pm

Language will be key. Everyone will speak English in The Netherlands and Belgium but you cannot walk into an interview in either country and expect to be interviewed in English. Or can you expect that if you are hired your colleagues would be happy constantly speaking English or translating...

otnomart · 07-09-2019 4:21pm

It is not easy with neither qualifications nor a second language.
Could try either the Call centres in Malta for the online betting/gaming companies, or the Back office/invoice processing centres in the likes of Brno, Bratislava and Budapest for Multinationals that have delocalised those functions there.
A useful job search website is: https://www.jobsinnetwork.com/

Tuesday_Girl · 10-09-2019 4:51pm

Lots of US companies in Amsterdam and surrounds where English is the spoken language, no need for Dutch (but would strongly recommend learning it). You may get work in data entry or customer service.

Lots of cafes, bars and shops in Amsterdam are hiring non-Dutch speakers as they can't find people who speak Dutch.

CelticRambler · 11-09-2019 1:22pm

Here you go, antix: Underpopulated Italian region offers visitors €25,000 to move in - 700€ a month to live on for three years, and all you've got to do is promise to open a business! Even if you don't speak Italian, there are so few other people living there, you'd probably get by fine with a mixture of rudimentary Spanish and pidgin English - on the days when you found anyone to talk to! :pac:

I'm tempted by the offer myself ...

antix80 · 11-09-2019 1:37pm

Thanks for the feedback folks.
Certainly a few things to think about. Learning the language would be part of any experience. I'd have no intention of moving somewhere without at least having the basics before I go.

Granadino · 16-09-2019 5:30pm

"Europe" is very different north to south. You mention you have Spanish. Even Marbella has nothing in common with San Sebastian in the north, so bear that in mind. Different food etc. Spain will be difficult depending on what you want to do. You really need to be there though.
I was in Italy, and while economically it's not in great shape, there seems to be a good few TEFL jobs etc advertised. Again you need to be there, and north v south Italy is very different. If you speak Spanish, 6 months in Italy, and you'll be able to hold a conversation. Gibraltar is another option if you can get an English language job. Malaga etc also has some jobs through English, but you'll need Spanish to get by outside of work.

Jim2007 · 17-09-2019 11:06am

antix80 wrote: »

Thanks for the feedback folks.
Certainly a few things to think about. Learning the language would be part of any experience. I'd have no intention of moving somewhere without at least having the basics before I go.

Getting the basics will take you at least a year to get to A2, so get started ASAP

population · 06-11-2019 4:11am

antix80 wrote: »

Thanks for the feedback folks.
Certainly a few things to think about. Learning the language would be part of any experience. I'd have no intention of moving somewhere without at least having the basics before I go.

It changes your life once you get the hang of it and start to feel socially and linguistically more integrated. Get stuck into it. Can't stress that enough. You won't regret it.

Aine Ni C · 11-01-2020 3:26am

You won’t get a job in Belgium without French or Dutch. I am living there.

antix80 wrote: »

I'm giving consideration to heading off for a while as I'm bored of my routine and there's no opportunity for career progression in my current job and no decent jobs in my area.

Tbh career isn't important right now but having a job is. I can make a living here but am more interested in living in a nice city abroad for a while even if i only break even. My background is accounts admin, always in demand, usually boring.

Im pushing 38 and have basic Spanish, moreso reading than conversational.

Well I'd like to go to another European country next March or April. They say Germany is an odd country and qualifications are key, while i don't have any. Had ACCA qualification years ago but let it lapse through lack of interest or experience in accounting bar fairly basic bookkeeping. Not great with stress but physically fit besides.

Others say Belgium or Netherlands is a good choice as everyone speaks English .

Has anyone headed off to "Europe" for a bit of metropolitan life, culture, soul searching etc? Where did you end up?

Car99 · 11-01-2020 6:49am

Aine Ni C wrote: »

You won’t get a job in Belgium without French or Dutch. I am living there.

Depends on the industry and the skills required .

4068ac1elhodqr · 11-01-2020 4:23pm

Much easier to work (with some very small exceptions) anywhere in the new world e.g. US/Can/Aus/NZ.

