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15-05-2019, 14:41   #16
Accumulator
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EU migration is perfectly legal and fine (within reason), the 21% factor in the Dublin region relates directly to 'non-EU' migration.

Expect the situation to worsen after brexit, May's twiddling of thumbs will likely lead to TBP winning or doing well in their upcoming elections.
Their next 2019 PM (Farage) will want it hard, very hard and fast.
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15-05-2019, 14:43   #17
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Originally Posted by El_Bee View Post
https://www.thejournal.ie/social-hou...07803-May2019/

There is no housing crisis, just an entitlement crisis.
Homelessness and the "housing Crisis" need to be separated here. There is some wonky stuff going on with homelessness to some extent.

But housing in general, the extortionate prices and rents are no figments of imagination. Maybe I should tell those students that lost their accommodation that they have an entitlement problem? They can change their attitude to produce money out of thin air
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15-05-2019, 14:50   #18
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Is it 100,000 houses we have vacant in Ireland. And as was said no social housing built for 10 years. So to me it's blatantly obvious terrible government policies have led to the lack of affordable housing for people. So my anger would be directed at the government, not immigrants.
If it were simply a case of available building, then why was there no housing crisis during the recession? Where did the massive demand come from once we magically became attractive to outsiders again (from individuals to corporations)?

Its not anger, by the way, its worry. And yes, the blame is entirely on the government. However, people should recognise that immigration is the biggest factor in the housing crisis, and bring that recognition to elections.

I'm happy to have my opinion changed, but I'm not seeing anything that trumps immigration as the greatest factor in housing problems. Or another way to put it, immigration needs to be prioritised in order for any other change to have an effect.
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15-05-2019, 14:53   #19
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Originally Posted by Accumulator View Post
EU migration is perfectly legal and fine (within reason), the 21% factor in the Dublin region relates directly to 'non-EU' migration.

Expect the situation to worsen after brexit, May's twiddling of thumbs will likely lead to TBP winning or doing well in their upcoming elections.
Their next 2019 PM (Farage) will want it hard, very hard and fast.
Dirty bugger that Farage.
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15-05-2019, 15:00   #20
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Dirty bugger that Farage.
All while in his traditional beer pose. WillHill have today put his TBParty short (at 5/1) to win the most seats in any next general election.

Time to panic, and build more houses/tents.
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15-05-2019, 15:12   #21
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Its the elephant in the room nobody wants to talk about because you would be branded a racist or far right. Year to April 2018 immigration counted for 50% increase in our population compared to year to April 2017.

UK got sick of it, we will eventually....
It may be the elephant in the room, but surely even the dogs in the street must be questioning their own observed reality.

Its not hard to make the simple, reasonable, logical link that youre getting lashed out of it by rent each month, yet the place is getting busier with non-irish people by the day.

The whole thing is a disgrace. And it has nothing to do with the colour of skin or different origin of people. Or maybe you can be racist against the entire planet nowadays, Ted. Theres no fake scaremongering about numbers, they are what they are.
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15-05-2019, 15:25   #22
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Originally Posted by ollkiller View Post
Is it 100,000 houses we have vacant in Ireland. And as was said no social housing built for 10 years. So to me it's blatantly obvious terrible government policies have led to the lack of affordable housing for people. So my anger would be directed at the government, not immigrants.
People seem to have such short memories.
In the last ten years we were amidst bankrupt and beholden to the IMF.
Covent policy is irrelevant when there is no money to pay for it.
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15-05-2019, 15:28   #23
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There's a lovely Brazillian lady in work who cleans our toilets. Her English is improving every day.

My boss is Puerto Rican.

I was just handed my lunch by the canteen chef who likes to practice Irish phrases on everybody who visits the canteen. His daughter started learning Irish in school, so he's learning it to help her with homework. He's from Cameroon.

I'd rather have these 3 people as neighbours than Deco, Jacinta and their ever growing brood of ill behaved, future criminal children.

If we're dividing up the population based on arbitrary categories like whether or not they are scumbags, or whether they were born in a different country before deciding if they should be our neighbour, then I'm all for it!

Do you play tennis OP? I think anybody who plays tennis should be evicted, made homeless and kicked out of the country.

