Dublin City Council obstructing housing through mindless height limits?

Kermit.de.frog · 28-02-2021 2:33am

Birds might fly in to it.

That's the argument.

What the actual fcuk?

How do other cities deal with this bird genocide?

Kermit.de.frog · 28-02-2021 2:47am

This is what Dublin City Council wants to turn it's nose up to.

If the rest of the city wasn't an uncared for kip you could kind of understand.

Big bad evil developer wants to drag city out of the stone age - NO NO!!! - not having that.

We can't have anything nice because...

I don't understand why every bit of ambition is shot down.

Bubbaclaus · 28-02-2021 11:58am

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

This is what Dublin City Council wants to turn it's nose up to.

If the rest of the city wasn't an uncared for kip you could kind of understand.

Big bad evil developer wants to drag city out of the stone age - NO NO!!! - not having that.

We can't have anything nice because...

I don't understand why every bit of ambition is shot down.

It would certainly be the most impressive building in the city.

Instead they seem to focus on protecting old run down 3 story buildings because they were built in 1960s and are deemed historical as a result or some ****e like that.

Geuze · 01-03-2021 1:39am

https://voxeu.org/article/worldwide-building-height-gaps-their-determinants-and-their-implications

Who does not build?
Table 1 gives those countries with the largest gaps (kilometres per million urban residents), which are also shown visually in Figure 2. The result support the common belief that Europe is more reluctant to build, despite its relative prosperity. Ireland, the number one country in the list, has no buildings taller than 100 metres and only five buildings taller than 50 metres (Barr and Lyons 2018), even though Dublin is one of the world’s ten wealthiest cities and a financial hub.

02-03-2021 10:03am

JDigweed wrote: »

It speaks volumes of the city planners that our 3 most prominent landmarks are 2 industrial chimneys and a needle like sculpture.
This is the same council that stood by and destroyed large sections of georgian Dublin while littering the city with those hideous 4 floor flat complexes.
Even the civic office blocks are right in the middle of the medieval section of the city.

I wonder are they overcorrecting for the mistakes made in the 60's. The Liberty Hall, Wood Quay monstrosities. The Bank of Ireland HQ on Baggot Street. The Ballymun flats.

Maybe they are paralysed by fear that they will be the ones who give the green light on something they will later regret? So they play it safe, unadventurous.

cruizer101 · 02-03-2021 10:18am

Geuze wrote: »

https://voxeu.org/article/worldwide-building-height-gaps-their-determinants-and-their-implications

Who does not build?

That is a very good article. Shows how far removed we are from other countries in terms of building up.

Every councilor should be made to read that, and realise the damage they are doing, increased house prices making housing unaffordable for many, increased congestion leading to productive time wasted and higher levels of pollution, urban sprawl leading to a much larger concrete footprint on the land than is required.

It really is a disgrace.

Kermit.de.frog · 02-03-2021 10:21am

They had a public consultation for the docklands last year. Literally 90%+ of the feedback which I think is still online from the public told them they want to see higher or much higher buildings there.

The public were totally ignored.

That's what you're dealing with.

We only live here.

This is distorting the housing market and I'd like to see the media look in to it.

blanch152 · 02-03-2021 11:08am

Bubbaclaus wrote: »

It would certainly be the most impressive building in the city.

Instead they seem to focus on protecting old run down 3 story buildings because they were built in 1960s and are deemed historical as a result or some ****e like that.

It is a great looking building and would be a fantastic addition to the Dublin skyline.

02-03-2021 12:02pm

blanch152 wrote: »

It is a great looking building and would be a fantastic addition start to the Dublin skyline.

FYP

Kermit.de.frog · 04-03-2021 12:55am

Letter in the Irish Time's refuting McDonald's nonsense

Docklands towers plan not ‘two fingers’

Sir, – Frank McDonald labels Ronan Group’s planning application for the North Wall Quay a “Manhattan scale” development (“Johnny Ronan’s docklands towers give ‘two fingers’ to Dublin”, Opinion, February 27th). This farfetched claim is an extravagant inflation.

By Manhattan’s scale, the 167-metre apartment building is so puny it would fail to make any list of notable New York heights. In fact, one such list has 144 buildings catalogued. The last in this line-up, Avenue of the Americas, at 183 metres, would comfortably outstretch Waterfront South, as applied for in Dublin’s Docklands.

Those who spent decades successfully objecting to all high-rise building in the city centre have helped drive the capital’s planning and development policy into a cul-de-sac with only one option left, reverse.

Dublin’s growing population needs high-rise for local housing and employment. Ideally away from the city’s historic core, but close enough to walk or cycle to work, with open space, a growing retail trade and a pre-existing public transport network.

Luckily for Dublin such a place already exists – Docklands. – Yours, etc,

ALAN ROBINSON,

Chief Executive,

Docklands Business Forum,

https://www.irishtimes.com/opinion/letters/docklands-towers-plan-not-two-fingers-1.4499411

AlmightyCushion · 04-03-2021 1:06am

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

Letter in the Irish Time's refuting McDonald's nonsense

https://www.irishtimes.com/opinion/letters/docklands-towers-plan-not-two-fingers-1.4499411

Unfortunately it is buried in the letters section whereas the original article was given a lot more prominence.

Kermit.de.frog · 04-03-2021 1:21am

AlmightyCushion wrote: »

Unfortunately it is buried in the letters section whereas the original article was given a lot more prominence.

The developers should get a right of reply. That article was filled with lies.

He also said half the development was build to rent. It's (all) build to sell!

No fact checking done. All propaganda.