Brexitland might offer up easier/faster work visas (e.g. +50pts for language fluency) with it's former colonies, and vice-versa.
Maybe post-brexit English language will diminish in the Franco-Germanic EU, or become simplified pidgin euro English.

Spanglish could also increase across the pond, until Donald get's his wall built (currently 41m speakers in US).

Jim2007 · 11-01-2020 5:53pm

This is just ignorance and nonsense...

Kyng Raspy Stakeout wrote: »

Much easier to work (with some very small exceptions) anywhere in the new world e.g. US/Can/Aus/NZ.

You don't need a visa to work anywhere in the EU/EEA/CH, you are not subject to quotas and you are entitled to permanent residence status after five years, there are reciprocal arrangements for qualifications. And furthermore, you are legally entitled be treated exactly the same as a citizen of the host country.

Kyng Raspy Stakeout wrote: »

Maybe post-brexit English language will diminish in the Franco-Germanic EU, or become simplified pidgin euro English.

English is popular in all schools in Europe and many authorities willing pay for kids to take the Cambridge exams, which mean that the are capable of taking university level course in English. In truth they probable have a better command of the language that many so called native speakers.

Kyng Raspy Stakeout wrote: »

Spanglish could also increase across the pond, until Donald get's his wall built (currently 41m speakers in US).

As I said ignorance and nonsense.

TimeToShine · 11-01-2020 6:13pm

Kyng Raspy Stakeout wrote: »

Much easier to work (with some very small exceptions) anywhere in the new world e.g. US/Can/Aus/NZ.

Brexitland might offer up easier/faster work visas (e.g. +50pts for language fluency) with it's former colonies, and vice-versa.
Maybe post-brexit English language will diminish in the Franco-Germanic EU, or become simplified pidgin euro English.

Spanglish could also increase across the pond, until Donald get's his wall built (currently 41m speakers in US).

Way more effort involved in getting visas, also distances are huge and would cost a fortune to move out and get set up there. And OP wouldn't get the culture shift he's looking for.

4068ac1elhodqr · 11-01-2020 8:07pm

Jim2007 wrote: »

You don't need a visa to work anywhere in the EU/EEA/CH,

Not talking about the obvious freedom of movement and visa/work freedoms.

Talking in 'practical terms'. E.g. I'm Prof/Technical with some niche skills. Worked in Aus for a while, had job offers as soon as walked off the plane and started contract shortly thereafter, zero integration and production issues from the getgo and viewed as a better asset than the local population. Granted it was only a temp work visa, and aquired fairly easily (after slight wait).

Also traveled across Can/US/NZ not a single issue or inconvience to report (apart from someone in Montréal–Trudeau giving it a bit of French lingo).

If I tried an overnight move to France/Germany/Italy would be largely stuffed.

4068ac1elhodqr · 11-01-2020 8:14pm

TimeToShine wrote: »

Way more effort involved in getting visas, also distances are huge and would cost a fortune to move out and get set up there. And OP wouldn't get the culture shift he's looking for.

Yes US visas are tricky, the rest are not so much trouble.

1 or 2yr open rtn Flights costs are reasonable, wouldn't need to ship the sofa over or anything. Could easily get set up with just basic research.

Seeking significant cultural shifts, without any other languages, isn't an ideal combo, unless doing a lesuire holiday with organised excursions.

Jim2007 · 11-01-2020 9:06pm

Kyng Raspy Stakeout wrote: »

Not talking about the obvious freedom of movement and visa/work freedoms.

Talking in 'practical terms'. E.g. I'm Prof/Technical with some niche skills. Worked in Aus for a while, had job offers as soon as walked off the plane and started contract shortly thereafter, zero integration and production issues from the getgo and viewed as a better asset than the local population. Granted it was only a temp work visa, and aquired fairly easily (after slight wait).

Also traveled across Can/US/NZ not a single issue or inconvience to report (apart from someone in Montréal–Trudeau giving it a bit of French lingo).

If I tried an overnight move to France/Germany/Italy would be largely stuffed.

So your generalisations are now down to your unique situation and your inability to learn a language....

as I said: This is just ignorance and nonsense...

