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Cyclocross for beginners

  • 23-09-2020 11:33am
    #1
    Tombo2001
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,709 ✭✭✭


    Am considering getting a cyclocross bike:
    - cycling is where I get my main cardio exercise, would cycle 3 or 4 times a week for maybe 90 minutes.
    - live in northside Dublin, too far from the mountains for mountain biking
    - most of my cycling is either laps of phoenix park or else out to sutton on bike path,so its a bit repetitive and boring.
    - I would have to be honest and I say i would not feel comfortable heading out for longer routes around north county Dublin, while the scenery is great I just think the roads are too dangerous. Its that one driver in 100 who truly does not give a f**k that I would be worried about.
    - so I am getting a bit bored of the same old.

    Cyclo cross offers something different, and its offroad so safer in that sense.

    But is there much of a scene? I dont want to spend up on a bike that will sit in the garage. Outside of a few laps of the phoenix park, where do people do Cyclocross.....

    Thank you.


Comments

  • #2
    crosswords
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 252 ✭✭crosswords


    Cyclocross is a racing event and there is a hugh scene.

    Go and see the next race and see if its something you would like to try.

    www.munstercx.com

    www.ulstercyclocross.com.

    or google "leinster league of cyclocross".

    Theres not much in Dublin this year due to Covid 19.

    Dont be put off buying a CX bike as it will double as a road or gravel bike too.

    Cx racing is a marmite form of cycling, you will either love it or hate it.


  • #3
    magicbastarder
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Arts Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 50,181 CMod ✭✭✭✭magicbastarder


    also, i'd be curious as to whether cross was more or less dangerous than leisure cycling on country roads.


  • #4
    crosswords
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 252 ✭✭crosswords


    Generally the injuries we (occasionally) see at races are soft tissue type, ie. sprains strains etc.

    Broken bones happen but are relatively rare, and are usually caused when dismounting, running, or remounting.

    We fall off lots more than our road brethren, but we usually bounce back.


  • #5
    dave_o_brien
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,301 ✭✭✭dave_o_brien


    For what it's worth, I got hurt more often doing cross but never injured.

    Got injured a few times racing road.


  • #6
    Tombo2001
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,709 ✭✭✭Tombo2001


    Thanks guys.

    I appreciate that there is a huge scene, but am wondering what that means in practice, for someone living in Dublin.

    e.g. apart from Phoenix Park, where do people train for CycloCross. What are the common routes? Are there clubs or groups that train together?

    To MagicBastarders point, I dont have a problem with country roads in general. I was specifically talking about country roads just outside of Dublin city, that are small country roads but with extremely heavy traffic. Unfortunately these are the roads I have to pass through from where I live.

    The far side of Meath, I would have no problem cycling around there - but not on the roads that go out past the airport, or up around Swords/ Skerries/ Balbriggan.


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  • #7
    magicbastarder
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Arts Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 50,181 CMod ✭✭✭✭magicbastarder


    i am usually on roads up around garristown/the naul/bellewstown. you do get occasional idiotic behaviour, but i'm not particularly scared cycling on those roads.


  • #8
    daragh_
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,124 ✭✭✭daragh_


    OP - This thread might be of interest if you are looking for off-road CX/Gravel Bike Routes

    https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=105747354


  • #9
    Tombo2001
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,709 ✭✭✭Tombo2001


    magicbastarder wrote: »
    i am usually on roads up around garristown/the naul/bellewstown. you do get occasional idiotic behaviour, but i'm not particularly scared cycling on those roads.

    And are you cycling out there from the city? I'd agree the naul would be way quieter than the roads around skerries...


  • #10
    Tombo2001
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,709 ✭✭✭Tombo2001


    daragh_ wrote: »
    OP - This thread might be of interest if you are looking for off-road CX/Gravel Bike Routes

    https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=105747354

    Thanks, plenty in that...


  • #11
    magicbastarder
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Arts Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 50,181 CMod ✭✭✭✭magicbastarder


    i've actually mulled over this myself (a colleague teaches or used to teach cyclocross for orwell, i think).
    i suspect it's quite a different load on your system for road cycling (and i've never competed in any way on the bike) - much more stop/starty and better bike handling skills required, i suspect.

    is there even such a thing as CX time trialling? i.e. where you'd be less worried about pratfalling and taking out several other riders?


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  • #12
    iwillhtfu
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,373 ✭✭✭iwillhtfu


    magicbastarder wrote: »
    also, i'd be curious as to whether cross was more or less dangerous than leisure cycling on country roads.