McDonald and the Irish Times have held the city back for decades objecting to everything.

blanch152 · 04-03-2021 11:20am

Geuze wrote: »

https://voxeu.org/article/worldwide-building-height-gaps-their-determinants-and-their-implications

Who does not build?
Table 1 gives those countries with the largest gaps (kilometres per million urban residents), which are also shown visually in Figure 2. The result support the common belief that Europe is more reluctant to build, despite its relative prosperity. Ireland, the number one country in the list, has no buildings taller than 100 metres and only five buildings taller than 50 metres (Barr and Lyons 2018), even though Dublin is one of the world’s ten wealthiest cities and a financial hub.

Incredible article that shows how the policies of Dublin City Council have left this country behind.

AlmightyCushion · 04-03-2021 12:50pm

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

The developers should get a right of reply. That article was filled with lies.

He also said half the development was build to rent. It's (all) build to sell!

No fact checking done. All propaganda.

McDonald and the Irish Times have held the city back for decades objecting to everything.

Even if the developers did reply and the paper was willing to publish it, it would just be a footnote at the bottom of the article. You see it all the time with articles and it's not just the Irish Times that do it either.

The fact checking thing doesn't surprise me either. Sure remember that busconnects article the Irish Times ran about the blind guy who currently has to get 2 buses to work but under busconnects would become a 'six-stage ordeal' i.e he has to get 3 buses instead of 2. Six-stage sounds worse than 3 so obviously they went with that in the tagline.

Under the BusConnects plan, Mr Murray will have to walk farther from home to a different bus stop. Then he will travel away from the city centre towards Artane. There he will get another bus into the city. Then he have to change again.

Turns out none of that was true. Under busconnects, he could get a bus closer to his house and it would be one bus direct to his work place. That was also published in the letter section by the NTA.

These articles are incredibly influential and wrongly gives people a negative impression of these things. Publishing letters is a cop out that doesn't undo the damage done by the article.

Kermit.de.frog · 14-03-2021 10:12pm

Another member of the Dublin obstruction cult here. From the ludicrous to the absurd...when you have no credible argument jump to identity

https://twitter.com/Orla_Hegarty/status/1370721227703214082

Seriously

major interest · 15-03-2021 1:45am

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

Another member of the Dublin obstruction cult here. From the ludicrous to the absurd...when you have no credible argument jump to identity

https://twitter.com/Orla_Hegarty/status/1370721227703214082

Seriously

Saw that earlier....fairly bad taste using a topical issue like women’s safety and trying to shoehorn it into a completely unrelated debate on building heights and density. Bizarre.

Kermit.de.frog · 15-03-2021 12:31pm

It's a candidate for the 'wokeism' thread in after hours alright.

How do women survive in New York, London, Dubai...

15-03-2021 12:36pm

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

Another member of the Dublin obstruction cult here. From the ludicrous to the absurd...when you have no credible argument jump to identity

https://twitter.com/Orla_Hegarty/status/1370721227703214082

Seriously

What an absolute head case. Seriously, if anything, there needs to be a discussion about these clowns who populate the twitter echo chamber with their warped views. They seem to be stuck in an endless feedback loop to their own crazy beliefs.

Nut jobs.

15-03-2021 4:52pm

AlmightyCushion wrote: »

Even if the developers did reply and the paper was willing to publish it, it would just be a footnote at the bottom of the article. You see it all the time with articles and it's not just the Irish Times that do it either.

The fact checking thing doesn't surprise me either. Sure remember that busconnects article the Irish Times ran about the blind guy who currently has to get 2 buses to work but under busconnects would become a 'six-stage ordeal' i.e he has to get 3 buses instead of 2. Six-stage sounds worse than 3 so obviously they went with that in the tagline.

Turns out none of that was true. Under busconnects, he could get a bus closer to his house and it would be one bus direct to his work place. That was also published in the letter section by the NTA.

These articles are incredibly influential and wrongly gives people a negative impression of these things. Publishing letters is a cop out that doesn't undo the damage done by the article.

This is why I hate journalists. They often declaim, with good reason, about fake news on the internet. Therefore it is incumbent on them to not be propagandists themselves especially in the “paper of record”.

Kermit.de.frog · 19-03-2021 12:09am

https://twitter.com/collision/status/1372580947325947908

Excellent idea.

Kermit.de.frog · 21-05-2021 11:14am

https://www.rte.ie/news/ireland/2021/0521/1223037-dublin-towers-ronan/

An absolute disgrace in the middle of a housing crisis. 1,000 apartments and 100 social units as well.

An Bord Pleanala said they would have approved it but said they can't due to height limits.

BTW DCC are also spending our money to make doubly sure more units are not built in the docklands...

https://www.irishtimes.com/business/commercial-property/dcc-seeks-to-overturn-bord-plean%C3%A1la-s-rejection-of-height-amendments-1.4569557

cruizer101 · 21-05-2021 8:37pm

Is there no way the government can step in to overrule DCC's idiotic policy especially given the current housing situation

Mad_maxx · 21-05-2021 8:39pm

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

https://www.rte.ie/news/ireland/2021/0521/1223037-dublin-towers-ronan/

An absolute disgrace in the middle of a housing crisis. 1,000 apartments and 100 social units as well.

An Bord Pleanala said they would have approved it but said they can't due to height limits.

BTW DCC are also spending our money to make doubly sure more units are not built in the docklands...

https://www.irishtimes.com/business/commercial-property/dcc-seeks-to-overturn-bord-plean%C3%A1la-s-rejection-of-height-amendments-1.4569557

Eoin o Broin warmly welcomed this news on Twitter earlier today

such shameless cynicism

Ubbquittious · 21-05-2021 8:43pm

Do these high rise buildings have a fairly fixed life time? Is their death-date already cast in stone before they start building? New York has some very high rise buildings still standing but how common is this? Does every piece of steel have to be removed from it in 50 years time to be inspected and blessed by the pope?

Dublin City Council obstructing housing through mindless height limits?

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