HBC08 · 11-01-2020 9:16pm

Kyng Raspy Stakeout wrote: »

Much easier to work (with some very small exceptions) anywhere in the new world e.g. US/Can/Aus/NZ.

Brexitland might offer up easier/faster work visas (e.g. +50pts for language fluency) with it's former colonies, and vice-versa.
Maybe post-brexit English language will diminish in the Franco-Germanic EU, or become simplified pidgin euro English.

Spanglish could also increase across the pond, until Donald get's his wall built (currently 41m speakers in US).

Jesus wept,
I used to work in organising visas for people going to US mostly but also have a bit of experience with Canada and NZ.
A working visa for a 38 year old non skilled worker can be done but a lot of hassle and potential expense.As an EU citizen they need to arrive at the airport.

TimeToShine · 11-01-2020 9:30pm

Kyng Raspy Stakeout wrote: »

Yes US visas are tricky, the rest are not so much trouble.

1 or 2yr open rtn Flights costs are reasonable, wouldn't need to ship the sofa over or anything. Could easily get set up with just basic research.

Seeking significant cultural shifts, without any other languages, isn't an ideal combo, unless doing a lesuire holiday with organised excursions.

I see where you're coming from but remember OP is 38, working holiday visas for Canada, Australia and NZ are off the table. Not a chance of a H1B or skilled labour visa as an accounts temp either, so imo in this case Europe makes the most sense, or failing that teaching English somewhere completely out there.

4068ac1elhodqr · 11-01-2020 9:36pm

Jim2007 wrote: »

So your generalisations are now down to your unique situation and your inability to learn a language....
as I said: This is just ignorance and nonsense...

Nope on the average person's terms.

Even outside of prof/technical roles you'd still struggle trying to lash out expressos and make light conversation with customers.

Could maybe hand out flyers for a club on the Costas, not much interaction required, hardly cultural.

So you're saying everyone in Ireland is fluent in one or more European languages (like many on the continent with different education systems)? This is just ignorant nonsense.

4068ac1elhodqr · 11-01-2020 9:42pm

TimeToShine wrote: »

I see where you're coming from but remember OP is 38, working holiday visas for Canada, Australia and NZ are off the table. Not a chance of a H1B or skilled labour visa as an accounts temp either, so imo in this case Europe makes the most sense, or failing that teaching English somewhere completely out there.

Fair enough 38 (forgot about that) can make things tricky. However accounts assistants are still somewhat in demand. Could maybe try payroll as a specialism.

Other than that looks like a lucky dip for the yearly GreenCard, or teaching Eng over in China/Dubai (they usually don't require any other langauages whatsoever).

Granadino · 29-01-2020 3:26pm

Do a TEFL course in Ireland, and try and pick up a bit of experience here. Head to Italy. You won't initially need the language. I didn't years ago, especially as it helps to reinforce using English in the classroom. A bit of a Walter Mitty option, as there is no job security and benefits, but will be culturally different, though Western I suppose.

Jim2007 · 29-01-2020 3:47pm

Granadino wrote: »

Do a TEFL course in Ireland, and try and pick up a bit of experience here. Head to Italy. You won't initially need the language. I didn't years ago, especially as it helps to reinforce using English in the classroom. A bit of a Walter Mitty option, as there is no job security and benefits, but will be culturally different, though Western I suppose.

It's very competitive and low salaries. There are lots of English speakers floating around Europe doing that and the demand for English courses is falling because most kids are learn English in school as well.

For example a laundry worker in a hospital earns about 27 francs per hour, a check out clerk at a supermarket about 20 francs per hour and an English teacher at a foreign language school about 23 to 25 francs. And there is more demand for laundry workers and checkout clerks.

redcup342 · 29-01-2020 5:17pm

Kyng Raspy Stakeout wrote: »

If I tried an overnight move to France/Germany/Italy would be largely stuffed.

It's pretty easy, you find a job, drive over in your car.

Get an apartment/Unpack car

Register at the City Hall

Job done.

