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Is it permissible to travel to viewings outside of 2KM?

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    #62
    the_syco
    Registered Users Posts: 37,295 ✭✭✭✭the_syco


    Slydice wrote: »
    The RTB have their newer document than any other source I can find:
    Emergency Legislation –FAQs for Landlords and Tenants
    2nd April 2020
    https://onestopshop.rtb.ie/images/uploads/Comms%20and%20Research/FAQs_on_Emergency_Legislation_Final.pdf
    In http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/eli/2020/act/2/section/5/enacted/en/html#sec5 5(7) refers to "all proposed evictions in all tenancies in the State" - a license is not a tenant.

    Also, in https://onestopshop.rtb.ie/images/uploads/Comms%20and%20Research/FAQs_on_Emergency_Legislation_Final.pdf it says "RENT A ROOM / ‘DIGS’ ACCOMMODATION" as opposed to "RENT A ROOM & ‘DIGS’ ACCOMMODATION". This appears to mean that Students, as per previous announcements, are included in the eviction ban, even if the LL doesn't classify it as "digs".

    From https://onestopshop.rtb.ie/images/uploads/Comms%20and%20Research/FAQs_on_Emergency_Legislation_Final.pdf
    Carrying out an illegal eviction, which includes prohibiting access to the property or making the property uninhabitable by disconnecting services, can result in damages of up to €20,000 being awarded to the tenant. The RTB can seek an injunction from the Courts to reinstate the tenant and will continue to prioritise these cases during the emergency period.
    Lodgers are not tenants. Also, there is no set amount of notice when telling a lodger to leave.

    =-=

    Finally, if you were right and licensees were included in the ban, said people would be allowed to stop paying rent, and engage in anti-social behaviour against the home owner until the emergency is deemed as over.


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    #63
    Slydice
    Registered Users Posts: 10,501 ✭✭✭✭Slydice


    Not sure if I missed this before or it's new:
    https://onestopshop.rtb.ie/covid-19-emergency-legislation-for-rental-sector

    Looks like RTB are interpreting it as including Rent-a-Room and Digs-style accommodation:
    The emergency legislation applies to all tenancies which fall under the Residential Tenancies Act, this includes Approved Housing Bodies, Student Specific and Private Rented Accommodation, along with Rent-a-Room and Digs-style accommodation.

    That site reads like they might come down heavy on court cases that arise.


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    #64
    road_high
    Registered Users Posts: 19,388 ✭✭✭✭road_high


    Baby01032012 wrote: »
    I’m an estate agent. Letting an apartment does not come under an essential service. I had a maintenance guy go to an apartment block time repair a gate he was stopped and fined €150 by the guards as it’s not an essential service.
    I doubt you’ll find any agent actually doing physical viewings. A lot including the bigger agents are doing virtual viewings.
    Your health is essential OP, this is potentially a life and death scenario. Your situation is not.

    I’m finding that a tad hard to believe. Repairing a gate is an essential service- it may pose a hazard to the emergency services needing access and any reasonable Garda would see that within their discretion


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    #65
    cython
    Registered Users Posts: 4,758 ✭✭✭cython


    Slydice wrote: »
    Not sure if I missed this before or it's new:
    https://onestopshop.rtb.ie/covid-19-emergency-legislation-for-rental-sector

    Looks like RTB are interpreting it as including Rent-a-Room and Digs-style accommodation:


    That site reads like they might come down heavy on court cases that arise.

    Well and good, but as stated here rent a room (in an owner-occupied environment) is not a tenancy. In fact another page on the same site explicitly says they have no remit there - see below (my emhpasis).
    RTB wrote:
    The RTB remit does not extend to:

    tenancies in local authority housing or under shared ownership lease arrangements.
    holiday letting agreements.
    the Rent a Room scheme (where the landlord and the tenant share the same self contained property).
    if a tenant lives with the spouse, civil partner, parent or child of the landlord and there is no written letting agreement in place.
    if the property has been let through AirBNB (an online residential accommodation booking service).
    There are further rare examples under the Landlord and Tenant (Ground Rents) Act 1978 and Landlord and Tenant (Amendment) Act 1980 when a dwellings may be exempted, for example:

    where a rented dwelling that may, in certain situations, be purchased by the tenant to take ownership of
    where a tenant may apply for a new tenancy on the ending of an earlier tenancy, if they can show long occupation or they have spent money on improvements of the property
    Licences
    Typically most licence arrangements do not come under the remit of the RTB. Please note that because a licence is named as such, it does not necessarily mean it is not operating as a tenancy for the purposes of the RTB.

    A licence is usually said to exist where a person is:

    Staying in a hotel, guesthouse, hostel.
    Sharing with the owner in Rent a Room / digs / college properties.
    Staying in rented accommodation at the invitation of the tenant.
    There is a formal licence agreement where the owner is not resident, not entitield to exclusive use and has contining access to the accommodation.
    The law gives a licencee the right to request the landlord to allow him / her to become a tenant provided:

    He/she is in lawful occupation of the dwelling.
    A tenancy is in place for at least six months.

    So it seems bizarre that they could claim/threaten to enforce something that they legally have no authority over.....


