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Does anyone actually believe that Gerry Adams wasn't in the IRA?

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24567…21

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    #32
    El_Duderino 09
    Registered Users Posts: 20,004 ✭✭✭✭El_Duderino 09


    [Deleted User] wrote: »
    I hear satire is making a comeback.

    What's satirical about it? Is something about what I said not accurate?


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    #33
    James Brown
    Closed Accounts Posts: 16,015 ✭✭✭✭James Brown


    markodaly wrote: »
    That is a cop-out, in fairness. Martin McGuiness was always upfront about it. Didn't stop him from sharing power with the late Rev. Ian Paisley.

    Also, the Good Friday Agreement was more than 20 years ago, yet today he still lies like the best of them about his IRA membership.

    He could come clean.... but he is the man he is, so he continues to lie.

    It would be a 'cop out' if I'd skin in the game, I do not. I was never a member of the IRA ;)
    Did you see McGuinness give a lot of political statements while organising hits on people and bombings? How did he fit it all in?

    I'd lie if I were him. Common sense. You'd have all sorts suing you and likely be charged on something.
    Also I think everyone has made up their mind and it's a non-news story IMO.


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    #34
    James Brown
    Closed Accounts Posts: 16,015 ✭✭✭✭James Brown


    lola85 wrote: »
    And here we go.

    You are constantly giving out about FFG lying and how utterly outraged you are.

    So what’s different?

    Absolutely nothing. Do you see me giving out about PBP or Renua much? No? likely they are up to all sorts of shenanigans....FG are in government. Their lies and decisions ruin lives. Whether or not Adams was in the IRA, I reckon he was. So that's it for me. If it were the 1970s/80's and Sinn Fein were in government, I'd likely have a stronger opinion.


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    #35
    markodaly
    Registered Users Posts: 13,954 ✭✭✭✭markodaly


    Matt Barrett wrote: »

    I'd lie if I were him. Common sense.

    Clearly you two share the same morals so.


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    #36
    ToBeFrank123
    Users Awaiting Email Confirmation Posts: 2,176 ✭✭✭ToBeFrank123


    Based on most of the evidence and numerous accounts from across the board, its not only obvious Adams was in the IRA but he also called many of the shots in the IRA.

    Only someone in the IRA could have persuaded them to eventually give up violence.

    There was a running "joke" during the Troubles about Adams going and asking the IRA if they were involved in something and they usually telling him no. Of course he needn't have gone far.


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    #37
    SafeSurfer
    Registered Users Posts: 6,421 ✭✭✭SafeSurfer


    Matt Barrett wrote: »
    markodaly wrote: »
    That is a cop-out, in fairness. Martin McGuiness was always upfront about it. Didn't stop him from sharing power with the late Rev. Ian Paisley.

    Also, the Good Friday Agreement was more than 20 years ago, yet today he still lies like the best of them about his IRA membership.

    He could come clean.... but he is the man he is, so he continues to lie.

    It would be a 'cop out' if I'd skin in the game, I do not. I was never a member of the IRA ;)
    Did you see McGuinness give a lot of political statements while organising hits on people and bombings? How did he fit it all in?

    I'd lie if I were him. Common sense. You'd have all sorts suing you and likely be charged on something.
    Also I think everyone has made up their mind and it's a non-news story IMO.

    Do you see any hypocrisy in a known liar consistently calling for a truth and reconciliation commission?

    If he took the risk of telling the truth it would be a very powerful statement and throw down the gauntlet to others. Instead he chooses to continue to lie.

    Multo autem ad rem magis pertinet quallis tibi vide aris quam allis



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    #38
    James Brown
    Closed Accounts Posts: 16,015 ✭✭✭✭James Brown


    markodaly wrote: »
    Clearly you two share the same morals so.

    Give over Marko. If you or I were in an illegal organisation we wouldn't be announcing it. That's logic.
    We're talking about Gerry Adams likely being in the IRA and why he might lie about it. Catch yourself on.


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    #39
    James Brown
    Closed Accounts Posts: 16,015 ✭✭✭✭James Brown


    SafeSurfer wrote: »
    Do you see any hypocrisy in a known liar consistently calling for a truth and reconciliation commission?