Australia/US/Canada you have to invest some money and time to go through the whole Visa process and they are also pretty far away (costs a good bit to get there and back, also you need a funeral/gtfo fund for when a family member dies or it all goes tits up and you have to go back home)

Even if you get a Green Card in the USA/Canada you are effectively stuck working there for the forseeable future to maintain your Permanent Residence status.

If you aren't a big fan of local languages, then move to a big European City.

Berlin
Dusseldorf
Munich
Amsterdam
Den Haag
Milan
Zurich
Vienna

To name a few.

And if you don't like it just pack up your car, find a job elsewhere or just drive back to Ireland.

Plus the continent offers a lot of culture and history, the new world (US/Canada/Australia/NZ) are all relatively new.

Of course not saying it's a bad thing, the nature in the above mentioned countries is fantastic.

4068ac1elhodqr · 29-01-2020 7:40pm

redcup342 wrote: »

It's pretty easy, you find a job, drive over in your car.

What sort of job would I find without any language whatsoever, compared, say to the time I walked off a plane in Sydney years ago, and got offered $50phr before barely leaving the airport, from a contact called the previous day. A house in the eastern 'burbs and a pint of black in Scruffies soon after.

Or what 'ease of integration', compared to the time I spend a couple of weeks over in Vancouver and felt at home within a couple of hours, without a single moment of headscratching (same goes for visits/work in Auckland, Melbourne, SanFran, London, Toronto etc etc).

redcup342 · 29-01-2020 9:12pm

Kyng Raspy Stakeout wrote: »

What sort of job would I find without any language whatsoever, compared, say to the time I walked off a plane in Sydney years ago, and got offered $50phr before barely leaving the airport, from a contact called the previous day. A house in the eastern 'burbs and a pint of black in Scruffies soon after.

Or what 'ease of integration', compared to the time I spend a couple of weeks over in Vancouver and felt at home within a couple of hours, without a single moment of headscratching (same goes for visits/work in Auckland, Melbourne, SanFran, London, Toronto etc etc).

I dunno man, most of the rest of us manage just fine :pac:

I haven't lived in Ireland since 2007

4068ac1elhodqr · 29-01-2020 9:31pm

redcup342 wrote: »

I dunno man, most of the rest of us manage just fine

With zero languages?
...On the continent in some sort of well paid professional/technical role, ideally with an understanding of cultural nuances to aid subtle market positioning, product development, media ambiguities and so on.

Sure, I'll take the sports car for a 35hr non-stop 3,158km spin over to Ljubljana/Bucharrest or somewhere, expecting to get settled in before the weekend (not).

redcup342 · 29-01-2020 10:00pm

Kyng Raspy Stakeout wrote: »

With zero languages?
...On the continent in some sort of well paid professional/technical role, ideally with an understanding of cultural nuances to aid subtle market positioning, product development, media ambiguities and so on.

Sure, I'll take the sports car for a 35hr non-stop 3,158km spin over to Ljubljana/Bucharrest or somewhere, expecting to get settled in before the weekend (not).

Well yeah, you can get really good jobs on the continent, there are tons of Contractors flying over and back from the UK/Ireland to Germany/Belgium/NL (and other countries) every week and most of them only speak English.

Aren't many companies selling their goods from European countries into other markets anyways ?

I don't understand why you found it so difficult or seem so against the idea, did you ever try ?

4068ac1elhodqr · 29-01-2020 10:07pm

redcup342 wrote: »

Contractors flying over and back

Over and back, every single week? Sounds a pain.
Besides the title of the thread was 'live in continental europe'
and that's short/mid-haul commuting.

Maybe it'll be easier in 2035 when auto-translate is perfected and available as a direct neural implant with zero lag via the 8G Starlink cloud.

marieholmfan · 29-01-2020 10:08pm

Kyng Raspy Stakeout wrote: »

Over and back, every single week? Sounds a pain.
Besides the title of the thread was 'live in continental europe'
and that's short/mid-haul commuting.

Maybe it'll be easier in 2035 when auto-translate is perfected and available as a direct neural implant with zero lag via the 8G Starlink cloud.

He doesn't want to move to a boring sh1thole like Canada or Australia.

Jim2007 · 29-01-2020 10:37pm

Kyng Raspy Stakeout wrote: »

Over and back, every single week? Sounds a pain.
Besides the title of the thread was 'live in continental europe'
and that's short/mid-haul commuting.