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    #66
    Slydice
    Registered Users Posts: 10,501 ✭✭✭✭Slydice


    My understanding is that the new law makes emergency changes for the time the emergency lasts to the previous laws on that.

    I can only guess that the RTB might have those pages on their to-update list or maybe they'll be back to being the pages they use when the emergency measures finish.

    Just going back to the emergency measures and how it works for the time the emergency lasts:
    Slydice wrote: »
    Just checking the Act of Law...
    the final one listed here "27 Mar 2020": https://www.oireachtas.ie/en/bills/bill/2020/4/
    direct link to the pdf:
    https://data.oireachtas.ie/ie/oireachtas/act/2020/2/eng/enacted/a0220.pdf

    They use the word 'Period' (of time) in the document in many places. Like for the Residential Tenancies Act 2004:
    to make provision in relation to theoperation of certain provisions of the Residential Tenancies Act 2004 during the period of 3 months following the enactment of this Act and such further period (if any) as maybe specified by order of the Government;


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    #67
    Graham
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 17,642 Mod ✭✭✭✭Graham


    My understanding is the government themselves aren't confident that the emergency legislation protects rent-a-room type tenants, hence the need to ask for forbearance.


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    #68
    Slydice
    Registered Users Posts: 10,501 ✭✭✭✭Slydice


    My understanding is the government is made up of more than the Dept of Housing and the Courts who the RTB mention are the ones who interpret the law.


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    #69
    d1980
    Registered Users Posts: 333 ✭✭d1980


    Not sure if correct forum or not. Grass needs cutting for a tenant of mine. Clearly this is non essential but has not been cut since last year. Is this something than I can do or do we have to wait until restrictions ease? I gave key to side gate so if I was allowed would drive over, cut grass and go.

    Thanks


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    #70
    saabsaab
    Registered Users Posts: 7,772 ✭✭✭saabsaab


    d1980 wrote: »
    Not sure if correct forum or not. Grass needs cutting for a tenant of mine. Clearly this is non essential but has not been cut since last year. Is this something than I can do or do we have to wait until restrictions ease? I gave key to side gate so if I was allowed would drive over, cut grass and go.

    Thanks


    Best ring your local Garda station, if you can guarantee you won't meet others you may be allowed.


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    #71
    Graham
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 17,642 Mod ✭✭✭✭Graham


    d1980 wrote: »
    Clearly this is non essential

    Looks like you answered your own question d1980.


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    #72
    Phoenix Wright
    Closed Accounts Posts: 717 ✭✭✭Phoenix Wright


    Similar debate I'm having - is it permissable to practice driving with a member of my household? It was bad enough having my test cancelled the week before, but I don't want to become completely rusty after months of hard work. There are so many debatable scenarios out there, never thought about a viewing as one of them but it's a good point


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    #73
    Graham
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 17,642 Mod ✭✭✭✭Graham


    Phoenix Wright wrote: »
    Similar debate I'm having

    What's to debate?
    Stay at home in all circumstances, except in the following situations:
    1. to travel to and from work where the work is considered an essential service.
    2. working in an essential shop, bank or post office.
    3. to buy food, medicines and other health products for yourself, your family or someone who is vulnerable or 'cocooning'
    4. to attend medical appointments
    5. for vital family reasons including caring for children, elderly or vulnerable people but excluding social family visits
    6. to exercise within 2 kilometres of your house. You cannot exercise with people from outside your household


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    #74
    Phoenix Wright
    Closed Accounts Posts: 717 ✭✭✭Phoenix Wright


    Graham wrote:
    What's to debate?


    True, by all accounts it's set in stone now. Frustrating all the same


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    #75
    Spon Farmer
    Registered Users Posts: 4,196 ✭✭✭Spon Farmer


    Graham wrote: »
    FWIW my opinion would be it's not essential unless you are homeless.

    Anybody who currently has accommodation would be protected by the emergency legislation for the most part.

    I came to the boards to ask about this. I know someone who was wanting to move out of her parents house just before the lockdown happened. Are landlords even allowed to take on new tenants during all of this?

    Surely viewing a flat (and house for that matter) is a no-no. You wouldn’t know who had been in the place looking and touching stuff or if any effort was made to clean it.


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    #76
    Caranica
    Registered Users Posts: 10,032 ✭✭✭✭Caranica


    Phoenix Wright wrote: »
    Similar debate I'm having - is it permissable to practice driving with a member of my household? It was bad enough having my test cancelled the week before, but I don't want to become completely rusty after months of hard work. There are so many debatable scenarios out there, never thought about a viewing as one of them but it's a good point

    Not wanting to be rusty will not be accepted as a reasonable excuse.


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    #77
    Phoenix Wright
    Closed Accounts Posts: 717 ✭✭✭Phoenix Wright


    Caranica wrote: »
    Not wanting to be rusty will not be accepted as a reasonable excuse.

    Yeah I don't think it will fly somehow, it would take a very kind Garda. Wonder if these restrictions will be extended past May 5th


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    #78
    saabsaab
    Registered Users Posts: 7,772 ✭✭✭saabsaab


    Phoenix Wright wrote: »
    Yeah I don't think it will fly somehow, it would take a very kind Garda. Wonder if these restrictions will be extended past May 5th


    Almost certainly, in most respects at least. Unless the cases start to drop significantly.


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