    I'd say dislocations are a common enough injury in cyclo cross


  • #13
    Matt Bianco
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 472 ✭✭Matt Bianco


    Falls are Invariably soft falls and at lower speeds and bar the first few corners the racing gets quite spread out so you are only a danger to yourself with minimal consequences for any spills.

    It is an all out effort, no doubt about it, so if you hope to be competitive it is a case of getting the HR up and kept up so quite like Zwift racing if you’re familiar with that.

    In terms of concerns about safety on country roads, I would recommend joining a club to build up confidence as well as opening up routes of which there are many around NCD


  • #14
    Tombo2001
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,709 ✭✭✭Tombo2001


    Thanks folks - looking at it objectively, the place say on the northside where you could for example practice or do CycloCross are Phoenix Park, maybe Santry Demesne, the further reaches of the Canal Path, possibly St Annes.

    I cant think of too many places, hence the question.

    I used to do a lot of cross country running and absolutely loved it, thats another reason I would be interested. Far preferred it to roadrunning or even track.


  • #15
    daragh_
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,124 ✭✭✭daragh_


    Phoenix Park has a lot of little trails that are great for getting used to handling a CX bike, plus some places to practice run-ups and steep descents etc.

    If you explore a bit you'll find them.

    This time of the year you will bump into people getting ready for the Race Season.


  • #16
    Tombo2001
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,709 ✭✭✭Tombo2001


    daragh_ wrote: »
    Phoenix Park has a lot of little trails that are great for getting used to handling a CX bike, plus some places to practice run-ups and steep descents etc.

    If you explore a bit you'll find them.

    This time of the year you will bump into people getting ready for the Race Season.

    Cheers - my next step is to get the bike!!


  • #17
    Macy0161
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,484 ✭✭✭Macy0161


    magicbastarder wrote: »
    i've actually mulled over this myself (a colleague teaches or used to teach cyclocross for orwell, i think).
    i suspect it's quite a different load on your system for road cycling (and i've never competed in any way on the bike) - much more stop/starty and better bike handling skills required, i suspect.
    I've mulled it over too, looked at the TrainerRoad CX plans (short power build and cx speciality), saw all the VO2 Max stuff and decided feck that for a game of soldiers! :D I think I'm too much of diesel.


  • #18
    nilhg
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,160 ✭✭✭nilhg


    daragh_ wrote: »
    Phoenix Park has a lot of little trails that are great for getting used to handling a CX bike, plus some places to practice run-ups and steep descents etc.

    If you explore a bit you'll find them.

    This time of the year you will bump into people getting ready for the Race Season.

    If the OP wanted a day out, train to Newbridge or Kildare and a couple of hours exploring the Curragh gives a great variety of gravel roads, grass tracks and steep little hills.

    Likewise to the PP, there will be a few out on CX bikes getting ready for the race season.


  • #19
    Oberkon
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 206 ✭✭Oberkon


    Has anyone raced cx on a gravel bike ? I’m looking to get a decent cx bike if anyone has something in A 51/52/53 size but would consider a race with the gravel . Presumably the B race is ok on 38mm tyres etc ?


  • #20
    murphyebass
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,553 ✭✭✭murphyebass


    Just curious does anyone ever ride flat/regular pedals in cyclocross?

    Obviously not competitively but for leisure for example.
    I know in the mountain bike scene you can make a case for flats over clipless.

    Even on my rides around the Phoenix park I can’t help but think I’d be more comfortable on flats even just for the steeper inclines. Being clipped in I feel like i wouldn’t be able to unclip in time.

    In a race I don’t think it’d annoy me as much as it’d be in a load of mud but in the park it’s generally tight trails with god knows what to fall into.

    For what it’s worth I ride clipless on the road and don’t mind it at all but yeah just think flats might be more crack as I’d be more confident knowing I could hop off a lot quicker/easier.

    Thinking of moving to the set of pedals below for the best of both worlds. Clipless for my road cycling and flats for the bit cyclocross fun along with handy for the shops.

    https://www.amazon.co.uk/SHIMANO-PD-EH500-Pedals-SM-SH56-grey/dp/B07FNMG6DH/ref=mp_s_a_1_2?dchild=1&keywords=shimano+pd+m530+pedals&qid=1600976540&sprefix=shinano+pd&sr=8-2

    Thoughts?


  • #21
    nak
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,538 ✭✭✭nak


    Oberkon wrote: »
    Has anyone raced cx on a gravel bike ? I’m looking to get a decent cx bike if anyone has something in A 51/52/53 size but would consider a race with the gravel . Presumably the B race is ok on 38mm tyres etc ?