Am I doing this right?
Why do we need to import people from Brazil who can't speak the language to clean the toilets?? There is a huge EU that we have access to their workforce. Or Cameroonian canteen chefs?? Why and how are we importing unskilled workers that we have no need for??
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15-05-2019, 15:35   #24
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Obviously immigration contributes to population growth which creates housing demand. But I fail to see which policy can be used to address it other than identifying a convenient "cause" to be blamed and then doing nothing to solve the issue. The housing issue, that is.
Placing immigrants on a different housing list may sound like a good idea as long as they keep the separate immigrant list at the revenue. Oh, wait, there is none, same tax should means same benefits, right?
Demand in Dublin is driven by economical factors, that is the real cause, growth and high employment. This can only be fixed by addressing supply, not reducing demand. Or it will fix itself at the next recession, so be careful what you wish for
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15-05-2019, 15:37   #25
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Why do we need to import people from Brazil who can't speak the language to clean the toilets?? There is a huge EU that we have access to their workforce. Or Cameroonian canteen chefs?? Why and how are we importing unskilled workers that we have no need for??
Its all ridiculous of course.

That poster is ascribing emotional feelings to people he knows NOT from here, versus imaginary irish people he doesn't know. It has nothing to do with reality in the slightest.

Its a huge problem when people rely upon feelings versus facts. The issue of the thread is the numbers of people ("extra" people by virtue of immigration, in relation to numbers looking for housing)

Youd wonder how people who believe such things evaluate reality when the huge mortgage has to be paid, or the huge rent paid, or the childrens rent or what have you. Total dissonance. Must be very confusing!

Theres only so long you can ignore reality, no matter how much youd "like" it to be different
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15-05-2019, 15:45   #26
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https://www.rte.ie/radio/utils/radio...83_08-11-2017_

Average no. of applications for family members under the Family Reunification provisions = 20.
The largest application being for 70 family members. Significant and unquantifiable impacts on the provision of housing, education, welfare supports.

Minister of State, David Stanton
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15-05-2019, 15:48   #27
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Originally Posted by Cordell View Post
Obviously immigration contributes to population growth which creates housing demand. But I fail to see which policy can be used to address it other than identifying a convenient "cause" to be blamed and then doing nothing to solve the issue. The housing issue, that is.
Placing immigrants on a different housing list may sound like a good idea as long as they keep the separate immigrant list at the revenue. Oh, wait, there is none, same tax should means same benefits, right?
Demand in Dublin is driven by economical factors, that is the real cause, growth and high employment. This can only be fixed by addressing supply, not reducing demand. Or it will fix itself at the next recession, so be careful what you wish for
Its true, theres little point in identifying a problem only to have nothing done about it.

But my wider point is that the problem isn't recognised in the first place. You cant fix a problem if you don't "know" it exists.

There are a load of policies and plans that could be put in place to fix the housing crisis. My opinion is that none of it will work unless you address the root cause.

The root cause is too many people. More specifically, there are too many people readily available to confound any attempted solution. If we built an entire new city, it would be filled up within 2 years, and I would confidently wager that the majority would not be irish people. A hypothetical scenario, of course.

As mentioned in that primetime episode (linked in the first post), someone mentions the potential fallout if (its when!) the country gets into a downturn and competition for everything increases exponentially for whats left in the country. That's when the whole issue of "rightful entitlement" will come to a fore.

That will be interesting!

Also, I don't agree in the slightest that immigrants (no matter from where) should be put on housing lists at all. Theres already a hotbed of contention about social housing for irish people, for non-irish people its just absolute madness.
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15-05-2019, 15:48   #28
 
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Originally Posted by weldoninhio View Post
Why do we need to import people from Brazil who can't speak the language to clean the toilets?? There is a huge EU that we have access to their workforce. Or Cameroonian canteen chefs?? Why and how are we importing unskilled workers that we have no need for??
We obviously do have a need for them...

Hiring someone from outside the EU is a pain in the hole for employers, far simpler to hire an Irish person. But if you can't find an Irish person who's willing to clean toilets for minimum wage, you'll find an immigrant who will.
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15-05-2019, 15:49   #29
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Add in the factor of job replacement (for all low-skilled occupations), circa 40% of these jobs will be gone by 2030.

Maybe some of the non-eu folks with very basic english or education, can pick up theoretical quantum machine scripting for the new ai-auto toilet cleaner and burger flipping 'bots.
2030+ will likely see cashless-UBI, foodbanks, soupkitchens, gated communities (only for the select few of course) otherwise it's tent cities and 'pod living' for the rest.

On the plus side automation will improve basic standards of living, and clean water will become an important and still accessible asset in NW Europe.
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15-05-2019, 15:49   #30
 
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Originally Posted by beejee View Post
If we built an entire new city, it would be filled up within 2 years, and I would confidently wager that the majority would not be irish people.
Stay out of the bookies!
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