Maybe it'll be easier in 2035 when auto-translate is perfected and available as a direct neural implant with zero lag via the 8G Starlink cloud.

At this stage we all get your position, you are either not will or incapable of learning another language. Fine that is up to you, but there are many other people who don't suffer your limitations, so stop trying project your limitations on to them.

redcup342 · 30-01-2020 12:00am

Kyng Raspy Stakeout wrote: »

Over and back, every single week? Sounds a pain.
Besides the title of the thread was 'live in continental europe'
and that's short/mid-haul commuting.

Maybe it'll be easier in 2035 when auto-translate is perfected and available as a direct neural implant with zero lag via the 8G Starlink cloud.

Just merely pointing out that if your goal is purely money then you can indeed make good money in Continental Europe only speaking English.

In NL there are many people using English as their second language to work.

Also you can dip your toe in the water and go over to work, see how you like it and then move over permanently if you want, you can't do that with the US, Canada, Oz or NZ. It's all or nothing.

If you want to get by with just English in larger Continental European cities you can do just that.

As an EU Citizen you have the same rights as everyone else as well (only difference being voting rights in National Elections) so you have access to all the same services as people living there.

You can even learn the local language if you like.

What I really appreciate is I don't need a car, i use Public Transport. If it's sunny I rent a cabrio, if it's long distance to go skiing I rent a big Diesel combi or if I want some fun I rent an Electric Car.

I just had a fractured ankle recently, went to a German Hospital, everyone spoke english, allot of the documentation was supplied in English, my Taxi costs to and from the Hospital were covered and they even offered someone to come around and do some shopping/cooking and cleaning while I was laid up.

And we get 32 days holidays per year + Public Holidays and overtime isn't seen as normal

Anyway man

I assume you have a good experience but just pointing out many people are living and working on the continent and living a very comfortable and enriching life and if you are an EU Citizen coming from another EU Country it's very easy to move.

Sure, Continental Europe is not for everyone, but the former Colonies which are relatively young with underdeveloped public transport, culture and history aren't really for everyone either, also they are far away from Family and long term friends whereas the Continent is not.

There are even more opportunies these days since IR35 came in, you'll see less UK Contractors going over to the continent to work as it's less financially attractive.
https://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/smallbusiness/article-7256775/Still-confused-IR35-tax-changes-impact-Heres-simple-guide.html

Jim2007 · 30-01-2020 4:34pm

redcup342 wrote: »

I just had a fractured ankle recently, went to a German Hospital, everyone spoke english, allot of the documentation was supplied in English, my Taxi costs to and from the Hospital were covered and they even offered someone to come around and do some shopping/cooking and cleaning while I was laid up.

Pretty much the same here in Switzerland, except you have to pay for transport. On the other hand it is pretty easy to get them to send you to resort in the mountains for a few weeks to recover.

redcup342 wrote: »

And we get 32 days holidays per year + Public Holidays and overtime isn't seen as normal

Overtime is not normal in most of the EU/EEA/CH, but I don't think the poster appreciates the work-live balance in any case.

redcup342 wrote: »

There are even more opportunies these days since IR35 came in, you'll see less UK Contractors going over to the continent to work as it's less financially attractive.
https://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/smallbusiness/article-7256775/Still-confused-IR35-tax-changes-impact-Heres-simple-guide.html

They won't get the permits for a start... and most agencies won't bother applying for them in any case, they will just take contractors from the rest of the EU.

murphaph · 02-02-2020 10:07pm

I would feel really isolated in Aus or NZ. It's just so far away from family. My 77 year old mam is here with us again for a couple of weeks. We'll be in Ireland for the Easter holidays. Mam will be back over in the summer and so on. That would be practically impossible if we didn't live in Europe.

We can visit a myriad of cultures in an hour on a plane. That's not possible in the new world where the distances are vast.

I personally know 3 families that went to Aus and returned. My best friend left for Aus when he was 5 years old. His parents argued about returning for the following 30 years!

Ok with modern technology it's not as bad but not the same.

Live in continental europe.

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