    It really depends on the course and the bike, if it's muddy you would want cyclocross tyres or you'll be all over the place. My gravel bike has a lower bottom bracket than my cyclocross bike so wouldn't be great on a muddy course but could get away with it if it was dry. Handling is different and the setup isn't great for cross on my Diverge - would find it difficult to shoulder my bike as the top tube is low.

    Re the pedal question, not sure how those pedals would work with flat shoes in a race setting - might be a bit slippy as the platform isn't designed with flat shoes in mind? Majority use SPDs and XC shoes, I back the tension most of the way off for cyclocross. Worth putting in the practice with dismounts and remounts if you plan to race.


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  • #22
    woody1
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,907 ✭✭✭woody1


    Oberkon wrote: »
    Has anyone raced cx on a gravel bike ? I’m looking to get a decent cx bike if anyone has something in A 51/52/53 size but would consider a race with the gravel . Presumably the B race is ok on 38mm tyres etc ?

    i have a focus mares al commuter, ( it was in my lbs and it was a quick fix with cross starting soon ) which is a tank, nearly as heavy as my mtb i dont think its 100 percent a gravel bike but its definitely not a cross bike, should never have bought it , should have waited for something better

    i had a quick spin on a club mates years old scott cx bike and it was half the weight and way easier

    anyway the point is i have raced cross on it, last 2 seasons, ive been toodling round at the middle to back mostly, but it does the job fine, if i had a few quid to top up id happily sell it and upgrade but itl have to do for this year,

    if you can at all try to get as decent a bike as you can get , if you dont, once you get into cross all youl be thinking about is upgrading


  • #23
    Tombo2001
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,709 ✭✭✭Tombo2001


    woody1 wrote: »
    i have a focus mares al commuter, ( it was in my lbs and it was a quick fix with cross starting soon ) which is a tank, nearly as heavy as my mtb i dont think its 100 percent a gravel bike but its definitely not a cross bike, should never have bought it , should have waited for something better

    i had a quick spin on a club mates years old scott cx bike and it was half the weight and way easier

    anyway the point is i have raced cross on it, last 2 seasons, ive been toodling round at the middle to back mostly, but it does the job fine, if i had a few quid to top up id happily sell it and upgrade but itl have to do for this year,

    if you can at all try to get as decent a bike as you can get , if you dont, once you get into cross all youl be thinking about is upgrading

    Are there any races you are doing out to year end?


  • #24
    Tombo2001
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,709 ✭✭✭Tombo2001


    murphyebass wrote: »
    Just curious does anyone ever ride flat/regular pedals in cyclocross?

    Obviously not competitively but for leisure for example.
    I know in the mountain bike scene you can make a case for flats over clipless.

    Even on my rides around the Phoenix park I can’t help but think I’d be more comfortable on flats even just for the steeper inclines. Being clipped in I feel like i wouldn’t be able to unclip in time.

    In a race I don’t think it’d annoy me as much as it’d be in a load of mud but in the park it’s generally tight trails with god knows what to fall into.

    For what it’s worth I ride clipless on the road and don’t mind it at all but yeah just think flats might be more crack as I’d be more confident knowing I could hop off a lot quicker/easier.

    Thinking of moving to the set of pedals below for the best of both worlds. Clipless for my road cycling and flats for the bit cyclocross fun along with handy for the shops.

    https://www.amazon.co.uk/SHIMANO-PD-EH500-Pedals-SM-SH56-grey/dp/B07FNMG6DH/ref=mp_s_a_1_2?dchild=1&keywords=shimano+pd+m530+pedals&qid=1600976540&sprefix=shinano+pd&sr=8-2

    Thoughts?


    Interesting. Since I had a tumble a few years back and broke my wrist, I am very wary of potential injuries.

    The clip ons for me would be a no no for cyclo, these look very good, just wondering would they have enough grip if covered in mud and rain.


  • #25
    woody1
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,907 ✭✭✭woody1


    Tombo2001 wrote: »
    Are there any races you are doing out to year end?
    im mayo based so itl be the connaught series, ive not been on the cross bike much at all and theres a fair amount of fear of dying , but im trying to encourage my youngest son into it so if im bringing him to races il throw the bike in the boot and slog around

    connaught series starts oct 18th , not sure on other race dates but normally
    enniscrone, westport, castlebar - there was one galway direction last year ,
    dont have dates for those yet though

    normally would try to get to oldcastle for one of their races, as id be spinning up to meath anyway normally, but hard to know whatl happen that direction this year


  • #26
    lennymc
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,458 ✭✭✭lennymc


    Tombo2001 wrote: »
    Interesting. Since I had a tumble a few years back and broke my wrist, I am very wary of potential injuries.