    If he took the risk of telling the truth it would be a very powerful statement and throw down the gauntlet to others. Instead he chooses to continue to lie.

    No. I see a man not putting himself on the chopping black. He'd have been an idiot to come out as IRA, IMO.
    Maybe if the SAS all come out?


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    #40
    SafeSurfer
    Registered Users Posts: 6,421 ✭✭✭SafeSurfer


    Matt Barrett wrote: »
    SafeSurfer wrote: »
    Do you see any hypocrisy in a known liar consistently calling for a truth and reconciliation commission?

    If he took the risk of telling the truth it would be a very powerful statement and throw down the gauntlet to others. Instead he chooses to continue to lie.

    No. I see a man not putting himself on the chopping black. He'd have been an idiot to come out as IRA, IMO.
    Maybe if the SAS all come out?

    Well at least there is a little progress. Up until very recently this defenders argued that he was never a member of the IRA. Now there is an acknowledgement that he was and lied consistently and repeatedly about it.

    Multo autem ad rem magis pertinet quallis tibi vide aris quam allis



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    #41
    James Brown
    Closed Accounts Posts: 16,015 ✭✭✭✭James Brown


    SafeSurfer wrote: »
    Well at least there is a little progress. Up until very recently this defenders argued that he was never a member of the IRA. Now there is an acknowledgement that he was and lied consistently and repeatedly about it.

    How is it progress? I am nobodies defender and always assumed he was in the IRA, since I was a child. It's an illegal organisation doncha know?
    People are complex comrade. I see you side step the parts of comments that draw you away from your little digs, enjoy :)


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    #42
    SafeSurfer
    Registered Users Posts: 6,421 ✭✭✭SafeSurfer


    Matt Barrett wrote: »
    SafeSurfer wrote: »
    Well at least there is a little progress. Up until very recently this defenders argued that he was never a member of the IRA. Now there is an acknowledgement that he was and lied consistently and repeatedly about it.

    How is it progress? I am nobodies defender and always assumed he was in the IRA, since I was a child. It's an illegal organisation doncha know?
    People are complex comrade. I see you side step the parts of comments that draw you away from your little digs, enjoy :)

    I don’t believe the issue of telling the truth or lying is all that complex. Sidestepping the part about the SAS? Calls for truth and justice from a known liar who could clear up a lot of lies and injustice by telling the truth ring pretty hollow don’t you think?

    Multo autem ad rem magis pertinet quallis tibi vide aris quam allis



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    #43
    xckjoo
    Registered Users Posts: 3,348 ✭✭✭xckjoo


    Met a guy in his early 20's a while back that was adamant he was never in it. Literally left me speechless because I thought everyone knew that he was. Might as well have tried to tell me the Pope isn't Catholic. He was neck deep in some kind of kool-aid though. Too "woke" for reality.


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    #44
    James Brown
    Closed Accounts Posts: 16,015 ✭✭✭✭James Brown


    SafeSurfer wrote: »
    I don’t believe the issue of telling the truth or lying is all that complex. Sidestepping the part about the SAS? Calls for truth and justice from a known liar who could clear up a lot of lies and injustice by telling the truth ring pretty hollow don’t you think?

    Truth and justice. We've opposing sides here. One legal armed forces and a secretive branch. The other an illegal group labelled terrorists. And you want an alleged member to come out? Give over.


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    #45
    James Brown
    Closed Accounts Posts: 16,015 ✭✭✭✭James Brown


    xckjoo wrote: »
    Met a guy in his early 20's a while back that was adamant he was never in it. Literally left me speechless because I thought everyone knew that he was. Might as well have tried to tell me the Pope isn't Catholic. He was neck deep in some kind of kool-aid though. Too "woke" for reality.

    So IRA deniers are woke now? I much catch up on Nickelodeon to learn all the latest Republican newspeak.


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    #46
    xckjoo
    Registered Users Posts: 3,348 ✭✭✭xckjoo


    Matt Barrett wrote: »
    So IRA deniers are woke now? I much catch up on Nickelodeon to learn all the latest Republican newspeak.
    What are you on about?


