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FAI’s financial position

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  • 04-12-2019 6:52pm
    #1
    Dots1982
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,957 ✭✭✭


    The FAI’s financial position currently is that total debt exceeds annual turnover.

    How bad or unusual a position is that?


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    #2
    thegolfer
    Registered Users Posts: 346 ✭✭thegolfer


    Dots1982 wrote: »
    The FAI’s financial position currently is that total debt exceeds annual turnover.

    How bad or unusual a position is that?

    It depends on the many factors.

    They have invested in the Aviva stadium, and obviously that constitutes a debt, but also an asset on the balance sheet. Is the debt being adequately serviced from the cash flow of the business and daily operations.

    Has the debt decreased in line with expectations, or remained on an interest only basis?

    If you consider irfu, has it the same debt levels, seen as it invested in the other half of the Aviva ?

    Obviously there are details which we no sight of, however based on media reports it doesn't stack up well for the Fai, miss management, rental being paid for, severance packages unknown, complete closed shop and jobs for the boys.


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    #3
    Dots1982
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,957 ✭✭✭Dots1982


    FAI seem to be in the position Ireland was during the banking crisis. Except the FAI don’t have a strong tech sector or agriculture to fall back on so they’ll be left to practice austerity for the next decade or two.


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    #4
    v638sg7k1a92bx
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,913 ✭✭✭v638sg7k1a92bx


    thegolfer wrote: »
    It depends on the many factors.

    They have invested in the Aviva stadium, and obviously that constitutes a debt, but also an asset on the balance sheet. Is the debt being adequately serviced from the cash flow of the business and daily operations.

    Has the debt decreased in line with expectations, or remained on an interest only basis?

    If you consider irfu, has it the same debt levels, seen as it invested in the other half of the Aviva ?

    Obviously there are details which we no sight of, however based on media reports it doesn't stack up well for the Fai, miss management, rental being paid for, severance packages unknown, complete closed shop and jobs for the boys.

    Haven't looked at the accounts but I expect the balances didn't change overnight, how have previous years accounts look?


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    #5
    Masala
    Registered Users Posts: 3,462 ✭✭✭Masala


    A lot of small clubs invested in Capital works in 2018 with an FAI committment of a Grant towards same in 2019. Will they honor these commitments o4 has everything been withdrawn..

    Any clubs out there getting paid recently ????


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    #6
    Dots1982
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,957 ✭✭✭Dots1982


    Billy Colossal Ripper wrote: »
    Haven't looked at the accounts but I expect the balances didn't change overnight, how have previous years accounts look?

    They are going to re release accounts going back to 2016 tonight. There is a suggestion that the profits shown in previous years were largely dependent on the future years’ incomes and therefore were at best misleading and at worst false and subject to dodgy accounting practices.

    That is the level they are at.


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    #7
    Dots1982
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,957 ✭✭✭Dots1982


    Masala wrote: »
    A lot of small clubs invested in Capital works in 2018 with an FAI committment of a Grant towards same in 2019. Will they honor these commitments o4 has everything been withdrawn..

    Any clubs out there getting paid recently ????

    That situation is very precarious. I’d say they will find it extremely difficult to honor any capital works commitments.


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    #8
    Jim2007
    Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators Posts: 10,028 Mod ✭✭✭✭Jim2007


    Dots1982 wrote: »
    That situation is very precarious. I’d say they will find it extremely difficult to honor any capital works commitments.

    It's not a commercial operation, so it is not that very precarious. It will be difficult no doubt, but give them five years and it will be as if it never happened. That is how it is with such organisations.


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    #9
    Seth Brundle
    Moderators, Politics Moderators Posts: 38,967 Mod ✭✭✭✭Seth Brundle


    How can Deloitte be their auditors for 20 years and continue to sign off in the accounts until Mark Tighe started raising dust?


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    #10
    DUBACC
    Registered Users Posts: 486 ✭✭DUBACC


    Seth Brundle wrote: »
    How can Deloitte be their auditors for 20 years and continue to sign off in the accounts until Mark Tighe started raising dust?


    Because minor things like independence and ethics only get applied to SME accountancy practices and not to the big 4.


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    #11
    berettaman
    Registered Users Posts: 553 ✭✭✭berettaman


    DUBACC wrote: »
    Because minor things like independence and ethics only get applied to SME accountancy practices and not to the big 4.


    Spot on..


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    #12
    Jim2007
    Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators Posts: 10,028 Mod ✭✭✭✭Jim2007


    DUBACC wrote: »
    Because minor things like independence and ethics only get applied to SME accountancy practices and not to the big 4.

    Alternatively small practices never have to deal with the serious issues and the deliberate intentions fo fraud encountered by the bigger practices.


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    #13
    Nermal
    Registered Users Posts: 2,616 ✭✭✭Nermal


    Presumably the stake in the Aviva is already on the balance sheet. If they're insolvent, how is cashing it in going to help? Or is it a liquidity issue, rather than solvency?


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    #14
    Dots1982
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,957 ✭✭✭Dots1982


    Nermal wrote: »
    If they're insolvent, how is cashing it in going to help?

    To meet their debt of 60 or so million which is more like 80 million.


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    #15
    Nermal
    Registered Users Posts: 2,616 ✭✭✭Nermal


    Dots1982 wrote: »
    To meet their debt of 60 or so million which is more like 80 million.

    If you’re insolvent, and you reduce your assets and liabilities by €30M, you’re still insolvent...


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    #16
    daheff
    Registered Users Posts: 5,837 ✭✭✭daheff


    Anybody got an easy link to their accounts?


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    #17
    Dots1982
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,957 ✭✭✭Dots1982


    Nermal wrote: »
    If you’re insolvent, and you reduce your assets and liabilities by €30M, you’re still insolvent...

    I don’t know. I’m just going on the concept of can’t pay, they take it away.

    They have massive liabilities. They owe Sports Direct 6 million. They have no home games next year so very little income from the stadium.

    Their stake in it won’t be sold to an outside party anyway. The government will bail them out more than likely and rent it back to the FAI on the cheap.


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    #18
    Dots1982
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,957 ✭✭✭Dots1982


    daheff wrote: »
    Anybody got an easy link to their accounts?

    https://www.fai.ie/domestic/news/2018-fai-accounts


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    #19
    DUBACC
    Registered Users Posts: 486 ✭✭DUBACC


    Jim2007 wrote: »
    Alternatively small practices never have to deal with the serious issues and the deliberate intentions fo fraud encountered by the bigger practices.


    Oh please! A blind man could have seen the issues in Anglo, etc.

    Too many consultancy contracts cloud the independence issue.


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    #20
    Jimbob1977
    Registered Users Posts: 2,239 ✭✭✭Jimbob1977


    I'm struggling to understand the Intangible Assets (Stadium Contribution) of €57m as the notes are vague.

    What is the nature of the Intangible?

    If it's not a debtor, not land & buildings and not an investment..... what are they capitalising in layman's terms??


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    #21
    atilladehun
    Registered Users Posts: 1,566 ✭✭✭atilladehun


    Jimbob1977 wrote: »
    I'm struggling to understand the Intangible Assets (Stadium Contribution) of €57m as the notes are vague.

    What is the nature of the Intangible?

    If it's not a debtor, not land & buildings and not an investment..... what are they capitalising in layman's terms??

    It's a 60 year lease of the stadium, would that make a difference.


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    #22
    Nermal
    Registered Users Posts: 2,616 ✭✭✭Nermal


    Dots1982 wrote: »
    https://www.fai.ie/domestic/news/2018-fai-accounts

    Thanks. Looking at that, it is a liquidity issue. Poor media reporting...


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