    The clip ons for me would be a no no for cyclo, these look very good, just wondering would they have enough grip if covered in mud and rain.

    the thing with pedals is they are part of a system. In CX, there is a lot of running up muddy banks, and cx/,mtb cycle shoes have studs in the toes to help. get traction. I forgot my pedals one day (dont ask) for a cx race, but had a set of standard pedals in the car, and raced in my runners, it was horrible. Wet runner soles, on flat pedals, slipping on the pedals, slipping on the rub ups. The SPD on lightest tension will be a hell of a lot better than flats for cross imho, and you will always be able to clip out - it really is not an issue.

    Also, if you are racing cross, you will fall off - it's par for the course. It doesnt hurt tho as it's so slow, and you generally land in mud.


  • #27
    murphyebass
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,553 ✭✭✭murphyebass


    lennymc wrote: »
    the thing with pedals is they are part of a system. In CX, there is a lot of running up muddy banks, and cx/,mtb cycle shoes have studs in the toes to help. get traction. I forgot my pedals one day (dont ask) for a cx race, but had a set of standard pedals in the car, and raced in my runners, it was horrible. Wet runner soles, on flat pedals, slipping on the pedals, slipping on the rub ups. The SPD on lightest tension will be a hell of a lot better than flats for cross imho, and you will always be able to clip out - it really is not an issue.

    Also, if you are racing cross, you will fall off - it's par for the course. It doesnt hurt tho as it's so slow, and you generally land in mud.

    I get you in a race but two examples in my “training” let’s call it I came across clipped in.

    1. Going up a really steep hill in the Phoenix park with all sorts of shrubs, nettles etc right and left of me. I very very nearly fell but just about made it up. In flats I’d have just stopped.

    2. Down by clonsilla train station you can cycle a mud path toward toward town but if you fall you can fall in the river which is terrifying clipped in but fine when you’re on flats as again you just stop if you lose control.

    So for me anyway I think the dual pedal might work as best of both worlds. I’d say for a cyclocross race I would use clipless but for day to day leisurely cycles to have no fear at all the flats might be more fun.


  • #28
    nak
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,538 ✭✭✭nak


    murphyebass wrote: »
    1. Going up a really steep hill in the Phoenix park with all sorts of shrubs, nettles etc right and left of me. I very very nearly fell but just about made it up. In flats I’d have just stopped.

    2. Down by clonsilla train station you can cycle a mud path toward toward town but if you fall you can fall in the river which is terrifying clipped in but fine when you’re on flats as again you just stop if you lose control.

    Sounds like you need to focus less on worst case scenarios and practice getting on and off the bike. Anyone who races cyclocross practices this over and over again. Some great YouTube tutorials to help with this.

    I've been mountain biking with plenty of people on flats and they fall just the same as those of us using SPDs. Lose momentum on a steep hill and you're going down unless you have the dismount dialled. At least with cyclocross it's generally a soft landing 😂


  • #29
    Tombo2001
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,709 ✭✭✭Tombo2001


    murphyebass wrote: »
    I get you in a race but two examples in my “training” let’s call it I came across clipped in.

    1. Going up a really steep hill in the Phoenix park with all sorts of shrubs, nettles etc right and left of me. I very very nearly fell but just about made it up. In flats I’d have just stopped.

    2. Down by clonsilla train station you can cycle a mud path toward toward town but if you fall you can fall in the river which is terrifying clipped in but fine when you’re on flats as again you just stop if you lose control.

    So for me anyway I think the dual pedal might work as best of both worlds. I’d say for a cyclocross race I would use clipless but for day to day leisurely cycles to have no fear at all the flats might be more fun.

    I fell into the canal while clipped, basically because my first instinct would always be unclip my right foot first... but as I was falling down a bank to my right, that was no good to me ....


  • #30
    murphyebass
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,553 ✭✭✭murphyebass


    So I did my first bit of cyclocross’ing yesterday in my local park. Unfortunately the Phoenix park is just outside of the 5km range. That said the local park is surprisingly decent with some tree routes, mud, hills etc. Roughly 5 mins per lap. Really enjoyable and on my doorstep.

    Anyway I’m going to upgrade to better tyres as the ones that came with the bike are more suited to gravel riding I’d say.

    Any recommendations for a good CX tyre? Not tubeless. I’m sticking with tubes for now.


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