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    #47
    Scoundrel
    Registered Users Posts: 1,435 ✭✭✭Scoundrel


    Deleted User wrote: »
    At least McGuinness had the stones to own up, Adams is a spineless jellyfish.

    It's very simple really Gerry Adams was never done for membership so he can't admit publicly he was in the IRA even though everyone knows he was and indeed he was in charge of it. Martin McGuinness could admit membership up to 1974 (which he did) because he was convicted of membership in 1973. My own opinion of Adams is that he was a sociopath who literally walked on corpses to get where he is and sold all of his supposed beliefs down the river to be a statesman.


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    #48
    ednwireland
    Registered Users Posts: 14,312 ✭✭✭✭ednwireland


    i suspect he was never made to swear allegience (or whatever they do ) to the IRA, basically as a way of giving him political plausible deniability when the armalite and ballot box strategy was invented.

    he may have ordered attacksa sat on army council meetings but was never officialy a member.

    officialy possibly not in every other respect however yes !

    My weather

    https://www.ecowitt.net/home/share?authorize=96CT1F



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    #49
    Portsalon
    Closed Accounts Posts: 702 ✭✭✭Portsalon


    Matt Barrett wrote: »

    Maybe if the SAS all come out?

    Out of what? Their various barracks?


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    #50
    SafeSurfer
    Registered Users Posts: 6,421 ✭✭✭SafeSurfer


    Matt Barrett wrote: »
    SafeSurfer wrote: »
    I don’t believe the issue of telling the truth or lying is all that complex. Sidestepping the part about the SAS? Calls for truth and justice from a known liar who could clear up a lot of lies and injustice by telling the truth ring pretty hollow don’t you think?

    Truth and justice. We've opposing sides here. One legal armed forces and a secretive branch. The other an illegal group labelled terrorists. And you want an alleged member to come out? Give over.

    Know who is sidestepping. Can you not bring yourself to acknowledge that Adams is a liar. A known and consistent liar and because he is perceived to be a liar he has no integrity in the eyes of many of the electorate who’s votes he tried to win? The fact that he is a liar with no integrity did huge damage to the republican movement in recent years. His inability to tell the truth made him a laughing stock. Nelson Mandela he ain’t.

    Multo autem ad rem magis pertinet quallis tibi vide aris quam allis



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    #51
    markodaly
    Registered Users Posts: 13,954 ✭✭✭✭markodaly


    Matt Barrett wrote: »
    Give over Marko. If you or I were in an illegal organisation we wouldn't be announcing it. That's logic.
    We're talking about Gerry Adams likely being in the IRA and why he might lie about it. Catch yourself on.

    What is the logic about lying about it for the past 20 years when there is no danger to his personal freedom?
    McGuinness admitted his membership, as have many people and they have gotten on with their lives.

    The fact you are here defending a pathological lier says it all.


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    #52
    James Brown
    Closed Accounts Posts: 16,015 ✭✭✭✭James Brown


    xckjoo wrote: »
    What are you on about?

    I thought 'woke' was socially aware? You said this young lad wasn't having it that Adams was in the 'RA and he was somehow 'woke'?


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    #53
    James Brown
    Closed Accounts Posts: 16,015 ✭✭✭✭James Brown


    SafeSurfer wrote: »
    Know who is sidestepping. Can you not bring yourself to acknowledge that Adams is a liar. A known and consistent liar and because he is perceived to be a liar he has no integrity in the eyes of many of the electorate who’s votes he tried to win? The fact that he is a liar with no integrity did huge damage to the republican movement in recent years. His inability to tell the truth made him a laughing stock. Nelson Mandela he ain’t.

    I think he is. You're desperate to score points bless. He said he wasn't in the 'RA, I think he was. Was it too complex to comprehend?

    And I said he'd be stupid to come out as IRA.
    Now you're just having a dig again, have at it :)
    markodaly wrote: »
    What is the logic about lying about it for the past 20 years when there is no danger to his personal freedom?
    McGuinness admitted his membership, as have many people and they have gotten on with their lives.

    The fact you are here defending a pathological lier says it all.

    Defending him by explaining why he might have lied? Do you get ...'words' at all?


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    #54
    lawrencesummers
    Registered Users Posts: 8,490 ✭✭✭lawrencesummers


    There is a bigger question that people should answer.

    Not do we believe him when he say that he wasn’t, but

    Is it worse that he was actually in the IRA or that he is lying about not being in it.

    ie. He is a politician, they all are economical with the truth at times, is the problem that he has possibly lied, or is he less of a person because he was in the IRA?


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    #55
    James Brown
    Closed Accounts Posts: 16,015 ✭✭✭✭James Brown


    lawrencesummers wrote: »
    There is a bigger question that people should answer.

    Not do we believe him when he say that he wasn’t, but

    Is it worse that he was actually in the IRA or that he is lying about not being in it.

    ie. He is a politician, they all are economical with the truth at times, is the problem that he has possibly lied, or is he less of a person because he was in the IRA?

    He'd likely have been locked up, sued or less likely to have been invited to the discussion table if he came out as IRA, IMO.


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    #56
    markodaly
    Registered Users Posts: 13,954 ✭✭✭✭markodaly


    Matt Barrett wrote: »

    Defending him by explaining why he might have lied? Do you get ...'words' at all?

    Yes, defending him as to why he has lied about a simple fact all these years.
    Why has he lied about it since the GFA?

    As an aside, this thread is going be comedy gold the next time you try and take the high moral ground over some other issue of note.
    *bookmarked*


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    #57
    xckjoo
    Registered Users Posts: 3,348 ✭✭✭xckjoo


    Matt Barrett wrote: »
    I thought 'woke' was socially aware? You said this young lad wasn't having it that Adams was in the 'RA and he was somehow 'woke'?
    "woke" in terms of believing he had his eyes open to things most people don't see. The kind of person that thinks he has the inside track on everything when in fact he's careening off into the bushes of fantasy.


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    #58
    James Brown
    Closed Accounts Posts: 16,015 ✭✭✭✭James Brown


    markodaly wrote: »
    Yes, defending him as to why he has lied about a simple fact all these years.
    Why has he lied about it since the GFA?

    As an aside, this thread is going be comedy gold the next time you try and take the high moral ground over some other issue of note.
    *bookmarked*

    I gave reasons why he might have lied, IMO. If that's 'defending' him, fair enough so. There was me thinking we discussed things when you seem intent on attacking and scoring points.

    Marko, try engaging in discussion, it's more healthy than waiting in the wings to score points, just saying.


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    #59
    Conall Cernach
    Registered Users Posts: 1,929 ✭✭✭Conall Cernach


    markodaly wrote: »
    Yes, defending him as to why he has lied about a simple fact all these years.
    Why has he lied about it since the GFA?

    As an aside, this thread is going be comedy gold the next time you try and take the high moral ground over some other issue of note.
    *bookmarked*
    Because it is still an offence to be a member of the IRA with a sentence of around 7 years. For directing terrorism, which is what he'd be looking at for being on the Army Council he'd expect a 20 year sentence. Now this might be mitigated as it was pre-GFA to "only" 2 years but he'd still be mad to admit it.


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    #60
    headnorth
    Registered Users Posts: 197 ✭✭headnorth


    ednwireland wrote:
    i suspect he was never made to swear allegience (or whatever they do ) to the IRA, basically as a way of giving him political plausible deniability when the armalite and ballot box strategy was invented.

    ednwireland wrote:
    he may have ordered attacksa sat on army council meetings but was never officialy a member.

    ednwireland wrote:
    officialy possibly not in every other respect however yes !


    Correct. He never swore an oath with the ira green book in his hand.


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    #61
    Danzy
    Registered Users Posts: 13,332 ✭✭✭✭Danzy


    begsbyOnaTrain wrote: »
    Yet another senior IRA man comes out saying that Adams was in it - https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-49718168



    I was surprised to see this in the top news stories because like, who doesn't believe this? We've had numerous other IRA people come out and say it in the past (and give details of the murders he ordered) so is this a shock to anyone? The man's been lying for decades but it just suits all sides to nod away and agree.

    Yet to meet someone who really cares either way.


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